NBA economics

[FultzNationRISE]

It’s kind of interesting what’s happening in the NBA right now in terms of salary and productivity disparities.

Altho every player on an NBA roster is making good money, star players still make the most… but are playing less and less.

This means bench guys are getting proportionally the same salary they always have… but carry more of the load.

Andrew Wiggins gets three months off for personal time, but still makes a max salary. The guy replacing him has to travel with the team, go to film sessions, show up and play those minutes, etc. But proportionally he doesnt make any more money than the bench player from 2012 or ‘91 or whenever, who had a lot less expected of him throughout the season. The guys at the top make the same bank for doing less.

Of course from the team perspective you just want those elite players on your side for the playoffs. The regular season is just for getting rich off society’s eagerness to cheerlead for any ol manchildren you can throw out onto the court and have run around chasing a ball. You can stick anybody out there and profit off the rank and file. You really just need those star players under contract for the playoff stretch run, so you can win a title and beat your chest. Basically youre paying extra for what the silver bullet does in a pinch. It’s not for just firing off a round down at the range with the rest of the ammo. And thats certainly fair enough and each team’s prerogative to do.

I guess my point is… it must be nice to be at the top. Nobody else seems to realize or care when theyre getting ripped off. Players make $250,000,000 to skip a month of games when they feel like it, maybe they got a papercut ot something, and in the meantime theyll lecture you on politics. But youll still watch. And the bench players will still take 1/12 their salary to carry more of the load each season. It’s an epic hustle.

Here’s to the upcoming season. Im sure its gonna be intensely competitive between all these semi-billionaires. I cant wait to watch! And Im sure as hell you cant wait either.

I mean what the hell else are you gonna do with your time? Learn something new?

:roll:

Kidding, kidding, thats obviously a joke. I know you wont do that.

Cheers :cheers:

[Kblaze8855]

I feel like I had this conversation with you recently and you were left so dismayed by the current realities you suggested you wouldn’t be an NBA fan anymore? Going forward. Have you been here since then?

Anyway your 250 number is too low. 250 is almost a bargain for a star from here on. Jaylen is eligible for I think 307. It was gonna be 295 but every time someone runs the numbers, the projections increase with the revenue. The deals we’re going to see when the media right deal goes from 25 billion to somewhere north of 50 to 75? They’re going to make you wish for the quaint days of $300 million contracts.

The biggest contract in history was Giannis at 228 like…2-3 years ago. It advances so fast fans can’t keep up with what a big deal is. The rookie scale Supermax is now at 260.

Guys gonna make 375 million to not play. And the owners will live with it…because they’ll make a lot more.

I just wonder how many will sell teams when that new money hits and team values shoot up again. A lot of these people aren’t as liquid rich as we think.

If you have 100 million but you’re worth 6 billion 5 of which is a team….you getting out early before the bubble bursts?

[highwhey]

I feel like I had this conversation with you recently and you were left so dismayed by the current realities you suggested you wouldn’t be an NBA fan anymore? Going forward. Have you been here since then?

Anyway your 250 number is too low. 250 is almost a bargain for a star from here on. Jaylen is eligible for I think 307. It was gonna be 295 but every time someone runs the numbers, the projections increase with the revenue. The deals we’re going to see when the media right deal goes from 25 billion to somewhere north of 50 to 75? They’re going to make you wish for the quaint days of $300 million contracts.

The biggest contract in history was Giannis at 228 like…2-3 years ago. It advances so fast fans can’t keep up with what a big deal is. The rookie scale Supermax is now at 260.

Guys gonna make 375 million to not play. And the owners will live with it…because they’ll make a lot more.

I just wonder how many will sell teams when that new money hits and team values shoot up again. A lot of these people aren’t as liquid rich as we think.

If you have 100 million but you’re worth 6 billion 5 of which is a team….you getting out early before the bubble bursts?
:roll:

[FultzNationRISE]

I feel like I had this conversation with you recently and you were left so dismayed by the current realities you suggested you wouldn’t be an NBA fan anymore? Going forward. Have you been here since then?



I havent been posting altho I pull ISH up on my phone out of pure rote habit a few times a day. Most times I close it immediately, altho if I'm long on time I'll glance around to stay current on the biggest topics. But I was recently thinking about some of the interesting parallels between general society and the NBA ecosystem and figured I'd make a post on it. But in general, I'll watch if I feel like it or not watch if I dont. But the thing is I at least understand what's going on around me and can make a conscious choice based on potential consequences. I'm not sure how many here really even have the core ability to observe/understand what is happening around them in life. It's the way it is and I cant change it, sometimes it's cathartic to post about it tho almost like a diary entry :lol I'll try to keep that to a minimum tho.

