Wtf was Kevin Durant supposed to do

[3ba11]

If there's 2 leaders in an industry and one of them starts colluding with rivals to gain an advantage, then the other leader must follow suit.

And it's purely subjective whether it's a materially higher level of collusion for 1 top five PER to join a 73-win team versus 2 top five PER's joining a 47-win team and a FMVP.

So there is zero reason to throw shade at Durant's rings and not Bron's.. 1st mover status gives any business a great advantage and Lebron enjoys this advantage by avoiding criticism for his collusions, while Durant's collusions appear late and desperate

TLDR: bron was 1st-mover in the colluding space and just like any industry, rivals followed suit - but these rivals appeared late and desperate so their collusions get criticism, while the first mover largely avoids criticism

[John8204]

Lebron is free to sign with any team he wishes...he plays out his contract and attempts to build his team into a contender. The best player he played with was Dwayne Wade who never won an MVP and was only close once. Bosh, Kyrie, Davis, and Lover were all good players but I believe they won zero playoff series before joining Lebron. Durant was on a team that was contending for the finals, he then left that team to join a team that had already made two finals appearances. He then left that championship level team after winning two rings to put together a title challenger with a group of MVP caliber talent. When he did this he was unable to win a ring or even make a finals appearance.

Lebron went to the finals with basically four different teams and played with far less talent than KD. KD could have stayed in OKC eventually win a title put up crazy numbers and end up as top ten player. KD could have stayed in GS chased 5-7 rings and taken out people like Jokic and Giannis and become a top ten player that way. What KD has done is fail at building title teams year after year and has lost his rights at a legacy.

If Durant doesn't three peet and get those five rings he really doesn't belong in top twenty discussions. He's going to fall behing Jokic, Giannis, people are going to look at CPIII and likely rank him as being better, Wemby, Chet, and Doncic are all going to make legacy for themselves in the next ten years and Durant is going to be known as the guy that was a cancer and a cautionary tale.

[Axe]

1-9

[3ba11]

Lebron is free to sign with any team he wishes





Except he didn't sign as a free agent.. He forced Dan Gilbert's hand by forcing a sign-and-trade to the Heat, which allowed Bosh to come as well - the top 3 first options in the conference decided to team up, thus diluting the conference and consolidating power on 1 team... So imagine if Jokic, Luka and Curry teamed up.






he plays out his contract and attempts to build his team into a contender.





Any top 20 all-time player will have an organic juggernaut and league favorite after about 6-7 years in the league, which is what happened with Giannis, Jokic, MJ or 2010 Lebron.

The issue is that Lebron gave up after Year 7 and teamed up with opposing franchise players, while Giannis, Jokic and MJ completed the learning curve of chemistry, brand of ball and perseverance, as required to develop lottery rosters into champions (organic winning).

By giving up, Lebron missed out on the 1-star organic chip that was available in 2011 (Dirk grabbed it) - unlike the Heat, those Cavs would've had the chemistry and reputed defense required to beat the Mavs.






The best player he played with was Dwayne Wade who never won an MVP and was only close once.





Wait.. that's the standard for a good sidekick now? He must have won an MVP?

Absurd and this is the kind of hypnosis that has occurred where Lebron fans move the goal posts to whatever makes Lebron's cast seem bad - and the goal posts are now at MVP - a sidekick must have MVP on their resume or he will get slammed on social media for being an insufficient sidekick.

But how about FMVP and arguably the most dominant Finals performance that we've ever seen?.. FMVP Wade taught Lebron how to win and perform under pressure.. Unfortunately, Lebron didn't learn the lesson until he'd cost Wade his 2nd FMVP.






Bosh, Kyrie, Davis, and Lover were all good players but I believe they won zero playoff series before joining Lebron.





AD swept Portland and then took a game off the 18' Warriors, while Lebron/Love were beaten by record amount.. AD is 4th all-time in PER (Jokic, MJ, Lebron, AD, aka sick company)

But the point is that these guys gave their primes to Lebron - he snatched each of them as they were entering their prime, so it shouldn't be surprising that they hadn't won many playoff series yet..

But I don't think there's ever been a guy that made 10 all-star games and played 3rd option for much of his prime like Bosh did.. And Love was a wildly sophisticated big man that won 40 games in the West with no help - he was putting up historic numbers and you could say that he was like a big-man version of Luka - top 10 player in the league.







