If they only played each other for 82 games who would you rather have Jokic or Embiid

[Mask the Embiid]

Lebron’s face in this picture was the same face I made as I clicked
(enter) to post this thread.

https://i.postimg.cc/pTR8bYMY/IMG-1398.jpg



If you don’t know who to vote for just google their h2h stats and that will tell you who is better…..and it’s not close

[ShawkFactory]

I mean..just like their standard numbers show, Embiid would likely outscore him. Doesn't really mean that he'd be better and more impactful overall though.

[SlimReaper]

https://i.postimg.cc/kXvQJgyv/Embiid.png


https://i.postimg.cc/J0qsLGWy/Jokic.png



Hmm, that's a tough one.


But, IF basketball was a team sport, I think I would go with the second.

[tpols]

I would take the one who actually has the balls to guard the other and not be hidden on the weakest assignment.

Which is the irony in all this. Embiid is supposedly a DPOY defender and Jokic is trash, yet Yolk plays Embiid straight up on defense and Joel hides behind Aaron Gordon. :oldlol:

[Mask the Embiid]

I would take the one who actually has the balls to guard the other and not be hidden on the weakest assignment.

Which is the irony in all this. Embiid is supposedly a DPOY defender and Jokic is trash, yet Yolk plays Embiid straight up on defense and Joel hides behind Aaron Gordon. :oldlol:

Joel doesn’t guard jokic because he’s not a threat….. if I can put Tobias Harris or someone 100 pounds less than you on u n u can’t get 30 you are NOT A THREAT!

[tpols]

I mean..just like their standard numbers show, Embiid would likely outscore him. Doesn't really mean that he'd be better and more impactful overall though.

Jokic actually had a higher +/- on the court last night than Embiid. Tobias shooting 80% from the field and Maxey outplaying Murray is why the Sixers won. They were game high +13 and +9.

Embiid was actually at 0 in +/- yesterday. They won the game with him on the bench.

[fourkicks44]

Jokic actually had a higher +/- on the court last night than Embiid. Tobias shooting 80% from the field and Maxey outplaying Murray is why the Sixers won. They were game high +13 and +9.

Embiid was actually at 0 in +/- yesterday. They won the game with him on the bench.

You gotta stop man, you sound like a desperate fool.

They play again in 10 day, it will be ok.

I don't think I have never seen you so upset:oldlol:

[highwhey]

Joel doesn’t guard jokic because he’s not a threat….. if I can put Tobias Harris or someone 100 pounds less than you on u n u can’t get 30 you are NOT A THREAT!

:applause:

[tpols]

Bro those are all straight facts. What do you think... the numbers are made up?

When Jokic and Embiid were on the court it was a stalemate. 0 and +1 respectively.

Tobias Harris and Maxey going off without either on the court was the difference maker in a huge way. They were a combined +22 in that regard which is blowout margin.

You guys want this to be a superhero match where we only look at two guys but the truth is buried in the details.

[tontoz]

:oldlol: @ embiid playing 82 games. How many seasons are we talking about here?

During the broadcast Van Gundy was asked who was the better between the two. He said that they were drafted the same season and Jokic has played over 200 more games and he actually plays well in the playoffs unlike Embiid.

[Kblaze8855]

Single game plus minus “facts” are some of the dumbest things sometimes. Have you any idea how many great games some superstar has a lower plus minus than a role player? Kobe has had 50 point nights on great shooting and been -13 while Odom was plus 3 doing 16/10. People have had a negative plus/minus in some of the greatest finals performances ever.

[Kblaze8855]

https://youtu.be/iwGyQCqOywA?si=drwRoWWGfQIrIUJq


Jimmy Butler was a negative 10 that game. One of the “worst” players on the floor.

[fourkicks44]

Single game plus minus “facts” are some of the dumbest things sometimes. Have you any idea how many great games some superstar has a lower plus minus than a role player? Kobe has had 50 point nights on great shooting and been -13 while Odom was plus 3 doing 16/10. People have had a negative plus/minus in some of the greatest finals performances ever.

Especially when certain posters in this thread are adding two players plus minus together for a game to find a total called "blowout margin"

[tpols]

It's not dumb at all. Tobias Harris factually kept the Sixers in the game with Embiid on the bench. He shot 80% from the field while guarding a GOAT player full time. And was +13 as a result. Maxey was +9 as well while Murray and MPJ were in the big negative.


