Was the Gobert trade actually a steal?

[90sgoat]

Best team in the NBA, Gobert supposedly playing great.

I wanted Mavs to get Gobert and I'm absolutely sure if Mavs had Gobert, they'd win a ring.

People like to make fun of Gobert because they're racist and have low IQ, but as a product of the superior european basketball system, he is simply much easier to build around as a chucker like Donovan Mitchell, who is putting up empty stats in the East on a team that is barely .500

[Xiao Yao You]

Best team in the NBA, Gobert supposedly playing great.

I wanted Mavs to get Gobert and I'm absolutely sure if Mavs had Gobert, they'd win a ring.

People like to make fun of Gobert because they're racist and have low IQ, but as a product of the superior european basketball system, he is simply much easier to build around as a chucker like Donovan Mitchell, who is putting up empty stats in the East on a team that is barely .500

I've heard Gobert is white and sucks and that Mitchell is one of the top players in the league

The Jazz certainly would have been one of the top teams if they'd made the Cavs trade and kept Gobert instead of one of the worst teams but I heard COTM made Gobert. How are his Hawks doing with Capela who is supposedly just as good?

[90sgoat]

I've heard Gobert is white and sucks and that Mitchell is one of the top players in the league

The Jazz certainly would have been one of the top teams if they'd made the Cavs trade and kept Gobert instead of one of the worst teams but I heard COTM made Gobert. How are his Hawks doing with Capela who is supposedly just as good?

Yeah, Gobert was never the issue, the sulking chucker who didn't play a lick of defense was.

Utah had a good core with Bojan and Conley, they just needed some better wing defenders and shooters.

[Kblaze8855]

With 4 first round picks and several pick swaps to go there is obviously no way to say what the other side even is. But there’s nothing that can happen in the regular season that would make another good big and a half dozen pics worth it for me. They won 46 games before the trade. 42 last year with injuries. We will see how this season ends but it doesn’t seem anybody cares about the good records the Jazz had with Mitchell or Rudy now. They are of absolutely no value right now.

You get clowned in the playoffs. None of this matters and history has told us that dozens of times.

A kings ransom of picks to lose in the playoffs anyway is tough to call a W. Like everything always does the playoffs will decide how it looks long term. The Clippers being great that one year with George is hardly hurting OKCs feelings with a team of young good players and the much brighter future. And the Clippers followed that year up with another season they made the wcf.

Not one person here cares.

Minny has a lot to do before this version of them is remembered as worth all they gave up to get it.

[Xiao Yao You]

With 4 first round picks and several pick swaps to go there is obviously no way to say what the other side even is. But there’s nothing that can happen in the regular season that would make another good big and a half dozen pics worth it for me. They won 46 games before the trade. 42 last year with injuries. We will see how this season ends but it doesn’t seem anybody cares about the good records the Jazz had with Mitchell or Rudy now. They are of absolutely no value right now.

You get clowned in the playoffs. None of this matters and history has told us that dozens of times.

A kings ransom of picks to lose in the playoffs anyway is tough to call a W. Like everything always does the playoffs will decide how it looks long term. The Clippers being great that one year with George is hardly hurting OKCs feelings with a team of young good players and the much brighter future. And the Clippers followed that year up with another season they made the wcf.

Not one person here cares.

Minny has a lot to do before this version of them is remembered as worth all they gave up to get it.

pulling multiple upsets in the playoffs is getting clowned?

[Kblaze8855]

Whatever you wanna call three total series wins one of them versus a 38 win team, and the other two versus teams with the exact same record.

Call that whatever you want. Nobody cares it happened either way. It isn’t the kind of winning that keeps criticism of any kinda at bay.

It’s the kind of “winning” pointed at by losers. It’s Clipper winning. It’s the golden era for a franchise like the pelicans or something.

[FireDavidKahn]

It's a lot but when you take a step back and look at everything, it really isn't that bad...Especially when you put it in the context that the Wolves are the worst franchise in all of MLB, NFL, NBA, NHL...

1) We now have arguably the best team we've ever had in history. We are dominating the league. If certain things align we can match up with any team. Gobert aside, we are one of the deepest teams in the league.

2) Star players very rarely will stay with the team that drafted them for their entire careers. I'd love if Ant decided to play his entire career here but the odds of that happening are slim. That isn't because this is Minnesota or that the Wolves historically have sucked....it's just the reality that star players rarely ever stick with one team their whole careers.

3) Given point 2, that puts us in a realistic window to go for it during Ant's next 5 years here while he plays out his contract. A 1st round pick in 2027 or 2029 does literally nothing to help Ant out. Even if we drafted a good player in those drafts the odds that they would even have positive impact would start in the 2030's...

4) We added more 1st round picks in order to keep Jaden McDaniels. It was either send McDaniels or we keep 2 1st round picks...that's an easy choice.

Given the context of this franchise and that we need to focus on Ant's current 5 year window here and that some of the assets given up wouldn't help out Ant at all, I got no problem with what we gave up. If things go south we will recuperate assets by trading Ant/KAT/Gobert down the road IF it comes to that down the road.

[999Guy]

Best team in the NBA, Gobert supposedly playing great.

I wanted Mavs to get Gobert and I'm absolutely sure if Mavs had Gobert, they'd win a ring.

People like to make fun of Gobert because they're racist and have low IQ, but as a product of the superior european basketball system, he is simply much easier to build around as a chucker like Donovan Mitchell, who is putting up empty stats in the East on a team that is barely .500
Gobert went to probably the worst fit possible and turned them into the best team in franchise history. People won’t ever see it that way but that’s exactly what happened.

I’m still bitter the Clippers, Mavs, Raptors, Celtics, Suns etc didn’t go hard to get him.

Kyrie? Old busted Hamstring Harden? Lillard? Beal? Middle aged CP3? These one dimensional ball dominating guards are the big moves supposed title contenders tried to make?

I said before, people don’t tend to realize just how stupid coaches and GM’s are. The lack of scouting and proper roster construction. Timerbwolves included, Towns should’ve been traded yesterday. Oh well.

[RRR3]

It's a lot but when you take a step back and look at everything, it really isn't that bad...Especially when you put it in the context that the Wolves are the worst franchise in all of MLB, NFL, NBA, NHL...

1) We now have arguably the best team we've ever had in history. We are dominating the league. If certain things align we can match up with any team. Gobert aside, we are one of the deepest teams in the league.

2) Star players very rarely will stay with the team that drafted them for their entire careers. I'd love if Ant decided to play his entire career here but the odds of that happening are slim. That isn't because this is Minnesota or that the Wolves historically have sucked....it's just the reality that star players rarely ever stick with one team their whole careers.