Durant was on a team that was contending for the finals





with Westbrick - that's a key point

KD had a Finals team with Westbrick, while Lebron missed the play-in with Westbrook/AD and other top 75 players.

So you're making my point about KD's superiority.. In addition to doing more with less, KD outplayed Lebron twice on the highest level (Finals).

After his 2 chips with the Warriors, Durant's subsequent collusions were back luck with injuries (otherwise he wins in 2021) and this is karmic because the 1st mover (lebron) gets all the luck and the copier (Durant) gets the bad end of the stick every time -that's how it works in business too.. But based on Durant's success with Westbrook and would-be title with New Jersey in 2021, it's clear that Durant can do more with less, while also reaching higher team ceilings or Finals records, and outplayed Lebron H2H.






Lebron went to the finals with basically four different teams and played with far less talent than KD.





Lebron was 1st-mover, so he got first pickings - he got FMVP's and guys that were entering their primes, while Durant was late to the colluding party, so he got the bad end of the stick most of the time via over-the-hill guys (Harden), or horrible luck with injuries (Kyrie).. So Lebron was just luckier as the 1st-mover.

And aside from 2017 and 2018, Lebron had greater help than KD easily.. Lebron had a veteran super-team in 2012, while Durant had a team of babies, bench players (harden) and westBRICK.. Yet Durant was still favored in that series because Lebron's brand of ball yielded a sub-par team record and lost as the favorite for the previous 3 seasons - so oddsmakers were skittish on Lebron's teams and downplayed them in the odds

[SouBeachTalents]

OP really gonna spend the rest of his life crying about LeBron :lol

[ArbitraryWater]

Didnt KD have a team that allowed him to comfortably lead the Warriors 3-1 without playing spectacularly, that allowed him to close them out with just 1 good quarter of basketball up 9, in which he then went 1/7 with 2 TOs in the last 2 minutes?


Only for him to run away tail tucked between his legs after the fact?

KD had a team that performed better without him then leBrons did without him.

[StrongLurk]

KD was already on a star talented team and BLEW a 3-1 series lead to Curry/Klay/Dray and Warriors. He then JOINED them a few months later while leaving his already talented team :roll:

Can't even be compared to Lebron.

Imagine Lebron leaving the Kyrie/Love Cavs to join the Warriors after losing to them :lol

[Mask the Embiid]

This will go down as the Lebron/curry era….kd was not one of “the leaders”


Kawhi > kd too btw…. We seen what kawhi was gonna do to the suns last year in the playoffs….n we seen kawhi up 20 vs kd on gsw….kawhi is the biggest what if in nba history…I know he’s better than kd but I can’t prove it because of the injuries, to KD’s fans….but I know the real


Kawhi makes kd his bch almost everytime he plays him since kd called him a system player…..FACTS!



Edit kawhi getting one ring on the clippers will leap frog him into the top 10 all time even with the injuries….yeah that’s above Hakeem & dem….n that’s with a part time playing career….so imagine


He is going to be right there with the Kobe’s if he can just get this ring on the clippers that would be 2 franchises he gave them their 1st ring.

[BarberSchool]

Stay his a$$ in OKC with Harden, Westbrick, Ibaka, and Steven Adams and win a few titles organically after years of development together.

[tpols]

OP really gonna spend the rest of his life crying about LeBron :lol

He's ethering you guys tbh.

Lebron wins nothing with those Thunder teams and Westbrook in a tough west. The fit is beyond horrible and we saw that in real time.

Durant OTOH would be a dynamo joining prime Wade and Bosh in a joke conference. Miami could've realized their not 4, not 5, not 6 destiny or at the very least not been blown out and embarrassed multiple times.

You know that but can't admit it because as they say... "the truth hurts".

[SATAN]

OP ran out of ideas years ago.

[3ba11]

Stay his a$$ in OKC with Harden, Westbrick, Ibaka, and Steven Adams and win a few titles organically after years of development together.