Now that begs the question... how could Harris and Maxey be so far in the positive while Embiid was at 0? There's no other answer to be had except the fact that they were doing serious damage with embiid on the bench.

It doesn't matter if it hurts your feelings. It's just simple logic.

[FultzNationRISE]

If they played 82 times consecutively I would actually bet on Jokic.

He’s like an AI program, he learns more and more through repetition. He would figure out Embiid over a large sample size just like he figures teams out over the course of a playoff series.w

These random regular season games are just track meets. Theres little coordinated game planning. Thats why Giannis and Embiid rule the roost. In the postseason its teams who execute high level systems like the Warriors, the old Spurs, Lebron, the Jokic Nuggets, even the Heat, who have consistent success. It’s not just one guy running around dunking on everyone the way you can have success with in the regular season. Unless you get a team who for no good reason doesnt Build The Wall in a finals.

Embiid is at his best when it’s just a spontaneous battle of individual scoring talent. When it’s a prolonged contest of adaptability, perseverance, mental toughness… you bet the other way.

[warriorfan]

+/- has been shown it can tell you things but it needs to be over the course of a pretty large sample size. Playoffs a lot more often than not aren’t even really enough of a sample. It’s been awhile since I looked at this stuff but I want to say you need 20ish games at the minimum for it to start equalizing out and getting noise reduction. Ideally you want a whole season or close to it. The bigger the sample the more accurate it will be.

[SouBeachTalents]

If they played 82 times consecutively I would actually bet on Jokic.

He’s like an AI program, he learns more and more through repetition. He would figure out Embiid over a large sample size just like he figures teams out over the course of a playoff series.w

These random regular season games are just track meets. Theres little coordinated game planning. Thats why Giannis and Embiid rule the roost. In the postseason its teams who execute high level systems like the Warriors, the old Spurs, Lebron, the Jokic Nuggets, even the Heat, who have consistent success. It’s not just one guy running around dunking on everyone the way you can have success with in the regular season. Unless you get a team who for no good reason doesnt Build The Wall in a finals.

Embiid is at his best when it’s just a spontaneous battle of individual scoring talent. When it’s a prolonged contest of adaptability, perseverance, mental toughness… you bet the other way.
It's not fair to lump Giannis in with Embiid in regards to the playoffs. He's had his struggles sure, and I'm not disagreeing teams can implement strategies that can expose his flaws, but he was dominant during that title run, even before the Finals, and has had FAR more great games and series than Embiid ever has.

Discounting the one series he had in 2015 well before he was elite, he averages 28 ppg in the playoffs for his career, while Embiid averages 24, so Giannis still generally produces at a superstar level, and far above what Embiid has ever shown.

[fourkicks44]

It's not dumb at all. Tobias Harris factually kept the Sixers in the game with Embiid on the bench. He shot 80% from the field while guarding a GOAT player full time. And was +13 as a result. Maxey was +9 as well while Murray and MPJ were in the big negative.


Now that begs the question... how could Harris and Maxey be so far in the positive while Embiid was at 0? There's no other answer to be had except the fact that they were doing serious damage with embiid on the bench.

It doesn't matter if it hurts your feelings. It's just simple logic.


Watch the whole game before you start crying.

It was a close game and the lead swung back and fourth, when Joel and Jokic were sitting at the end of the 3rd Tobias isolated Braun and backed him down to his spot and scored on him 3 times, then on the buzzer Macus Morris hit a 3 and DeAndre Jordan fouled him and he completed a 4 point play. That is why Maxey and Tobias had such a high plus minus. Porter JR had just checkedin about this time, so his plus minus was down because he subbed in at the "wrong" time.

Harris guaded Joker one on one for the first 5 minutes of the game. He shared the duties with Batum and Joel, particularly in the 4th when the game was on the on the line and foul trouble didn't matter anymore.
.
God you are going to be pissed off when you find out about this new futuristic concept called zone defense.

The Sixers also played a zone coverage which was the reason why Joker had so many offensive boards but limited his playmaking.

On the night Nurse out coached Malone. Joel out played Joker. They play again in just over a week. We will see how they all adjust.

You're welcome.

[Kblaze8855]

It’s not just one guy running around dunking on everyone the way you can have success with in the regular season. Unless you get a team who for no good reason doesnt Build The Wall in a finals.





that continues to be the most ridiculous criticism. Needing to dedicate four people at all times to hold somebody to mere run of the mill Hall of Fame production instead of all-time elite isn’t a negative. A DPOY with another DPOY help defender flanked by one or two more people Isn’t something teams can just decide to use.

