Here's why "Russell won 11" doesn't save Lebron & excludes him from goat debate

[3ba11]

both MJ and Russell won the most of their era, while Lebron is outside of this goat debate.criteria by winning less than Duncan and Kobe.

Russell was goat for winning the most of his era, and then MJ and Kobe followed, while Lebron fell short of this goat criteria

Carry on

[Carbine]

Lebron quite literally has won as much as anybody since entering the NBA. So he meets that criteria of winning.

[8Ball]

Lebron quite literally has won as much as anybody since entering the NBA. So he meets that criteria of winning.

Thread cliffs.

[gengiskhan]

Lebron quite literally has won as much as anybody since entering the NBA. So he meets that criteria of winning.

So what you are really saying.....

1990 MJ loses Game 7 because of "migrane" Pippen and "quits" and colludes with 1991 Bad Boys

1991 MJ led Bad Boys win.....gets his 1st Ring and 1st FMVP

then 1992 MJ-zeke-dumar's SUPER Bad Boys lose to 1992 Knicks (1992 NYK Champs beating 1992 Blazers).....

1992 MJ jumps ship again (1992 Bad Boys self destructs)....MJ "quits" Joins 1993 NYK and Ewing.

1993 MJ-Ewing-Starks NYK win MJ 2nd Ring and 2nd FMVP

1994 MJ-Ewing-Starks NYK Back-2-Back Champs. MJ 3rd Ring and 3rd FMVP.

1995 MJ-Ewing-Starks NYK 3-peat beat 1995 Dream-Drexler Rockets. MJ 4th Ring and 4th FMVP.


WHAT DO YOU THINK OF THIS SCENARIO?

MJ has 4 Rings with 4 FMVPs = LBJ has 4 Rings with 4 FMVPs.
MJ has 3peat as well = LBJs 2020 "Bubble" ring ? (despite both colluded and quit on their former teams)

But in all this scenario 1992-1995 EWING actually 4-peated. His 1992 NYK actually defeated in-fighting, self-destructing 1992 MJs Bad Boys.

Would you still respect MJ for "quiting" and "colluding" to collect rings and FMVPs. With Pippen constantly beaching in media how MJ destroyed his legacy and destroyed Bulls after 1990 Game 7 loss.

If you dont respect this alternate version of MJ than this is exactly what LBJ did. and Durant followed him.

In light of this, MJ's legacy of 6 Rings, 2 3peats and 6 FMVPs are miles and miles ahead of LBJ and Durant and Curry legacies all combined!

[3ba11]

Lebron quite literally has won as much as anybody since entering the NBA. So he meets that criteria of winning.


Lebron cannot compete on the championship level (lottery record on the championship level) and no game-winners on the championship level (0-7 choker).

You're apparently unaware that most people see through someone that drastically failed to win their conference twice when expected (09', 10'), so they put the top 3 players in the conference on 1 team to manufacture a 'streak' of Finals.

Jokic could never get away with teaming up with SGA and KAT to make a bunch of Finals.. Or maybe he could, but this is why only winning the Finals matters, in order to show that a team won the whole league instead of being the 4th or 5th-best team that was luckily in the right conference.




Lebron quite literally has won as much as anybody since entering the NBA. So he meets that criteria of winning.


When Jordan won 6 chips, his fans said he was goat because they said "Russell's 11 chips don't count since it was back in the boonies"...

Similarly, Lebron fans discount Jordan's higher ring count for the same reason, "it was a different era, so throw those rings in the trash", but the issue is that Lebron must at least win the most in his era to make that argument, and he didn't.. MJ won the most in his era, so he could say, "screw the prior era", but Lebron didn't do this, so he can't say "screw Jordan's 6 rings" the way Jordan fans could say "screw Russell's 11".

Does that make sense?.. A player must win the most rings of his era to say "screw the prior era".. So that means that Kobe or Duncan are the goats and can say "screw Jordan's rings from that crappy era", while Lebron cannot make this argument because he didn't conquer this era like others by winning the most chips in the era.

Ultimately, Russell was goat for winning the most of his era, and then MJ and Kobe followed, while Lebron fell short of this goat criteria.

