Ewing goaltending on purpose to start the national championship game.

[Kblaze8855]

https://youtu.be/9smO51-eepA?si=fPnioMxa8pD4BjLR


if you don’t know the story or remember the game, Ewing was an incredibly big deal in college but mostly for defense. When he came to the league, he was supposed to be like Bill Russell with a mean streak who could shoot a bit. And he turned into a scorer who also blocks shots. anyway, at this point he is mostly there for intimidation. So he was told to go out there in the national championship game against a team with worthy Jordan and Sam Perkins and just block everything. Dont let them see the ball go in. And as you can see up there he did.


In the end…Jordan hits the shot…they lose the national title by one…and he gave them 10 points early just catching the ball on the way down on purpose.


Lets say you run Georgetown and John Thompson comes and tells you he told him to do that.


Acceptable?

Fireable offense?

[beasted]

I think he was legitimately trying to block some of those.

Did he ever confirm this during any interviews?

[Kblaze8855]

It’s long been understood that Thompson told him to go after everything to start the game and didn’t care if it was a goaltend, but I don’t know the original source of the confirmation

[tontoz]

I remember that lol. Dubious strategy but i get it.

Reminds me of a conversation i had early in that season. I was a freshman in high school and one of my friends was a big tar heel fan. He was telling me about this freshman on UNC who was getting regular time. He said Dean Smith never plays freshmen and that this guy looks unbelievable and i'm like get a grip dude there is no way he will be that good. It was MJ of course.

[L.Kizzle]

Did it work? As in, keeping the team from inside the paint.
Did it make them shoot more jumpers? I mean they obviously lost the game but did it force guys to shoot outside shots they normally wouldn't?

[Xiao Yao You]

Did it work? As in, keeping the team from inside the paint.
Did it make them shoot more jumpers? I mean they obviously lost the game but did it force guys to shoot outside shots they normally wouldn't?

MJ hit the game winner further out than he later became famous for

[warriorfan]

I remember that lol. Dubious strategy but i get it.

Reminds me of a conversation i had early in that season. I was a freshman in high school and one of my friends was a big tar heel fan. He was telling me about this freshman on UNC who was getting regular time. He said Dean Smith never plays freshmen and that this guy looks unbelievable and i'm like get a grip dude there is no way he will be that good. It was MJ of course.

lol

[RogueBorg]

Reminds me of a conversation i had early in that season. I was a freshman in high school and one of my friends was a big tar heel fan. He was telling me about this freshman on UNC who was getting regular time. He said Dean Smith never plays freshmen and that this guy looks unbelievable and i'm like get a grip dude there is no way he will be that good. It was MJ of course.

I had a similar conversation. Back in ('81) I was playing basketball with a kid on our block, ironically enough, his name was Keith Jordan (he was white). He was telling me about this super rookie at North Carolina with almost the same name. Turned out to be MJ.

[tpols]

When you're overmatched you do have to employ more aggressive high risk strategies. Play it safe you're gonna lose anyway.

[pandiani17]

It’s long been understood that Thompson told him to go after everything to start the game and didn’t care if it was a goaltend, but I don’t know the original source of the confirmation

I read in a book about the Big East Conference that was written a couple of years ago that yes, Thompson wanted to intimidate the opposition and he wanted them to think that scoring against Ewing would be a challenge, putting some sort of a mental barrier in their heads. It almost worked, if MJ didn't hit the shot they would have won the game.

[tontoz]

When you're overmatched you do have to employ more aggressive high risk strategies. Play it safe you're gonna lose anyway.

Gtown was a 1 seed. They were a really strong team. Their guard Sleepy Floyd had a long NBA career.

[tpols]

Gtown was a 1 seed. They were a really strong team. Their guard Sleepy Floyd had a long NBA career.

Well then I guess coach ****ed up. Ain't taking that duo over MJ and James worthy though.

[tontoz]

Well then I guess coach ****ed up. Ain't taking that duo over MJ and James worthy though.



MJ wasn't MJ then. The old joke was: "who could hold MJ under 20?" answer: Dean Smith

MJ only averaged 13 ppg in his freshman year. Worthy is quoted as saying he had no clue how good MJ would become. MJ grew and got stronger leading into his 2nd season and that is when he broke out.

Even when he finally came out for the draft he wasn't the top prospect. Hakeem was the consensus top pick. Nobody talked about taking MJ over him.