The guy dropped 50 to win the title versus the same team that contained Jokic and suddenly shot from the ft line like Steph To win the title after weeks of criticism about it.

Your refusal to credit him for his own play Makes it clear it’s just bias talking. Just like Tpols Now doing some bullshit plus minus because he doesn’t like Embiid Ignoring how often role players have a higher plus minus than stars while obviously not being as instrumental in the games.


Jordan, Kobe LeBron and Shaq types have had plenty of incredible games where they were obviously the most instrumental player but the plus minus doesn’t reflect it. People go have 40/20 games in the finals on great shooting and be a negative 1 while a role player is plus 10.

It’s trivial bullshit pulled out strictly to push the necessary agenda.

nobody with a brain gives a **** Jimmy Butler is -10 scoring 40 something points hitting the buzzer beater to force overtime and close out an elimination game. It’s a completely unnecessary narrative to push and nobody would do it for any reason but emotional attachment to an agenda they can’t take a night off from.

sometimes people you don’t like win matchups or have great games. Doesn’t necessitate a search for why it was anything but Great players having great games.

These are all MVPs, and first ballot Hall of Famers, who have a legendary status. Any feelings about them will do nothing to remove their place in history. They can just have a great game without poking and prodding to downplay it.

A lot of people I don’t **** with have great games. No need to dig into why they weren’t simply triple teamed at all times or look for who had a better plus minus. Everyone having a great game could be defended better or differently, and everyone who wins a game has other people who play well.

Only a dedicated hater needs to make it a big deal

[tpols]

Watch the whole game before you start crying.

It was a close game and the lead swung back and fourth, when Joel and Jokic were sitting at the end of the 3rd Tobias isolated Braun and backed him down to his spot and scored on him 3 times, then on the buzzer Macus Morris hit a 3 and DeAndre Jordan fouled him and he completed a 4 point play. That is why Maxey and Tobias had such a high plus minus. Porter JR had just checkedin about this time, so his plus minus was down because he subbed in at the "wrong" time.

:biggums:

You literally just illustrated exactly what I said happened. It was a stalemate between Jokic and Embiid on the court, and when they both went to the bench Philly took over.

[fourkicks44]

:biggums:

You literally just illustrated exactly what I said happened. It was a stalemate between Jokic and Embiid on the court, and when they both went to the bench Philly took over.

If that was your idea of a stalemate, sure :oldlol:

Hopefully we will see another stalemate in Denver in 10 days time :cheers:

P.S

No talk from ANYONE about Joel's assists and Jokic's lack of last night.

Always been the amazing thing that seperates them offensively and puts Jokic far ahead.

Crickets....

[Kblaze8855]

:biggums:

You literally just illustrated exactly what I said happened. It was a stalemate between Jokic and Embiid on the court, and when they both went to the bench Philly took over.

when Kobe has 50 on great shooting and is a -1 he is not at a stalemate with the opposing shooting guard who has 14 and is +6. That isn’t now, never was, and never will be how performance is determined.

[tpols]

that continues to be the most ridiculous criticism. Needing to dedicate four people at all times to hold somebody to mere run of the mill Hall of Fame production instead of all-time elite isn’t a negative. A DPOY with another DPOY help defender flanked by one or two more people Isn’t something teams can just decide to use.

The guy dropped 50 to win the title versus the same team that contained Jokic and suddenly shot from the ft line like Steph To win the title after weeks of criticism about it.

Your refusal to credit him for his own play Makes it clear it’s just bias talking. Just like Tpols Now doing some bullshit plus minus because he doesn’t like Embiid Ignoring how often role players have a higher plus minus than stars while obviously not being as instrumental in the games.


Jordan, Kobe LeBron and Shaq types have had plenty of incredible games where they were obviously the most instrumental player but the plus minus doesn’t reflect it. People go have 40/20 games in the finals on great shooting and be a negative 1 while a role player is plus 10.

It’s trivial bullshit pulled out strictly to push the necessary agenda.

nobody with a brain gives a **** Jimmy Butler is -10 scoring 40 something points hitting the buzzer beater to force overtime and close out an elimination game. It’s a completely unnecessary narrative to push and nobody would do it for any reason but emotional attachment to an agenda they can’t take a night off from.

sometimes people you don’t like win matchups or have great games. Doesn’t necessitate a search for why it was anything but Great players having great games.

