Kevin Durant's 2012 Finals - What if he had Curry's Luck?

[StrongLurk]

Everyone remembers the Heat beating the Thunder despite KD having a solid finals series himself in 2012.

It's a common narrative that "Curry won before Durant joined the Warriors". This is technically true, but the context is key.

Curry's Warriors were no doubt elite in 2015 (as was Curry too), but they got an insane break in the finals with Love not playing and Kyrie getting injured in game 1. Cavs would have most likely defeated the Warriors in 2015 since that was definitely the weakest iteration of the Warriors championship teams.

But what if Durant got that lucky? Imagine KD's Thunder playing the Heat in 2012 with no Bosh and only one game of Dwayne Wade? Clearly KD's Thunder would've won in the same circumstances that Curry got blessed with.

There is a weird narrative that KD can't lead teams to great heights like Curry, but KD never had Curry's luck pre-2017 NOR did he have anything close to the spacing Curry's teams had. The Thunder also traded away James Harden right after those finals...

[highwhey]

yeah, curry has had insane luck in almost every finals trip.

[warriorfan]

What if op wasn’t a f.aggot?

[Akhenaten]

This would've been a viable argument if 2022 never happened

[StrongLurk]

This would've been a viable argument if 2022 never happened

I'm not talking about that. The point is people try to act like Curry was this massive "winner" and KD was a "loser.

But KD 100% would've won in 2012 if he had the conditions Curry did in 2015.

[tontoz]

How many playoff series has Durant won since he left Curry? Looks like the bad luck follows him wherever he goes.

[StrongLurk]

There is a lot of deflection going on in this thread because those people don't want to admit my OP is correct.

Durant would've been a "winner" way before Curry if he got Curry's luck in 2012.

[tpols]

I don't think OP realizes the reason KD started team hopping was the ass kicking Curry gave him in the 2016 WCFs. Totally outplayed him in a 1-3 comeback choke.

People forget, but Chef used to own Durant and Westbrook and the Thunder. He had the most iconic game of his career vs them that left KD in awe.


https://youtu.be/TsDxhD7mVcE?si=Uofvlncm2MMrVrG5

[Stephonit]

If KD had Curry's luck in 2012 he'd be out missing most of the season due to an ankle injury.

[StrongLurk]

If KD had Curry's luck in 2012 he'd be out missing most of the season due to an ankle injury.

Kevin Durant only played 27 games in 2015 and then blew his Achilles while on his way to a 3rd FMVP in a row. He's had plenty of bad luck with injuries :lol

You all literally refuse to accept the reality that KD would've been a winner before Curry even hit his prime if KD got to played an injured Heat team in 2012.

[StrongLurk]

I don't think OP realizes the reason KD started team hopping was the ass kicking Curry gave him in the 2016 WCFs. Totally outplayed him in a 1-3 comeback choke.

People forget, but Chef used to own Durant and Westbrook and the Thunder. He had the most iconic game of his career vs them that left KD in awe.


https://youtu.be/TsDxhD7mVcE?si=Uofvlncm2MMrVrG5

Go ahead and say it. It won't hurt you. It's just reality. Narratives are not important. Go ahead and say it "KD would've been a winner before Curry even hit his prime if KD got to played an injured Heat team in 2012."

[tontoz]

If KD had Curry's luck he wouldn't have had two future MVPs as teammates. Steph had David Lee and Monte Ellis.

[StrongLurk]

If KD had Curry's luck he wouldn't have had two future MVPs as teammates.

That's not how things work buddy. Russ and Harden won MVPs 5+ years after the 2012 finals. Also they would not have been MVPs sticking on the Thunder.

Face it, Curry got lucky as hell in 2015, choked in 2016, and they he and Draymond literally cried/begged KD to join them because they didn't actually believe they could beat Lebron/Kyrie and the Cavs in the future.

Ultimately my point is Curry's narrative as a winner before 2017 is overrated and KD's narrative as a loser before 2017 is not a really accurate.

[tontoz]

That's not how things work buddy. Russ and Harden won MVPs 5+ years after the 2012 finals. Also they would not have been MVPs sticking on the Thunder.

Face it, Curry got lucky as hell in 2015, choked in 2016, and they he and Draymond literally cried/begged KD to join them because they didn't actually believe they could beat Lebron/Kyrie and the Cavs in the future.