3) Given point 2, that puts us in a realistic window to go for it during Ant's next 5 years here while he plays out his contract. A 1st round pick in 2027 or 2029 does literally nothing to help Ant out. Even if we drafted a good player in those drafts the odds that they would even have positive impact would start in the 2030's...

4) We added more 1st round picks in order to keep Jaden McDaniels. It was either send McDaniels or we keep 2 1st round picks...that's an easy choice.

Given the context of this franchise and that we need to focus on Ant's current 5 year window here and that some of the assets given up wouldn't help out Ant at all, I got no problem with what we gave up. If things go south we will recuperate assets by trading Ant/KAT/Gobert down the road IF it comes to that down the road.
I get that you’re desperate for success as a Wolves fan and I feel for y’all but I absolutely cannot take KAT and the Toods seriously in a playoff series. And I actually quite like KAT, he seems like a great guy and I’m a fan of his skillset, but he’s just not a playoff performer so far.

[FireDavidKahn]

I get that you’re desperate for success as a Wolves fan and I feel for y’all but I absolutely cannot take KAT and the Toods seriously in a playoff series. And I actually quite like KAT, he seems like a great guy and I’m a fan of his skillset, but he’s just not a playoff performer so far.

I don't disagree with anything you said. KAT and Rudy have to prove they can keep this level of play up in the play offs. Neither has ever played on a team this talented.

[Real Men Wear Green]

Yes, 5 first round picks for a non allstar is a steal.

[Manny98]

Yes, 5 first round picks for a non allstar is a steal.

:oldlol:

[90sgoat]

I said before, people don’t tend to realize just how stupid coaches and GM’s are. The lack of scouting and proper roster construction. Timerbwolves included, Towns should’ve been traded yesterday. Oh well.

People around the NBA seem to buy into hype and disregard fit way too much.

They struggle to separate a player from their situation, both good or bad.

[90sgoat]

Yes, 5 first round picks for a non allstar is a steal.

5 first round picks like Scoot potentially. Or Fatboy Zion.

You go with the proven talent.

[Kblaze8855]

5 first round picks like Scoot potentially. Or Fatboy Zion.

You go with the proven talent.


Im not sure the “proven talent” has ever been the winning side of these things. You would have to be so terrible at drafting…

Worst case you have a shot at 3-4 stars though nobody gets them all. But these things are so far reaching.

Webber was traded for Googs who became an all star and picks that ended up Vince Carter, Todd Fuller, and Chris Mihm which is fine itself….but the pick they used on Todd Fuller could have been used to take Kobe, Nash, Peja, or Jermaine O’Neal.


they basically traded Chris Webber for an all star and the option of taking Kobe or Nash one year and then Vince, Dirk, or Pierce later. And the 7th pick in 2000 too.

It’s impossible to know how these things shake out.

[NBAGOAT]

It’s not a steal but I like this team a lot and they’re the most likely team with 3 all stars this year. Goberts been that good on defense and he has the narrative

[tontoz]

No for what they gave up it will never be considered a steal. However it can be considered a success if they do well in the playoffs the next few years.

[GimmeThat]

the Jazz just stepped out of bounds and turned the ball over.

[Xiao Yao You]

Whatever you wanna call three total series wins one of them versus a 38 win team, and the other two versus teams with the exact same record.

Call that whatever you want. Nobody cares it happened either way. It isn’t the kind of winning that keeps criticism of any kinda at bay.

It’s the kind of “winning” pointed at by losers. It’s Clipper winning. It’s the golden era for a franchise like the pelicans or something.

it's 2nd round as an underdog vs lottery without him

[Xiao Yao You]

It's a lot but when you take a step back and look at everything, it really isn't that bad...Especially when you put it in the context that the Wolves are the worst franchise in all of MLB, NFL, NBA, NHL...

1) We now have arguably the best team we've ever had in history. We are dominating the league. If certain things align we can match up with any team. Gobert aside, we are one of the deepest teams in the league.

2) Star players very rarely will stay with the team that drafted them for their entire careers. I'd love if Ant decided to play his entire career here but the odds of that happening are slim. That isn't because this is Minnesota or that the Wolves historically have sucked....it's just the reality that star players rarely ever stick with one team their whole careers.

3) Given point 2, that puts us in a realistic window to go for it during Ant's next 5 years here while he plays out his contract. A 1st round pick in 2027 or 2029 does literally nothing to help Ant out. Even if we drafted a good player in those drafts the odds that they would even have positive impact would start in the 2030's...

4) We added more 1st round picks in order to keep Jaden McDaniels. It was either send McDaniels or we keep 2 1st round picks...that's an easy choice.

Given the context of this franchise and that we need to focus on Ant's current 5 year window here and that some of the assets given up wouldn't help out Ant at all, I got no problem with what we gave up. If things go south we will recuperate assets by trading Ant/KAT/Gobert down the road IF it comes to that down the road.

Can other teams match up with them is the question? No one can right now. I'd expect at the trade deadline and buyouts other teams will try to get bigger but good luck getting bigger while still being able to defend like they are. Only way anyone can hope to beat them is with mismatches

[Xiao Yao You]

Yes, 5 first round picks for a non allstar is a steal.

for the greatest defender of his generation and an all NBA player it's certainly paying off in the short term

[Kblaze8855]

it's 2nd round as an underdog vs lottery without him

it’s nothing versus nothing with false hope. Teams pull off actual upsets to no real result all the time. You have to know nobody gives a shit about beating a team with the same record as you. Plenty of people who actually win get overwhelming criticism. Too many for you to be forever harping on beating two equal teams to make the second round in a decade of false hope. You’re a jazz fan. You have at least seen great teams in your life even if not champions. You should have higher standards than you do.

[Xiao Yao You]

it’s nothing versus nothing with false hope. Teams pull off actual upsets to no real result all the time. You have to know nobody gives a shit about beating a team with the same record as you. Plenty of people who actually win get overwhelming criticism. Too many for you to be forever harping on beating two equal teams to make the second round in a decade of false hope. You’re a jazz fan. You have at least seen great teams in your life even if not champions. You should have higher standards than you do.

I've seen it all and only the statues can compare no matter how much you want to hype beating the 8th seed

[Xiao Yao You]

He thinks the good stuff from last year is still in the lineup. “I think now it’s just (doing it on) a consistent basis,” said Mitchell, explaining he hadn’t been through this kind of thing since his rookie season in Utah. “But that was all a blur.” That 2017-18 Jazz band started 19-27 before winning 11 straight and making it to the second round of the playoffs. “So it’s just figuring that out, and part of myself as being a leader is not only leading, but also being able to listen and be receptive and finding a way,” he said. “So we’ll figure it out.” (https://heavy.com/sports/cleveland-cavaliers/donovan-mitchell-not-deflated/)

– via Steve Bulpett @ Heavy.com (https://heavy.com/sports/cleveland-cavaliers/donovan-mitchell-not-deflated/)



yeah Gobert came back from injury and carried your sorry ass to the playoffs after being closer to the top pick in the draft than the playoffs :lol

[Proctor]

Gobert and KAT are the soft bros. Wayyyy too much hype for this team.