These are all MVPs, and first ballot Hall of Famers, who have a legendary status. Any feelings about them will do nothing to remove their place in history. They can just have a great game without poking and prodding to downplay it.

A lot of people I don’t **** with have great games. No need to dig into why they weren’t simply triple teamed at all times or look for who had a better plus minus. Everyone having a great game could be defended better or differently, and everyone who wins a game has other people who play well.

Only a dedicated hater needs to make it a big deal

The argument being made in this thread is that Embiid destroyed Jokic because his team won. Pointing out that they played each other equally on the court and the margin was decided mostly when they both hit the bench isn't a crazy take. It's just factually what happened.

[tpols]

when Kobe has 50 on great shooting and is a -1 he is not at a stalemate with the opposing shooting guard who has 14 and is +6. That isn’t now, never was, and never will be how performance is determined.

Bullshit argument.

I'm not comparing Kobe to a role player SG. I'm comparing Jokic to Embiid. And Murray / MPJ to Harris / Maxey.

I'm doing it apples to apples. You're doing it oranges to watermelons.

[ShawkFactory]

The argument being made in this thread is that Embiid destroyed Jokic because his team won. Pointing out that they played each other equally on the court and the margin was decided mostly when they both hit the bench isn't a crazy take. It's just factually what happened.

Something being factually what happened doesn't mean that there is anything to take away from it.

[fourkicks44]

Bullshit argument.

I'm not comparing Kobe to a role player SG. I'm comparing Jokic to Embiid. And Murray / MPJ to Harris / Maxey.

I'm doing it apples to apples. You're doing it oranges to watermelons.

Go on, tpols just say it man....

Tell us Jokic had a better game than Embiid last night.

It will make you and all of us feel better

[Kblaze8855]

Bullshit argument.

I'm not comparing Kobe to a role player SG. I'm comparing Jokic to Embiid. And Murray / MPJ to Harris / Maxey.

I'm doing it apples to apples. You're doing it oranges to watermelons.


what plus minus measures makes it irrelevant what your role on the team is. Youre talking about how the team performs when somebody is on the floor and off. You out here comparing Tobias Harris to the MVP. You obviously don’t care about the role a player has in greater success. You just shitting on Joel Embiid because you don’t like him. I don’t like a lot about what he does, but I can be fair.


You check games, you can find 500 examples of plus minus obviously flying in the face of who had the better and more important performance. That’s comparing opposing stars. Opposing role players. Role players to stars. Doesn’t matter. Using plus minus to denigrate a great performance To aid in your mission of hate simply doesn’t get you anywhere because there will always be dozens of times it will go against whatever point you want to make.

The 46 point clutch game from Jimmy Butler I posted he had a worse plus minus than the opposing star in Giannis. He’s -10. Certainly isn’t how you talked about it at the time because you didn’t give a ****. Everybody talking about single game plus minus does so very selectively because every 10 minutes the results are going to go against your agenda.

You could use that bullshit to take down some of the greatest performances in the history of sports. We just don’t do it because nobody not trying to hate at the moment gives a ****. And you don’t either.

[Manny98]

Embiid turns into Kwame Brown come playoff time so who cares if he has the edge in some random game mid season

[FultzNationRISE]

It's not fair to lump Giannis in with Embiid in regards to the playoffs. He's had his struggles sure, and I'm not disagreeing teams can implement strategies that can expose his flaws, but he was dominant during that title run, even before the Finals, and has had FAR more great games and series than Embiid ever has.

Discounting the one series he had in 2015 well before he was elite, he averages 28 ppg in the playoffs for his career, while Embiid averages 24, so Giannis still generally produces at a superstar level, and far above what Embiid has ever shown.

I agree, I didnt even necessarily mean current Giannis, who is a more comprehensive player than back-to-back MVP Giannis from a few years ago, who did just bulldoze his way to regular season MVPs then performed like an awkward klutz in the playoffs. That was the specific illustration I was using of being an MVP when nobody's scheming for you, and then collapsing when they do.

G is a more legitimate playoff performer nowadays, I give him that.

[tpols]

what plus minus measures makes it irrelevant what your role on the team is. Youre talking about how the team performs when somebody is on the floor and off. You out here comparing Tobias Harris to the MVP. You obviously don’t care about the role a player has in greater success. You just shitting on Joel Embiid because you don’t like him. I don’t like a lot about what he does, but I can be fair.


