The MJ/LeBron debate boiled down to 3 simple questions:

[Baller234]

Assume that MJ and Lebron are both in their primes and are both teammates.


1. Who is getting the ball and who is the team playing through in crunch time?

2. Tied or down a basket, who is the team drawing a play for in the final possession?

3. Who is the leader of the team?


This should be interesting.

[1987_Lakers]

LeBron
LeBron
LeBron

/thread

[8Ball]

I love how Jordan stans have to dumb down everything in order for a PPGz scorer to do well on the questionaire. :oldlol:



Even then the answer is:

LeBron
LeBron
LeBron

/thread

[SouBeachTalents]

1. LeGod, he has the most playoff GW's of all time

2. LeGod, Jordan usually had to get bailed out by Paxson or Kerr in these situations

3. LeGod, he's been the leader on multiple teams, even had his teammates make GOAT sounds in reference to him, while Jordan's teammates just talked about what a bald, degenerate gambling asshole he was

[8Ball]

3. LeGod, he's been the leader on multiple teams, even had his teammates make GOAT sounds in reference to him, while Jordan's teammates just talked about what a bald, degenerate gambling asshole he was

Damn.


Wade loves LeBron even after 2014.
Kyrie loves LeBron today even after 2017.
AD Loves LeBron.


Pippen hates Jordan and vice versa.

[bison]

These questions do not make a good indicator of who is GOAT and the only reason is you could sub MJ with most any other great (Kobe, bird, Duncan, wilt, etc) and the answer to all three questions will always be the guy that ISNT lebron :lol:

[Baller234]

These questions do not make a good indicator of who is GOAT and the only reason is you could sub MJ with most any other great (Kobe, bird, Duncan, wilt, etc) and the answer to all three questions will always be the guy that ISNT lebron :lol:

If you honestly feel that way, that says a lot about LeBron.

[bison]

If you honestly feel that way, that says a lot about LeBron.

Yes. Your questions don’t settle the GOAT debate but they do settle the fact lebron is a beta who doesn’t sniff the top 5

[Baller234]

Yes. Your questions don’t settle the GOAT debate but they do settle the fact lebron is a beta who doesn’t sniff the top 5

Ah, gotcha. I misinterpreted what you were saying.

I wasn't really asking who the GOAT is, just comparing MJ & LeBron.

[SaltyMeatballs]

Look at this idiot thinking he cherrypicked the right questions believing they would all go in the favor of Jordan :roll:

[SATAN]

Autistic neckbeard gonna autistic neckbeard.

[Baller234]

Look at this idiot thinking he cherrypicked the right questions believing they would all go in the favor of Jordan :roll:

What makes you think I cherry picked the questions?

I think these questions provide a more than fair assessment of who is the better hypothetical player.

[SATAN]

1. LeGod, he has the most playoff GW's of all time

2. LeGod, Jordan usually had to get bailed out by Paxson or Kerr in these situations

3. LeGod, he's been the leader on multiple teams, even had his teammates make GOAT sounds in reference to him, while Jordan's teammates just talked about what a bald, degenerate gambling asshole he was

So let me get this straight...The guy who is almost always wrong...is wrong yet again?

https://media.giphy.com/media/v1.Y2lkPTc5MGI3NjExcXBiMDIxdGJjbGg4b3hyODE1dHRsOHF qYnhtZ3VzNHhxdmJocWhxMyZlcD12MV9pbnRlcm5hbF9naWZfY nlfaWQmY3Q9Zw/LoHx6ykTaUB9Df6Ygb/giphy.gif

[SaltyMeatballs]

What makes you think I cherry picked the questions?

I think these questions provide a more than fair assessment of who is the better hypothetical player.

Well then your answer is LeBron

[Baller234]

Well then your answer is LeBron

Okay if you feel that way then fine. I disagree but you're entitled to your opinion.

But the questions themselves are absolutely a fair indicator. So it's kind of suspect that you guys would attack the questions, especially if you honestly felt that Lebron was the correct answer.

[Bawkish]

Damn.


Wade loves LeBron even after 2014.
Kyrie loves LeBron today even after 2017.
AD Loves LeBron.


Pippen hates Jordan and vice versa.

For them, Bron is a friend. Not their GOAT

[red1]

So let me get this straight...The guy who is almost always wrong...is wrong yet again?

https://media.giphy.com/media/v1.Y2lkPTc5MGI3NjExcXBiMDIxdGJjbGg4b3hyODE1dHRsOHF qYnhtZ3VzNHhxdmJocWhxMyZlcD12MV9pbnRlcm5hbF9naWZfY nlfaWQmY3Q9Zw/LoHx6ykTaUB9Df6Ygb/giphy.gif

not gonna lie I laughed :oldlol:

[Wally450]

Who beat a 70 win team in the Finals?