The trade was a steal for Utah, no doubt.

[Xiao Yao You]

Gobert and KAT are the soft bros. Wayyyy too much hype for this team.

The trade was a steal for Utah, no doubt.

He's no Greg Monroe but Gobert is hardly soft. Jazz are one of the worst teams in the league and have held their opponent under 100 once since he left :facepalm

[Kblaze8855]

I've seen it all and only the statues can compare no matter how much you want to hype beating the 8th seed

Going to the conference finals is simply a greater accomplishment than beating a team with the same record as you to go to the second round. Just what it is. You’re free to be impressed by whatever you want. Nobody has reason to talk about any Jazz teams accomplishments in 20 years. Just the 90s Hawks. 55-56 wins. Don’t matter once the games count. Won’t be in any era recap. Will possibly never be spoken of out loud once our generation is dead.

Nothing to even mention in passing. Some real Ft.Wayne pistons shit lost to history. If we ignore how much more accomplished Ft Wayne was at least.

[Xiao Yao You]

Going to the conference finals is simply a greater accomplishment than beating a team with the same record as you to go to the second round. Just what it is. You’re free to be impressed by whatever you want. Nobody has reason to talk about any Jazz teams accomplishments in 20 years. Just the 90s Hawks. 55-56 wins. Don’t matter once the games count. Won’t be in any era recap. Will possibly never be spoken of out loud once our generation is dead.

Nothing to even mention in passing. Some real Ft.Wayne pistons shit lost to history. If we ignore how much more accomplished Ft Wayne was at least.

I tend to judge things on a case by case basis. Kidd and Iverson going to the NBA finals out of a weak conference or beating the 8th seed to go to the conference finals not the same as going through a gauntlet. Jazz lost one series with Gobert where you could argue they were favored. Not sure if they were or not? Had the higher seed because of their hot start while everyone else dealt with Covid

[Kblaze8855]

Somehow your claims of higher standards when judging something as impressive ring hollow after years of watching you talking up a lottery team having the sixth best record after the All-Star break and talking about playoff “upsets” of 2 teams with the exact same record, one of which was won while Rudy played 13 minutes in game seven.

Your standards don’t seem to be high as much as entirely dependent on your emotional connection to the subject matter.

Rudy Gobert has accomplished nothing in his entire career to justify the devotion of somebody who has discerning standards when it comes to handing out praise for winning.

[Norcaliblunt]

This is a classic example of people arguing just to argue.

Right now the trade is working for the Wolves.

Is title or bust the expectations?

Lol.

You fools are why there’s a pointless in season tournament.

[Kblaze8855]

If you trade 5+ picks for a final piece to add to two other all star caliber young guys and trade for a guy like Conley too?

What would you say the goal was?

To make the second round?

I don’t think title or bust is the way to judge baseline success. But when you go all in?

I don’t think teams do that with expectation of being good and flaming out. If Minny did all this to be happy with a good showing? It’s probably a loser franchise to begin with. If I’m the owner and you tell me we have no draft capital for half a decade I don’t assume it’s to be a pretender for half a decade.

[tontoz]

They have been irrelevant for so long I think getting to the finals would be considered a success given how many good teams they have to get through.

If they don't get to the wcf over the next few years that would have to be considered a failure imo.

[Real Men Wear Green]

for the greatest defender of his generation and an all NBA player it's certainly paying off in the short term

Well sure but they only got Gobert.

[Norcaliblunt]

If you trade 5+ picks for a final piece to add to two other all star caliber young guys and trade for a guy like Conley too?

What would you say the goal was?

To make the second round?

I don’t think title or bust is the way to judge baseline success. But when you go all in?

I don’t think teams do that with expectation of being good and flaming out. If Minny did all this to be happy with a good showing? It’s probably a loser franchise to begin with. If I’m the owner and you tell me we have no draft capital for half a decade I don’t assume it’s to be a pretender for half a decade.

I disagree.

If we actually put stock and accolade into a team having the best record in the regular season maybe you wouldn’t see guys sitting out load managing and a pointless in season tournament.

Best record in regular season is an accomplishment even if you get bounced early in the playoffs.

[Kblaze8855]

They have been irrelevant for so long I think getting to the finals would be considered a success given how many good teams they have to get through.

If they don't get to the wcf over the next few years that would have to be considered a failure imo.

Id say the finals would do. They don’t have to win. A finals team at least has a place in history. Especially for a historically irrelevant franchise.

[Xiao Yao You]

Somehow your claims of higher standards when judging something as impressive ring hollow after years of watching you talking up a lottery team having the sixth best record after the All-Star break and talking about playoff “upsets” of 2 teams with the exact same record, one of which was won while Rudy played 13 minutes in game seven.

Your standards don’t seem to be high as much as entirely dependent on your emotional connection to the subject matter.

Rudy Gobert has accomplished nothing in his entire career to justify the devotion of somebody who has discerning standards when it comes to handing out praise for winning.

lottery because he was their 4th big to start the year and didn't start until they traded Kanter at the deadline. They had the lower seed which means they didn't have home court advantage. As far as the Jazz franchise he can't be praised enough. Only one player made bad teams good for several years. They were tanking. He ruined their plans

[Xiao Yao You]

Id say the finals would do. They don’t have to win. A finals team at least has a place in history. Especially for a historically irrelevant franchise.

apparently conference finals get some guys a place a history even if they only had to beat the 8th seed to get there

[Kblaze8855]

I disagree.

If we actually put stock and accolade into a team having the best record in the regular season maybe you wouldn’t see guys sitting out load managing and a pointless in season tournament.

Best record in regular season is an accomplishment even if you get bounced early in the playoffs.

I’d say the point of the in season tournament is to have games players and fans care about before Christmas and the post All-Star game sprint for the playoffs. They managed to accomplish that by getting the players to buy in for a check. Rest assured I wouldn’t have seen a Pacers Laker game this season outside that. But I watched it and saw a hard played game both teams wanted to win in December. It was worth my time.

teams barely make game to game adjustments in the regular season. A farmer executive who started out as a video scout for the suns was talking about the difference between playoff and regular season prep. The scouts are working 18 hour days for a playoff game. The regular season is there to get your basic style of play down.