Ultimately my point is Curry's narrative as a winner before 2017 is overrated and KD's narrative as a loser before 2017 is not a really accurate.


Russ was already a two time All-Star when they made the 2012 finals. Harden was top 10 in the MVP race the following year.

KD isn't doing crap with the teammates Steph had early in his career, and he hasn't done crap with his hand picked teams after he left Steph.

[StrongLurk]

Russ was already a two time All-Star when they made the 2012 finals. Harden was top 10 in the MVP race the following year.

KD isn't doing crap with the teammates Steph had early in his career, and he hasn't done crap with his hand picked teams after he left Steph.

So you DONT THINK KD would've won a ring in 2012 facing the Heat WITHOUT Bosh and only one game of WADE???

That's what this thread is about, read the OP. I'll need your answer to this question before I respond to you again.

[tontoz]

So you DONT THINK KD would've won a ring in 2012 facing the Heat WITHOUT Bosh and only one game of WADE???

That's what this thread is about, read the OP. I'll need your answer to this question before I respond to you again.


The title to the thread mentions "Curry's luck". If you are going to make a claim like that you have to look at ALL of Curry's luck, not just a couple of weeks that fit your agenda.

[dankok8]

If KD won his only title against the Heat without Wade and Bosh, it would be a giant asterisk. I really don't think it elevates his career over winning two rings in GS to be honest.

[StrongLurk]

The title to the thread mentions "Curry's luck". If you are going to make a claim like that you have to look at ALL of Curry's luck, not just a couple of weeks that fit your agenda.

The OP is very specific, there is no agenda either.

I will take your non-answer as an admission that KD would've won in 2012 if he faced a brutally injured Heat team, before Curry even hit his prime.

[StrongLurk]

If KD won his only title against the Heat without Wade and Bosh, it would be a giant asterisk. I really don't think it elevates his career over winning two rings in GS to be honest.

Do you apply that asterisk to Curry's 2015 ring? For some reason, a lot of people don't and want to give Curry full credit for being a "winner" when discussing him vs Durant.

[warriorfan]

So you DONT THINK KD would've won a ring in 2012 facing the Heat WITHOUT Bosh and only one game of WADE???

That's what this thread is about, read the OP. I'll need your answer to this question before I respond to you again.

He’s literally choked and lost every single time in his career he wasn’t next to Curry so logic says he would probably still lose

[tpols]

He’s literally choked and lost every single time in his career he wasn’t next to Curry so logic says he would probably still lose

KD was an absolute monster in 2021 playoffs and probably would've won the title if Harden and Kyrie dont get hurt.

They totally dominated the champion Boston Celtics in the 1st round, and then were up 2-0 on the Bucks with a Trae less Hawks and choking chris paul Suns on deck.

That was his best shot and even with the injuries he lost by a pinky toe.

[tontoz]

The OP is very specific, there is no agenda either.

I will take your non-answer as an admission that KD would've won in 2012 if he faced a brutally injured Heat team, before Curry even hit his prime.


There are 52 weeks in a year. If you are only looking at one of those weeks to determine if someone is lucky that is called cherry picking.

Put KD with Klay and Dray in 2012 does he even make the Finals? Doubtful.

[StrongLurk]

There are 52 weeks in a year. If you are only looking at one of those weeks to determine if someone is lucky that is called cherry picking.

Put KD with Klay and Dray in 2012 does he even make the Finals? Doubtful.

You mean, Klay, Dray, David Lee, Iggy, Bogut, Barnes, Shaun Livingston? KD definitely could make the finals with that. But let's be real, the teams would be slightly adjusted roster-wise considering Curry is a PG and KD is a SF.

Again, the OP is specifically about the insane LUCK that Curry's 2015 Warriors got literally in the FINALS.

I don't know why it's so hard for you to answer the OP. Is KD's 2012 Thunder winning the finals against the Heat with one game of Wade and no Bosh?

[RRR3]

Most people are incapable of admitting rings are circumstantial because it would destroy their precious narratives so you get tap-dancing around a simple question like this thread. Obviously Durant beats the Heat easily if Wade and Bosh go down. LeBron isn't beating an elite Thunder team with Mario Chalmers as his second option.

[tpols]

There are 52 weeks in a year. If you are only looking at one of those weeks to determine if someone is lucky that is called cherry picking.

