Has a team had to go through a tougher gauntlet than these Mavs

[Manny98]

51 win Clippers in the first round
57 win Thunder first seed thunder in the second round
56 win and number 1 defense Timberwolves with 3 all star caliber player plus 6moy
And now having two face a loaded 65 win Celtics team that have one of the best starting 5s in NBA history

Has a team had to go through a tougher selection of teams to the championship because I can't think of one?

[tontoz]

Wolves and Thunder were healthy and Dallas went 8-3. Gotta respect that.

[FultzNationRISE]

Some of Lebron’s runs were tougher but this one is up there

[John8204]

Miami last year, Bucks, Knicks, Celtics, and then Nuggets

Detroit had Jordan, Bird, Magic and the refs one year

[tpols]

Eh... they actually lucked out with their path to me a little bit and I posted about it before. If Dallas was the 6 seed they'd have to take the wolves in the 1st round, Denver in the 2nd, and then OKC or the Suns in the Conference Finals. That would be tougher than what they had basically a free 1st round Bye with Kawhi out.

Also Dallas in 2011 went through

Brandon Roy LMA Blazers
Kobe Pau Bynum Lakers
Durant Harden Ibaka Westbrook thunder
Lebron Wade Bosh Heat

^^^
That path was probably the toughest of all time. I'm pretty sure they were underdogs in every series. This years Dallas team has been favorites.

[HoopsNY]

Houston in 1995 went through...

61 win Jazz
59 win Suns
62 win Spurs
57 win Magic

[sdot_thadon]

Yeah one of the last 2 posts would be my answer 2011 mavs or 95 rockets.

[SouBeachTalents]

I know it's blasphemy to say this, but I really feel that 2011 Mavs run gets overrated.

The Blazers are your standard first round opponent, and Brandon Roy was done as a player by then.

The Lakers were clearly running on fumes and a shell of themselves, not uncommon for teams going for a 3peat and coming off 3 straight Finals. Kobe & Gasol were complete ass the entire playoffs, so while yes it was impressive to sweep them, that's a team that was only elite on paper, not performance. Hell, CP3 took 2 games off them in the first round with a complete nothing cast.

The Thunder are legit, but they were a worse, younger version of the team everyone claims was a bunch of inexperienced kids in 2012, so the agenda always seems to fluctuate when discussing them.

And I'm sorry, beating the Heat with LeBron playing like that is simply not the accomplishment people make it out to be. It's still a great win, and it was a great story for basketball fans for them take down the most despised team in league history, but when their top player inexplicably morphs into Ben Simmons, it takes a little bit of the shine off that accomplishment.

Don't get it twisted, it's still a great run, but imo definitely gets overstated, especially considering how badly LeBron & Kobe played.

I would honestly agree with HoopsNY, the '95 Rockets were probably the most impressive title run of all time.

[tpols]

If guys are healthy and available there's no excuse that can be made. Lebron and Kobe simply choked. And Durant. They were all favorites and got destroyed in the clutch. That counts. If that's not the case we'd have to wipe out Hakeems 1994 ring given how poorly Ewing shot, and how hard John Starks choked.

The Heat were +175 favorites and Dallas was at +2000. To discount that monstrous difference is an absurdity that can't even be put into words. Everybody was fully healthy and prime.

[NBAGOAT]

95 run is really good on paper but at same time it’s basically beating 2 teams that were worse versions of teams that couldn’t beat mj and a spurs team carried by drob(no legit 2nd star). The Jazz/suns are good teams but if they won the title they’re weak title teams

Compare to say 02 lakers beating blazers(mostly same core as the 00 team that’s one of the best teams to never win title weaker than any of 95 rockets competition sure but not a pushover), spurs(similar core to the team that won title next year), kings(one of goat teams to not win a title)

Edit: ok finals lowers it but then I can go 08 lakers

Beat denver team with melo/ai, Jazz with their deron/boozer/okur/kirilenko core a conference finals quality team, big 3 spurs, and ofc big 3 Celtics. 1st two easier than any 95 rockets opponent sure but no pushover but I think the last 2 opponents are tougher than any rockets opponenf

[gengiskhan]

Has a team had to go through a tougher selection of teams to the championship because I can't think of one?

clippes had injured Kawhi.........next

Mavs did not dethrone the Defending Champs. Nuggets would've beaten Mavs in 6 imo. Jokic was perfect match up for Mav's biggies.

Thunder are immature and small. Mavs got lucky there.......next

The real Mavs matchup is Celtics imo. this team can pass quick. attack you quick. and defend you physical. this is it.

Lets see how Kyrie's 32 y body holds up. Luka is about to bust his knee cap. watch out!

[hold this L]

clippes had injured Kawhi.........next

Mavs did not dethrone the Defending Champs. Nuggets would've beaten Mavs in 6 imo. Jokic was perfect match up for Mav's biggies.