LeBron.

[Full Court]

Who beat a 70 win team in the Finals?


LeBron.

Who had the most epic choke job in the history of the sport in 2011?

LeShrivel.

[tontoz]

After all these years debating this topic has anyone here actually changed their mind about who is the GOAT?

[8Ball]

For them, Bron is a friend. Not their GOAT

Pippen called Bron the GOAT like 10 years ago before Pippen started hating Jordan.

Wade and AD have Chicago nostalgia.

[8Ball]

After all these years debating this topic has anyone here actually changed their mind about who is the GOAT?

10 years ago 95% of people thought Jordan was the GOAT.

Now it's only like 55-65%.

That's hundreds of millions of NBA fans that changed their minds.

[sdot_thadon]

Assume that MJ and Lebron are both in their primes and are both teammates.


1. Who is getting the ball and who is the team playing through in crunch time?

Lebron obviously, he's the superior playmaker of the 2 and is as capable as anyone ever down the stretch. The boring reality of it is, they'll play off each other and be an even nastier version of he and Wade. They'll run 2 man actions with Lebron and Mj and continuously cash in. Easy money.



2. Tied or down a basket, who is the team drawing a play for in the final possession?

Either one, Lebron has more playoff gamewinners than anyone to ever play the game, and that was before he reached any longevity plateu.



3. Who is the leader of the team?

Scottie Pippen was the leader of the 2nd 3peat Bulls according to their teammates. And I mean Mj was ome of the greatest leaders to ever walk the earth in Washington as well as Charlotte. Lebron has led many different ball clubs for different franchises and has done it well wherever he's gone. The 2 times he wasn't the clear leader? Rookie season, and 2011. We saw the results when he wasn't leading.



This should be interesting.
Yup maybe not in the way you expected it for sure.

[tontoz]

10 years ago 95% of people thought Jordan was the GOAT.

Now it's only like 55-65%.

That's hundreds of millions of NBA fans that changed their minds.


So you should be able to name a couple of people on here who changed their minds, right?

[RRR3]

So you should be able to name a couple of people on here who changed their minds, right?
Most of the LeBron fans, not like any LeBron fan thought he was GOAT in 2012 lol

[tontoz]

Most of the LeBron fans, not like any LeBron fan thought he was GOAT in 2012 lol

If that was the case then there wouldnt have been a big goat debate at that time so it would be irrelevant. :facepalm

Since you didn't understand the question the first time i will repeat it.


After all these years debating this topic has anyone here actually changed their mind about who is the GOAT?


I am not talking about the years before this topic was brought up. RIF

[dankok8]

1. Both. Jordan has better crunch time stats but you still run your team through Lebron late too.

2. Jordan. As a better scorer and shooter, he is the better choice to make the final play.

3. Both. Good cop bad cop situation is perfect for leadership.

[FKAri]

1. Lebron but MJ would be doing the scoring.
2. MJ
3. Lebron because he is just so much more gregarious than MJ

[Baller234]

An observation since I decided to post this yesterday:

Most of the replies thus far have favored Lebron, but the vast majority of them were troll posts with no real attempt to make a case. The only pro LeBron poster who approached the question seriously and tried to make a case was sdot_thadon.

I see that some of you are were attacking the questions themselves, as if to insinuate I was asking loaded questions that would favor Jordan somehow. I also think this is extremely telling.

[Airupthere]

10 years ago 95% of people thought Jordan was the GOAT.

Now it's only like 55-65%.

That's hundreds of millions of NBA fans that changed their minds.

95%, ten years ago.. Lebron is almost at the end of his career now and yet, 55% (assuming you are correct, lol)? Considering recency bias is on his side, lol.

[3ba11]

Kyrie, Wade and AD would match Lebron in usage for every conference finals or Finals except a few, and they would even lead him in ppg for numerous series or entire playoff runs

This doesn't compare to Jordan, who always carried his team's usage and ppg load, and he's the only player ever that won titles while leading the league in usage

So there's no comparison - Jordan carried a far bigger burden to win titles and had far less help, yet still had far superior teams and won much more.. it's a completely fake debate

[3ba11]

10 years ago 95% of people thought Jordan was the GOAT.

Now it's only like 55-65%.

That's hundreds of millions of NBA fans that changed their minds.


the 30% drop-off shows the resounding success of the fraud, aka creating a fake debate - it's an impressive feat to make people think that a player who isn't capable of having a winning Finals record over the long-term REGARDLESS OF CAST is infact the best player ever*..

