How do you define who a best basketball player ever is

[Street Hunger]

How do you define who the best basketball player of all time is?

Meaning what's the criteria?

Is it the player who had the most skill and the best at any one time?

Or is it who had the best overall career?

The same question could actually be applied to almost every single best of all time type list.

Like with Michael Jordan's best season better or worse than LeBron James's best season?

To me that's a different question than asking who had the better overall NBA career.

[SATAN]

LeBron.

[ArbitraryWater]

PER and Vorp

[ILLsmak]

To me it's who was the best at their best, period.

It has to last long enough to not be a fluke, but a couple season or w/e is fine for me. People talk about guy's peaks, like Steph, but I don't think Steph is a GOAT level player even though he did some wild stuff. It's a short list.

The reason winning rings matters is because you wanna show what you can do at that level, too, or in the playoffs, whatever, but 'in theory' it would not be necessary. That being said, I dunno who played the best bball ever. There are a bunch of people who had runs. I think it's wack to put it on one person, and the reason people say MJ is because of hype + his resume.

MJ is def on the list, but is he the person who played the best bball? Is he the 'gimme him' for one game to win regardless? I dunno. He's def one to consider, but is he far and away the only answer, no... imo.

-Smak

[ILLsmak]

PER and Vorp

They both are skewed because they are based on other players. Even if PER was less bullshit, it's still based on 15 = average player. It's impossible to use one number to define greatness. It's impossible, arguably, to use a bunch of numbers to define greatness. They must be laid out with context.

-Smak

[GimmeThat]

collecting nick names and handing out nick names

[BarberSchool]

The door test, kid. The door test is what counts.

[mr4speed]

How do you define who the best basketball player of all time is?

Meaning what's the criteria?

Is it the player who had the most skill and the best at any one time?

Or is it who had the best overall career?

The same question could actually be applied to almost every single best of all time type list.

Like with Michael Jordan's best season better or worse than LeBron James's best season?

To me that's a different question than asking who had the better overall NBA career.

To answer your question IMO it cannot be done. There are too many variables. Different teammates and different competition, the rules have changed, the interpretation of the rules have changed, the court itself has changed and the game is 5 on 5. There can still be a debate today in a Bill Russell vs Wilt comparison because people have different measuring sticks and criteria. Russell had more success but Wilt had better stats. Even playing against one another, in the head to head games, Wilt outscored Russell in points, shot a higher FG% and got more rebounds, but Russell is viewed as being more team oriented, focused, and dedicated to winning. Russell himself said "I do not distort the offense or the defense" and yet many would argue that Russell simply had better teammates around him. My point is if there are legitimate arguments about 2 players going head to head in the same era = how is it ever possible to determine a "goat" across 50 or 60 years. Subjectivity and personal preference cannot be erased. I sometimes find it fascinating, not that we have debates but that people are so committed to trying to change another person's opinion.

[3ba11]

highest championship frequency with the least all-star help and greatest measurable burden (aka usage, ppg, etc)

[StrongLurk]

Most FMVPs since the three point line inception - Kareem is the only exception.

[Real Men Wear Green]

Whoever is the player that the most teams could use the most. That's a vague criteria that rarely has a firm answer but that's how I see it. Stats can definitely be the basis of a player's argument but there's always more to it. Currently I would say that's Jokic but Giannis is close. Being honest the main reasons I figure it's Jokic right now are the stats and championship. It's hard to give anyone the bid over what Giannis does offensively and defensively.

[sdot_thadon]

Best and greatest can be 2 separate things. I'd imagine best is the best overall player. Greatest is the best career.

[Duffy Pratt]

The one I like the most.

Oh, and anyone who disagrees with me is an idiot.

I think that’s the standard definition.

[lxlHoTsAuSelxl]

If by a season or in their prime you could argue Jordan, Tmac, Shaq, Lebron, Kobe, Jokic(base off players from 90s-current).

Ask yourself this, who would be your #1 pick if we talking about skills/longevity. A player who is a little more skilled and will give you 13 elite years(15 total years) or 21 elite years and counting?

[ImKobe]

His name is Michael Jeffrey Jordan.

[Overdrive]

It has to last long enough to not be a fluke, but a couple season or w/e is fine for me. People talk about guy's peaks, like Steph, but I don't think Steph is a GOAT level player even though he did some wild stuff. It's a short list.


Steph's first and last ring were as far apart as Jordan's. I don't get your logic.

[Round Mound]

Fun, Heart, Passion and Love For The Game.

[ILLsmak]

Steph's first and last ring were as far apart as Jordan's. I don't get your logic.

There is no context to that. I'm talking about when Steph was playing at or near ATG level. Like the year he got unanimous MVP then lost in the Finals.

-Smak

[Norcaliblunt]

I don’t define the best basketball player all time.