Put KD with Klay and Dray in 2012 does he even make the Finals? Doubtful.

I don't think he realizes how trash Klay was in the 2015 Finals.

15/4/2 on 40% FG. Straight mid. I know we all like to shit on Westbrook but he averaged 27/6/6 on better shooting than Klay in the 2012 NBA Finals. And then KD had Harden on top of that.

2015 Dray was a bench scrub who only got time due to All Star David Lee getting hurt, and Klay was pedestrian at best. Durant doesn't win shit with that cast. His Thunder team was stronger.

[StrongLurk]

I don't think he realizes how trash Klay was in the 2015 Finals.

15/4/2 on 40% FG. Straight mid. I know we all like to shit on Westbrookbut he averaged 27/6/6 on better shooting than Klay. And then KD had Harden on top of that.

Dray was a bench scrub who only got time due to All Star David Lee getting hurt, and Klay was pedestrian at best. Durant doesn't win shit with that cast. His Thunder team was stronger.

Lol you just agreed with my OP but you won't quite say it. The Warriors in the 2015 finals played below their normal average and only won because they got a huge break with injuries to their opponent.

The 2015 finals is the weakest finals in recent memory due to the 2015 Warriors being very inexperienced/new (despite being an elite team all regular season and in the WC playoffs) and the Cavs playing at like 50% capacity. The lights were looking too bright for the Warriors even without Love/Kyrie playing, but Iggy, who is an experienced vet, injected new life into the team in game 4 and they got the momentum they needed.

[StrongLurk]

Most people are incapable of admitting rings are circumstantial because it would destroy their precious narratives so you get tap-dancing around a simple question like this thread. Obviously Durant beats the Heat easily if Wade and Bosh go down. LeBron isn't beating an elite Thunder team with Mario Chalmers as his second option.

Exactly.

[tpols]

Yes the 2015 warriors caught huge breaks. Everybody knows that. But Curry proved after that to still be a Champion performer and Durant didn't. Just the way it went.

I don't even see much of a separation between them as players. Both skilled GOAT basketball players. But it was proven in Golden State that Durants iso ball style didn't enhance his teammates like Currys off ball style.

The 2012 Thunder were dead LAST in team assists. They had horrible ball movement and relied on their overwhelming MVP talent to win. Literally 3 MVPS on the same team with a DPOY candidate in Ibaka to round the defense out.

Currys teams OTOH were #1 ranked in team assists and ball movement. Which elevated lesser talent to GOAT record.

You don't seem to understand that context.

[tontoz]

The Warriors won 67 games in 2015 in the stronger conference. The Cavs won 53 games in a weak conference. lets not pretend like the Cavs were the favorites.

[RRR3]

The Warriors won 67 games in 2015 in the stronger conference. The Cavs won 53 games in a weak conference. lets not pretend like the Cavs were the favorites.
The Cavs won 53 games because LeBron missed 13 games and they went 3-10 without him.

[1987_Lakers]

The Warriors won 67 games in 2015 in the stronger conference. The Cavs won 53 games in a weak conference. lets not pretend like the Cavs were the favorites.

I think Warriors would still be Vegas favorites if both teams were healthy heading into the Finals, but the inexperience of the Warriors in the Finals kinda showed. They looked kinda shook in the beginning of that series.

[tpols]

It really is just comical to cry about Durants "luck" when he had a much better team than Curry though.

Not only did KD, Westbrook, and Harden all win MVPs in the mid 2010s... I didn't even realize this but Ibaka was the best shot blocker and possibly defender in the whole world during their run.

https://i.postimg.cc/DzzT2MbV/Screenshot-20240815-105331-Chrome.jpg

He was like a 6'10 bodybuilder version of Draymond Green. :lol

[tontoz]

The Cavs won 53 games because LeBron missed 13 games and they went 3-10 without him.

Missing 13 games isn't a big deal. He played 80 games only 3 times in his career so some missed games have to be assumed.

If we assume he plays 76, which he did the following year, they would probably pick up maybe 3 more wins (guessing). Yawn

[dankok8]

Do you apply that asterisk to Curry's 2015 ring? For some reason, a lot of people don't and want to give Curry full credit for being a "winner" when discussing him vs Durant.

