Giannis is being over looked for the MVP

[Rudeboy3]

He's been the best and most consistent player this season, if Dame wasn't so hot and cold, Middleton wasn't washed and Griffin wasn't a shit coach he'd be number one rn. It's insane how Jokic is ahead of him despite playing mid for a month now, media loves that white boy. Embiid is number one despite missing 8 ****ing games and counting!!!

What did my pookie bear Gianni deserve to get this treatment, he shan't be overlooked anymore, if i can help it!!! He's having the best season of his career at 29, playing more minutes but somehow more efficient, he's averaging 31/11/1/1 on 61% shooting!! That's insane, doing all of that carrying while having Dame, a supposed "top" 75 player of all time. Give my pookie his MVP

https://www.milwaukeemag.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/09/0923-414-Gabe-VM_GiannisMural22_-1-scaled.jpg

[Real Men Wear Green]

Don't worry pookie, he still has a chance.

[k0kakw0rld]

Shai Gilgeous-Alexander

[ImKobe]

Issue is that Jokic blows him out of the water with the advanced metrics, and the media people are stat-whores and weigh those numbers heavily in their voting because they think it makes them look smarter, but it's amazing what Giannis has done this year with the lack of offensive help around him. They have the 3rd highest ORTG in the league and that's with Dame struggling and with no one else on the team averaging more than 15 a game. If Dame and Khris could get close to their prime selves I wouldn't pick any other team over the Bucks in the POs.

[Full Court]

Issue is that Jokic blows him out of the water with the advanced metrics, and the media people are stat-whores and weigh those numbers heavily in their voting because they think it makes them look smarter, but it's amazing what Giannis has done this year with the lack of offensive help around him. They have the 3rd highest ORTG in the league and that's with Dame struggling and with no one else on the team averaging more than 15 a game. If Dame and Khris could get close to their prime selves I wouldn't pick any other team over the Bucks in the POs.

And that's what bugs me about the over-reliance on advanced metrics. It eliminates intangibles and allows people to opine without actually understanding the game.

[Jasper]

Obviously I watch Giannis then the rest of the list.

But over all player he will always be my MVP , tangibles make him that.
(dame just needs to be Dame , and this team will right it self , as shown last night against the number 1 team in bball boston.
All most lead by 40 at half time , and throughout the 3th QTR was leading over 40.

Some players are all-stars - Giannis is a super star.
(I laughed when Boston put Holiday on Giannis , Giannis must of thought I will own you just like How I practiced against you)

Other MVP notables (Tatum could not guard him, and ended with 7 points)

Note worthy : Beasley did well defensively in the first half.

[ArbitraryWater]

Jokic playing mid for a month now?


Didnt he just have a 39/44 stretch capped with that buzzer beater on GSW?

Lol

[ArbitraryWater]

And that's what bugs me about the over-reliance on advanced metrics. It eliminates intangibles and allows people to opine without actually understanding the game.

Explain to us whats getting lost in the advanced stats and where the higher understanding of the game comes in

[hold this L]

Issue is that Jokic blows him out of the water with the advanced metrics, and the media people are stat-whores and weigh those numbers heavily in their voting because they think it makes them look smarter, but it's amazing what Giannis has done this year with the lack of offensive help around him. They have the 3rd highest ORTG in the league and that's with Dame struggling and with no one else on the team averaging more than 15 a game. If Dame and Khris could get close to their prime selves I wouldn't pick any other team over the Bucks in the POs.
Jokic is a better player

[tontoz]

Being 3rd in the MVP rankings isn't exactly being overlooked. The only guys ahead of him are the guy who won MVP last season and the guy who won FMVP last season.

[Kblaze8855]

It’s more about people getting sick of the same story. Which is why Jokic won his two and might retire with two. Giannis got his two and they have moved on. They both got better after winning mvps but you never get the same love after the initial jump. Embiid might force the voters hand by missing too many games though. I don’t imagine they would go all the way to SGA or Tatum to avoid giving Giannis or Jokic the third one. If Embiid plays enough and stays at the 35ppg level he likely gets his second.

[hold this L]

It’s more about people getting sick of the same story. Which is why Jokic won his two and might retire with two. Giannis got his two and they have moved on. They both got better after winning mvps but you never get the same love after the initial jump. Embiid might force the voters hand by missing too many games though. I don’t imagine they would go all the way to SGA or Tatum to avoid giving Giannis or Jokic the third one. If Embiid plays enough and stays at the 35ppg level he likely gets his second.

What has Giannis gotten better at since he won his MVPs?

