Clear-cut proof of wide conspiracy to deflate player weight of previous eras

[3ba11]

.
This debunks the idea that previous eras weighed less, since the current-day sources are BS (2nd pic below):



https://i.makeagif.com/media/7-31-2024/agcRvZ.gif



https://i.makeagif.com/media/7-31-2024/hz6uri.gif

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wFMN_IQR3lM&t=17m59s


Previous eras always looked huge to me - guys like Ewing, Otis Thorpe, and so many guys - even Pippen - looked like bigger bone structures than today's lightweights - i NEVER BELIEVED the numbers on bballref - they always looked SO LOW

[1987_Lakers]

https://64.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lpgr48Ifhl1qbcs46o1_640.png

https://wp.usatodaysports.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/92/2019/07/michaelcooper_patriley_1.jpg

[3ba11]

https://64.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lpgr48Ifhl1qbcs46o1_640.png

https://wp.usatodaysports.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/92/2019/07/michaelcooper_patriley_1.jpg


I'll have to watch one of the CBS games and see what he actually weighed

[3ba11]

.

Another one



https://i.makeagif.com/media/7-31-2024/BGWNPn.gif



https://i.makeagif.com/media/7-31-2024/FDSdCY.gif

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oyAxsI7wEyw&t=15m35s

[Im Still Ballin]

They update player weight in the modern era more frequently. Durant came into the league weighing 215 pounds and was 237-242 by 2014. He's been listed at 240 pounds ever since even though he's dropped down to 225 pounds, which was confirmed by the 2021 Olympics.

Bill Russell came into the league at 215 pounds and spent his prime at 230-240 pounds. And that was without lifting weights. The practice of weightlifting became commonplace in the NBA sometime during the '80s.

I think you're right. Historical weight listings underreport compared to modern ones. Moses Malone is listed as 215 pounds which is what his rookie weight was. He was 250+ pounds in his prime.

[3ba11]

They update player weight in the modern era more frequently. Durant came into the league weighing 215 pounds and was 237-242 by 2014. He's been listed at 240 pounds ever since even though he's dropped down to 225 pounds, which was confirmed by the 2021 Olympics.

Bill Russell came into the league at 215 pounds and spent his prime at 230-240 pounds. And that was without lifting weights. The practice of weightlifting became commonplace in the NBA sometime during the '80s.

I think you're right. Historical weight listings underreport compared to modern ones.


So far I'm 2 for 2.... I happened to see the Dennis Johnson discrepancy on a whim, so I looked for another one... 2 minutes later I had the Cedric Maxwell example above.

I'm sure the entire era is deflated by 10-20 pounds on bballref - I've always felt that their numbers were low - ridiculously low in some cases.. I was always thinking "that can't be the case" in so many instances.

I never thought to actually check until Dennis Johnson's weight popped up during the FT... It was a CBS game, so I looked up another CBS game and the first FT of the game was Cedric Maxwell - it showed his weight... I'll keep doing it and post more in the coming days.

[iamgine]

Not sure this is a conspiracy :lol

[3ba11]

Not sure this is a conspiracy :lol

.

Another one




https://i.makeagif.com/media/7-31-2024/YPKXo4.gif



https://i.makeagif.com/media/7-31-2024/H_ZMDn.gif



Maybe it isn't a conspiracy, but bballref is the most prominent source of this kind of information, and it's all wrong - players in previous eras have their weights deflated by 10-20 pounds, which exposes the myth that today's players are so much bigger.. they aren't and they actually are SHORTER on average - this is statistical fact - the average height was 6'7" in the 80's and 90's, and now it's 6'6"

[Kblaze8855]

they just list old players by the rookie season weight forever because it would obviously fluctuate every day for the rest of their career. All those old guys might have it changed on a basketball card or something issued for a single season, but if you get the old almanac like I used to have as a kid everybody was listed at rookie weight. Other than Wilt oddly who I think may have been listed as 300 like he was on the lakers.