Sure I did before he won more. I wasn't convinced that Curry was the best player in the world in 2016 before the playoffs despite his literal GOAT level RS and the fact that he was robbed of the 2015 Finals MVP. I still felt like he had more to prove. Even though the metrics suggest that the 2015 Warriors would win against the healthy Cavs too but it's just not the same actually doing it and winning your only ring facing a shell of a team.

Perfect example of what I'm talking about is Giannis. I feel like his 2021 ring just doesn't resonate that strongly with me. Like he has more to prove before I put him in the same category as the great winners of the game.

[Phoenix]

It really is just comical to cry about Durants "luck" when he had a much better team than Curry though.

Not only did KD, Westbrook, and Harden all win MVPs in the mid 2010s... I didn't even realize this but Ibaka was the best shot blocker and possibly defender in the whole world during their run.

https://i.postimg.cc/DzzT2MbV/Screenshot-20240815-105331-Chrome.jpg

He was like a 6'10 bodybuilder version of Draymond Green. :lol

But we now have the benefit of hindsight with those two. They don't play championship basketball and being MVPs years after the fact says little about what they were in OKC back in 2012 as up and coming talents. To borrow a 3ball-ism( Jesus), their brand of ball isn't conducive to chips. Stephs clearly is, and Durants is but he can't be the one leading the way. We have 15 years outside the Warriors to know that. 'I just wanna hoop'...

[tontoz]

But we now have the benefit of hindsight with those two. They don't play championship basketball and being MVPs years after the fact says little about what they were in OKC back in 2012 as up and coming talents.

Russ was 2nd team All-NBA that year, for the 2nd time.

Harden was a CP3 injury away from defeating GS at their best, with Durant. I dont think it is fair to just dismiss him like that just because he couldnt get past maybe the best team ever.

[Phoenix]

Russ was 2nd team All-NBA that year, for the 2nd time.

Harden was a CP3 injury away from defeating GS at their best, with Durant. I dont think it is fair to just dismiss him like that just because he couldnt get past maybe the best team ever.

Yah Russ was cool but he's always been boneheaded as a PG and he wasn't an MVP. Harden was a supersub. This was 2012. What they were 5 years later in different situations isn't really here or there.
If Harden gets past the Warriors in 2018, I'm not taking him over the Cavs in the finals. Yeah he gets legacy points for beating GS but I don't know....Ive just never been into that guy. His style, his playoff failures....anything. One of the great season players obviously, but so is David Robinson.

[tontoz]

Yah Russ was cool but he's always been boneheaded as a PG and he wasn't an MVP. Harden was a supersub. This was 2012. What they were 5 years later in different situations isn't really here or there.


Harden was 8th in the MVP race the following year. He played 31 mpg in the playoffs for OKC so he was a sub in name only.

[warriorfan]

It really is just comical to cry about Durants "luck" when he had a much better team than Curry though.

Not only did KD, Westbrook, and Harden all win MVPs in the mid 2010s... I didn't even realize this but Ibaka was the best shot blocker and possibly defender in the whole world during their run.

https://i.postimg.cc/DzzT2MbV/Screenshot-20240815-105331-Chrome.jpg

He was like a 6'10 bodybuilder version of Draymond Green. :lol

Sefolosha was a solid perimeter defender role player too

[tpols]

But we now have the benefit of hindsight with those two. They don't play championship basketball and being MVPs years after the fact says little about what they were in OKC back in 2012 as up and coming talents. To borrow a 3ball-ism( Jesus), their brand of ball isn't conducive to chips. Stephs clearly is, and Durants is but he can't be the one leading the way. We have 15 years outside the Warriors to know that. 'I just wanna hoop'...

You're right their brand of ball isn't good that's why they were the 30th ranked assist team in 2012 but the point is they were stacked with talent. A fully healthy Durant, Harden, Westbrook, and Ibaka.

Part of it is on KD though. Even on the Warriors we saw that when Curry was out and Durant was in their ball movement and chemistry took a nose dive from it's usual GOAT status. This is proven with data from the 2017-2019 Golden State reign.

So what OP doesn't get is KD wouldn't have been able to elevate Golden State to ~70 win team status like Curry did because his brand of ball isn't on Stephs level. There's no way KD wins with a 15ppg Klay and Dray because he'd never elevate that talent to GOAT record.