[highwhey]

What has Giannis gotten better at since he won his MVPs?

refs are quicker at blowing their whistles to save his busted offensive foul shoulder drop bowling ball hitting every pin in its way and still airballing the ball drive :D

[Kblaze8855]

Shot selection for one. He won MVP taking 5 threes a game when he can’t shoot. You see shot logs where he takes 22 shots and 20 are dunks and layups. People mention it like it’s a bad thing but frankly if you can get a shot at 2 feet 20 times and you don’t do it you’re an idiot.

Hes not as prone to bail the D out by settling and taking a jumper just to prove he can. He comes out there like he just wants to go through you and get the call or the layup and he does it. Over and over and over and over and it’s a lot smarter than pull-up 18 footers just because they’re disrespecting you.

**** them. They play off go into the paint anyway. You’re not trying to prove anything. You’re trying to get the ball in the basket.

It’s a subtle mental change but it matters. He is coming at you all game every game. Transition. Early postups. Reposting. Cutting. Putbacks. He gets it right by the rim and dunks it or goes through your chest and happily takes his ugly free throws unlike a Ben Simmons type who runs from contact out of fear looking bad at the line. Giannis has no fear and total confidence.

He doesnt let up. And he shouldn’t. His motor is being matched by an increase in common sense. He’s at that prime sweet spot where you still have the legs but have the knowledge to go with it.

[Manny98]

Pookie?

***** you gay :oldlol:

[hold this L]

Shot selection for one. He won MVP taking 5 threes a game when he can’t shoot. You see shot logs where he takes 22 shots and 20 are dunks and layups. People mention it like it’s a bad thing but frankly if you can get a shot at 2 feet 20 times and you don’t do it you’re an idiot.

Hes not as prone to bail the D out by settling and taking a jumper just to prove he can. He comes out there like he just wants to go through you and get the call or the layup and he does it. Over and over and over and over and it’s a lot smarter than pull-up 18 footers just because they’re disrespecting you.

**** them. They play off go into the paint anyway. You’re not trying to prove anything. You’re trying to get the ball in the basket.

It’s a subtle mental change but it matters. He is coming at you all game every game. Transition. Early postups. Reposting. Cutting. Putbacks. He gets it right by the rim and dunks it or goes through your chest and happily takes his ugly free throws unlike a Ben Simmons type who runs from contact out of fear looking bad at the line. Giannis has no fear and total confidence.

He doesnt let up. And he shouldn’t. His motor is being matched by an increase in common sense. He’s at that prime sweet spot where you still have the legs but have the knowledge to go with it.
His shot selection is horrible in the playoffs. Easier to dominate during regular season where referees ref him as if he is a NFL linebacker. All of his issues during his 2x MVP seasons are all for everyone to see once the PS starts. And Giannis comes to guys every game, that has never changed.

[Kblaze8855]

He has become progressively more physical. Early in his career he would bail you out all the time. The first two shots of his career were a Dirk fade away, and a pull up three. He made both. But the fact is regardless of what fans respect it’s stupid to be a shooter with his physical gifts, and a league that caters fully to the offense. You don’t take five threes. You try to dunk 10 times and try to lay it up 8 more. Which is exactly what he does.

He has no more issues in the playoffs than anyone else. It’s just an easy no thought needed criticism because he like everyone else is going to lose most of his career.

All it takes is winning to validate your approach, and he’s already done that. Doesn’t matter who we are talking about. They’re going to mostly lose. Doesn’t mean everybody approaches the game wrong and has a style that can be stopped in the playoffs. You put a bunch of great players and great teams at the same time in a tournament all but one is going to be stopped, and most of them will look worse because you play exclusively great teams with no nights off versus the wizards .

But it doesn’t matter if it’s Giannis or if it’s someone of immense skill and craft like Kyrie. Youre generally going to look easier to stop in the playoffs because teams are going to put a lot more effort into stopping you.

If you’re lucky you get a year or two where they can’t. But mostly they find a way to get rid of you. Guys like Kyrie shoot 35% and 21% from three getting eliminated and Jokic can get swept by the same team Giannis gave 50 for the ring against and only have one good game in the series. If you’re going to set out to hate, you can find a reason to do it most of anybody’s career. Either say they didn’t play well enough when the numbers aren’t great or say, all they did was provide ineffective stat padding when they have the numbers and lose. That’s how you put up 28/12/5 over like 7 years in the playoffs shoot in the mid 50s and have people say you’re easy to stop in the playoffs.

Fans are well practiced in the art of shitting on great players they don’t like. It’s not specific to any particular skill set.

[90sgoat]

I could be wrong, but it seems to me as if Giannis plays more back to basket now.

[tontoz]

I am glad he finally cut down on his 3pt attempts. Took too long. At some point you just have to accept you aren't a shooter.

[Kblaze8855]

I am glad he finally cut down on his 3pt attempts. Took too long. At some point you just have to accept you aren't a shooter.