Teams are definitely not doing all they can do to win those games though. The games matter in that they are most of the games a player will ever play so you have to use them to evaluate, but for a franchise? A coach can have the best record in the league and get fired two weeks later if they flame out. The franchise shouldn’t have regular season Sized ambitions, if they’re building a lineup with three or four All-Stars.

If you aren’t that worried about the playoffs, I don’t think you make the kind of trade we are talking about. I’ll give it some thought though. There may be exceptions.

[Norcaliblunt]

I’d say the point of the in season tournament is to have games players and fans care about before Christmas and the post All-Star game sprint for the playoffs. They managed to accomplish that by getting the players to buy in for a check. Rest assured I wouldn’t have seen a Pacers Laker game this season outside that. But I watched it and saw a hard played game both teams wanted to win in December. It was worth my time.

teams barely make game to game adjustments in the regular season. A farmer executive who started out as a video scout for the suns was talking about the difference between playoff and regular season prep. The scouts are working 18 hour days for a playoff game. The regular season is there to get your basic style of play down.

Teams are definitely not doing all they can do to win those games though. The games matter in that they are most of the games a player will ever play so you have to use them to evaluate, but for a franchise? A coach can have the best record in the league and get fired two weeks later if they flame out. The franchise shouldn’t have regular season Sized ambitions, if they’re building a lineup with three or four All-Stars.

If you aren’t that worried about the playoffs, I don’t think you make the kind of trade we are talking about. I’ll give it some thought though. There may be exceptions.

Lmao. So they openly admit they don’t care and everyone still watches anyway?

What other industry can do that? Not care at all for it’s clients, customers, and consumers 90% of the time?

Shits hilarious.

And homie quit acting like the playoffs are not just as fake as the regular season. Injuries suspensions conference seedlings etc make for way bigger asterisks when it comes to titles than any regular season flukes. Lol.

[SaltyMeatballs]

Not for what was given up to get him

However, Gobert's proved to be very valuable to them this season

[Kblaze8855]

apparently conference finals get some guys a place a history even if they only had to beat the 8th seed to get there

i’m not certain, but I might be able to name every conference finals team ever. Perhaps not by season for the teams in the 50s 60s and 70s but I think I could name every core to ever make it that far.

That said I readily accept The label of “weirdo” about such things.

I don’t know what I would put in a career summary of him from a team perspective. Back in the day, when teams would hang division champion banners, and you would see recaps like “Always a winner he made the playoffs in 8 of his 12 seasons for the Rockets” . Not so much today. He’s won as much in the playoffs as Bradley Beal. You imagine a Bradley Beal career recap is going to mention three conference semifinals? You just leave that section out and talk about other things. It’ll say defensive player of the year and mention some rebound numbers and I imagine that’s it.

The part of the recap, where they talk about what he won is not yet written. Perhaps it will be but right now?

[Kblaze8855]

Lmao. So they openly admit they don’t care and everyone still watches anyway?

What other industry can do that? Not care at all for it’s clients, customers, and consumers 90% of the time?

Shits hilarious.

And homie quit acting like the playoffs are not just as fake as the regular season. Injuries suspensions conference seedlings etc make for way bigger asterisks when it comes to titles than any regular season flukes. Lol.

I don’t think it’s not caring as much as seeing it as a tool to get ready for what you care about most. way I’ve seen it described it’s like the regular season is there to master your game. The playoffs is where you worry about the opponents game. You can’t change your whole style 4 times a week in the regular season. You just master what it is that you do. Playoffs? You bend to adjust to each teams specific challenges.

Teams aren’t trying to beat you in the regular season. Theyre worried about getting to be the best version of themselves.

In the playoffs it’s about beating you specifically which is why some types get exposed. Teams don’t care to gameplan against 29 teams at the cost of mastering their default game. Playoffs? They play to win. Regular season they play to get comfortable.

[Norcaliblunt]

I don’t think it’s not caring as much as seeing it as a tool to get ready for what you care about most. way I’ve seen it described it’s like the regular season is there to master your game. The playoffs is where you worry about the opponents game. You can’t change your whole style 4 times a week in the regular season. You just master what it is that you do. Playoffs? You bend to adjust to each teams specific challenges.

Teams aren’t trying to beat you in the regular season. Theyre worried about getting to be the best version of themselves.

In the playoffs it’s about beating you specifically which is why some types get exposed. Teams don’t care to gameplan against 29 teams at the cost of mastering their default game. Playoffs? They play to win. Regular season they play to get comfortable.

They might care if there was a 1 million dollar bonus for each player on the regular seasons best team. And 500 thousand for division winners.

So we give all the money and praise to teams who can beat depleted teams in favorable conference seedlings?

Lmao.

[tontoz]

Historically a 1 seed wins the title roughly half the time so the regular season absolutely matters.

[Norcaliblunt]

Honestly this discussion is why the NFL is more popular. The regular season means something. Each game is an event.

[Norcaliblunt]

A players total wins should actually be a respected stat.

Like pitchers in baseball.

You play to win. And a starters win total should a stat discussed.

[SouBeachTalents]

Honestly this discussion is why the NFL is more popular. The regular season means something. Each game is an event.
A 17 game season where you play once a week vs an 82 game season where you play 3x a week is frankly a ridiculous comparison to make. No professional leagues regular season can even touch the NFL's.

[Kblaze8855]

Historically a 1 seed wins the title roughly half the time so the regular season absolutely matters.

It all matters. How much just varies by the franchise. Like…a top seed would be much more satisfying to Minnesota than it would for Riley and Jimmy Butler. The Heat dont care about that much. They wanna win in general but they aren’t sweating those kinda accomplishments.

The really driven guys? They don’t even wanna talk about shit like that if they didn’t win.

[tontoz]

It all matters. How much just varies by the franchise. Like…a top seed would be much more satisfying to Minnesota than it would for Riley and Jimmy Butler. The Heat dont care about that much. They wanna win in general but they aren’t sweating those kinda accomplishments.

The really driven guys? They don’t even wanna talk about shit like that if they didn’t win.


The current heat are an anomaly. They have Spo and Riley running the show. Those guys will find a way to win above their talent level. But the last time they won a ring the had the best record in the league by far

Last yr Denver tanked the.end of the regular season but still had the top seed and rolled through the playoffs.

[Kblaze8855]

A players total wins should actually be a respected stat.

Like pitchers in baseball.

You play to win. And a starters win total should a stat discussed.


The year the Bucks won the title the best records in each conference were the 76ers and the Jazz. And both teams lost to pretenders themselves. They lost to the Hawks and the Clippers with an injured Leonard. Number 1 seeds eliminated by Terrance Mann and Kevin Huerter running wild.

there’s a YouTube clip of Terrence Man on a podcast talking about that series. He said Paul George pulled him aside before that last game and they talked about how Rudy isn’t really guarding him, so just shoot it every time he gets the ball.