He can't stay in OKC because his main rival started colluding and stacking the deck - so he must follow suit - and that's exactly what lebron did - he saw Kobe get his 5th chip in 2010 and immediately called Wade to start planning the team-up - Wade says they teamed up to stop Kobe here (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ufTvYqiZIF8)

[ShawkFactory]

He can't stay in OKC because his main rival started colluding and stacking the deck - so he must follow suit - and that's exactly what lebron did - he saw Kobe get his 5th chip in 2010 and immediately called Wade to start planning the team-up - Wade says they teamed up to stop Kobe here (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ufTvYqiZIF8)

Lol no. He joined his main rival after they came back on him up 3-1 while he fumbled the bag multiple times late in those closing games.

If they'd continuously lost to Lebron's teams then you'd have a point. But alas, you don't. He lost to them once and left the Thunder 4 years later.

[3ba11]

Lol no. He joined his main rival after they came back on him up 3-1 while he fumbled the bag multiple times late in those closing games.

If they'd continuously lost to Lebron's teams then you'd have a point. But alas, you don't. He lost to them once and left the Thunder 4 years later.


Right and Lebron did the exact same thing by fumbling MANY games late in the 2009 ECF or 2010 ECSF

so he lost as historic favorite both times and subsequently ran away to team up with opposing franchise players thereafter.

This isn't bs - Lebron averaged 21 on 34% for the last 3 games of the 2010 ECSF (he literally melted down in the locker room and quit (weak mentally), so he lost to the 50-win Celtics and fossils as a massive favorite.. And in 2009 he turned into a 12 turnover per game player in clutch-time (last 5 within 5) - it's impossible to win when the primary ballhandler turns into a 12 turnover player in the clutch and chokes in the critical Game 4 OT that swung the series.

So Lebron had many bad losses from 2004-2010, which is why he ran away and teamed up with opponents thereafter.. Lebron's first 7 years reads as follows: lottery, lottery, 2nd Round loss, sweep loss, 2nd Round loss (locked up), historic upset loss, historic upset loss in 2nd Round (locked up) - so that's 2 lotteries, 3 losses in 2nd Round, 2 upsets, 1 sweep and locked up twice.

[iamgine]

Nothing. Durant can do whatever he want. And we can have any opinion we want about him.

[StrongLurk]

Right and Lebron did the exact same thing by fumbling MANY games late in the 2009 ECF or 2010 ECSF

so he lost as historic favorite both times and subsequently ran away to team up with opposing franchise players thereafter.

This isn't bs - Lebron averaged 21 on 34% for the last 3 games of the 2010 ECSF (he literally melted down in the locker room and quit (weak mentally), so he lost to the 50-win Celtics and fossils as a massive favorite.. And in 2009 he turned into a 12 turnover per game player in clutch-time (last 5 within 5) - it's impossible to win when the primary ballhandler turns into a 12 turnover player in the clutch and chokes in the critical Game 4 OT that swung the series.

So Lebron had many bad losses from 2004-2010, which is why he ran away and teamed up with opponents thereafter.. Lebron's first 7 years reads as follows: lottery, lottery, 2nd Round loss, sweep loss, 2nd Round loss (locked up), historic upset loss, historic upset loss in 2nd Round (locked up) - so that's 2 lotteries, 3 losses in 2nd Round, 2 upsets, 1 sweep and locked up twice.

Every time you post, it just makes me more convinced the Lebron is the GOAT.

[Wally450]

He's ethering you guys tbh.

Lebron wins nothing with those Thunder teams and Westbrook in a tough west. The fit is beyond horrible and we saw that in real time.

Durant OTOH would be a dynamo joining prime Wade and Bosh in a joke conference. Miami could've realized their not 4, not 5, not 6 destiny or at the very least not been blown out and embarrassed multiple times.

You know that but can't admit it because as they say... "the truth hurts".

Does that change the fact that all he does is cry about LeBron?

[sdot_thadon]

This isn't bs - Lebron averaged 21 on 34% for the last 3 games of the 2010 ECSF (he literally melted down in the locker room and quit (weak mentally), so he lost to the 50-win Celtics and fossils as a massive favorite.. And in 2009 he turned into a 12 turnover per game player in clutch-time (last 5 within 5) - it's impossible to win when the primary ballhandler turns into a 12 turnover player in the clutch and chokes in the critical Game 4 OT that swung the series.
Yeah it's not bs, it's trash. Only thing you have going for you here most of the time is no one even bothers to fact check you anymore because we all know you're full of shit lol. In games lost in that 2009 series, he literally had 1 turnover per 4th qtr except for one game , game 4 in which he had 7 across the 4th and Ot. And still had a shot to win it at the end. More fun facts about the 2009 ECF and playoff run in general:

Lebron avg 39 8 8 on 59% TS against the #1 defense with the dpoy (3, almost 4, 40 point games)

Has the NBA record for PER in that playoff run at 37.4 and all his advanced metrics being off the charts as well.