[3ba11]

they just list old players by the rookie season weight forever because it would obviously fluctuate every day for the rest of their career. All those old guys might have it changed on a basketball card or something issued for a single season, but if you get the old almanac like I used to have as a kid everybody was listed at rookie weight. Other than Wilt oddly who I think may have been listed as 300 like he was on the lakers.


indeed, the weights of players in previous eras are routinely deflated by 10-20 pounds.. these are BIG discrepancies.. I'm 3 for 3 so far and each example shows a gap of 10-20 pounds.. I'm sure I will find some that are well over 20 pounds of deflation.

[3ba11]

.
.
Another one and it's a big one




https://i.makeagif.com/media/7-31-2024/r01d2k.gif



https://i.makeagif.com/media/7-31-2024/Ga1ztg.gif



Are we done here? Previous eras have seen the player weights DEFLATED significantly by 10-20 pounds on average..

[3ba11]

.
.
Another one




https://i.makeagif.com/media/7-31-2024/T8I3dP.gif



https://i.makeagif.com/media/7-31-2024/gKTHRf.gif




these aren't small gaps - they're BIG discrepancies

[ShawkFactory]

How would you suggest they list past players' weights on basketball reference? Current players are accurate because they can update year-to-year in real time. There is no way to do that for past players.

[3ba11]

How would you suggest they list past players' weights on basketball reference? Current players are accurate because they can update year-to-year in real time. There is no way to do that for past players.


There are many ways to get the accurate weights of the players... You can purchase the media guides on Ebay (the booklets that they hand out to fans that attend the games) for each team and each year to get all the weights that way (here (https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=p4432023.m570.l1313&_nkw=1991+philadephia+76%27er+media+guide&_sacat=0)).. I purchased a few a while back because I heard that they had the dunk stats in there for how many dunks each player got (and they did) - it might've been the first thread I made on this site or one of the first ones.. the links to pics of the media guides are dead now but here's (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?352399-Dunking-Data-For-1988-1993-MJ-is-the-Goat-In-Game-Dunker-for-Wing-Players) the original thread.

So there are many ways to get the right weights and this is just one way.. The info is out there and I don't think it would take a professional researcher or anything like that.. Any tom, dick and harry could track down the info, let alone a big site like bballref

[90sgoat]

.
.
Another one and it's a big one




https://i.makeagif.com/media/7-31-2024/r01d2k.gif



https://i.makeagif.com/media/7-31-2024/Ga1ztg.gif



Are we done here? Previous eras have seen the player weights DEFLATED significantly by 10-20 pounds on average..

Wow, that's a bad one.

Kareem at 225lb? How could anyone believe that? Kareem was pretty muscular at his peak and more likely to be around 250-270bs.

People think that upper body is where the weight is, but about half of the weight is in the legs.

https://images.squarespace-cdn.com/content/v1/61ec85f3478ce80130415aeb/1676049414999-9WEA3JHXPT76O311MRKW/FNRrr56X0AEt65u.jpg?format=750w

[ShawkFactory]

There are many ways to get the accurate weights of the players... You can purchase the media guides on Ebay (the booklets that they hand out to fans that attend the games) for each team and each year to get all the weights that way (here (https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=p4432023.m570.l1313&_nkw=1991+philadephia+76%27er+media+guide&_sacat=0)).. I purchased a few a while back because I heard that they had the dunk stats in there for how many dunks each player got (and they did) - it might've been the first thread I made on this site or one of the first ones.. the links to pics of the media guides are dead now but here's (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?352399-Dunking-Data-For-1988-1993-MJ-is-the-Goat-In-Game-Dunker-for-Wing-Players) the original thread.