A team plays one way the whole season, and then makes the adjustment and knocks out the top seed while missing their best player by having a role player take advantage of being guarded by the defensive player of the year.

Those situations are exactly why best season record doesn’t really get celebrated. I bet Embiid doesn’t even like to talk about that season.

And really it works that way even in the NFL. You win 13 or 14 games and losing the divisional round you get laughed at. People start talking about what you have to do to take the next step.

The regular season doesn’t really get that respected in either sport. Not for long at least. It does initially. But the shine wears off quick and you just get called chokers.

[Norcaliblunt]

The year the Bucks won the title the best records in each conference were the 76ers and the Jazz. And both teams lost to pretenders themselves. They lost to the Hawks and the Clippers with an injured Leonard. Number 1 seeds eliminated by Terrance Mann and Kevin Huerter running wild.

there’s a YouTube clip of Terrence Man on a podcast talking about that series. He said Paul George pulled him aside before that last game and they talked about how Rudy isn’t really guarding him, so just shoot it every time he gets the ball.

A team plays one way the whole season, and then makes the adjustment and knocks out the top seed while missing their best player by having a role player take advantage of being guarded by the defensive player of the year.

Those situations are exactly why best season record doesn’t really get celebrated. I bet Embiid doesn’t even like to talk about that season.

And really it works that way even in the NFL. You win 13 or 14 games and losing the divisional round you get laughed at. People start talking about what you have to do to take the next step.

The regular season doesn’t really get that respected in either sport. Not for long at least. It does initially. But the shine wears off quick and you just get called chokers.


So why have seasons with playoffs and not just pay per view events each month like boxing and UFC? Field super teams to battle in epic events where each team has an equal training camp and level playing field without the charade of a regular season and playoffs?

[Kblaze8855]

So why have seasons with playoffs and not just pay per view events each month like boxing and UFC? Field super teams to battle in epic events where each team has an equal training camp and level playing field without the charade of a regular season and playoffs?

Well if you want the real reason it’s because the actual goal(money) was built for a system that had a certain number of games to sell. When they started the gate is what paid the owners. More games was more attendance and more profit since they didn’t have to increase player pay with the games. In fact they used to have 20+ preseason games just to stack spending money for the season and the players union revolted.

Once the deals were made to have a set number of dates and games and the money kept creeping up? Why go the other way?

The nba went from 3 billion in revenue to 10 during the load management era of selling out for the playoffs.

The new partnerships all require a set number of games for each service. And now they’re selling the IST.

Less games is always talked about but the money matters more than anything. Thats why it doesn’t change.

[tontoz]

The year the Bucks won the title the best records in each conference were the 76ers and the Jazz. And both teams lost to pretenders themselves. They lost to the Hawks and the Clippers with an injured Leonard. Number 1 seeds eliminated by Terrance Mann and Kevin Huerter running wild.

.


This is lame reasoning.

First of all a sample size of 1 season isn't as reliable as a sample of 40 seasons. In one season.anything can happen. Last year Miami made the finals with 3 undrafted guys playing big minutes. That doesn't mean that is what teams should be doing.

Secondly neither Philly or the jazz were that good. Philly and Utah were both only one game over 2nd place. Utahs primary advantage during the regular season was good health. Phillys point differential was actually worse than the bucks.

Then in the playoffs Simmons had a meltdown. Let's not forget that their 4 losses to the Hawks we're by a combined 17 points. They were +22 for the series.

If I remember right the.clippers were seen as title contenders prior to the season but just struggled with injuries.
They still won 47 games, and kawhi/PG13 were healthy for the series so let's not pretend they were scrubs.

Over time the top seed wins the title half the time. I went back and looked. Just because 78 suited beats AA on one hand doesn't change the fact that the odds favor AA.

[Norcaliblunt]

Well if you want the real reason it’s because the actual goal(money) was built for a system that had a certain number of games to sell. When they started the gate is what paid the owners. More games was more attendance and more profit since they didn’t have to increase player pay with the games. In fact they used to have 20+ preseason games just to stack spending money for the season and the players union revolted.

Once the deals were made to have a set number of dates and games and the money kept creeping up? Why go the other way?

The nba went from 3 billion in revenue to 10 during the load management era of selling out for the playoffs.

The new partnerships all require a set number of games for each service. And now they’re selling the IST.

Less games is always talked about but the money matters more than anything. Thats why it doesn’t change.

Think about what the players could make with my model?

Mayweather money only playing at most a 7 game series every 3 months.

You’re literally spelling out why the NBA structure is obsolete for everyone but the owners.

[Xiao Yao You]

i’m not certain, but I might be able to name every conference finals team ever. Perhaps not by season for the teams in the 50s 60s and 70s but I think I could name every core to ever make it that far.

That said I readily accept The label of “weirdo” about such things.

I don’t know what I would put in a career summary of him from a team perspective. Back in the day, when teams would hang division champion banners, and you would see recaps like “Always a winner he made the playoffs in 8 of his 12 seasons for the Rockets” . Not so much today. He’s won as much in the playoffs as Bradley Beal. You imagine a Bradley Beal career recap is going to mention three conference semifinals? You just leave that section out and talk about other things. It’ll say defensive player of the year and mention some rebound numbers and I imagine that’s it.

The part of the recap, where they talk about what he won is not yet written. Perhaps it will be but right now?

Beal is #4 on basketball reference in Washington history. Gobert # 3 in Jazz history. But I'm sure you have another Carlos Boozer for Washington

[Xiao Yao You]

A players total wins should actually be a respected stat.

Like pitchers in baseball.

You play to win. And a starters win total should a stat discussed.

win shares. Gobert 3rd in Jazz history. 1st per 48 minutes

[Xiao Yao You]

The year the Bucks won the title the best records in each conference were the 76ers and the Jazz. And both teams lost to pretenders themselves. They lost to the Hawks and the Clippers with an injured Leonard. Number 1 seeds eliminated by Terrance Mann and Kevin Huerter running wild.

there’s a YouTube clip of Terrence Man on a podcast talking about that series. He said Paul George pulled him aside before that last game and they talked about how Rudy isn’t really guarding him, so just shoot it every time he gets the ball.

A team plays one way the whole season, and then makes the adjustment and knocks out the top seed while missing their best player by having a role player take advantage of being guarded by the defensive player of the year.

Those situations are exactly why best season record doesn’t really get celebrated. I bet Embiid doesn’t even like to talk about that season.

And really it works that way even in the NFL. You win 13 or 14 games and losing the divisional round you get laughed at. People start talking about what you have to do to take the next step.