I can see why he felt the need to work on it when they were leaning more towards making him a guard. Remember, he played some point years ago. It’s less of a problem to not be respected as a shooter when you’re in the paint all game. if you’re standing 25 feet away, and your man is sagging into the paint it’s more disruptive. He’s a straight up power forward who attacks now instead of a no position hybrid finding a place.

[warriorfan]

I am glad he finally cut down on his 3pt attempts. Took too long. At some point you just have to accept you aren't a shooter.

It was an interesting idea. I could see where they were coming from in trying it even if it didn’t work out. Giannis is one of the few guys where it almost doesn’t matter if he has a 3 or not when he can live in the paint all day.

[Kblaze8855]

It was an interesting idea. I could see where they were coming from in trying it even if it didn’t work out. Giannis is one of the few guys where it almost doesn’t matter if he has a 3 or not when he can live in the paint all day.

Yea it’s not really an issue now it’s just extra. He’s morphed into a full time big. But as I mentioned earlier…these are the first two shots of his career:


https://i.ibb.co/Yb3j6nX/IMG-7454.gif




https://i.ibb.co/vjhcRTL/IMG-7456.gif

The announcers immediately referenced KD as the comparison for that size and length with his mobility. You can see why he and his trainers wouldn’t let go of that part of his game right away. He looked like he could develop that way at the time. No hesitstion. Just catch and shoot. These days he measures that 3 for 2 seconds before taking it. He came in as a more traditional but still raw wing who was trying to do wing things.

Now he just wants to put you in the grave. And he had a bit of that then too. His 3rd and 4th shot attempts are him going full speed right into a slightly out of position defenders chest and getting to the line. He does it now people say the league biased and helping him.

Refs gave him that call when nobody could even pronounce his name. You drive your man into the paint and punish him as you go up…you’re taking free throws. Rookie or legend.

Corey Maggette started suddenly doing it for a year or two for you guys and the Bobcats. League didn’t care about him. He got those calls because that’s how you get calls. You make them call something they aren’t gonna foul out the scorer. They foul out the defender if it’s at all possible.

Its simply more intelligent to create contact and dunk if at all possible than to be a middling shooter which he probably could have developed into and let defenses off the hook.

[ArbitraryWater]

Yea it’s not really an issue now it’s just extra. He’s morphed into a full time big. But as I mentioned earlier…these are the first two shots of his career:


https://i.ibb.co/Yb3j6nX/IMG-7454.gif




https://i.ibb.co/vjhcRTL/IMG-7456.gif

The announcers immediately referenced KD as the comparison for that size and length with his mobility. You can see why he and his trainers wouldn’t let go of that part of his game right away. He looked like he could develop that way at the time. No hesitstion. Just catch and shoot. These days he measures that 3 for 2 seconds before taking it. He came in as a more traditional but still raw wing who was trying to do wing things.

Now he just wants to put you in the grave. And he had a bit of that then too. His 3rd and 4th shot attempts are him going full speed right into a slightly out of position defenders chest and getting to the line. He does it now people say the league biased and helping him.

Refs gave him that call when nobody could even pronounce his name. You drive your man into the paint and punish him as you go up…you’re taking free throws. Rookie or legend.

Corey Maggette started suddenly doing it for a year or two for you guys and the Bobcats. League didn’t care about him. He got those calls because that’s how you get calls. You make them call something they aren’t gonna foul out the scorer. They foul out the defender if it’s at all possible.

Its simply more intelligent to create contact and dunk if at all possible than to be a middling shooter which he probably could have developed into and let defenses off the hook.


Well, he changed his jumpshot, that was a big talking point.

[Kblaze8855]

I’m not sure he needed to. This is also his rookie year


https://i.ibb.co/pJwVg0Z/IMG-7457.gif



No thought just catch and shoot. And while he wasn’t a good shooter he did seem more confident. Like if he just worked on what he had he’d have rounded into form. It’s like they just rebuilt it and got him thinking too much and he became robotic. But all the work he put in made him wanna see it pay off so he took more.

Left alone he’d probably be a better shooter….but a worse player if he leaned on it more.

[tontoz]

I ran into this clip awhile back and thought it was funny. From a few years ago.


https://youtu.be/GWajqr55HFg?si=XTt34Q7y9xvdWCbl

[Kblaze8855]

He and Jokic both have a few of those. They don’t even hide it. Come down and wipe your ass out. I can’t pearl clutch considering how the league was when I loved it most. I don’t remember what got him upset that time but I bet it wasn’t worth all that.

[tontoz]

He and Jokic both have a few of those. They don’t even hide it. Come down and wipe your ass out. I can’t pearl clutch considering how the league was when I loved it most. I don’t remember what got him upset that time but I bet it wasn’t worth all that.

For one thing the Bucks were down 3-2 and were getting blown out in an elimination game. Then Dunleavy pushed Giannis down on the other end so Giannis was like F this my season is over so i will lay this dude out.