So there are many ways to get the right weights and this is just one way.. The info is out there and I don't think it would take a professional researcher or anything like that.. Any tom, dick and harry could track down the info, let alone a big site like bballref

So...you're saying that basketball reference should purchase the media guides for every team in every year before it existed (some 50 years, and if its even possible). And then what? Reference EVERY player's weight in every year they played to come up with what...an average? Find their heaviest? Where they were at at their "peak"?

Given the relative inconsequentiality of this, it's easy to see why listing rookie weights was the choice.

[sdot_thadon]

I don't think this is brand new to any older fans besides yourself. They didn't really keep track of weight officially past guys rookie year and heights have been super sketchy as well, playing the shoes on shoes off game and sometimes just blatant carnival heights lol. Look into Barkley's actual height or some of the "7 footers" actual height. Height smudging was probably good promo for the game, while weight fudging was just not really caring about those numbers in all likelihood. Not some grand conspiracy.

[3ba11]

I don't think this is brand new to any older fans besides yourself. They didn't really keep track of weight officially past guys rookie year and heights have been super sketchy as well, playing the shoes on shoes off game and sometimes just blatant carnival heights lol. Look into Barkley's actual height or some of the "7 footers" actual height. Height smudging was probably good promo for the game, while weight fudging was just not really caring about those numbers in all likelihood. Not some grand conspiracy.


When I was at FIU, I was 6'6" and weighed 205 pounds..

According to bballref, Toni Kukoc weighed nearly 15 pounds less than me at 6'10".. He's listed at 192 pounds.. But he weighed at least 220.

You have no idea how crazy this is... There is a zero percent chance that I was bigger or weighed more than Kukoc.. I've seen bs like this for years on the site but only recently did I happen to have the website open while I was watching a game of Dennis Johnson - Johnson's weight of 202 popped up on the screen, so I figured that bballref listed him far lower than that and I was right... And this is the STANDARD - player weights in previous eras are massively deflated.

I don't think the massive deflation can be explained by recording the high school or college weights of these guys.. The weights are so low and absurd that I think it's on purpose... They took Kukoc's weight at 16 years old from his first pro game and went with it... bballref is all about the current era - they're on board with "we done with 90's" bs

[Nowoco]

There is zero chance that Kareem was ever 225lbs. Except maybe when he was like 14 or something.

I find it hard to believe that MJ was ever sub 200 either.

[sdot_thadon]

When I was at FIU, I was 6'6" and weighed 205 pounds..

According to bballref, Toni Kukoc weighed nearly 15 pounds less than me at 6'10".. He's listed at 192 pounds.. But he weighed at least 220.

You have no idea how crazy this is... There is a zero percent chance that I was bigger or weighed more than Kukoc.. I've seen bs like this for years on the site but only recently did I happen to have the website open while I was watching a game of Dennis Johnson - Johnson's weight of 202 popped up on the screen, so I figured that bballref listed him far lower than that and I was right... And this is the STANDARD - player weights in previous eras are massively deflated.

I don't think the massive deflation can be explained by recording the high school or college weights of these guys.. The weights are so low and absurd that I think it's on purpose... They took Kukoc's weight at 16 years old from his first pro game and went with it... bballref is all about the current era - they're on board with "we done with 90's" bs

Ok, and I'm telling you it's not "deflation" if it never changed, "not updated" is the wording you're looking for here. As in not updated since their draft weights or rookie weights probably in some cases. Toni was drafted in 1990 bro, 3 plus seasons before he'd play for the Bulls. That weight would reflect that. Negligence/=conspiracy.

[sdot_thadon]

When I was at FIU, I was 6'6" and weighed 205 pounds..

If true, you mean to tell me you was big for nothing? :lol

[Real Men Wear Green]

https://www.nba.com/player/1628369/jayson-tatum

Nba.com telling you that Tatum is 210 pounds. He's started at power forward for the last two years and in the playoffs was one of the main defenders on Bam Adebayo.

[ILLsmak]

Yall got trolled again.