It’s a team sport.

I find the best team debate more worthy of discussion.

[warriorfan]

How do you define who the best basketball player of all time is?

Meaning what's the criteria?

Is it the player who had the most skill and the best at any one time?

Or is it who had the best overall career?

The same question could actually be applied to almost every single best of all time type list.

Like with Michael Jordan's best season better or worse than LeBron James's best season?

To me that's a different question than asking who had the better overall NBA career.

basically jordan and everyone else has to measure up to him

[warriorfan]

There is no context to that. I'm talking about when Steph was playing at or near ATG level. Like the year he got unanimous MVP then lost in the Finals.

-Smak

you mean where he lost in the finals after he tore his mcl and had dray suspended for the close out game and andre iggy and barnes went for a combined 2 for 30 something in the last two games on wide open 15 foot jumpers?

i’m not saying you didn’t watch the series, it’s been a minute, but go refresh your memory with a rewatch if you can find the games available, then come back at us. because right now your take is 100 percent dog shit

[Norcaliblunt]

Jordan is the original Lebron media creation Gatoraid Nike corporate clown.

Y’all repping Jordan are just as stupid as fools sucking Lebron off.

[warriorfan]

Jordan is the original Lebron media creation Gatoraid Nike corporate clown.

Y’all repping Jordan are just as stupid as fools sucking Lebron off.

what? please explain.

[Norcaliblunt]

what? please explain.

This idea Jordan is clearly ahead of Kareem, Bird, Magic, Russel, Shaq, etc, etc is just as much a media creation and ridiculous as saying Lebron is ahead of Jordan.

It’s basically old millennials and Gen X arguing with young millennials and Gen Z in click bait media created non sense.

Jordan was Lebron before Lebron. A corporate media tool.

[FilmyCogTurner]

Its a combination of multiple things...

Peak player ability
Personal and team accolades
Talent/skill
Wins/loses and dominance
Eye test
Competition / team make up
Respect from peers, vets and fans/media
Leadership
Clutchness

and Jordan has the greatest mixture of the key attributes.

[warriorfan]

This idea Jordan is clearly ahead of Kareem, Bird, Magic, Russel, Shaq, etc, etc is just as much a media creation and ridiculous as saying Lebron is ahead of Jordan.

It’s basically old millennials and Gen X arguing with young millennials and Gen Z in click bait media created non sense.

Jordan was Lebron before Lebron. A corporate media tool.

I’ve done the homework. This jive shit isn’t gonna fly with me dog.

Jordan is the GOAT. Hands down.

Educate yourself

[Norcaliblunt]

I’ve done the homework. This jive shit isn’t gonna fly with me dog.

Jordan is the GOAT. Hands down.

Educate yourself

I’m pretty educated on the Air Jordan corporate clown era. It’s when corps went all in on this entertainment bullshit. Music, movies, and sports along with all of its stars were manufactured corporate advertisements. Lmao.

[ILLsmak]

you mean where he lost in the finals after he tore his mcl and had dray suspended for the close out game and andre iggy and barnes went for a combined 2 for 30 something in the last two games on wide open 15 foot jumpers?

i’m not saying you didn’t watch the series, it’s been a minute, but go refresh your memory with a rewatch if you can find the games available, then come back at us. because right now your take is 100 percent dog shit

you got trolled. lol read the post again. Everything I said is absolute fact. The only arguable part is 'near atg level' or that it was his peak. The part you are talking about definitely happened. He did win unanimous MVP and he did lose in the finals.

Edit: let me expand since it's hard for people to understand what I'm saying. I was saying that Steph's peak does not start at his first ring and end at his last ring. To me, at least. I think he was peak for a few years and it was pretty crazy. I would put the year he won unanimous mvp as one of his peak years, but maybe Warfan would not. Will have to see what he thinks.

-Smak

[ILLsmak]

I’m pretty educated on the Air Jordan corporate clown era. It’s when corps went all in on this entertainment bullshit. Music, movies, and sports along with all of its stars were manufactured corporate advertisements. Lmao.

Yea I can't say MJ ISN'T the goat, but I think other people did GOAT thangz. It's tough to compare cross era. If a sport is at all worth something, it's hard to have a unanimous GOAT. There have been many great players. MJ does have the GOAT resume. 2 3 peats in the modern era + all the extras is tough, but like I said I define as how people played when they were at their peak of peaks, like their greatest moments. MJ is up there tho, nobody can deny that.

-Smak

[And1AllDay]

His name is Michael Jeffrey Jordan.

whod that bum beat at shooting guard?? john starks and terry porter and jefferey hornacek? :oldlol:

[Xiao Yao You]

whod that bum beat at shooting guard?? john starks and terry porter and jefferey hornacek? :oldlol:

Porter was a pg and Horny was a hell of a player but don't let that stop ya!