(* bron is 20-21 in the Finals if we exclude 07', 15', 18', aka losing Finals record regardless of cast - literally not capable of having a winning Finals record no matter who we put around him.. goat doh)

[8Ball]

95%, ten years ago.. Lebron is almost at the end of his career now and yet, 55% (assuming you are correct, lol)? Considering recency bias is on his side, lol.

LeBron is fighting nostalgia of old white Jordan fans that were themselves young in the 80s.

That's even more powerful than recency bias.

[8Ball]

the 30% drop-off shows the resounding success of the fraud, aka creating a fake debate - it's an impressive feat to make people think that a player who isn't capable of having a winning Finals record over the long-term REGARDLESS OF CAST is infact the best player ever*..

(* bron is 20-21 in the Finals if we exclude 07', 15', 18', aka losing Finals record regardless of cast - literally not capable of having a winning Finals record no matter who we put around him.. goat doh)

Jordan has officially lost the unanimous GOAT title forever and will never get it back.

We won.

[8Ball]

So you should be able to name a couple of people on here who changed their minds, right?


Paul Pierce and Kevin Garnett call LeBron their GOAT. They changed their mind.

If you go on reddit you see posts of ex LeBron haters admitting they hated Bron but call him the GOAT.


Whatever is left of certain LeBron haters congregate here because they get banned every where else for retardation. I wouldn't use this forum as any kind of signal. I don't need to post on realgm or reddit because its mostly LeBron fans there.

[Da_Realist]

Assume that MJ and Lebron are both in their primes and are both teammates.


1. Who is getting the ball and who is the team playing through in crunch time?

2. Tied or down a basket, who is the team drawing a play for in the final possession?

3. Who is the leader of the team?


This should be interesting.

1. Mr Turnovers and Chokes is getting the ball over Jordan in crunch time? No, he would be doing what he did when Kyrie beat Golden State: standing in the corner watching like the rest of us.

2. LOL. Make that a double LOL

3. :roll:

ISH is full of idiots. Keep believing your made up narratives. :oldlol:

[tontoz]

Paul Pierce and Kevin Garnett call LeBron their GOAT. They changed their mind.

If you go on reddit you see posts of ex LeBron haters admitting they hated Bron but call him the GOAT.


Whatever is left of certain LeBron haters congregate here because they get banned every where else for retardation. I wouldn't use this forum as any kind of signal. I don't need to post on realgm or reddit because its mostly LeBron fans there.


RIF :facepalm

Pretty sure Pierce and Garnett aren't posting on here.


Quote Originally Posted by tontoz View Post
So you should be able to name a couple of people on here who changed their minds, right?

[SaltyMeatballs]

Who had the most epic choke job in the history of the sport in 2011?

LeShrivel.

So tell us. What happened 5 years after that?

[SATAN]

1. Mr Turnovers and Chokes is getting the ball over Jordan in crunch time? No, he would be doing what he did when Kyrie beat Golden State: standing in the corner watching like the rest of us.





He might pass to Paxson or Kerr. :lebronamazed:

Don't talk about ish being full of idiots when it's clear you don't even understand basketball.

[8Ball]

RIF :facepalm

Pretty sure Pierce and Garnett aren't posting on here.

Mr. Jabbar

Greatest LeBron hater into LeBron fan.


Any other kind of point you want to make?

[tontoz]

Mr. Jabbar

Greatest LeBron hater into LeBron fan.


Any other kind of point you want to make?


When was the last time he even posted?

The point is that there is no point to this argument that has been an everyday thing for years. It is the same people posting the same nonsense over and over.

The point is that all of you in this argument have some 3ball in you but you just don't want to admit it, just like 3ball doesn't want to admit he is a nut job.

[Baller234]

Jordan has officially lost the unanimous GOAT title forever and will never get it back.

We won.

I wouldn't be so quick to gloat. In your first post you accused me of tilting the questions in favor of Jordan. I think that is very telling. It reveals that when you saw the questions, your gut instinct went to Jordan.

I don't think someone who genuinely thought the questions favored LeBron would have gone out of their way to make that accusation.

[sdot_thadon]

1. Mr Turnovers and Chokes is getting the ball over Jordan in crunch time? No, he would be doing what he did when Kyrie beat Golden State: standing in the corner watching like the rest of us.

2. LOL. Make that a double LOL

3. :roll:

ISH is full of idiots. Keep believing your made up narratives. :oldlol:

At the end of a post made up of narratives. Can't make this shit up lol.