[Hey Yo]

Russell wasn't a mental midget like MJ and didn't need to quit the league twice to load manage

[3ba11]

Russell wasn't a mental midget like MJ and didn't need to quit the league twice to load manage


Thread Cliffs


Lebron doesn't qualify for a goat debate because he didn't win the most rings in his era - this matters because players must win the most of their own era to say "screw the prior era" (and their ring counts)

[SouBeachTalents]

Another classic 3ball contradiction where he claims rangz are all that matters, yet ranks Bird like 10 spots above Magic and had 1 time champs like Dirk & Giannis in his top 10.

Now time for the epic goal post shifting :lol

[Hey Yo]

Thread Cliffs


Lebron doesn't qualify for a goat debate because he didn't win the most rings in his era - this matters because players must win the most of their own era to say "screw the prior era" (and their ring counts)

4fmvp >>>>>

[sdot_thadon]

Actually Russell's 11 just proves how utterly futile the "rangz" argument really is. His total dwarfs MJ's while facing actual Hall of famers at his position and battled another goat candidate in his era. And he didn't just 3 peat......He 8 peated. Didn't "retire" in the middle of his prime for mental exhaustion in the 60s when black men faced the worst of the worst. The fact that you and your kind don't beleive Russell > Mj also proves you don't really believe Mj > Lebron. The contradiction is literally baked into your own argument. Thanks for the clarification.

[Carbine]

Duncan and Kobe actually don't have more rings than Lebron since he's been in the league. Duncan has three (two as the best player) and Kobe has two in that time frame.

I don't think many people consider Lebron in the Duncan and Kobe era. Kobe is a couple months from being 7 years older and Duncan 8 years older. It would be like saying Jokic and Wemby are in the same "era" which just isn't going to be true

[ELITEpower23]

Players with more than three FMVP is League History:

LeBron & Jordan

That's the list. Wake up :lol

[gengiskhan]

Players with more than three FMVP is League History:

LeBron & Jordan

That's the list. Wake up :lol

"Bubble" FMVP is highly questionable!. Its ADs

2016 FMVP is highly questionable!. Its Kyrie's.

LeBlowJob has only 2 FMVPs that belongs to him.

Even those two are because he had a SUPER team.

[AlternativeAcc.]

Lebron cannot compete on the championship level (lottery record on the championship level) and no game-winners on the championship level (0-7 choker).

You're apparently unaware that most people see through someone that drastically failed to win their conference twice when expected (09', 10'), so they put the top 3 players in the conference on 1 team to manufacture a 'streak' of Finals.

Jokic could never get away with teaming up with SGA and KAT to make a bunch of Finals.. Or maybe he could, but this is why only winning the Finals matters, in order to show that a team won the whole league instead of being the 4th or 5th-best team that was luckily in the right conference.






When Jordan won 6 chips, his fans said he was goat because they said "Russell's 11 chips don't count since it was back in the boonies"...

Similarly, Lebron fans discount Jordan's higher ring count for the same reason, "it was a different era, so throw those rings in the trash", but the issue is that Lebron must at least win the most in his era to make that argument, and he didn't.. MJ won the most in his era, so he could say, "screw the prior era", but Lebron didn't do this, so he can't say "screw Jordan's 6 rings" the way Jordan fans could say "screw Russell's 11".

Does that make sense?.. A player must win the most rings of his era to say "screw the prior era".. So that means that Kobe or Duncan are the goats and can say "screw Jordan's rings from that crappy era", while Lebron cannot make this argument because he didn't conquer this era like others by winning the most chips in the era.

Ultimately, Russell was goat for winning the most of his era, and then MJ and Kobe followed, while Lebron fell short of this goat criteria.

Fmvps little guy.

Using your method is preposterous and gives credit to Kobe for being a 16ppg for one of the rings and 2nd fiddle for the majority.

No fmvp and it doesn't count. Just the way it is.

[ELITEpower23]

Actually Russell's 11 just proves how utterly futile the "rangz" argument really is. His total dwarfs MJ's while facing actual Hall of famers at his position and battled another goat candidate in his era. And he didn't just 3 peat......He 8 peated. Didn't "retire" in the middle of his prime for mental exhaustion in the 60s when black men faced the worst of the worst. The fact that you and your kind don't beleive Russell > Mj also proves you don't really believe Mj > Lebron. The contradiction is literally baked into your own argument. Thanks for the clarification.