You check games, you can find 500 examples of plus minus obviously flying in the face of who had the better and more important performance. That’s comparing opposing stars. Opposing role players. Role players to stars. Doesn’t matter. Using plus minus to denigrate a great performance To aid in your mission of hate simply doesn’t get you anywhere because there will always be dozens of times it will go against whatever point you want to make.

The 46 point clutch game from Jimmy Butler I posted he had a worse plus minus than the opposing star in Giannis. He’s -10. Certainly isn’t how you talked about it at the time because you didn’t give a ****. Everybody talking about single game plus minus does so very selectively because every 10 minutes the results are going to go against your agenda.

You could use that bullshit to take down some of the greatest performances in the history of sports. We just don’t do it because nobody not trying to hate at the moment gives a ****. And you don’t either.

Yes and in that same game Giannis was -8. He put up 38/20. Jimmy Butler put up 42/8/4 and was -10. Stalemate. Apples to apples.

The difference? Middleton played bad that game. Shot poorly and was -2. Lopez got abused at -13. Wes mathews was a tragedy at -19.

Meanwhile Gabe Vincent during his hot streak was +15. Bam was +17. And Kevin Love was +13.

The Heats supporting cast was the difference there. Not Butler or Giannis who both played great to a stalemate.

[Kblaze8855]

Yes and in that same game Giannis was -8. He put up 38/20. Jimmy Butler put up 42/8/4 and was -10. Stalemate. Apples to apples.

The difference? Middleton played bad that game. Shot poorly and was -2. Lopez got abused at -13. Wes mathews was a tragedy at -19.

Meanwhile Gabe Vincent during his hot streak was +15. Bam was +17. And Kevin Love was +13.

The Heats supporting cast was the difference there. Not Butler or Giannis who both played great to a stalemate.


and have you been calling it a stalemate or can I show you a dozen examples of you suggesting anything but?

[Kblaze8855]

I agree, I didnt even necessarily mean current Giannis, who is a more comprehensive player than back-to-back MVP Giannis from a few years ago, who did just bulldoze his way to regular season MVPs then performed like an awkward klutz in the playoffs. That was the specific illustration I was using of being an MVP when nobody's scheming for you, and then collapsing when they do.

G is a more legitimate playoff performer nowadays, I give him that.


A lot of this shit is just confirmation bias and seeing what we want to see.


Yeah, if you guard a face up, driving power forward with a combination of Kawhi Leonard, Ibaka and Marc Gasol, and help defenders collapsing on him so he is Double teamed at the lease and occasionally quadruple teamed his numbers will decline. Guarded by Jimmy Butler and Bam Adebayo In a series he gets hurt and misses two games(one of two times that’s happened vs the heat)? Yea. There will be a difference compared to regular season.

He was still having series of like 23/14/6/3 under those circumstances.


This


https://i.ibb.co/tZ03Mpj/IMG-7492.gif



Does not mean you can’t play in the playoffs. It means you’re a slasher being double and triple teamed and two of the people doing it are defensive players of the year.

take them away and replace them with run of the mill defenders while there is enough shooting to keep you from putting three guys on him? He’s going to go off. Doesn’t make him an entirely different player. Means he played an entirely different set of obstacles.

we treat a lot of this shit like it’s more complicated than it is.

[tpols]

I mean I'm sure you can catch me in game threads hyping up the clutchness of Jimmy Butler but the fact is if his teammates don't severely outplay Giannis teammates in that game there would be no crunchtime at all.

[Kblaze8855]

I mean I'm sure you can catch me in game threads hyping up the clutchness of Jimmy Butler but the fact is if his teammates don't outplay Giannis teammates in that game there would be no crunchtime at all.

but you’re only willing to say it outside the confines of the argument in which you were hating.

You had access to these numbers then. But you didn’t give a **** that Jimmy was -10 because we both know it doesn’t matter. It only matters when it is fuel for the flame of hatred.

It’s probably the most selectively acknowledged stat there is.

[elementally morale]

I'd take Jokic. It may change but until they play a series and proven otherwise I think he can adjust. Yesterday's game was basically was won on Jokic' passing taken away and while that was a very smart game plan it wasn't Embiid's effect. We will see in 10 days what adjustments both coaches come up with.

[Carbine]

It's a bullshit single game stat.

It gives creedence to variables outside of that player. Over the entire course of YEARS I'm sure those single game variables level out so it's useful in that respect.