[Duffy Pratt]

Only clear answer to these three questions is:

Larry Bird

[ELITEpower23]

I love how Jordan stans have to dumb down everything in order for a PPGz scorer to do well on the questionaire. :oldlol:



Even then the answer is:

LeBron
LeBron
LeBron

/thread

Gottem :lol

NEXT

[Axe]

I love how Jordan stans have to dumb down everything in order for a PPGz scorer to do well on the questionaire. :oldlol:



Even then the answer is:

LeBron
LeBron
LeBron

/thread
https://c.tenor.com/dnlIGrSiEhYAAAAC/tenor.gif

[Keno]

LeBron
LeBron
LeBron

/thread

in all seriousness, this is the correct answer to all of OP's questions.

[Baller234]

I strongly disagree that you are better off giving the ball to Lebron in crunch time over Mike.

If your back is against the wall and you absolutely need a basket, there is almost zero argument for Bron. Maybe he would be the answer 99% of the time, but not when the other guy is Jordan.

Remember your goal is to get a basket first. Lebron can do that sure but Jordan can do it better. Both have the ability to create for open teammates so if that's the case why not give the ball to the guy who's better at scoring?

And yes Jordan is better at scoring when push comes to shove. Lebron does not have a reliable go-to move. He is either settling for a long range jumper or he is driving to the basket and hoping for the best. Meanwhile Jordan can get to his spot anytime and get himself a decent look. He could score facing up and he could score in the post, OR he can drive it on you just like Lebron. That combined with his ice cold veins and lack of fear. AND he's better at the free throw line.

There really is no argument for Lebron.

[RRR3]

I strongly disagree that you are better off giving the ball to Lebron in crunch time over Mike.

If your back is against the wall and you absolutely need a basket, there is almost zero argument for Bron. Maybe he would be the answer 99% of the time, but not when the other guy is Jordan.

Remember your goal is to get a basket first. Lebron can do that sure but Jordan can do it better. Both have the ability to create for open teammates so if that's the case why not give the ball to the guy who's better at scoring?

And yes Jordan is better at scoring when push comes to shove. Lebron does not have a reliable go-to move. He is either settling for a long range jumper or he is driving to the basket and hoping for the best. Meanwhile Jordan can get to his spot anytime and get himself a decent look. He could score facing up and he could score in the post, OR he can drive it on you just like Lebron. That combined with his ice cold veins and lack of fear. AND he's better at the free throw line.

There really is no argument for Lebron.
I’d rather have Kyrie Irving than Dwight Howard if I needed someone to create a shot late. Guess who the better player was though.

[Baller234]

I’d rather have Kyrie Irving than Dwight Howard if I needed someone to create a shot late. Guess who the better player was though.

I never said it did.

I was talking strictly to those who said they would rather give the ball to Lebron in crunch time, which was several of you.

[bizil]

For me it's about MJ's edge in killer instinct scoring the rock (not saying Bron doesn't have it though) VS. the more pass first and positionless nature of Bron's game. Me personally, I consider MJ the GOAT still. AND the better player peak-prime wise. BECAUSE MJ gives you the ULTIMATE KILLER who ALSO has the total package floor game (passing, rebounding his position, defense), and has great positional versatility (can play or defend PG, SG, and SF).

However Bron is the best all around player of all time. And if I was a dominant scorer, I would rather play with Bron than MJ. Because I know Bron looks to pass first, BUT can still score just as much as me IF NEEDED with that mindset. So I would STILL get all the scoring help I would need. And Bron can plug more holes than MJ on a squad. Because he's the rare positionless type of player.

So even though I prefer MJ, it could come down to what you prefer. Or what you need. BOTH players are dominant scorers, great all around players, freakish athletic, and have as much positional versatility one could have at their respective sizes. BUT MJ is a score first phenom while Bron is more of a pass first phenom! GOAT wise Bron could VERY WELL pass MJ by. And I won't agrue TOO HARD is somebody already considers Bron the GOAT. But I would STILL disagree!

[TheMan]

I strongly disagree that you are better off giving the ball to Lebron in crunch time over Mike.

If your back is against the wall and you absolutely need a basket, there is almost zero argument for Bron. Maybe he would be the answer 99% of the time, but not when the other guy is Jordan.

Remember your goal is to get a basket first. Lebron can do that sure but Jordan can do it better. Both have the ability to create for open teammates so if that's the case why not give the ball to the guy who's better at scoring?

And yes Jordan is better at scoring when push comes to shove. Lebron does not have a reliable go-to move. He is either settling for a long range jumper or he is driving to the basket and hoping for the best. Meanwhile Jordan can get to his spot anytime and get himself a decent look. He could score facing up and he could score in the post, OR he can drive it on you just like Lebron. That combined with his ice cold veins and lack of fear. AND he's better at the free throw line.