I actually did something similar in a pickup game. I made a steal and there was a guy who i didn't like standing under the rim on the other end. I was like ooohhhh i am going to F him up. I turned on the jets and at the last second he realized what i was doing. Instead of jumping up to block the shot he ducked and his shoulder went right into my ribs.

He was bigger than me and it hurt. Of course i played it off, running back down the court after making the shot like it was nothing. Everyone laughed. I was out of action for maybe 6 weeks with a cracked rib. It was worth it though. :oldlol:

[fourkicks44]

Pookie?

***** you gay :oldlol:

For so long I was convinced OP was one of your alts, Manny.

I dont think it is anymore but I am still not 100% sure :lol

[SATAN]

What did my pookie bear Gianni deserve to get this treatment, he shan't be overlooked anymore, if i can help it!!! Give my pookie his MVP


You couldn't possibly be any gayer.

[plowking]

He has become progressively more physical. Early in his career he would bail you out all the time. The first two shots of his career were a Dirk fade away, and a pull up three. He made both. But the fact is regardless of what fans respect it’s stupid to be a shooter with his physical gifts, and a league that caters fully to the offense. You don’t take five threes. You try to dunk 10 times and try to lay it up 8 more. Which is exactly what he does.



This right here is why Giannis is 10 times better than Anthony Davis.

If AD played the right way he'd be right up there with him in these conversations, but he has played his entire career as an inconsistent, soft, hang around the outside player on offense.

[MrFonzworth]

For so long I was convinced OP was one of your alts, Manny.

I dont think it is anymore but I am still not 100% sure :lol

It is pretty sure he admitted it on his kd7 alt

[ImKobe]

Jokic is a better player

But that's not what MVP is about. Who's more valuable to their team right now? I'd say Giannis. He's definitely carrying a bigger workload and his team depends on him more on defense and he also does everything on offense. FWIW, he's ahead of Jokic in EPM right now.

You can't go wrong with picking either so I don't want it to be a Jokic vs. Giannis debate, there's no clear winner IMO. If my Lakers continue to suck I'd love to see those two face off in the Finals.

[Axe]

Explain to us whats getting lost in the advanced stats and where the higher understanding of the game comes in
:roll:

[Full Court]

Explain to us whats getting lost in the advanced stats and where the higher understanding of the game comes in

If you understood the game, you wouldn't need me to explain it to you.

[Rudeboy3]

Pookie?

***** you gay :oldlol:

You saying bro ain't a cutie patootie?
https://e0.365dm.com/20/12/1600x900/skysports-giannis-antetokounmpo_5210261.jpg

[Rudeboy3]

How exactly is he a btter player? He's marginally better at offence than Giannis and defensively it's not even close

[Rudeboy3]

But that's not what MVP is about. Who's more valuable to their team right now? I'd say Giannis. He's definitely carrying a bigger workload and his team depends on him more on defense and he also does everything on offense. FWIW, he's ahead of Jokic in EPM right now.

You can't go wrong with picking either so I don't want it to be a Jokic vs. Giannis debate, there's no clear winner IMO. If my Lakers continue to suck I'd love to see those two face off in the Finals.

There is a clear winner and that's my pookie bear

[Rudeboy3]

He had a single-digit scoring game a couple of weeks ago. Dude is going through the motions, he shouldn't be second.

[SATAN]

Getting outplayed by Sabonis :yaohappy:

[Micku]

Getting outplayed by Sabonis :yaohappy:

Sabonis has been playing like Jokic lately with the efficiency. He's been the Kings best player for a stretch.

[elementally morale]

Sabonis has been playing like Jokic lately with the efficiency. He's been the Kings best player for a stretch.

He absolutely is. When I watched Kings vs. Nuggets earlier this season Sabonis really seemed to be Jokic light. His stats tell the same story.

[Xiao Yao You]

He absolutely is. When I watched Kings vs. Nuggets earlier this season Sabonis really seemed to be Jokic light. His stats tell the same story.

makes sense since his father was the prototype for Jokic

[SATAN]

Giannis is deliberately trying to rack up triple doubles...I wonder why...

[elementally morale]

makes sense since his father was the prototype for Jokic

Old Sabonis was stunning before his injuries but was always a whiner. His son plays harder. Less talent but makes up for it with effort. He simply earns his role, status and salary every night out there. I've never seen him take a game off.

[elementally morale]

Giannis is deliberately trying to rack up triple doubles...I wonder why...

Jokic changed and changes the game the same way Curry has.

[SATAN]

Holly shit what a bail out by Dame :bowdown:

(it only went to OT because Giannis choked at the line)

[elementally morale]

Wow. Lillard just did it again.

[Micku]

Amazing finish from Dame. Wow