[FultzNationRISE]

:roll:

highwhey, I Promise i'll be treating you with dignity and respect from now on.

You have a valuable role to play in society's future. You are appreciated. I'm rooting for you, champ!

:cheers: :basketball

[Im Still Ballin]

Him: Put the ****in' money in the briefcase!

Me: It shouldn't be about the money.

[Im Still Ballin]

You can pull the mental health card and take several games off here and there. Did Ben Simmons get all his money back?

[Norcaliblunt]

No different than society bruh. Rich find a way to make more while doing less, and the poor end up working more for less.

[FultzNationRISE]

Him: Put the ****in' money in the briefcase!

Me: It shouldn't be about the money.


This guy gets it.

[tpols]

Kawhi should be charged with grand larceny. Makes 100s of millions of dollars to literally not play basketball.

[FultzNationRISE]

Kawhi should be charged with grand larceny. Makes 100s of millions of dollars to literally not play basketball.

Yeah but the people in LA know Kawhi’s deal and still pay more and more for season tickets. Or choose to invest the same amount of time watching games on TV while the best players play less and less.

Maybe they should be charged with grand apathy?

It’s not Kawhi’s fault. He’s doing what he’s allowed to do. That doesnt make him a bad guy.

The fascinating thing is that when people keep getting less and less, by and large they dont notice or care…

[tpols]

Yeah but the people in LA know Kawhi’s deal and still pay more and more for season tickets. Or choose to invest the same amount of time watching games on TV while the best players play less and less.

Maybe they should be charged with grand apathy?

It’s not Kawhi’s fault. He’s doing what he’s allowed to do. That doesnt make him a bad guy.

The fascinating thing is that when people keep getting less and less, by and large they dont notice or care…

Well as it was explained to me, NBA owners get money whether people watch their team or not because TV and internet deals are all bundled with other stuff. So they get a big cut whether we watch or not. And then the more popular shows in the bundle basically carry them. It's very unfair though imo. But that's how this world works. The higher up you are the less you have to do, and the lower you are you're basically a slave.

[FultzNationRISE]

Well as it was explained to me, NBA owners get money whether people watch their team or not because TV and internet deals are all bundled with other stuff. So they get a big cut whether we watch or not. And then the more popular shows in the bundle basically carry them. It's very unfair though imo. But that's how this world works. The higher up you are the less you have to do, and the lower you are you're basically a slave.

For sure, the people losing money when nobody watches are essentially the companies/sponsors who paid money to air commercials and product placement no one is seeing. Or the broadcasters themselves if companies stop advertising.

Once the NBA signs the deal theyre golden. But it’s ok because again, watching dudes run around chasing the ball helps us escape. Even if the best players dont even play. Our attention/adoration helps Kyrie Irving take 3 weeks off for his sister’s birthday and still make 120 million dollars. Its ok. I dont mind watching Parnell Haskins-Montagne replace him as a call-up from the g league. The point is it’s something for me to watch!

Just feels so manly to know Kyrie is making “influence society” money while I sit on the couch at the end of the day and watch his backup play basketball, as my six digit or less bank account becomes increasingly impotent.

I mean thats the definition of taking pride as a man in your limited time on Earth.

Go kyrie go! I cant wait to watch you throw the ball next year!

[Norcaliblunt]

Kyrie really makes or breaks it for you that bad? Lol.

[FultzNationRISE]

Kyrie really makes or breaks it for you that bad? Lol.

Not at all, I think it’s amazing how he reportedly undermined and disrespected Mike Brown as a young player, took unprovoked pot shots at Lebron after leaving Cleveland, implied after leaving Boston the fans were all racist without providing examples of when/how he was treated poorly, openly demeaned Steve Nash in Brooklyn, took a few weeks off for his sisters birthday without telling his teammates why he wasnt showing up, and then complained he wasnt being “celebrated”enough after posting a video promoting Holocaust denial.

I think it’s great for society this guy makes more money than all of ISH combined. I really respect the self awareness of anyone who helps enrich him further by watching and cheering as he travels and carries and consistently leads teams to worse records with him than without him.

If theres anyone who deserves to be more rich, powerful and influential thanks to your lack of having anything better to do, it’s K-Irv!