-Smak

[j3lademaster]

Have to agree here. David Robinson being listed at 230 lbs as a 7 footer always seemed sus to me, especially considering muscle weighs more than fat.

https://go.navyonline.com/hs-fs/hubfs/davidrobinsonusna2.jpg?width=315&height=435&name=davidrobinsonusna2.jpg

This frame is easily 230 at 6'5. a 7'0 230 lbs guy would look like a twig.

[Real Men Wear Green]

Have to agree here. David Robinson being listed at 230 lbs as a 7 footer always seemed sus to me, especially considering muscle weighs more than fat.

https://go.navyonline.com/hs-fs/hubfs/davidrobinsonusna2.jpg?width=315&height=435&name=davidrobinsonusna2.jpg

This frame is easily 230 at 6'5. a 7'0 230 lbs guy would look like a twig.

The NBA doesn't update player measurements. That was true in the past and it's still true in the present. They check them out before the draft at the combine and then don't care. Tatum is 230 or 240. Not 210.

[3ba11]

If true, you mean to tell me you was big for nothing? :lol


your momma said I was big for sumthin

[3ba11]

Have to agree here. David Robinson being listed at 230 lbs as a 7 footer always seemed sus to me, especially considering muscle weighs more than fat.

https://go.navyonline.com/hs-fs/hubfs/davidrobinsonusna2.jpg?width=315&height=435&name=davidrobinsonusna2.jpg

This frame is easily 230 at 6'5. a 7'0 230 lbs guy would look like a twig.




bballref says Paul Pressey is 185 but he was 201 apparently - and this was just his 2nd season, so it's purposeful deflation:



https://i.makeagif.com/media/8-01-2024/HewEBj.gif

[1987_Lakers]

Have to agree here. David Robinson being listed at 230 lbs as a 7 footer always seemed sus to me, especially considering muscle weighs more than fat.

https://go.navyonline.com/hs-fs/hubfs/davidrobinsonusna2.jpg?width=315&height=435&name=davidrobinsonusna2.jpg

This frame is easily 230 at 6'5. a 7'0 230 lbs guy would look like a twig.

D-Rob was a freak nature physically. I remember Bill Simmons saying when D-Rob played his first game in Boston the entire crowd gasped when they first saw D-Rob.

[iamgine]

Was D-Rob more like 250? Same weight as Hakeem and Lebron.

[3ba11]

Was D-Rob more like 250? Same weight as Hakeem and Lebron.



.
.
Rookie George Zidek was 272 pounds but bballref said he was a generic 250:




https://i.makeagif.com/media/8-02-2024/DrLjEa.gif





bballref turned the entire "Bad Boy" front line into lightweights:




* James Edwards is 225 on bballref but 252 in reality:


https://i.makeagif.com/media/8-02-2024/P5bYL7.gif




* Laimbeer is 245 on bballref but 260 in reality:


https://i.makeagif.com/media/8-02-2024/wdALX-.gif




* Rick Mahorn is 240 on bballref but 255 in reality:


https://i.makeagif.com/media/8-02-2024/kDKH0y.gif




* Dennis Rodman is 6'7" on bballref but 6'8" or taller in reality:


https://i.makeagif.com/media/8-02-2024/99EaR3.gif



Oakley (https://i.makeagif.com/media/8-02-2024/MinQT2.gif) and Cartwright (https://i.makeagif.com/media/8-02-2024/xpikBM.gif) were similarly deflated on ballref from 245 to 225, and Harper (https://i.makeagif.com/media/8-02-2024/sbYhUz.gif) was deflated from 216 to 185 - so everyone thinks all these guys are lightweights when they weren't, hence the many misperceptions, aka "we done with the 90's".

[3ba11]

Was D-Rob more like 250? Same weight as Hakeem and Lebron.