[3ba11]

Actually Russell's 11 just proves how utterly futile the "rangz" argument really is. His total dwarfs MJ's while facing actual Hall of famers at his position and battled another goat candidate in his era. And he didn't just 3 peat......He 8 peated. Didn't "retire" in the middle of his prime for mental exhaustion in the 60s when black men faced the worst of the worst. The fact that you and your kind don't beleive Russell > Mj also proves you don't really believe Mj > Lebron. The contradiction is literally baked into your own argument. Thanks for the clarification.



"screw the weak eras of the past because I won the most of THIS era (the modern tougher era)."


^^^ this is a very effective argument.. It was used by MJ fans to discount Russell's higher ring count, and now it's being used by Lebron fans to discount MJ's higher ring count.. The problem is that Lebron didn't win the most of his era, which is required to make the argument.. Kobe & Duncan won the most, while Curry had the best dynasty and teams, so they qualify for this GOAT standard, while lebron doesn't.

[3ba11]

Actually Russell's 11 just proves how utterly futile the "rangz" argument really is. His total dwarfs MJ's while facing actual Hall of famers at his position and battled another goat candidate in his era. And he didn't just 3 peat......He 8 peated. Didn't "retire" in the middle of his prime for mental exhaustion in the 60s when black men faced the worst of the worst. The fact that you and your kind don't beleive Russell > Mj also proves you don't really believe Mj > Lebron. The contradiction is literally baked into your own argument. Thanks for the clarification.



[B]"screw the weak eras of the past because I won the most of THIS era (the modern tougher era)."


^^^ this is a very effective argument.. It was used by MJ fans to discount Russell's higher ring count, and now it's being used by Lebron fans to discount MJ's higher ring count.. The problem is that Lebron didn't win the most of his era, which is required to make the argument.. Kobe & Duncan won the most, while Curry had the best dynasty and teams, so they qualify for this GOAT particular standard, while lebron doesn't.

[sdot_thadon]

[B]"screw the weak eras of the past because I won the most of THIS era (the modern tougher era)."


^^^ this is a very effective argument.. It was used by MJ fans to discount Russell's higher ring count, and now it's being used by Lebron fans to discount MJ's higher ring count.. The problem is that Lebron didn't win the most of his era, which is required to make the argument.. Kobe & Duncan won the most, while Curry had the best dynasty and teams, so they qualify for this GOAT particular standard, while lebron doesn't.

And this is a very ineffective argument. You're penalizing Lebron for rings guys won while he was in high-school carrying a backpack? That's not Lebrons era, his era is when he played and clearly no one has more rings than him in his "era"

[bison]

Lebron quite literally has won as much as anybody since entering the NBA. So he meets that criteria of winning.

lebron playing in the most watered down era also excludes him from the goat debate. 30 teams means the competition is spread thin.

russell played when there were 8 teams. imagine cutting down today's league to 8 teams, leaving only the current top 100 players on nba rosters. russell faced STACKED competition while winning the most.

[AlternativeAcc.]

lebron playing in the most watered down era also excludes him from the goat debate. 30 teams means the competition is spread thin.

russell played when there were 8 teams. imagine cutting down today's league to 8 teams, leaving only the current top 100 players on nba rosters. russell faced STACKED competition while winning the most.

So nobody can ever be GOAT except Russell because talent isn't monopolized by 1 or 2 teams (no salary cap )

So Celtics had more talent relative to any team today by a huge margin, and had to win far less games in thr playoffs to win the finals. And they were able to keep their monopoly on talent because no salary cap.

But otherwise, good point!

[Carbine]

lebron playing in the most watered down era also excludes him from the goat debate. 30 teams means the competition is spread thin.

russell played when there were 8 teams. imagine cutting down today's league to 8 teams, leaving only the current top 100 players on nba rosters. russell faced STACKED competition while winning the most.

The talent nowadays is definitely deeper to accomodate more teams. Way more black players, way way way more international players.

Not a good argument at all.