Lebron averaged 47.5 points per 100 possessions on 62 % TS over 14 games, bbuh bbuh Mj right? The next highest points per 100 possessions with at least 60 % TS was Jordan with 43.4 points per 100 possessions on 60 % TS in 1989

Meanwhile the Magic shot lights out that series:

Lewis: 48% (career 39%)
Turk: 39% (career 38%)
Pietrus 47% from 3 (career 35%)
Alston: 38% from 3 (career 35%)
Dwight: 70% free throw (career 57%)

Not to mention BigZ and Andy being completely unequipped to deal with prime Dwight.

Oh and "Superstar Mo"? Shot 37% from the field (47% during the season, 44% in the 1st rd, 50% in the 2nd rd)

You can try to blame Lebron for 09 but the truth is he literally did everything that series and any game they were in striking distance of winning was because of his excellence not the other way around. If only he had a spare all nba/all defensive teammate to back him up that series.....



So Lebron had many bad losses from 2004-2010, which is why he ran away and teamed up with opponents thereafter.. Lebron's first 7 years reads as follows: lottery, lottery, 2nd Round loss, sweep loss, 2nd Round loss (locked up), historic upset loss, historic upset loss in 2nd Round (locked up) - so that's 2 lotteries, 3 losses in 2nd Round, 2 upsets, 1 sweep and locked up twice. if only he could make the playoffs and be in the lottery at the same time like some players lol. You forgot finals appearance on the back of a historic game in that 1st 7 years

[3ba11]

Nothing. Durant can do whatever he want. And we can have any opinion we want about him.


yes but when forming an opinion, it's good to have all the facts like Lebron having a 6-year headstart in the colluding space, so he got first pickings on the best teammates - he got guys entering their prime while he himself had a lot of prime left, whereas KD was 6 years behind and therefore his choices of teammates were older and injured, as was himself.. The 1st mover gets all the luck and breaks, while the 2nd-mover (copier) gets all the bad breaks and the criticism - this is true in business and most walks of life.. Durant's only mistake was waiting 6 years to respond and then leaving the Warriors in my opinion was also a mistake because he could've 6-peated, which would've made him GOAT.. His brand of ball allows such a team ceiling

[3ba11]

Yeah it's not bs, it's trash. Only thing you have going for you here most of the time is no one even bothers to fact check you anymore because we all know you're full of shit lol. In games lost in that 2009 series, he literally had 1 turnover per 4th qtr except for one game , game 4 in which he had 7 across the 4th and Ot. And still had a shot to win it at the end. More fun facts about the 2009 ECF and playoff run in general:






You completely made my point - the bolded above shows that only 3 of 6 games did he get 1 turnover in 4th, which is still a 4 turnover per game player in the 4th.. The other 3 games he was at least an 8 turnover per game player (2+ turnovers in 4th) and the critical game he was a 28-turnover per game player in the 4th (7 turnovers in 4th and OT)..

holy shit that's bad and literal butterfingers in the clutch - this is why people say LeChoke.. it's because the numbers completely back this up (the most 4th quarter turnovers or missed FT's ever) and this is why he lost as a historic favorite in the 2009 ECF - heck, the Magic had the injury excuse but still won and they were one of the 5 biggest underdogs to ever win a playoff series.. Imagine what Kobe would do to Lebron in the Finals considering what Dwight and Dirk already did lol

Overall, nba.com reports that Lebron averaged 1.2 turnovers during "clutch-time" in that series (last 5 within 5).. This equates to 11.5 turnovers per 48 minutes of clutch-time, so he was a 12-turnover per game player in clutch-time.. it's impossible for any team to win a close series with a 12 turnover per game player.