.
.
Rookie George Zidek was 272 pounds but bballref said he was a generic 250:




https://i.makeagif.com/media/8-02-2024/DrLjEa.gif





bballref turned the entire "Bad Boy" front line into lightweights:




* James Edwards is 225 on bballref but 252 in reality:


https://i.makeagif.com/media/8-02-2024/P5bYL7.gif




* Laimbeer is 245 on bballref but 260 in reality:


https://i.makeagif.com/media/8-02-2024/wdALX-.gif




* Rick Mahorn is 240 on bballref but 255 in reality:


https://i.makeagif.com/media/8-02-2024/kDKH0y.gif




* Dennis Rodman is 6'7" on bballref but 6'8" or taller in reality:


https://i.makeagif.com/media/8-02-2024/99EaR3.gif



Oakley (https://i.makeagif.com/media/8-02-2024/MinQT2.gif) and Cartwright (https://i.makeagif.com/media/8-02-2024/xpikBM.gif) were similarly deflated on ballref from 245 to 225, and Harper (https://i.makeagif.com/media/8-02-2024/sbYhUz.gif) was deflated from 216 to 185 - so everyone thinks all these guys are lightweights when they weren't, hence the many misperceptions, aka "we done with the 90's".

Ultimately, bballref used this generic guessing or equally-generic database of information for players whose careers ended before 2000, and only updated players like Shaq who ended their careers after 2000, aka "we done with the 90's".. It's this mentality that leads to this type of flippant inaccuracy and the resulting misperceptions of about a weak era and lightweight players.

[90sgoat]

Man, I think you might have stumbled on something for real.

Harper at 185lbs is completely absurd, it's either some kind of lazyness or an agenda.

[iamgine]

everyone thinks all these guys are lightweights when they weren't

Who are these "everyone" who think these guys are lightweights?

[dankok8]

Detailed player measurements from an old post by CavsFTW (Wilt Chamberlain Archive).

http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?257270-Kareem-Wilt-Bill-Russell-Detailed-Player-Measurements


Detailed Measurement Data.

(In order by height)

Yao Ming:
Billed Information:
FIBA:: 7-5, 276
NBA (rookie): 296
NBA: 7-6, 310
Basketball Reference: 7-6, 310
Actual Measurements:
Height: 7-5.75 (Was 7-5 in October 2002, then measured 7'5.75 in September 2004)
Wingspan: 7-5
Standing Reach: 9-7
Hand Length:10"
Playing Weight:
296 - early career
310 - mid career
276 - 2010 FIBA
Shoes: U.S. size 18

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar:
Billed Information:
NCAA: 7-1 3/8
Milwaukee Bucks (rookie): 7-1 1/2, 235
Basketball Reference: 7-2, 225
NBA (late career): 7-2, 267
Actual Measurements:
Height: 7-1.88 (7-1.375 UCLA, 7-1.5 rookie Bucks training camp, 7-1.625 2nd season Bucks training camp, 7-1.88 3rd season Bucks training camp)
Wingspan: 7-5
Playing Weight:
225lbs - rookie
231lbs - 2nd season
235lbs - early career
240lbs - mid career
267lbs - late career
Shoes: U.S. size 16

Wilt Chamberlain:
Billed Information:
NCAA: 7-0
Philadelphia Warriors: 7-1 1/16, 250
Basketball Reference: 7-1, 275
NBA (All teams after the Warriors): 7-1, 275
Actual Measurements:
Height: 7-1.06 (6-11.5 age 17, 7-1.06 age 23)
Wingspan: 7-8
Standing Reach: 9-6
Hand Length: 9.5"
Hand Spread: 11.5"
Playing Weight:
258 - rookie
265 - 3rd season
292 - 5th season
310 - late career
320 - maximum (training camp of 5th season)
Shoes: U.S. size 15