Thunder are immature and small. Mavs got lucky there.......next

The real Mavs matchup is Celtics imo. this team can pass quick. attack you quick. and defend you physical. this is it.

Lets see how Kyrie's 32 y body holds up. Luka is about to bust his knee cap. watch out!

Luka is not someone I would doubt, the guy is a killer.

[TheMan]

51 win Clippers in the first round
57 win Thunder first seed thunder in the second round
56 win and number 1 defense Timberwolves with 3 all star caliber player plus 6moy
And now having two face a loaded 65 win Celtics team that have one of the best starting 5s in NBA history

Has a team had to go through a tougher selection of teams to the championship because I can't think of one?

Recency bias...I bet you my mortgage you can look it up and see that tougher roads to the Finals have been done before.

Everything that happens today doesn't necessarily have to be the greatest ever, kids. Jokic blackhole on defense ass ain't nowhere near the top 5 GOAT centers, let alone all time players.

Relax.

[pandiani17]

Recency bias...I bet you my mortgage you can look it up and see that tougher roads to the Finals have been done before.

Everything that happens today doesn't necessarily have to be the greatest ever, kids. Jokic blackhole on defense ass ain't nowhere near the top 5 GOAT centers, let alone all time players.

Relax.

This. I laugh when people use that term, especially considering the league is almost 80 years old.

[pandiani17]

51 win Clippers in the first round
57 win Thunder first seed thunder in the second round
56 win and number 1 defense Timberwolves with 3 all star caliber player plus 6moy
And now having two face a loaded 65 win Celtics team that have one of the best starting 5s in NBA history

Has a team had to go through a tougher selection of teams to the championship because I can't think of one?

You said what?:roll: They don't even have a top 5 starting five in the Celtics history.

[ArbitraryWater]

Its been tough but I wouldnt say its among the toughest ever.

Clips were a slightly above standard R1 opponent without Kawhi, OKC was a standard WCSF team in my opinion, and Wolves honestly seemed a bit out of their element.


And I agree with SouBeach about 2011. And I lived that run. That was a core memory.

But once you contextualize it, its slightly less impressive.


It wouldnt have been possible otherwise.

You cant have weak supporting cast + GOAT opposition lol.

[Spurs m8]

Certainly not the cupcake east a certain LeCupcake abused and then got raped when he faced a REAL opponent, more of than not

[Real Men Wear Green]

Certainly a fearsome road, but the Celtics, having to face these Mavericks that have gone through the second-toughest Finals route ever (the Celtics have the toughest for having to face these Mavs) are truly to be pitied.

[NBAGOAT]

You said what?:roll: They don't even have a top 5 starting five in the Celtics history.

Okay name the 5 better. 80s Celtics 08 Celtics 60s Celtics. Who are the 2 others?

[pandiani17]

Okay name the 5 better. 80s Celtics 08 Celtics 60s Celtics. Who are the 2 others?

63/64 Celtics
68/69 Celtics
83/84 Celtics
85/86 Celtics
07/08 Celtics

[NBAGOAT]

63/64 Celtics
68/69 Celtics
83/84 Celtics
85/86 Celtics
07/08 Celtics

with these lists you usually dont list teams with similar cores like 84 and 86. No one is including both 17 and 18 warriors 96 and 97 bulls in a goat team list

[pandiani17]

with these lists you usually dont list teams with similar cores like 84 and 86. No one is including both 17 and 18 warriors 96 and 97 bulls in a goat team list

OK, three teams that had a better starting five only in their own franchise. Imagine how many better line-ups have been in the 80 years of the league.

[NBAGOAT]

OK, three teams that had a better starting five only in their own franchise. Imagine how many better line-ups have been in the 80 years of the league.

not as many as you would think. celtics have a bunch of the greatest. Think it's less than 20 all time

[FKAri]

You said what?:roll: They don't even have a top 5 starting five in the Celtics history.

Hard to compare to teams from decades ago. Roles were more specialized back then. For today's position-less style of basketball the Celtics starting 5 is scary. Assuming we're slotting a healthy KP in for Horford.

All 5 can shoot. All 5 can put it on the floor. All 5 can defend well at their position and on switches. All 5 can play smart system basketball. And on average they're good passers even if not great. It's the kind of team a coach dreams up but you can never really make in reality.

[Kblaze8855]

The Heat were +175 favorites and Dallas was at +2000. To discount that monstrous difference is an absurdity that can't even be put into words.


Nah. It’s just acknowledging that odds are not a basketball playing trait and obviously did not factor into how either team played all season or in the playoffs. You aren’t worse because someone thought you would be. You’re worse when you play worse.

That said…it was still a tougher run.

[Neal Romer]

I read somewhere this is the first time a team had to beat three straight 50 win opponents before the finals since like… maybe the ‘10 Lakers? I dont remember exactly who or when but it’s been about 15 years.

Not that regular season records are everything, but it is food for thought.