Gene Smith on Gtown was one of the best college defenders ive ever seen. He was almost like Pat Bev on steroids, very strong and rabidly intense.

[tpols]

MJ wasn't MJ then. The old joke was: "who could hold MJ under 20?" answer: Dean Smith

MJ only averaged 13 ppg in his freshman year. Worthy is quoted as saying he had no clue how good MJ would become. MJ grew and got stronger leading into his 2nd season and that is when he broke out.

Even when he finally came out for the draft he wasn't the top prospect. Hakeem was the consensus top pick. Nobody talked about taking MJ over him.

Gene Smith on Gtown was one of the best college defenders ive ever seen. He was almost like Pat Bev on steroids, very strong and rabidly intense.

Bob Knight one of the best college coaches ever is on record saying Jordan was the best college basketball player he ever saw. And he clearly demonstrated that in the championship game.

[tontoz]

Bob Knight one of the best college coaches ever is on record saying Jordan was the best college basketball player he ever saw. And he clearly demonstrated that in the championship game.

That's not accurate. In fact Knight ended Jordan's college career. He punk'd Jordan in Jordan's last game in college, completely shutting him down by playing a box and 1 defense against him.

https://www.ncaa.com/news/basketball-men/article/2020-06-02/how-indiana-stunned-north-carolina-michael-jordans-final-college-game#:~:text=Maybe%20you%20watched%20The%20Last,16 %20game%20in%20Atlanta's%20Omni.

Bob Knight was the Olympic coach that summer. After watching Jordan day after day that was when he said Jordan was the best player (pro or college) that he'd ever seen. He said he had no clue Jordan was that good until he had the chance to coach him.

Jordan actually said that the best player in the tryouts was Barkley, who didn't make the team.

[tpols]

That's not accurate. In fact Knight ended Jordan's college career. He punk'd Jordan in Jordan's last game in college, completely shutting him down by playing a box and 1 defense against him.

Bob Knight was the Olympic coach that summer. After watching Jordan day after day that was when he said Jordan was the best player (pro or college) that he'd ever seen. He said he had no clue Jordan was that good until he had the chance to coach him.

Jordan actually said that the best player in the tryouts was Barkley, who didn't make the team.

That... doesn't really refute anything. So MJs talent was innate and when he really saw it up close he realized he was the GOAT? Yea...

If MJ was a scrub in the Championship game versus Georgetown you'd have a point but he literally buried them to win the title.

And James worthy hung 28 on 77% shooting. UNC obviously had extreme firepower than the opposing coach was trying to intimidate.

[Xiao Yao You]

Well then I guess coach ****ed up. Ain't taking that duo over MJ and James worthy though.

Don't forget their 2nd best player Sam Perkins

[tontoz]

That... doesn't really refute anything. So MJs talent was innate and when he really saw it up close he realized he was the GOAT? Yea...

If MJ was a scrub in the Championship game versus Georgetown you'd have a point but he literally buried them to win the title.

And James worthy hung 28 on 77% shooting. UNC obviously had extreme firepower than the opposing coach was trying to intimidate.

MJ was a 6'4" skinny freshman averaging 13 ppg. Obviously they had confidence in him to take the last shot, but back then he was just a good player.

I assume UNC was favored but it probably wasnt by a lot.

Bobby Knight coached against him when Jordan was at his college peak and shut him down.

[ralph_i_el]

This is the same Thompson who lost the '88 Olympics?

My dad still rants about how awful a coach he was, and how he was outright racist, to the detriment of team USA. Idk, I wasn't there.

Something about him avoiding bringing white guy shooters on the team? Anyone have any insight into what my 65 year old dad is still heated about this?

[tontoz]

This is the same Thompson who lost the '88 Olympics?

My dad still rants about how awful a coach he was, and how he was outright racist, to the detriment of team USA. Idk, I wasn't there.

Something about him avoiding bringing white guy shooters on the team? Anyone have any insight into what my 65 year old dad is still heated about this?


To be honest I never cared about Olympic basketball.

Thompson was a defense first coach and that probably worked against him in the Olympics.

[Xiao Yao You]

To be honest I never cared about Olympic basketball.

Thompson was a defense first coach and that probably worked against him in the Olympics.

college kids playing against pros was a bigger issue.

[tontoz]

college kids playing against pros was a bigger issue.

Knight's team in '84 with Jordan cruised to gold pretty easily I believe, but yeah that had to change.

If we had to use college players now we would never get a medal with all the 1 and done players.