[Im Still Ballin]

Not at all, I think it’s amazing how he reportedly undermined and disrespected Mike Brown as a young player, took unprovoked pot shots at Lebron after leaving Cleveland, implied after leaving Boston the fans were all racist without providing examples of when/how he was treated poorly, openly demeaned Steve Nash in Brooklyn, took a few weeks off for his sisters birthday without telling his teammates why he wasnt showing up, and then complained he wasnt being “celebrated”enough after posting a video promoting Holocaust denial.

I think it’s great for society this guy makes more money than all of ISH combined. I really respect the self awareness of anyone who helps enrich him further by watching and cheering as he travels and carries and consistently leads teams to worse records with him than without him.

If theres anyone who deserves to be more rich, powerful and influential thanks to your lack of having anything better to do, it’s K-Irv!

Not even Mike's Lemonade is this Hard.

Fire emoji.

[FultzNationRISE]

Not even Mike's Lemonade is this Hard.

Fire emoji.

ISH fan: Kyrie I love you!! Go Kyrie go!!!

Kyrie: Actually it’s Héla, bc Im woke and edgy. And why are you white? I hate that. Stand before me so I may spit on you.

ISH fan: Cool! Can you try to get it in my mouth? Im so glad you signed that 120 million dollar deal, will you let me pay you 150 dollars for an autograph?? Pleaseeee Hélà, pleaseeeeeeeee!!!!

[FultzNationRISE]

Anyway I think that covers about everything I had to say for now.

See yall again in a few weeks maybe.

[Kblaze8855]

Well as it was explained to me, NBA owners get money whether people watch their team or not because TV and internet deals are all bundled with other stuff. So they get a big cut whether we watch or not. And then the more popular shows in the bundle basically carry them. It's very unfair though imo. But that's how this world works. The higher up you are the less you have to do, and the lower you are you're basically a slave.


That’s what I’ve been trying to explain to people having a hard time understanding we’re all this money comes from and why owners don’t care for the last couple years. There’s a lot more money in 500 million people having the means to watch you through a paid subscription than you make having 20 million people watching commercials you don’t get the money from.

Abc doesn’t pay the nba ad dollars directly. It pays for the right to air games that hopefully generate ad dollars. Amazon and apple on the other hand eventually will pay for the right to air games…and support it through subscription fees. Don’t even need you to watch. Just need you to buy the option. And you could buy Apple TV to watch Ted Lasso. They’d never know why you have it. Just that you do.

Sports leagues are getting into that money. The NBA finals could do Super Bowl ratings and all it gives them is negotiating power on the next rate deal. They don’t get paid more for it at the moment. They stopped thinking the way fans thought they did a long time ago.

It’s a near bottomless well as long as everyone’s fighting for content to monetize a billion bored people who all stream shit. They don’t need your eyes anymore. They need you to give your debit card info to some app that doesn’t even care if you watch them play.

[Kblaze8855]

Anyway I think that covers about everything I had to say for now.

See yall again in a few weeks maybe.


no need to explain yourself. I’m not sure I’ve ever seen an announced ISH retirement last. People just vanish quietly but if they tell you they’re gone? They’ll be back. I remember Gobb “retired” in like 02 and a while later he slipped up and posted when Marbury hit this shot



https://youtu.be/7SLFtLqk2mQ



Something always brings em back.

[FultzNationRISE]

no need to explain yourself. I’m not sure I’ve ever seen an announced ISH retirement last. People just vanish quietly but if they tell you they’re gone? They’ll be back. I remember Gobb “retired” in like 02 and a while later he slipped up and posted when Marbury hit this shot



https://youtu.be/7SLFtLqk2mQ



Something always brings em back.

Im tellin you, that was the last post Im making for at least a few weeks!!!

[Jasper]

NBA has the highest paid athlete's compared to any other sport.

it is history. /

[Duderonomy]

I feel like I had this conversation with you recently and you were left so dismayed by the current realities you suggested you wouldn’t be an NBA fan anymore? Going forward. Have you been here since then?

Anyway your 250 number is too low. 250 is almost a bargain for a star from here on. Jaylen is eligible for I think 307. It was gonna be 295 but every time someone runs the numbers, the projections increase with the revenue. The deals we’re going to see when the media right deal goes from 25 billion to somewhere north of 50 to 75? They’re going to make you wish for the quaint days of $300 million contracts.

The biggest contract in history was Giannis at 228 like…2-3 years ago. It advances so fast fans can’t keep up with what a big deal is. The rookie scale Supermax is now at 260.