[Phoenix]

You're right their brand of ball isn't good that's why they were the 30th ranked assist team in 2012 but the point is they were stacked with talent. A fully healthy Durant, Harden, Westbrook, and Ibaka.

Part of it is on KD though. Even on the Warriors we saw that when Curry was out and Durant was in their ball movement and chemistry took a nose dive from it's usual GOAT status. This is proven with data from the 2017-2019 Golden State reign.

So what OP doesn't get is KD wouldn't have been able to elevate Golden State to ~70 win team status like Curry did because his brand of ball isn't on Stephs level. There's no way KD wins with a 15ppg Klay and Dray because he'd never elevate that talent to GOAT record.

Yes. KD wasn't the one to lead that team. Top 10 talent, top 30 intangibles. Whatever that means. Any number of good, solid SFs win chips between 2017 and 2018. And and I said before, the Warriors record in 2017 and 2018 shows who the engine was, regardless of whether one thinks KD is better in isolation or otherwise. Stephs gravity made that team what it was.

[tontoz]

https://hosting.photobucket.com/images/g195/tontoz/FUH2MZTXwAEgX1H.jpeg

[Phoenix]

https://hosting.photobucket.com/images/g195/tontoz/FUH2MZTXwAEgX1H.jpeg

And there you go. The engine of the team is obvious, even in 2017 and 2018. Their whole style changed with KD and Steph out. KD gave them a large margin of error and competitively upset the balance of the league for 3 years.

[dankok8]

^^ The lineup data provides an even more stark contrast.

2017-2019 Warriors

Steph ON Durant ON: +15.9 Net
Steph ON Durant OFF: +12.4 Net
Steph OFF Durant ON: +2.4 Net
Steph OFF Durant OFF: -3.8 Net

[Hey Yo]

It really is just comical to cry about Durants "luck" when he had a much better team than Curry though.

Not only did KD, Westbrook, and Harden all win MVPs in the mid 2010s... I didn't even realize this but Ibaka was the best shot blocker and possibly defender in the whole world during their run.

https://i.postimg.cc/DzzT2MbV/Screenshot-20240815-105331-Chrome.jpg

He was like a 6'10 bodybuilder version of Draymond Green. :lol

Make up your mind.... was the 2012 OKC Finals squad a bunch of kids and were expected to lose or stacked like you're insinuating above??

[tpols]

Make up your mind.... was the 2012 OKC Finals squad a bunch of kids and were expected to lose or stacked like you're insinuating above??

They were stacked but the Heat were even more stacked and experienced. Both were loaded to the brim squads.

[StrongLurk]

The Warriors won 67 games in 2015 in the stronger conference. The Cavs won 53 games in a weak conference. lets not pretend like the Cavs were the favorites.

:roll:

[StrongLurk]

https://hosting.photobucket.com/images/g195/tontoz/FUH2MZTXwAEgX1H.jpeg

Playoffs/Finals number please. That's always been the debate. No one cares about their regular season stats like this. Unless you want to say the Warriors would be better off with KD not on the team (which is what these stats show lol.).

[StrongLurk]

Seems like it's obvious to everyone that KD wins in 2012 against a injury riddled Heat.

So the narrative that Curry was a winner and KD was a loser that had to hop on Curry's ride is a fake narrative. And KD proved to ultimately be the best player on the Warriors when it matter most (playoffs/finals).

They are also very similar players after their breakup. Curry does have the edge but KD blew his damn achilles man. It's ridiculous how people are like "what has KD done after Curry?". Kobe's career completely ended that way. The fact that KD is still all-nba is insane. Curry should be better than a post-achilles tear KD.

Curry 2020 playoffs to now:
35 games, 28.5/5/6, 22.9 PER, 59.9 TS%, 7.2 BPM, .175 WS/48

KD 2020 playoffs to now:
31 games, 30/8/5, 22.2 PER, 60.8 TS%, 5.5 BPM, .130 WS/48

[tontoz]

:roll:

Are you saying the Cavs were the favorites? Links please.

[Phoenix]

Seems like it's obvious to everyone that KD wins in 2012 against a injury riddled Heat.

So the narrative that Curry was a winner and KD was a loser that had to hop on Curry's ride is a fake narrative. And KD proved to ultimately be the best player on the Warriors when it matter most (playoffs/finals).