[tpols]

but you’re only willing to say it outside the confines of the argument in which you were hating.

You had access to these numbers then. But you didn’t give a **** that Jimmy was -10 because we both know it doesn’t matter. It only matters when it is fuel for the flame of hatred.

It’s probably the most selectively acknowledged stat there is.

Where am I hating in this thread besides throwing a little heat back? Where am I hating within "the confines of this argument"?

I said it was a stalemate between Jokic and Embiid and provided proof.

OP said Embiid destroyed Jokic. And you come at me wiseguy? :oldlol:

[Kblaze8855]

Because you’re lying about it and only pretending that plus minus means what you’re saying is true at the moment, while spending years ignoring it. It was not a stalemate and you know it. You may act stupid for a laugh but you aren’t actually that stupid.

You’re just being emotional right now because Embiid has ho tendencies which annoy you like they annoy me. But you need to come to grips with the fact that hoes sometimes outplay players we prefer. All of my favorite players have been bested by an annoying hoe from time to time. You don’t fabricate standards you clearly don’t use across the board to pretend something else happened.

you roll with the punch and keep it moving because if you have faith in the guy you prefer, you know he’s going to laugh last.

Jokic Just won the ****ing title. He can get out played now and then. It doesn’t matter. It’s just annoying because he got out played by hoe you have less respect for. I’m just here to give you a lesson….

Sometimes…..the hoe wins the battle.

Focus on the war.

[ShawkFactory]

+\- also doesn’t acknowledge what they did while they were on the court at the same time. Due to whatever factors at play, how can we say that Embiid didn’t get more run with the second unit on this particular night?

[tontoz]

Just got done watching the game. Denver just sucked in the 4th, 5 turnovers and a bunch of bricks from 3. They only scored 17 in the 4th after scoring 78 in the first half. Whatevs

While there seems to big a big rivalry amongst their fans it certainly seems like Embiid and Jokic are cool with each other. Whenever I have seen them play against each other they seem pretty friendly.

[tpols]

Because you’re lying about it and only pretending that plus minus means what you’re saying is true at the moment, while spending years ignoring it. It was not a stalemate and you know it. You may act stupid for a laugh but you aren’t actually that stupid.

You’re just being emotional right now because Embiid has ho tendencies which annoy you like they annoy me. But you need to come to grips with the fact that hoes sometimes outplay players we prefer. All of my favorite players have been bested by an annoying hoe from time to time. You don’t fabricate standards you clearly don’t use across the board to pretend something else happened.

you roll with the punch and keep it moving because if you have faith in the guy you prefer, you know he’s going to laugh last.

Jokic Just won the ****ing title. He can get out played now and then. It doesn’t matter. It’s just annoying because he got out played by hoe you have less respect for. I’m just here to give you a lesson….

Sometimes…..the hoe wins the battle.

Focus on the war.

If Jokic truly got dominated 1v1 I would admit it. He hung 25/19 on 55%FG. That's almost a prime Shaq line. And he outplayed Embiid while both were on the floor while the latter wouldn't even guard him. What's wrong with my take here without deflecting to unrelated topics?

You know what? You should be more mad at the OP for making it seem lopsided.

[fourkicks44]

If Jokic truly got dominated 1v1 I would admit it. He hung 25/19 on 55%FG. That's almost a prime Shaq line. And he outplayed Embiid while both were on the floor while the latter wouldn't even guard him. What's wrong with my take here without deflecting to unrelated topics?

You know what? You should be more mad at the OP for making it seem lopsided.

Bingo!

There it is :lol

[ShawkFactory]

Just following up on the fact that +/- doesn't consider when both are on court at the same time. 76ers were +4 in that case.

[tpols]

I mean... he did. The game would've been a blowout if not for what happened at the end of the 3rd and start of the 4th by his bench.

[ShawkFactory]

They both played the entire 3rd quarter. Nuggets actually went on a 9-0 run to end it.

[warriorfan]

I don’t know if I would rag on embiid too much for not guarding Jokic. I didn’t see the game but it sounds like 76ers were running a good amount of zone. Sounds like a coaching game plan thing.

[tpols]

They ran zone but they were hiding embiid on Aaron Gordon.

Tobias Harris was tasked with guarding Jokic. And an ancient Batum.