Meanwhile the Magic shot lights out that series:





Yeah so did the 11' Mavs, `14' Spurs, 17' Warriors, 21' Suns and 23' Nuggets

That's what happens against ball-domination that lets defenses rest, so they have more capacity for offense and to "get hot" offensively..

Meanwhile, Lebron's team is facing zippy ball movement that wears down his team and leaves them with less capacity for offense - his brand of ball loses the attrition battle in this fashion - TIME AND TIME AGAIN - his team gets worn down more than they wear down the opponen, aka his team applies less pressure than they face - the best defense is a good offense - a tenet of all competition....

[tpols]

game 4 in which he had 7 across the 4th and Ot.


That's an insane amount of turnovers for such a short period of time in a crucial game that put them down 1-3 in the series. Then Dwight hung 40/14 on him in the closeout game. That's embarrassing. The cavs were a 66 win team with HCA.

[tpols]

If only he had a spare all nba/all defensive teammate to back him up that series.....


Anderson Varejeo was literally voted to the NBA All Defense team when he was on Cleveland and the Cavs in 2009 were the 3rd ranked defense in the entire league.

[ArbitraryWater]

That's an insane amount of turnovers for such a short period of time in a crucial game that put them down 1-3 in the series. Then Dwight hung 40/14 on him in the closeout game. That's embarrassing. The cavs were a 66 win team with HCA.


tpols is where lebron gets flamed for a 44 pt triple double with 7 turnovers in 4th+OT but KD going 1/7 in the 4th with 2 TOs the last 2 minutes is spared

[3ba11]

tpols is where lebron gets flamed for a 44 pt triple double with 7 turnovers in 4th+OT but KD going 1/7 in the 4th with 2 TOs the last 2 minutes is spared


KD wasn't the favorite and had Westbrook, which hurts clutch-time strategy and effectiveness

Lebron is the greatest turnover machine ever based on career turnovers or turnover rate for a frontcourt player (a normally low-turnover position, so it really kills a team) and we aren't talking a one-off - there are many series that he lost due to high turnovers, low team assists and inferior brand of ball (not inferior team talent).. And Lebron also lost series due to shooting below 40%, or letting his defensive matchup go off and even win FMVP over him (4 times, 3 different opposing SF's including a bench player)

[tpols]

tpols is where lebron gets flamed for a 44 pt triple double with 7 turnovers in 4th+OT but KD going 1/7 in the 4th with 2 TOs the last 2 minutes is spared

It wasn't spared if you're talking about 2016. But the Thunder were underdogs up against a fully healthy, non suspended 73 win juggernaut. They weren't even expected to win. The fact they even went up 3-1 was extremely impressive. Lebron doesn't even make the playoffs with Westbrook.

[aj1987]

It wasn't spared if you're talking about 2016. But the Thunder were underdogs up against a fully healthy, non suspended 73 win juggernaut. They weren't even expected to win. The fact they even went up 3-1 was extremely impressive. Lebron doesn't even make the playoffs with Westbrook.

Kobe BARELY made the PO's with 2 DPOY's, a MVP, HOF Gasol, and an All-Star in Jamison. PEAK Kobe missed the PO's and got choked a 3-1 lead the next season.

[ShawkFactory]

Right

Yea...

Pretty much answers your question.

[sdot_thadon]

Anderson Varejeo was literally voted to the NBA All Defense team when he was on Cleveland and the Cavs in 2009 were the 3rd ranked defense in the entire league.

Wrong. Andy made that defensive 2nd team the following season in 2010, which was the only time Lebron ever had a teammate make it. And he never would ever sniff an all nba team at the same time as I stated. Meanwhile some other guy would get both all nba/ all defensive 1st selections yearly out of 1 teammate.

[sdot_thadon]

You completely made my point - the bolded above shows that only 3 of 6 games did he get 1 turnover in 4th, which is still a 4 turnover per game player in the 4th.. The other 3 games he was at least an 8 turnover per game player (2+ turnovers in 4th) and the critical game he was a 28-turnover per game player in the 4th (7 turnovers in 4th and OT)..

holy shit that's bad and literal butterfingers in the clutch - this is why people say LeChoke.. it's because the numbers completely back this up (the most 4th quarter turnovers or missed FT's ever) and this is why he lost as a historic favorite in the 2009 ECF - heck, the Magic had the injury excuse but still won and they were one of the 5 biggest underdogs to ever win a playoff series.. Imagine what Kobe would do to Lebron in the Finals considering what Dwight and Dirk already did lol

Overall, nba.com reports that Lebron averaged 1.2 turnovers during "clutch-time" in that series (last 5 within 5).. This equates to 11.5 turnovers per 48 minutes of clutch-time, so he was a 12-turnover per game player in clutch-time.. it's impossible for any team to win a close series with a 12 turnover per game player.