Shaquille O'Neal:
Billed Information:
NCAA: 7-1, 294
Orlando Magic: 7-1, 300
Basketball Reference: 7-1, 325
NBA (after Orlando): 7-1, 325
Actual Measurements:
Height: 6-11.5 (Self admission. Draftexpress lists 7-0)
Wingspan: 7-7
Standing Reach: 9-5
Hand Length: 11"
Hand Spread: 9"
Playing Weight:
280 - Freshman LSU Season
285 - Sophomore LSU Season
294 - Final LSU Season
301 - 1992 draft measurement 1
303 - 1992 draft measurement 2
315 - early career
325 - early-mid career
350 - mid-late career
368 - maximum (out of shape after an injury)
Shoes: U.S. size 22

Bill Russell:
Billed Information:
NCAA: 6-10
Olympics: 6-10
Boston Celtics: 6-9, 215
Basketball Reference: 6-9, 215
NBA : 6-10, 220
Actual Measurements:
Height: 6-9.63 (6-9 and 5/8ths, 1955 NCAA measurement)
Wingspan:7-4
Hand Length:10.5"
Playing Weight:
215 - rookie
222 - early career
230 - late career
240 - last season
Shoes: U.S. size 14

Elvin Hayes:
Billed Information:
NCAA: 6-8
Basketball Reference: 6-9, 235
NBA : 6-9, 235
Actual Measurements:
Height: 6-9.5 (6-8.5 UCLA age 19, 6-9.5 UCLA age 21)
Wingspan:7-2
Playing Weight:
240 - Junior NCAA season
235 - early NBA career
240 - majority of NBA career
Shoes: U.S. size 16

Dwight Howard:
Billed Information:
NBA (rookie): 6-11, 240
NBA (current): 6-11, 265
Basketball Reference: 6-11, 240
Actual Measurements:
Height: 6-9 (2004 draft at age 19)
Wingspan: 7-4.5
Standing Reach: 9-3.5
Playing Weight:
240 - 2004 draft measurement
265 - 3rd season weight
280 - 7th season weight
Shoes: U.S. size 18

Lebron James:
Billed Information:
NBA (rookie): 6-8, 240
NBA (current): 6-8, 250
Basketball Reference: 6-8, 240
Actual Measurements:
Height: 6-7.25 (2003 draft at age 18)
Wingspan: 7-0.25
Standing Reach: 8-10.25
Hand Length: 9"
Hand Spread: 9.25"
Playing Weight:
245 - 2003 draft measurement
266 - 9th season weight
Shoes: U.S. size 15

[3ba11]

thread cliffs

bballref, google and other mainstream sources of player weight information should use a RANGE of weights (i.e. 200-220) to encompass the entirety of the player's career.. Unfortunately, the current method for reporting on players from prior eras is to use the player's weight as a kid out of HS or college, which understates the size of players in prior eras compared to the current era.

[3ba11]

thread cliffs

bballref, google and other mainstream sources of player weight information should use a RANGE of weights (i.e. 200-220) to encompass the entirety of the player's career.. Unfortunately, the current method for reporting on players from prior eras is to use the player's weight as a kid out of HS or college, which understates the size of players in prior eras compared to the current era

[Phoenix]

Why is there a conspiracy? For what purpose? To whose benefit? Most importantly, why am I asking serious questions in a 3ball thread?

[3ba11]

Why is there a conspiracy? For what purpose? To whose benefit? Most importantly, why am I asking serious questions in a 3ball thread?


It's a common argument by today's fans that today's players are "bigger and stronger", so the weight deflation works against that in a big way.

And only certain players on bballref saw their stats updated from the original guesstimate and generic source used for players in prior eras..

Shaq is listed at 325, while Robinson is listed at 230 - Shaq didn't outweigh Robinson by 100 pounds... 50 pounds.. maybe... not 100

for the most part, if a player's career ended before 2000, their weight wasn't updated on bballref from the original guesstimate.. But there are even exceptions to this - it's well-known that MJ was 220 when he came back from baseball, and he played until 2003, yet he's still listed at 198.. So it's selective - a few guys that had careers past 2000 are still not updated from the original guesstimate

[Phoenix]

Only certain players on bballref saw their stats updated from the guesstimate and generic sources used for players in prior eras..