[Xiao Yao You]

Knight's team in '84 with Jordan cruised to gold pretty easily I believe, but yeah that had to change.

If we had to use college players now we would never get a medal with all the 1 and done players.

'84 was the Soviet boycott. USA probably wins anyway but not as easily as they did. USA pulled off the upset in the '86 Worlds too but the world was getting better

[Wally450]

Totally unrelated, but I saw Patrick Ewing at a volleyball tournament in DC last week.

[90sgoat]

Whenever I watch young Ewing, I get a better idea why he was such a highly touted and respected player and why MJ etc considered him such a force.

I only watched Ewing when his knees were gone and his athleticism has turned him into a jump shooter and defensive anchor, but when you see young Ewing, he's an absolute athletic phenom, in many ways what David Robinson turned out to be, but with better fundamentals.

I mean, Ewing on those 90s Knicks was one of the more iconic franchise players, no doubt a big culture guy and leader too, but he was limited and he didn't really force himself on the opposition offensively, it was a lot of midrange jumpers, which I guess lessened his offensive impact.

Perhaps that's why they coined the "Ewing syndrome", that some teams tend to play better initially when their star player goes down. Probably because the offense gets more free flowing, but ... and it's important, that the defensive intensity and leadership that Ewing brought was still with them.

It's something quite similar to Spurs. Parker and Kawhi were easily the more obvious offensive players in the 2010s, but it took all but a season for the Spurs to fall completely apart after Duncan quit. Not only team success, but the entire Spurs culture dissipated. It was like that with Ewing and probably why he was so highly respected.

[90sgoat]

Totally unrelated, but I saw Patrick Ewing at a volleyball tournament in DC last week.

Was he tall?

[Xiao Yao You]

Whenever I watch young Ewing, I get a better idea why he was such a highly touted and respected player and why MJ etc considered him such a force.

I only watched Ewing when his knees were gone and his athleticism has turned him into a jump shooter and defensive anchor, but when you see young Ewing, he's an absolute athletic phenom, in many ways what David Robinson turned out to be, but with better fundamentals.

I mean, Ewing on those 90s Knicks was one of the more iconic franchise players, no doubt a big culture guy and leader too, but he was limited and he didn't really force himself on the opposition offensively, it was a lot of midrange jumpers, which I guess lessened his offensive impact.

Perhaps that's why they coined the "Ewing syndrome", that some teams tend to play better initially when their star player goes down. Probably because the offense gets more free flowing, but ... and it's important, that the defensive intensity and leadership that Ewing brought was still with them.

It's something quite similar to Spurs. Parker and Kawhi were easily the more obvious offensive players in the 2010s, but it took all but a season for the Spurs to fall completely apart after Duncan quit. Not only team success, but the entire Spurs culture dissipated. It was like that with Ewing and probably why he was so highly respected.

Robinson and Hakeem were on a different level from Ewing

[90sgoat]

Robinson and Hakeem were on a different level from Ewing

Hakeem yes, Robinson, I'm not so sure.

Young Ewing is almost as athletic as Robinson and arguably better mentally and fundamentally.

[tontoz]

Hakeem was the best player I ever saw in college. It was jaw dropping some of the stuff he did. He averaged over 5 blocks per game in his last season :lol

[Xiao Yao You]

Hakeem yes, Robinson, I'm not so sure.

Young Ewing is almost as athletic as Robinson and arguably better mentally and fundamentally.

I never thought he was close to the athlete that Robinson was. He played more like a 3 in a 7'1 body

[Xiao Yao You]

Hakeem was the best player I ever saw in college. It was jaw dropping some of the stuff he did. He averaged over 5 blocks per game in his last season :lol

Chris Jackson or Tinsdale were probably the best scorers I saw in college

[tpols]

I never thought he was close to the athlete that Robinson was. He played more like a 3 in a 7'1 body

David Robinson was a nice guy. Ewing was way tougher than Robinson and he led his Knicks teams further prime for prime. Pat would easily make any center today his bitch aside from Jokic who could take him outside.

[1987_Lakers]

David Robinson was a nice guy. Ewing was way tougher than Robinson and he led his Knicks teams further prime for prime. Pat would easily make any center today his bitch aside from Jokic who could take him outside.

Healthy Embiid > Ewing

[tontoz]

Healthy Embiid > Ewing


It's not close either. Ewing fell in love with his jumper in the pros which hurt his efficiency. His jumper wasn't close to Embiids.