I get that it's a component of your trolling to never actually dispute what's said, but to sidetrack it but at some point bruh you're still gonna look like an idiot that can't read or is too stupid to spend a moment to debate with. I said he had one turnover in the 4th in 3 out the 4 loses. The rest are a moot point because he still won the games and he won them himself. Fun fact for the series Lebron only had 3 more turnovers than Mj had in the 89 ecf on a higher usage rate as basically the primary AND secondary playmaker for his team vs the no.1 defense with the dpoy anchoring them.




Yeah so did the 11' Mavs, `14' Spurs, 17' Warriors, 21' Suns and 23' Nuggets

That's what happens against ball-domination that lets defenses rest, so they have more capacity for offense and to "get hot" offensively..

Meanwhile, Lebron's team is facing zippy ball movement that wears down his team and leaves them with less capacity for offense - his brand of ball loses the attrition battle in this fashion - TIME AND TIME AGAIN - his team gets worn down more than they wear down the opponen, aka his team applies less pressure than they face - the best defense is a good offense - a tenet of all competition.... it lets the defense rest? He's literally leveraging the whole floor and forcing 5 guys to react to him at this point is his career, are you high? It just goes to show he's faced not only some incredible teams but he's seen them on their best days too. His level of comp isn't touched by your guy.

[3ba11]

I get that it's a component of your trolling to never actually dispute what's said, but to sidetrack it but at some point bruh you're still gonna look like an idiot that can't read or is too stupid to spend a moment to debate with. I said he had one turnover in the 4th in 3 out the 4 loses. The rest are a moot point because he still won the games and he won them himself. Fun fact for the series Lebron only had 3 more turnovers than Mj had in the 89 ecf on a higher usage rate as basically the primary AND secondary playmaker for his team vs the no.1 defense with the dpoy anchoring them.



it lets the defense rest? He's literally leveraging the whole floor and forcing 5 guys to react to him at this point is his career, are you high? It just goes to show he's faced not only some incredible teams but he's seen them on their best days too. His level of comp isn't touched by your guy.


You think it's coincidence that Lebron had so many bad losses in his prime (sweeps, record losses, gentleman sweeps, upset losses).. Many different teams destroyed him

When 1 guy is pounding the rock, the ball isn't moving so the 5 defenders get to stand and watch.

No need to rotate when the ball isn't moving

bball 101... Ball-dominance kills ball movement - opponents get hot because they're fresher from getting to rest rather than get worn down vs ball movemen

I know this because when I went from HS to college, the faster brand of ball made me do layups in spots that I would've dunked im HS, while tired legs exposed my weak shooting mechanics

And Lebron had 7 turnovers in the critical 4th and critical game to lose the series - massive choke - and still massive turnover machine in the other games (4 turnover per game player was the minimum in the 4th quarters).

To summarize - 3 things lost the 09' ECF - 1) choke in critical Game 4 OT 2) decided to defend Courtney Lee instead of providing the size/agility needed to defend Hedo (his position) 3) turnover machine (28 turnover per game player im the critical 4th & OT)

[tpols]

Wrong. Andy made that defensive 2nd team the following season in 2010, which was the only time Lebron ever had a teammate make it. And he never would ever sniff an all nba team at the same time as I stated. Meanwhile some other guy would get both all nba/ all defensive 1st selections yearly out of 1 teammate.

Wait you think Varejeo just magically got better on defense from 2009 to 2010? :oldlol: Cleveland was the THIRD ranked defense in the league in 2009 and your complaining about their defense that year. That makes no sense. The facts bear out that they were indeed an elite defense at that time.

[StrongLurk]

The Cavs lost two the Magic in 09 for two reasons.