The regular season doesn’t really get that respected in either sport. Not for long at least. It does initially. But the shine wears off quick and you just get called chokers.

yeah that was a covid year. Jazz were the last team to have anyone miss time because of covid. They had built up a big lead before fading. They would have actually matched up well against the Bucks if they could have faced them. Matchups are huge. Playing in a weak conference or getting 8th seed in the semis can certainly help your legacy

[Kblaze8855]

Secondly neither Philly or the jazz were that good.




Do you not realize that’s my point?


Im not sure what you’re arguing against right now. I’m not sure what you think I think.

[Xiao Yao You]

Do you not realize that’s my point?


Im not sure what you’re arguing against right now. I’m not sure what you think I think.

yet Gobert was supposed to beat the better team because he had the higher seed. You've told me how stacked that team was before with all their all stars and 6th man of the year(who got off to a great start but actually sucked most of they year) and the one dimensional Bojan, etc. Lue out coached COTM by throwing everything at them while COTM again refused to make any adjustments :lol

[tontoz]

Do you not realize that’s my point?


Im not sure what you’re arguing against right now. I’m not sure what you think I think.

You seem to be downplaying the significance of the regular season. Then to back up your position you pick out one season (which is lame) where the top seeded teams hadn't separated themselves and had a history of coming up short in the post season.

Why would you pick that particular season to make your point?

[Kblaze8855]

Beal is #4 on basketball reference in Washington history. Gobert # 3 in Jazz history. But I'm sure you have another Carlos Boozer for Washington

Greatest Wizards/Bullets? Ranked by winshares I assume.

Is that supposed to mean something to me? Like…are you saying Beal is the 4th best Wizard/Bullet ever and I’d be wrong to say otherwise?

Should I also think the GOAT Piston is Bill Laimbeer? That Nick Anderson and Vucevic are the second and third greatest in Magic history over Shaq, Penny, and Tmac? That Calvin Murphy is the third greatest Rocket ahead of Moses Malone? That Haslem is 4th in Heat history and Jimmy Butler is 9th. That Barkley isn’t a top 10 sun? That Wilt with MVPs and a title isn’t top 6 for the 76ers?

It somehow both counts the ABA and still has Doctor J below Buck Williams in nets history.

I just file all that under trivia and keep it moving.

[Xiao Yao You]

You seem to be downplaying the significance of the regular season. Then to back up your position you pick out one season (which is lame) where the top seeded teams hadn't separated themselves and had a history of coming up short in the post season.

Why would you pick that particular season to make your point?

had nothing to with the Jazz or Gobert I'm sure. Covid year so about as bad of a choice as you could make besides the year before or the '99 lockout year

[Xiao Yao You]

Greatest Wizards/Bullets? Ranked by winshares I assume.

Is that supposed to mean something to me? Like…are you saying Beal is the 4th best Wizard/Bullet ever and I’d be wrong to say otherwise?

Should I also think the GOAT Piston is Bill Laimbeer? That Nick Anderson and Vucevic are the second and third greatest in Magic history over Shaq, Penny, and Tmac? That Calvin Murphy is the third greatest Rocket ahead of Moses Malone? That Haslem is 4th in Heat history and Jimmy Butler is 9th. That Barkley isn’t a top 10 sun? That Wilt with MVPs and a title isn’t top 6 for the 76ers?

It somehow both counts the ABA and still has Doctor J below Buck Williams in nets history.

I just file all that under trivia and keep it moving.

no idea about Washington or any of those other teams but I know who the 3rd most impactful player in Jazz history is even if he didn't carry anyone over an 8th seed to get to a conference final

[Kblaze8855]

You seem to be downplaying the significance of the regular season. Then to back up your position you pick out one season (which is lame) where the top seeded teams hadn't separated themselves and had a history of coming up short in the post season.

Why would you pick that particular season to make your point?

Relative to the post season of course I downplay the significance of the regular season when discussing franchise goals and what they are shooting for when going all in. I asked him what he thinks a team is trying to do when it gives up 5 years of picks to add a third all star.

I don’t think you do that with a goal of winning a few more regular season games.

And what year would you think I’d reference talking Rudy Gobert regular season teams if not when they had the best record to no result? You think I’d be talking about 1971?

The best record with no playoff result is something he’s already done and come out of mocked. I don’t see why doing it again with another 3 all star good role player squad would result in something different.

A team did that and decided to start over. Just like teams have the top seed and fire the coach.

Those things just aren’t what teams that take winning seriously value. Now do I think teams are at times too hasty that way?

Yes. But it is what it is.

[fourkicks44]

You seem to be downplaying the significance of the regular season. Then to back up your position you pick out one season (which is lame) where the top seeded teams hadn't separated themselves and had a history of coming up short in the post season.

Why would you pick that particular season to make your point?


That season was a really bad example for any sort of normality.

If you recall it was the year were everyone was getting forced to sit out because of COVID protocols, weeks at a time for some players.

The Sixers had a consistent season but their record probably wasn't a true reflection of how good the team was and more so about luck in who was in and out for opposing teams night to night.

I dunno if it was a similar situation for the Jazz, but that whole season was an anomaly.

They were even playing in empty arenas for part of the season.

[Kblaze8855]

no idea about Washington or any of those other teams but I know who the 3rd most impactful player in Jazz history is even if he didn't carry anyone over an 8th seed to get to a conference final

You brought up the numbers like they mean something to you. If they don’t…I don’t know why you’re telling me about them. Beal is 4th for the wizards. Rudy 3rd for Utah. Laimbeer is also first for the Pistons.

What am I to do with that information?

[tontoz]

Relative to the post season of course I downplay the significance of the regular season when discussing franchise goals and what they are shooting for when going all in. I asked him what he thinks a team is trying to do when it gives up 5 years of picks to add a third all star.

I don’t think you do that with a goal of winning a few more regular season games.

And what year would you think I’d reference talking Rudy Gobert regular season teams if not when they had the best record to no result? You think I’d be talking about 1971?

The best record with no playoff result is something he’s already done and come out of mocked. I don’t see why doing it again with another 3 all star good role player squad would result in something different.

A team did that and decided to start over. Just like teams have the top seed and fire the coach.

Those things just aren’t what teams that take winning seriously value. Now do I think teams are at times too hasty that way?

Yes. But it is what it is.



If you have to point to a COVID season to back up your position then your position is lame. No way around that.

I seriously doubt the jazz were even favored against the clippers, especially since there was no home court advantage. You do realize there was no home court advantage, right?

Over time having the top seed is absolutely a good predictor of playoff success. That isn't debatable and the COVID season certainly doesn't change that.

If you flip a coin the odds are 50/50 it lands on heads. If you flipped the coin 3 times previously and it came up tails do you think it changes the odds?