There really is no argument for Lebron.

This actually the best post in this troll infested site...but no one is changing their minds, either you stan LeBron or MJ and neither side is budging.

[TheMan]

I never said it did.

I was talking strictly to those who said they would rather give the ball to Lebron in crunch time, which was several of you.

:lol

[8Ball]

I wouldn't be so quick to gloat. In your first post you accused me of tilting the questions in favor of Jordan. I think that is very telling. It reveals that when you saw the questions, your gut instinct went to Jordan.

I don't think someone who genuinely thought the questions favored LeBron would have gone out of their way to make that accusation.

Because PPGz is the only lens Jordan tards can think through, and we see right through it for a decade now.

You can't fool us anymore.


Even then I give LeBron the ball over Jordan 7-8 out of 10 times in clutch time... I also give LeBron the ball 75% of the time throughout the entire game.

And for sure Lebron is the leader of the team 100% of the time, no doubt.

[sdot_thadon]

I strongly disagree that you are better off giving the ball to Lebron in crunch time over Mike.

If your back is against the wall and you absolutely need a basket, there is almost zero argument for Bron. Maybe he would be the answer 99% of the time, but not when the other guy is Jordan.

Remember your goal is to get a basket first. Lebron can do that sure but Jordan can do it better. Both have the ability to create for open teammates so if that's the case why not give the ball to the guy who's better at scoring?

And yes Jordan is better at scoring when push comes to shove. Lebron does not have a reliable go-to move. He is either settling for a long range jumper or he is driving to the basket and hoping for the best. Meanwhile Jordan can get to his spot anytime and get himself a decent look. He could score facing up and he could score in the post, OR he can drive it on you just like Lebron. That combined with his ice cold veins and lack of fear. AND he's better at the free throw line.

There really is no argument for Lebron.


Jordan's teams lost anywhere between 10 and 52 games any given season of his career. That means there were plenty of games they "needed a bucket" and he didn't get it. Yes he was clutch, no he didn't save the day everytime. I feel like we look back on Mjs career as highlights only, no one acknowledges any shortcoming or failure because those didnt make the reels lol, meanwhile we're watching Lebron's in realtime holding him to a standard we never held Mj to.

[Baller234]

Jordan's teams lost anywhere between 10 and 52 games any given season of his career. That means there were plenty of games they "needed a bucket" and he didn't get it. Yes he was clutch, no he didn't save the day everytime. I feel like we look back on Mjs career as highlights only, no one acknowledges any shortcoming or failure because those didnt make the reels lol, meanwhile we're watching Lebron's in realtime holding him to a standard we never held Mj to.

This seems like a defensive, emotional post. Of course there were times Jordan couldn't get the job done, and? The fact of the matter is that he is more reliable in those situations than Bron. Especially if it is a big time game with high stakes.

The history and the resume speaks for itself. You can give the ball to Jordan and let him take care of the rest. He was that skilled and that fearless. More often than not you'll be okay. Plus he could seal the game from the free throw line if need be.

Lebron asked to be held to this standard. He said he was striving to be better than Jordan. He even came into the league wearing the guy's number. He put that pressure on himself.

[Baller234]

Because PPGz is the only lens Jordan tards can think through, and we see right through it for a decade now.

You can't fool us anymore.


Even then I give LeBron the ball over Jordan 7-8 out of 10 times in clutch time... I also give LeBron the ball 75% of the time throughout the entire game.

And for sure Lebron is the leader of the team 100% of the time, no doubt.

I see zero arguments being made in this post. No facts, no reasoning, no insight... nothing.

I just see emotion.

[Axe]

^^Casual confirmed.

[SATAN]

Jordan's teams lost anywhere between 10 and 52 games any given season of his career. That means there were plenty of games they "needed a bucket" and he didn't get it. Yes he was clutch, no he didn't save the day everytime. I feel like we look back on Mjs career as highlights only, no one acknowledges any shortcoming or failure because those didnt make the reels lol, meanwhile we're watching Lebron's in realtime holding him to a standard we never held Mj to.

You're right. We all know it. All us non-casual basketball fans that is. Take "the shot" for instance... It was the FIRST ****ING ROUND OF THE PLAYOFFS yet has gone down as practically the best thing since sliced bread among Mikey's brainwashed devotees and sports media. Wow! an 18 ft jump shot over Craig Ehlo! All praise our Master MJ! :oldlol: LeBron does this? You wouldn't hear a peep out of them as it's expected anyway. I don't want to be rude but it's absolutely sickening how stupid these people are. They are toxic as ****.

EDIT: Actually if LeBron did it they would be dishonestly claiming he traveled or something lol.