1. Mo Williams shit the bed

2. The much BIGGER reason is simply "format". The 09 Magic played a more analytically sound offense with 3 point shooters spacing the floor for Dwight. The 09 Magic set a record for most made 3's in that series (most at the time and only needed 6 games too). It was a snapshot into what the NBA would change to. This is why I always laugh when people think the 90's Bulls could compete with modern teams. They'd literally get swept by a team like the 2017 Warriors.

[Xiao Yao You]

The Cavs lost two the Magic in 09 for two reasons.

1. Mo Williams shit the bed

2. The much BIGGER reason is simply "format". The 09 Magic played a more analytically sound offense with 3 point shooters spacing the floor for Dwight. The 09 Magic set a record for most made 3's in that series (most at the time and only needed 6 games too). It was a snapshot into what the NBA would change to. This is why I always laugh when people think the 90's Bulls could compete with modern teams. They'd literally get swept by a team like the 2017 Warriors.

why when these era comparisons are made it's always by current rules? Warriors would get beat in the 90's

[StrongLurk]

why when these era comparisons are made it's always by current rules? Warriors would get beat in the 90's

No they wouldn't :oldlol:. Especially if you are giving them the mid-90's shortened 3 point line. There are no "rules" that would equalize the huge difference between the skill/talent/schemes that the 2017 Warriors had compared to the 90's Bulls. Remember, those Warriors teams were ELITE on defense too. They had top offenses/defenses, massive superstar talent, and good depth with versatile defenders.

[bison]

100% high IQ take by OP once again. KD essentially made a business move when he signed with golden state. LeBron signed with Miami out of desperation for his declining brand. We owe KD an apology.

[3ba11]

The Cavs lost two the Magic in 09 for two reasons.

1. Mo Williams shit the bed





MJ won with that crap from Pippen all the time, whereas Lebron never beat a top 5 SRS or Finals team with weak scoring & efficiency from a sidekick..

The reason that Lebron can't successfully carry the scoring load against top teams is because the team is too ball-dominant when Lebron is scoring that much, so he needs franchise players at sidekick that can match his scoring and adequately offset his brand of ball.. Otoh, expert jumpshooters can drop 40-50 while the ball moves, so they routinely beat top teams with bed-wetting sidekicks and lesser scoring help, which allows winning with non-franchise guys like Klay, Wiggins or Pippen.. This contrasts with the franchise players and all-time scorers that ball-dominators need (kareem, ad, wade, kyrie).






2. The much BIGGER reason is simply "format". The 09 Magic played a more analytically sound offense with 3 point shooters spacing the floor for Dwight. The 09 Magic set a record for most made 3's in that series (most at the time and only needed 6 games too). It was a snapshot into what the NBA would change to. This is why I always laugh when people think the 90's Bulls could compete with modern teams. They'd literally get swept by a team like the 2017 Warriors.





Even though Lebron had the best size/agility in the league, he decided NOT to provide these things that were critical in defending hybrids like Hedo or Lewis (who were controlling the series).. It's a catastrophic error by Mike Brown and Lebron to have Lebron NOT guard his normal position (forward).

Secondly, Lebron's 38 ppg is too ball-dominant to beat a top team, which is why he never beat a top 5 SRS or Finals team with weak scoring & efficiency from a sidekick (no carry-jobs vs top teams in 2 decades)..

If the top scorer on a team is a high-scoring ball-dominator, then that's a lot of buckets that go UNASSISTED, leading to a low-assist team and inferior brand of ball.. Accordingly, Lebron needs all-time scorers at sidekick like AD, Wade or Kyrie that can match his scoring and adequately offset his brand of ball, whereas expert jumpshooters can score 40 while the ball moves and therefore win with less scoring help like Klay, Wiggins or Pippen.

Thirdly, there's the historic Game 4 choke - 7 turnovers in the 4th quarter and OT and 3-11 in OT - dominated by Dwight in the OT - a massive choke and a precursor to the 2010 2nd Round collapse/quit-job/choke and then the goat choke of them all - 2011 Finals.. This is why Lebron is called a choker - it's because he had catastrophic losses during his prime (record losses, sweeps, or upset losses) in 09', 10', 11', 14', 17', 18', and 23'... And he has the most 4th quarter turnovers or missed FT's in history.. The all-time leader in turnovers and low-efficiency on game-winners, aka butterfingers in the clutch, LeButterFingers