Shaq is listed at 325, while Robinson is listed at 230 - Shaq didn't outweigh Robinson by 100 pounds... 50 pounds.. maybe... not 100

for the most part, if a player's career ended before 2000, their weight wasn't updated on bballref from the original guesstimate.. But there are even exceptions to this - it's well-known that MJ was 220 when he came back from baseball, and he played until 2003, yet he's still listed at 198.. So it's selective - a few guys that had careers past 2000 are still not updated from the original guesstimate

OK but where's the conspiracy? None of the above addresses why you think it's a conspiracy.

[3ba11]

OK but where's the conspiracy? None of the above addresses why you think it's a conspiracy.


It's a common argument by today's fans that today's players are "bigger and stronger", so the weight deflation works against that in a big way.

[Phoenix]

It's a common argument by today's fans that today's players are "bigger and stronger", so the weight deflation works against that in a big way.

OK but are you saying the owners of Basketball reference are conspiring with these fans to not keep accurate weights for past players?

[3ba11]

OK but are you saying the owners of Basketball reference are conspiring with these fans to not keep accurate weights for past players?


Maybe... Here's Kukoc at 192 in bball ref but 230 in reality:




https://i.makeagif.com/media/8-02-2024/5YU_jM.gif


https://i.makeagif.com/media/8-02-2024/2WqXkC.gif



So Kukoc gained 38 pounds in a year or wherever they got the 192 from?... Again, only players in previous eras see this kind of manipulation and/or inaccuracy.

[Phoenix]

Maybe... Here's Kukoc at 192 in bball ref but 230 in reality:




https://i.makeagif.com/media/8-02-2024/5YU_jM.gif


https://i.makeagif.com/media/8-02-2024/2WqXkC.gif



So Kukoc gained 38 pounds in a year or wherever they got the 192 from?... Again, only players in previous eras see this kind of manipulation and/or inaccuracy.

I still don't see how this is a conspiracy.

[3ba11]

I still don't see how this is a conspiracy.


the selective updating of the weights - only players from previous eras have this kind of inaccuracy and manipulation... shaq saw his weight updated to 325 but no one on the 90's bulls has accurate weights - harper is listed at 185 on bballref but he was 216 as posted earlier.. mj is forever listed at 198... pippen is still 6'7" and 210... gimme a break.. kukoc is 192... cartwright is 225 instead of 245... and on and on... previous eras have been purposefully deflated.. all the 80's celtics, pistons and lakers, as shown elsewhere itt.

[Phoenix]

the selective updating of the weights - only players from previous eras have this kind of inaccuracy and manipulation... shaq saw his weight updated to 325 but no one on the 90's bulls has accurate weights - harper is listed at 185 on bballref but he was 216 as posted earlier.. mj is forever listed at 198... pippen is still 6'7" and 210... gimme a break.. kukoc is 192... cartwright is 225 instead of 245... and on and on... previous eras have been purposefully deflated.. all the 80's celtics, pistons and lakers, as shown elsewhere itt.

None of that is proof of a conspiracy though.

[sdot_thadon]

The 90s conspired against....wait for it......the 90s so they could appear physically inferior 30 years later. That's some unbelievable 5D chess going on for an era that couldn't go left:oldlol:

[3ba11]

None of that is proof of a conspiracy though.


it's a lot of circumstantial evidence - cases have been won on less - we're talking WIDESPREAD MASSIVE DEFLATION of player weights

And ultimately that's the point - the weights were massively deflated.. So an example of how this would matter is someone saying Lebron could dominate Moses Malone on the block because Moses only weighed 215 pounds... This would be wildly inaccurate but the snobby Lebron poster would simply post the inaccurate bballref weight and what can the MJ poster do?... They will succumb as anyone would to that argument... But they shouldn't succumb - as we can see, the weights are massively deflated.