[3ba11]

Clippers = trash

OKC = babies

Wolves = babies


And the Mavs will get stomped by the first real organic juggernaut they face in these Finals.. A team that has cut their teeth already

Otoh, the 98' Jazz beat Hakeem's Rockets, Shaq's 4 all-star Lakers and Popovich/Duncan/Robinson... A bunch of super-veterans and champions - Shaq and Duncan cut their teeth on the Jazz

[tpols]

Nah. It’s just acknowledging that odds are not a basketball playing trait and obviously did not factor into how either team played all season or in the playoffs. You aren’t worse because someone thought you would be. You’re worse when you play worse.

That said…it was still a tougher run.


Yea except the Heat actually did play better than the Mavs all year. They finished with more wins and dominated the 1st three rounds of the playoffs. So the odds were legit. They only struggled vs Dallas when Lebron quit because Wade was about to win FMVP and ruin his GOAT case.

[SouBeachTalents]

Yea except the Heat actually did play better than the Mavs all year. They finished with more wins and dominated the 1st three rounds of the playoffs. So the odds were legit. They only struggled vs Dallas when Lebron quit because Wade was about to win FMVP and ruin his GOAT case.
The Heat won one more game and they both lost 3 playoff games heading into the Finals.

[Kblaze8855]

So now you’re gonna pretend to believe 58 wins in that east is playing better than 57 in the west? Just…gonna act like you aren’t on record opposing that all these years?

The Mavs were just as good as the Heat or better people just have trouble with what they think “should” be true.

The oddsmakers were just wrong. It happens. Teams aren’t what someone predicted. They are what they are. Oddsmakers can’t account for unseen growth, chemistry development, different approaches and gameplans year to year, and any number of factors that change how good teams actually play.

The mavs were factually better than people thought. What people think is not basketball.

[tpols]

The Mavs were just as good as the Heat or better people just have trouble with what they think “should” be true.


No... they absolutely were not.

https://i.postimg.cc/FFky7BwZ/Screenshot-20240602-115940-Chrome.jpg

That was right before the Finals. The odds of Jason Terry outscoring peak LeBron were probably +5000. Or unbettable on.

Your actually committing some of the worst revisionist history we've perhaps ever seen on this website.

[Kblaze8855]

While responding to the idea that odds and basketball aren’t the same thing you come and show me odds right before the two basketball teams play and that fact is proven for what was probably the 200,000th time. It was a 58 win East team versus a 57 win West team with the same playoff record while playing teams you would definitely say are better.

nothing but a piece of paper Suggest those heat were better than those mavs. Not wins. Not performance against competition. Not performance against each other when it was time to decide it. One team played better basketball. The other played better press release.

everybody thinking they would win was absolutely not backed up by anything either team had done. It was feelings not performance. Doesnt matter what anyone feelings were when Terry makes like 10 threes to knock out the lakers or lights up Miami.

They played better basketball than everyone. What anyone predicted they were able to do means nothing. Teams aren’t what gambling odds set to minimize downside by spreading out bets say they are.

They are what they actually are.

[Mask the Embiid]

Playing against Lou Dort, Terrance Mann, and Jaden Mcdaniels is a gauntlet now? being able to leave 1 person on the court wide the fk open for an entire series, 3 str8 times is a gauntlet?

Boyboyboy, these kids are some circus clowns....

[3ba11]

The Mavs were just as good as the Heat





58 wins with Lebron/Wade/Bosh is a joke and massive underachievement... quintessential "bron-ball"

So the Mavs were better than the Heat but they shouldn't have been, due to vastly inferior on-paper talent.. They offset this with superior brand of ball and chemistry, which is the achilles heel of Lebron's game - he always gets beat by better chemistry whether it's the Mavs, Magic, Spurs, Warriors or Nuggets.

21 years of inferior brand of ball and chemistry, thereby needing more help and losing as the favorite in 2009, 2010, or 2011, while also losing by record amount with 2 all-star teammates in 2014 or 2017..

[Hey Yo]

Eh... they actually lucked out with their path to me a little bit and I posted about it before. If Dallas was the 6 seed they'd have to take the wolves in the 1st round, Denver in the 2nd, and then OKC or the Suns in the Conference Finals. That would be tougher than what they had basically a free 1st round Bye with Kawhi out.

Also Dallas in 2011 went through

Brandon Roy LMA Blazers
Kobe Pau Bynum Lakers
Durant Harden Ibaka Westbrook thunder
Lebron Wade Bosh Heat

^^^
That path was probably the toughest of all time. I'm pretty sure they were underdogs in every series. This years Dallas team has been favorites.
2011 OKC was a tough out yet the following year in the Finals they were just kids??

[bison]

Not since the 2020 finals aka the gauntlet ring, having to play on a literal prison colony with no home court advantage

[Neal Romer]

not since the 2020 finals aka the gauntlet ring, having to play on a literal prison colony with no home court advantage

b i n-g-o