[Xiao Yao You]

That season was a really bad example for any sort of normality.

If you recall it was the year were everyone was getting forced to sit out because of COVID protocols, weeks at a time for some players.

The Sixers had a consistent season but their record probably wasn't a true reflection of how good the team was and more so about luck in who was in and out for opposing teams night to night.

I dunno if it was a similar situation for the Jazz, but that whole season was an anomaly.

They were even playing in empty arenas for part of the season.

Jazz were the last team to have anyone miss time because of covid and they had piled up a great record during that time. They faded down the stretch but still hung on to the 1st seed because of the great start while other teams players sat

[Kblaze8855]

That season was a really bad example for any sort of normality.

If you recall it was the year were everyone was getting forced to sit out because of COVID protocols, weeks at a time for some players.

The Sixers had a consistent season but their record probably wasn't a true reflection of how good the team was and more so about luck in who was in and out for opposing teams night to night.

I dunno if it was a similar situation for the Jazz, but that whole season was an anomaly.

They were even playing in empty arenas for part of the season.


The results weren’t that weird were they?

The top seed didn’t make the finals out of the East last year either. Or the one before that. Or the one before that. Or the one before that. Or the one before that. Or the one before that. Or the one before that. They made it in 16 but not 15 or 14. They did in 13. But not 12, 11, 10, or 09.

It happens.

The best teams having the best records also happens. But not often enough to be sure it will shake out that way.

I will admit I’d damn near forgotten that Hawks series though.

[Kblaze8855]

If you have to point to a COVID season to back up your position then your position is lame. No way around that.

I seriously doubt the jazz were even favored against the clippers, especially since there was no home court advantage. You do realize there was no home court advantage, right?

Over time having the top seed is absolutely a good predictor of playoff success. That isn't debatable and the COVID season certainly doesn't change that.

If you flip a coin the odds are 50/50 it lands on heads. If you flipped the coin 3 times previously and it came up tails do you think it changes the odds?


Yea…I don’t care about a covid season. I care about things one team has to deal with and not the other but covid? That was just sports…hell society…for two years. Not just throwing out all results especially when some of the results were so common(Brady, Lebron, Dodgers….Alabama football I think). Just win your games.

I don’t think Utah gave up a 25 point lead being shelled by Terrence Mann with no Leonard because covid existed. That was just…earth. For a while there at least.

[tontoz]

Yea…I don’t care about a covid season. I care about things one team has to deal with and not the other but covid? That was just sports…hell society…for two years. Not just throwing out all results especially when some of the results were so common(Brady, Lebron, Dodgers….Alabama football I think). Just win your games.

I don’t think Utah gave up a 25 point lead being shelled by Terrence Mann with no Leonard because covid existed. That was just…earth. For a while there at least.


Somehow I doubt it would be as easy for Mann knock down all those 3s if there were actual fans in.the stands going nuts. It isn't like he is a proven playoff performer.

I am not throwing out those results but I am also not using them as if they have some statistical significance either.

I think it is lame that you are comparing the jazz to the wolves just because Rudy is on both teams. They are very different teams.

If Minnesota gets the top seed it will absolutely be a big accomplishment for them and give them a better chance to get to the finals regardless of what happened during the COVID season. What happened then has no relevance to this season.

[RRR3]

Somehow I doubt it would be as easy for Mann knock down all those 3s if there were actual fans in.the stands going nuts. It isn't like he is a proven playoff performer.

I am not throwing out those results but I am also not using them as if they have some statistical significance either.
I also think it is lame that you are comparing the jazz to the wolves just because Rudy is on both teams
Still SEETHING LeBron won in 2020, damn.

[Xiao Yao You]

Yea…I don’t care about a covid season. I care about things one team has to deal with and not the other but covid? That was just sports…hell society…for two years. Not just throwing out all results especially when some of the results were so common(Brady, Lebron, Dodgers….Alabama football I think). Just win your games.

I don’t think Utah gave up a 25 point lead being shelled by Terrence Mann with no Leonard because covid existed. That was just…earth. For a while there at least.

they gave it up because 1 guy can't guard 5 by himself while his coach does nothing

[Xiao Yao You]

Somehow I doubt it would be as easy for Mann knock down all those 3s if there were actual fans in.the stands going nuts. It isn't like he is a proven playoff performer.

I am not throwing out those results but I am also not using them as if they have some statistical significance either.

I think it is lame that you are comparing the jazz to the wolves just because Rudy is on both teams. They are very different teams.

If Minnesota gets the top seed it will absolutely be a big accomplishment for them and give them a better chance to get to the finals regardless of what happened during the COVID season. What happened then has no relevance to this season.

Wolves are easily the best team he's been on. Everyone buying in defensively while having Towns and Conley shooting 3's instead of Rubio and Favors and Ant playing at both ends instead of 1 like Mitchell

[Kblaze8855]

Somehow I doubt it would be as easy for Mann knock down all those 3s if there were actual fans in.the stands going nuts. It isn't like he is a proven playoff performer.

I am not throwing out those results but I am also not using them as if they have some statistical significance either.

I think it is lame that you are comparing the jazz to the wolves just because Rudy is on both teams. They are very different teams.

If Minnesota gets the top seed it will absolutely be a big accomplishment for them and give them a better chance to get to the finals regardless of what happened during the COVID season. What happened then has no relevance to this season.

A couple of those points are you manufacturing an argument to points that I don’t see anyone making so I’ll just let you do that on your own.

Far as if it’s a big accomplishment…eh. Like I said it varies by team. Cant say I know their front office feelings on the matter. But I do know historically top teams that don’t break through are mocked in retrospect not praised unless someone thinks they maybe got screwed by refs.

Its a feel good story…then its “Did ____ win or did _____ collapse?” and then your coach gets fired because feeling good in December isn’t enough.

At least for serious franchises. Minny is so starved they might be fine losing 5 years of picks to look great before teams start game planning seriously. And either way the question of this topic will come down to the career of people who are like 16-17 right now.

These things take a looooong time. One of these deals from 30 years ago had the last player involved with it retire in 2022. It’s gonna be a while no matter what.

[tontoz]

Still SEETHING LeBron won in 2020, damn.


Seething? Really? You still haven't come up with another word to use?

This thread has nothing to do with LeBron. Might be time to pull your nose away from his anus, step outside and get some fresh air.

[tontoz]

A couple of those points are you manufacturing an argument from points that I don’t see anyone making so I’ll just let you do that on your own.

Far as if it’s a big accomplishment…eh. Like I said it varies by team. Cant say I know their front office feelings on the matter. But I do know historically top teams that don’t break through are mocked in retrospect not praised unless someone thinks they maybe got screwed by refs.