Not only plenty of 250-260 guys to guard Lebron, but there were actually more of them and they were tougher/meaner/more physical - they didn't lay down if they were getting beat - they put the guy on their ass and saw if they could deal with it.. We've seen that Lebron doesn't want smoke and will absolutely meltdown (2010) or simply choke (2011), or give up (2014 and others), while also shooting poorly in clutch-time or on game-winners... So the evidence of Lebron's weak mentality is there, which means the higher physicality and toughness would turn Lebron into a passive facilitator back then just like Magic or Kidd.

[RRR3]

https://i.giphy.com/media/v1.Y2lkPTc5MGI3NjExenlwajFueDhvd2VubHQzeDZxcGVxdTc 2dGRrbjZuaHNtdGVwcTgyMSZlcD12MV9pbnRlcm5hbF9naWZfY nlfaWQmY3Q9Zw/xUPGcGZUH0XvpE01CE/giphy.gif
:roll:

[Im Still Ballin]

Patrick Ewing - listed at 240 pounds on Basketball Reference - was 255 pounds according to this January 1990 Sports Illustrated article (https://vault.si.com/vault/1990/01/22/the-big-man-gets-bigger-patrick-ewing-has-added-finesse-to-his-intimidating-presence-and-made-new-york-an-nba-force) from Jack McCallum:


He is 255 pounds of muscle hardened by five-times-a-week weight-training sessions, even during the season.

[Nowoco]

Patrick Ewing - listed at 240 pounds on Basketball Reference - was 255 pounds according to this January 1990 Sports Illustrated article (https://vault.si.com/vault/1990/01/22/the-big-man-gets-bigger-patrick-ewing-has-added-finesse-to-his-intimidating-presence-and-made-new-york-an-nba-force) from Jack McCallum:

I find it hard to believe Patrick Ewing was ever as low as even 255. Shaq was listed at 285 in his rookie season. There cant be much, if anything, between them.

https://news.cgtn.com/news/2020-06-07/The-top-4-centers-of-the-1990s-Patrick-Ewing-R8rKyJv86k/img/8547cc1902dc4547aa1ee5cd56bd1c7d/8547cc1902dc4547aa1ee5cd56bd1c7d.jpeg

[Phoenix]

it's a lot of circumstantial evidence - cases have been won on less - we're talking WIDESPREAD MASSIVE DEFLATION of player weights

And ultimately that's the point - the weights were massively deflated.. So an example of how this would matter is someone saying Lebron could dominate Moses Malone on the block because Moses only weighed 215 pounds... This would be wildly inaccurate but the snobby Lebron poster would simply post the inaccurate bballref weight and what can the MJ poster do?... They will succumb as anyone would to that argument... But they shouldn't succumb - as we can see, the weights are massively deflated.

Not only plenty of 250-260 guys to guard Lebron, but there were actually more of them and they were tougher/meaner/more physical - they didn't lay down if they were getting beat - they put the guy on their ass and saw if they could deal with it.. We've seen that Lebron doesn't want smoke and will absolutely meltdown (2010) or simply choke (2011), or give up (2014 and others), while also shooting poorly in clutch-time or on game-winners... So the evidence of Lebron's weak mentality is there, which means the higher physicality and toughness would turn Lebron into a passive facilitator back then just like Magic or Kidd.

You're no further to explaining why it's a conspiracy, though.

[sdot_thadon]

You're no further to explaining why it's a conspiracy, though.

He did. Lebron :facepalm

What he's suggesting is the 90s purposely reported inaccurate weights so a kid born in 80 something could look better in 30 years. Dude's lost the plot. All he's missing is an air jordan tinfoil hat.

[90sgoat]

I am currently listed at 95 kg, but the truth is that I am around 102-104 kg as of this morning.