Guys gonna make 375 million to not play. And the owners will live with it…because they’ll make a lot more.

I just wonder how many will sell teams when that new money hits and team values shoot up again. A lot of these people aren’t as liquid rich as we think.

If you have 100 million but you’re worth 6 billion 5 of which is a team….you getting out early before the bubble bursts?

I wonder if there is a chance the league revenue goes down in a few years. I've been a cable cord cutter and attended less games than in the past. The oversees money is nice but it's not as big as you might think, only popularity in China makes a huge dent. Only a matter of time until there is a dead cap max player or a bust making $200 million based on potential.

[Kblaze8855]

In a few years? No. A decade to two decades? Maybe. You’re gonna have to get through the streaming bubble with every media company trying to buy their way into the game and knowing that live sports is a loadbearing wall of pay TV. Apple or Amazon are gonna straight up offer to buy espn at some point. There are a lot of major moves left. After that you have to get through the gambling bubble. Every state that doesn’t have legalized sports gambling is being lobbied hard to add it now at the supreme court allows it. They’ve pretty much won Florida though there are still appeals from the native Americans down there who run the casinos currently. What’s going to happen in time is there will be near nationwide sports gambling and all these companies like DraftKings and FanDuel will be joined by the big casinos and all the sports leagues have to negotiate a piece of that pie.

in one year, the legal sports gambling revenue jumped from a record high of 4 billion to over seven. And they don’t have access to California yet. Or Texas. And a lot of the states they do have limit the types.

When all these states get sick of seeing that revenue lost? The money will be insane. We’re talking $150 billion a year to break up primarily among the NFL NBA college football and basketball and combat sports. And that money will go up…forever. We can realistically project legalize sports betting in 11 new markets in the next few years. Do you know how much money Laker fans are going to hand directly to the NBA? A lot more than they spend going to games I promise you that.

The nba is shooting for a contract for 1 percent of all bets placed. That’s pure profit sucked from every day Americans going directly into their pocket without having to do anything to earn it. You consider that and that they’re definitely going to expand to both Las Vegas and Seattle if not Europe, which was David Stern’s plan and the revenue is going up for a good long time. we have to reach a point where the streaming wars are so settled. No of them even need to prove anything anymore.

Amazon has 200 million people paying them every month for services they barely use. Theyre leaving another billion people with Internet access on the table and both them and Apple want as much of it as they can because the forgotten about monthly subscription is where the money really is. Apple TV is shit. They got Messi to mls and the rights to those games. They got some baseball. But they need exclusive content. Amazon stole Thursday night football. Google got nfl Sunday ticket.

Someone needs the nba.

Long as they have them to play against each other and the ever looming monster of sports gambling?

Its not impossible we see 100 million a year super max deals in time. Sounds crazy but we went from 155 as the all time record to Jaylens 307 to be his teams second best player being a given. And it took like 6 years. 5 for 500….I think we will see it or close to it by the end of the next deal. 400 is a lock.

[FultzNationRISE]

In a few years? No. A decade to two decades? Maybe. You’re gonna have to get through the streaming bubble with every media company trying to buy their way into the game and knowing that live sports is a loadbearing wall of pay TV. Apple or Amazon are gonna straight up offer to buy espn at some point. There are a lot of major moves left. After that you have to get through the gambling bubble. Every state that doesn’t have legalized sports gambling is being lobbied hard to add it now at the supreme court allows it. They’ve pretty much won Florida though there are still appeals from the native Americans down there who run the casinos currently. What’s going to happen in time is there will be near nationwide sports gambling and all these companies like DraftKings and FanDuel will be joined by the big casinos and all the sports leagues have to negotiate a piece of that pie.

in one year, the legal sports gambling revenue jumped from a record high of 4 billion to over seven. And they don’t have access to California yet. Or Texas. And a lot of the states they do have limit the types.

When all these states get sick of seeing that revenue lost? The money will be insane. We’re talking $150 billion a year to break up primarily among the NFL NBA college football and basketball and combat sports. And that money will go up…forever.

The nba is shooting for a contract for 1 percent of all bets placed. That’s pure profit sucked from every day Americans going directly into their pocket without having to do anything to earn it. You consider that and that they’re definitely going to expand to both Las Vegas and Seattle if not Europe, which was David Stern’s plan and the revenue is going up for a good long time. we have to reach a point where the streaming wars are so settled. No of them even need to prove anything anymore.