Its a feel good story…then its “Did ____ win or did _____ collapse?” and then your coach gets fired because feeling good in December isn’t enough.

At least for serious franchises. Minny is so starved they might be fine losing 5 years of picks to look great before teams start game planning seriously. And either way the question of this topic will come down to the career of people who are like 16-17 right now.

These things take a looooong time. One of these deals from 30 years ago had the last player involved with it retire in 2022. It’s gonna be a while no matter what.

It doesn't matter what the feelings of the front office are. What does matter is that.teams with the best record have the best chance to reach the finals. They have an easier path ( unless they get unlucky) and home court ( which didn't exist in the bubble).

[RRR3]

Seething? Really? You still haven't come up with another word to use?

This thread has nothing to do with LeBron. Might be time to pull your nose away from his anus, step outside and get some fresh air.
Boiling. Everyone knows you would have been fine with the bubble if Curry won.

[Kblaze8855]

I keep feeling like there’s a mix up.

Did the Jazz play the clippers in the bubble? I think they played the Nuggets when Mitchell and Murray were both going crazy.

Wasnt the clipper series in front of fans?

Its hard to tell in clips because they still had the weird seating.

[tontoz]

Boiling. Everyone knows you would have been fine with the bubble if Curry won.


What makes you think I am not fine with it now? I never said it was an asterisk ring.
.

[Kblaze8855]

Ok yea there were like 18 thousand fans at the Terence Mann game.

[tontoz]

I keep feeling like there’s a mix up.

Did the Jazz play the clippers in the bubble? I think they played the Nuggets when Mitchell and Murray were both going crazy.

Wasnt the clipper series in front of fans?

Its hard to tell in clips because they still had the weird seating.


I think you are right. The bubble year was 19/20. When Xiao said it was the COVID season I just assumed it was the bubble. didn't bother to double check.

[Kblaze8855]

Yea I’m guessing he means that next season where they rushed back. I knew the suns and bucks had great atmospheres for the finals so I was wondering how the earlier rounds had no fans. But when you watch clips it almost looks like the bubble the way they keep people back a bit. Just had me second guessing.

[tontoz]

Speaking of coming up short in the playoffs, DMitch won only one game in the playoffs last year against the Knicks. Just sayin

[Xiao Yao You]

Speaking of coming up short in the playoffs, DMitch won only one game in the playoffs last year against the Knicks. Just sayin

with two other all stars and the best defense in the league

[Kblaze8855]

Speaking of coming up short in the playoffs, DMitch won only one game in the playoffs last year against the Knicks. Just sayin

So they are at one playoff win each since the breakup. That something to revisit each year going forward?

Should we keep a tally on the wall?

[Xiao Yao You]

So they are at one playoff win each since the breakup. That something to revisit each year going forward?

Should we keep a tally on the wall?

or we could look at the Jazz with Gobert on the floor vs off or the Jazz being better with Mitchell off the floor vs on

[tontoz]

So they are at one playoff win each since the breakup. That something to revisit each year going forward?

Should we keep a tally on the wall?


I was just hearing trade rumors about DMitch this week. Pretty sure they were favored to beat the Knicks. Maybe having an undersized 2 that struggles on D is a bigger problem than we realized. I was shocked they got punked by the Knicks.


I was impressed with the way the Minny looked against the top seed without 2 of their main guys Jaden and Nazr.

[Kblaze8855]

I’m not interested in the endless plus minus debate where both sides want to ignore the 50 examples of it going against their feelings. And with you it may be against your feelings on Rudy’s impact on Minnesota but I generally fast scroll those talks. I tired of the plus/minus debate around the time some guy told me 5 Amir Johnson’s would beat 5 Kobe’s due to box plus minus or something.

Anyway this woman on my house just realized hbo max had the Barbie movie and I hear who has to be Lizzo singing the intro song so….let me go suffer through that and eat this doordash.

You have a nice night.

[Xiao Yao You]

I was just hearing trade rumors about DMitch this week. Pretty sure they were favored to beat the Knicks. Maybe having an undersized 2 that struggles on D is a bigger problem than we realized. I was shocked they got punked by the Knicks.


I was impressed with the way the Minny looked against the top seed without 2 of their main guys Jaden and Nazr.

doesn't make plays for others either like Garland. Minnesota has looked good without Ant

[Xiao Yao You]

https://sports.yahoo.com/nba-power-rankings-rudy-gobert-182740078.html

That Rudy Gobert (https://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/5197) trade doesn’t look so bad now, does it?


The Minnesota Timberwolves (https://sports.yahoo.com/nba/teams/minnesota/) own the best record in the Western Conference at 19-5 and the No. 1 defense, allowing 106.6 points per 100 possessions – and those victories include triumphs over some of the league’s top teams: Denver (https://sports.yahoo.com/nba/teams/denver/), Boston (https://sports.yahoo.com/nba/teams/boston/), Philadelphia (https://sports.yahoo.com/nba/teams/philadelphia/), Oklahoma City (https://sports.yahoo.com/nba/teams/oklahoma-city/) and Dallas (https://sports.yahoo.com/nba/teams/dallas/).


Anthony Edwards (https://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/6355) is a two-way star (24.2 points, 5.3 rebounds, 5.1 assists and 1.3 steals per game), Karl-Anthony Towns (https://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/5432) is having one of his best all-around seasons (22.4 points, 9.5 rebounds, 51.6% from the field, 43% on 3-pointers) and Rudy Gobert (12.7 points, 12.0 rebounds and 2.4 blocks per game) helps anchor a defense on a deep roster that includes Naz Reid (https://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/6253), Mike Conley (https://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/4246), Jaden McDaniels (https://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/6420), Kyle Anderson (https://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/5341), Shake Milton (https://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/6065), Nickeil Alexander-Walker (https://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/6205) and Troy Brown Jr.


In July 2022, new Timberwolves president Tim Connelly gave Utah four first-round picks (2023, 2025, 2027 and 2029) plus 2022 first-rounder Walker Kessler (https://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/6712) and a 2026 first-round pick swap for Gobert.


The Timberwolves were 16-21 as 2022 turned to 2023. Minnesota made the play-in tournament with a 42-40 record and advanced to the playoffs where it lost to Denver in the first round.


The Timberwolves are off to the best start in franchise history, and while winning a playoff series for the first time since 2004 is necessary, they are playing like a team with bigger goals under fourth-year coach Chris Finch.


USA TODAY NBA power rankings
1. Minnesota Timberwolves (19-5)
The Timberwolves have nine victories by at least 15 points through 24 games – that’s three more than they had in 82 games last season.

[Manny98]

It won't look bad when they actually win in the playoffs