They are also very similar players after their breakup. Curry does have the edge but KD blew his damn achilles man. It's ridiculous how people are like "what has KD done after Curry?". Kobe's career completely ended that way. The fact that KD is still all-nba is insane. Curry should be better than a post-achilles tear KD.

Curry 2020 playoffs to now:
35 games, 28.5/5/6, 22.9 PER, 59.9 TS%, 7.2 BPM, .175 WS/48

KD 2020 playoffs to now:
31 games, 30/8/5, 22.2 PER, 60.8 TS%, 5.5 BPM, .130 WS/48

But....that didn't happen. And the 2022 Chip, if not the 2015 one, should have laid to rest any doubts about which player you built around. Steph is a cornerstone. KD has no history of winning outside 2017 and 2018. 2021 chip would have done wonders. It is what it is. And basically anyone on the opposite of Lebron is going to win the FMVP if he loses. Kawhi, Iggy, KD. That's the history.

[StrongLurk]

Are you saying the Cavs were the favorites? Links please.

Bro, Kevin Love got taken out of the playoffs in round 1 and Kyrie had been hobbled since round 2. Bron himself has lingering back issues that whole year too.

The Cavs were not at all full strength before the finals so of course people would choose the Warriors as favorites. Kyrie's knee popping in game 1 is proof that he was barely hanging on already...

[tontoz]

Playoffs/Finals number please. That's always been the debate. No one cares about their regular season stats like this. Unless you want to say the Warriors would be better off with KD not on the team (which is what these stats show lol.).

Nobody cares, or is it just you that doesn't care because it doesn't fit your narrative?

Steph has 3 Finals appearances without Durant. I think he has proved he can be successful in the playoffs without KD. He won a ring after KD left and after a ruptured achilles and torn ACL for Klay.

KD has one finals appearance without Steph. His teammate Russ had more All-NBA 2nd team appearances by 2012 than Dray and Klay have combined for their careers.

[StrongLurk]

But....that didn't happen. And the 2022 Chip, if not the 2015 one, should have laid to rest any doubts about which player you built around. Steph is a cornerstone. KD has no history of winning outside 2017 and 2018. 2021 chip would have done wonders. It is what it is. And basically anyone on the opposite of Lebron is going to win the FMVP if he loses. Kawhi, Iggy, KD. That's the history.

The bolded is called "logical conclusion". Every knows it didn't happen in reality. But Curry got LUCKY in 2015 finals while Durant did not in 2012. Geez buddy use your damn brain. Also it's funny you bring up 2021 for KD, where once again, he got unlucky with Kyrie getting hurt and Harden reduced to like 20% capacity in those playoffs.

KD could've won in 2012 AND 2021 if he better luck. Isn't in interesting that Curry lost in 2019 finals because KD wasn't there?

[tontoz]

Bro, Kevin Love got taken out of the playoffs in round 1 and Kyrie had been hobbled since round 2. Bron himself has lingering back issues that whole year too.

The Cavs were not at all full strength before the finals so of course people would choose the Warriors as favorites. Kyrie's knee popping in game 1 is proof that he was barely hanging on already...


Are you saying that a healthy 53 win team from the east would have been the favorite over a 67 win team from the west?

During the season Love averaged 16/10 with a 56% TS and weak defense. They were 12-2 in the playoffs without Love prior to the finals so it doesn't look like they missed him that much.

[Phoenix]

The bolded is called "logical conclusion". Every knows it didn't happen in reality. But Curry got LUCKY in 2015 finals while Durant did not in 2012. Geez buddy use your damn brain. Also it's funny you bring up 2021 for KD, where once again, he got unlucky with Kyrie getting hurt and Harden reduced to like 20% capacity in those playoffs.

KD could've won in 2012 AND 2021 if he better luck. Isn't in interesting that Curry lost in 2019 finals because KD wasn't there?

Luck and circumstance does play into it. It is what it is( as I said above). Always loaded with talent. We don't need to make excuses for why he hasnt won otherwise. He's had plenty of chances in 17 years. Thats me using my brain. The best of the best will find a way to put themselves in best position to win. KD has done this by playing mercenary, not franchise cornerstone that others come to play with. Hell, he joined Kyrie in 2019. A worse overall player. These guys have 100% control over the direction of their careers now. He's done nothing since Golden State and not through lack of talent. To me the 2022 title is the real separation point. We can theorize everything else about them but that's where Steph definitively went into another tier.