[Kblaze8855]

If Jokic truly got dominated 1v1 I would admit it. He hung 25/19 on 55%FG. That's almost a prime Shaq line. And he outplayed Embiid while both were on the floor while the latter wouldn't even guard him. What's wrong with my take here without deflecting to unrelated topics?

You know what? You should be more mad at the OP for making it seem lopsided.

he absolutely did not outplay him and the thing you’re using to suggest he did you have ignored literally hundreds of times and heaped praise on people in the exact same situation and heaped praise on people deep in the negatives by plus minus because you know it doesn’t decide these things. You are fabricating an argument that doesn’t need to be made. You’re so upset about Joel Embiid being an annoying hoe you are displaying ho tendencies yourself.

And there is no deflection. I’m pointing out the indisputable fact that you are pulling an argument out of your ass that can be applied to dozens of situations you chose not to apply it because you didn’t have enough of an emotional reaction to what went on to need to bullshit everybody. The argument itself is sound or it isn’t. It isn’t, which is why you so often ignore it.


All thats gonna happen going forward is a brief period of you pretending you give a shit about plus minus to create the false sense of consistency. I know how the game is played. I invented the game. I see you. I see your inconsistent hating ass annoyed and not wanting to be real.


https://www.hostpic.org/images/2401180515460102.gif



Please. It’s for your own good.

[tpols]

Apples to apples +/- is probably the best way to determine impact. A lot of guys put up numbers and give up just as many. What you produce minus what you give up is your total value extenuating circumstances excluded.

[Xiao Yao You]

Apples to apples +/- is probably the best way to determine impact. A lot of guys put up numbers and give up just as many. What you produce minus what you give up is your total value extenuating circumstances excluded.

over time it can be useful. Game to game one of the worst stats there is

[Kblaze8855]

You know that somewhere deep in the darkest crevices of my heart I **** with you to some extent. Which is why….
























https://www.hostpic.org/images/2401180529280092.jpeg

[elementally morale]

No talk from ANYONE about Joel's assists and Jokic's lack of last night.

Not entirely true. I said it in the first half of the game thread that the 76ers zone defense was working very well despite the score at the time not showing it. Jokic was clearly out of his element and even though he had 15 points, his usual impact was nowhere to be seen. Also, I stated over and over again that exactly that lack of playmaking was the game. Not Embiid's defense but the game plan and team defense. Sure, Joel's assists helped but he had his usual passes just in the 1st half everyone was making everything on both teams.

So it was the game plan, great outside shooting from Embiid and the lack of playmaking from Jokic. The Nuggets should'v adjusted during halftime but they probably thought they can pull it out. It worked until it didn't. Nurse outcoached Malone and Embiid had a great game.

[elementally morale]

Where am I hating in this thread besides throwing a little heat back? Where am I hating within "the confines of this argument"?

I said it was a stalemate between Jokic and Embiid and provided proof.

OP said Embiid destroyed Jokic. And you come at me wiseguy? :oldlol:


It wasn't a stalemate and no one embarrassed anyone. The score was even, 111-111 when both Jokic and Embiid returned. Up until that point, Harris kept the 76ers in the game when the two centers had their rest. However, when Embiid came back he went on to score the next 10 points. As for plus minus: it doesn't show there because Jokic actually wasn't in the game for the last minute when the Nuggets made a 5 point mini-run. The game was decided at that point. When Jokic sat down the 76ers were up by 8. No stalemate: Embiid played a better 4th quarter.

Anyway, no embarrassment. 25/19 is a good individual game. The team game went missing for the Nuggets. It wasn't Jokic playing bad it was one game plan having worked better than the other. Up until his last two hail Mary 3 pointers Jokic was 11/18 from the floor. Not terrible. Embiid wes better. (Actually, Jokic took those 18 shots only on paper it was more like 14. He had three occasions when he collected 6 or 7 rebounds and put up multiple shots per possession.)

I'd still have Jokic. The 76ers and Embiid played better yesterday. It happens. Good team, MVP-caliber player, good coach, home game. Good for them. BTW, it was a nice game. I wanted Denver to win but the other team deserved it more. That's it.

[Duffy Pratt]

Who want’s to lay odds on Embiid playing in Denver? His performance here helps solidify his bid for MVP, which is what really matters, right?

[HighFlyer23]

Embiid is a perennial loser with empty stats

He's no where near jokic

[Akeem34TheDream]

over time it can be useful. Game to game one of the worst stats there is

100%. Anyone who uses that stat for a single game is either trolling or an idiot.