[tpols]

Healthy Embiid > Ewing

Believing in healthy embiid is like believing in the tooth fairy. He flops like a bitch and plays like one as well. Ewing would literally have that dude leaving a series in a wheelchair. Not only was he better, he was 1000x tougher and down to go to war.

[1987_Lakers]

Believing in healthy embiid is like believing in the tooth fairy. He flops like a bitch and plays like one as well. Ewing would literally have that dude leaving a series in a wheelchair. Not only was he better, he was 1000x tougher and down to go to war.

Believing in a healthy Ewing is like believing in the tooth fairy. He had knee issues the moment he entered the league.

Had like 2 knee surgeries before he turned 30. Lost alot of his athleticism because of how bad they were by the time the 90's rolled around.

Ewing wasn't nearly as skilled as Embiid offensively.

[tpols]

Yea... and Ewing played the entire decade despite the pain. And with better playoff production in an era that suppressed offensive numbers. Embiid has never showed up in the playoffs not even once. And he's never led playoff teams as far as Ewing did with less... scratch that... way way way less offensive help. :lol

[1987_Lakers]

Yea... and Ewing played the entire decade despite the pain. And with better playoff production in an era that suppressed offensive numbers. Embiid has never showed up in the playoffs not even once. And he's never led playoff teams as far as Ewing did with less... scratch that... way way way less offensive help. :lol

Ewing was not a great playoff performer. Besides his '90 & '93 run, he was pretty unspectacular across the board.

Knicks made the Finals in '94 with Ewing averaging 22 ppg, far from elite.

[tpols]

Thats... still farther than Embiid ever got with less help. Dude bombed out of the playoffs with prime Jimmy Butler being the leading scorer. Meanwhile Ewing had John "2/18" Starks.

You're just... not going to win a discussion about who had more playoff success between embiid and Ewing.

This is only reinforcing the fact that you have 0 knowledge of the game or basketball history.

[1987_Lakers]

Thats... still farther than Embiid ever got with less help. Dude bombed out of the playoffs with prime Jimmy Butler being the leading scorer. Meanwhile Ewing had John "2/18" Starks. .

It was the 90's, you didnt need much to advance. Today's league is a blood bath

[tpols]

Yea... having to face a Bulls dynasty year in and year out and then peak Hakeem in the Finals was an easy road.

:lol

You're literally a little dancing clown.

[1987_Lakers]

Yea... having to face a Bulls dynasty year in and year out and then peak Hakeem in the Finals was an easy road.

:lol

You're literally a little dancing clown.

Peak Hakeem with role players in '94. :lol

[90sgoat]

Chris Jackson or Tinsdale were probably the best scorers I saw in college

Hmm...

I didn't get to watch a lot of college games back then, I think ocassionally we'd get like some trial-channel and it might be some american sports channel.

I do recall watching Allen Iverson's last college game. To be honest, he didn't seem that great.

[90sgoat]

David Robinson was a nice guy. Ewing was way tougher than Robinson and he led his Knicks teams further prime for prime. Pat would easily make any center today his bitch aside from Jokic who could take him outside.

I feel like Ewing is what Embiid would be if he had the tenacity and grit of Ewing.

[Kblaze8855]

It was the 90's, you didnt need much to advance. Today's league is a blood bath

The year Philly was the #1 seed they lost to the Hawks. From 22-32 Ewing lost to(in order) Bird, Jordan, Badboy pistons, Jordan, Jordan, Jordan, Hakeem.

After that they did lose to the Pacers(who were definitely better than the Hawks) and then the 96 Bulls and a 61 win Heat team.

The Knicks generally ran into more historically significant teams. They lost to the champs 4-5 times. Embiid lost to the Raptors once.

Embiid has not really had tougher roads than Ewing.

[Xiao Yao You]

I feel like Ewing is what Embiid would be if he had the tenacity and grit of Ewing.

Embiid is a more of a poor man's Hakeem to me

[FKAri]

Embiid is a more of a poor man's Hakeem to me

If you take injuries into account, sure. Otherwise it's very close. Embiid's better offensively and Hakeem's better defensively.

Hakeem was good right away in the league but after that his rate of improvement was surprisingly slow for a talent of his caliber. It took him a while to learn to read and react to coverages. He didn't handle doubles well. He would tunnel vision on the basket at times. And once Hakeem's quickness started to go it took a lot more out of his game than it did other all time great centers. In this sense Hakeem had a very short time where he was the best version of himself.