Amazon has 200 million people paying them every month for services they barely use. Theyre leaving another billion people with Internet access on the table and both them and Apple want as much of it as they can because the forgotten about monthly subscription is where the money really is. Apple TV is shit. They got Messi to mls and the rights to those games. They got some baseball. But they need exclusive content. Amazon stole Thursday night football. Google got nfl Sunday ticket.

Someone needs the nba.

Long as they have them to play against each other and the ever looming monster of sports gambling?

Its not impossible we see 100 million a year super max deals in time. Sounds crazy but we went from 155 as the all time record to Jaylens 307 to be his teams second best player being a given. And it took like 6 years. 5 for 500….I think we will see it or close to it by the end of the next deal. 400 is a lock.


The drastic acceleration of speed and size just means we’re nearing closer to the end of the bubble. Its like falling into a black hole, the closer you get to the singularity the more warped things become from one moment to the next. Endless exponential growth is not sustainable.

Your decade or two estimation is way optimistic. The league’s bubble (or the networks, or whoever owes the money) will pop within five years, some kind of disaster will be declared and teams will force majeure their way out of these contracts theyre giving. It’s much closer than people think.

Bookmark it.

[FultzNationRISE]

Also… I aint posting no more, starting NOW!!!!

[Kblaze8855]

I was being told the same thing about the NFL during the Kapernick thing and I’ll tell you the same thing I told the wishful thinking alarmists then. Five years from now they’ll be making more money than ever and you’ll be telling me five years from that it’ll be over. I was right last time I’ll be right this time and I’ll be right next time. There is a fundamental misunderstanding of how these entities make all this money and until people realize that traditional means of gauging public interest don’t matter anymore you’re going to keep missing your projections.

They will eventually collapse, because everything eventually runs its course, but there is too much money already being guaranteed for it to be soon. World War III could start and the draft could be reinstated and they take half the players like they did the baseball in the 40s. As long as the league broadcast the games, the number of people who watch them won’t matter for the foreseeable future. Covid cost them money because they didn’t have anything to broadcast which put them in the breach of the rights deal. They’re going to put something on TV even if it’s the ISH all stars.

that and being within shouting distance of adding legal sports gambling to 100 million Americans in sports saturated markets like California, Texas, and Florida? Owners eating good for quite some time.

[FultzNationRISE]

I was being told the same thing about the NFL during the Kapernick thing and I’ll tell you the same thing I told the wishful thinking alarmists then. Five years from now they’ll be making more money than ever and you’ll be telling me five years from that it’ll be over. I was right last time I’ll be right this time and I’ll be right next time. There is a fundamental misunderstanding of how these entities make all this money and until people realize that traditional means of gauging public interest don’t matter anymore you’re going to keep missing your projections.

They will eventually collapse, because everything eventually runs its course, but there is too much money already being guaranteed for it to be soon. World War III could start and the draft could be reinstated and they take half the players like they did the baseball in the 40s. As long as the league broadcast the games, the number of people who watch them won’t matter for the foreseeable future. Covid cost them money because they didn’t have anything to broadcast which put them in the breach of the rights deal. They’re going to put something on TV even if it’s the ISH all stars.

that and being within shouting distance of adding legal sports gambling to 100 million Americans in sports saturated markets like California, Texas, and Florida? Owners eating good for quite some time.

The US pumped ten trillion dollars into the world economy 3 years ago. Thats why these deals are so much bigger.

Thats not a perpetual solution because the global economy/population is no longer growing at the rate it has through all of history. It’s a gigantic bubble. You cant keep pumping in money or you eventually devalue all of it, and a 300 Million dollar contract will mean as much as a homeless bum’s nickel.

Everyone is signing and paying these deals now because it’s everyone involved’s job to keep up with business as usual for now. But the deals themselves arent going to provide the tangible return long term to justify it. And eventually they cant keep borrowing the money. Look at the short lived “Alliance of American Football. (https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alliance_of_American_Football)” They were operating, playing games etc on borrowed money, and then just like that, the money ran out and the league was cancelled overnight.

It is absolutely a house of cards in the long run, and “the long run” is going to come sooner than you think.

Again… bookmark it.

[FultzNationRISE]

Also… I aint posting no more, starting NOW!!!!

This.

[Kblaze8855]

Comparing the AAF to the nfl is so ridiculous that even I with my well-known love of words, choose not to address it further

[FultzNationRISE]

Comparing the AAF to the nfl is so ridiculous that even I with my well-known love of words, choose not to address it further


Well GOOD! Cuz Im done posting about it!!!

[paksat]

But youll still watch

n0pe