[RRR3]

https://i.imgflip.com/90egww.jpg

[StrongLurk]

https://i.imgflip.com/90egww.jpg

Holy shit :lol

[dankok8]

I still vehemently disagree that a hypothetical scenario where KD wins a title in 2012 over a Heat team missing Wade and Bosh dramatically improves his legacy. Or even much at all especially if he never goes to Golden State.

In fact, Curry himself was very much doubted after 2015 beating an injured team and still doubted by some after 2018 because KD was seen as helping him win those next two. As Phoenix above said, the 2022 title finally laid those criticisms to rest. KD would need to do more than just win an "asterisk" title in 2012 to move to Curry's level IMO.

And as another example Giannis now is still very much doubted by many despite winning in 2021 against injured competition.

[tontoz]

Lets just ignore that GS won 14 more games in a tougher conference. Lets also ignore that Wade was far better than anyone on the Cavs other than Lebron. He already had a FMVP and a ring before Lebron joined him.

[Axe]

Andre iguodala was a true lucky charm for the GS franchise. With him, the warriors started to have...

- a 50-win season for the first time in many years
- a ring and a finals mvp in the season after for the first time in 40 years
- breaking over 72-wins and other team records in just his third season rt
- two b2b titles after 2018 (thanks kd)
- Five straight trips to the finals in 2019

Wow, the dubs would have never been the same without this guy. The team fell off significantly along with other factors when he got sent away but he ended up with the heat during the 2020 disney bubble and made his sixth trip to the finals lmao. Made the playoffs another year with them before coming back to the warriors in 2022 for his fourth and final ring. Still made the playoffs last year before he retired and now, the dubs went in shambles when they didn't win in the play-ins aka losers bracket during april this year...

[tontoz]

:facepalm

Iggy played 19 minutes total during the 2022 Finals.

[Axe]

Yk it doesn't have to be his playing time or whatever. It's more on about his spiritual presence in the team. :confusedshrug: :roll:

[tpols]

Yk it doesn't have to be his playing time or whatever. It's more on about his spiritual presence in the team. :confusedshrug: :roll:

Axey baby you're really not making a whole lot of sense right now and we don't like the way you're talking to Uncle T. We're going to strap you in the timeout chair for now. And put a bib on so you can be spoonfed some apple sauce and calm down. Ok?

[Axe]

Axey baby you're really not making a whole lot of sense right now and we don't like the way you're talking to Uncle T. We're going to strap you in the timeout chair for now. And put a bib on so you can be spoonfed some apple sauce and calm down. Ok?
https://c.tenor.com/bj7D0gpVJ4UAAAAC/tenor.gif

[Akhenaten]

Curry wasn't physically right in the 16 Finals coming off the MCL tear and ankle ijury

Everybody talks about "choking" a 3-1 lead but Curry wasn't playing very well in those 4 games

They went up 2-1 with him avg 16 with 5 turnovers per game. A healthy Curry gets Cleveland out the way in Game 5

We can play the what if Game all day, are we gonna negate Kawhi's 19 chip?

Durant hasn't gotten it done, Curry has....TWICE bottomline

[StrongLurk]

Curry wasn't physically right in the 16 Finals coming off the MCL tear and ankle ijury

Everybody talks about "choking" a 3-1 lead but Curry wasn't playing very well in those 4 games

They went up 2-1 with him avg 16 with 5 turnovers per game. A healthy Curry gets Cleveland out the way in Game 5

We can play the what if Game all day, are we gonna negate Kawhi's 19 chip?

Durant hasn't gotten it done, Curry has....TWICE bottomline

KD was better than Curry when they were together. Snagged all the FMVPs and was going to get a 3rd. Bottomline. KD was Shaq and Curry was Kobe. That's what happened. Kobe has more rings than Shaq, but Shaq was better were they played together.

Also yes I asterisked the shit out of Kawhi's ring. Kevin Durant was the best player in the league in 2019 and Kawhi got to duck him. Klay got hurt too right at the end of those finals.

[Axe]

Lol kawhi just avenged what happened to him in 2017, when the warriors were huge favorites to win it all that year but were about to lose game 1 of the wcf until zaza intentionally injured him in the third quarter bt. It's also worth noting that tony parker, who usually contributed 10 ppg in the playoffs, missed the entire series as well.