Why do people say "Anyone can make the Basketball Hall of Fame!"

[L.Kizzle]

I did a little research and narrowed the list down to just players who made the Hall for mainly their NBA career. So, no guys like Sabonis or Toni Kukuc who made it for their international career and influence.

In NBA is entering in 79th season, with the 2019-2020 as the most recent year a player who last played is in the Hall (Vince Carter.)

I came up with a total of 136 players who've made the Basketball Hall for mostly their NBA career. Below are, IMO a few questionable admissions going by the other players who are in the Hall. Out of the 4,800 players who've ever played in the NBA, thats not a whole lot.

First, three ABA guys I did not include. Mel Daniels, Louie Dampier and Roger Brown all made it for their stellar ABA careers. Rarely played in the NBA, if at all at the end of their careers.

Calvin Murphy; Dick Barnett; Bill Bradley. Three NBA guys, who's Collegiate career trumps their pro career. All three made 1 All-Star game each.

Frank Ramsey; K.C. Jones. 50s-60s Celtics, got in for their association with the Dynasty. Frank Ramsey, the first 6th man and K.C. Jones, probably the best perimeter defender of the era. No individual accolades

Michael Cooper. Made it for his defense, yet was only All-Defense 8 of his 12 seasons (only five 1st teams.) The only modern era player selected without an All-Star appearance.

You then have guys who are borderline like say, Jack Sikma, Zelmo Beaty, Carl Braun and so forth. But they have the accolades and credentials to debate that.

The guys I listed, no so much.

On conclusion, can anyone make the Basketball Hall of Fame? Not really!

Also, some other random Hall of Fame info ... at least for the modern era.

2007; no players selected none. A bunch of coaches and contributors.
2001; Three inductees total. Was their even a ceremony that year.

[1987_Lakers]

Steve Kerr is gonna make it

[RRR3]

Steve Kerr is gonna make it
Yeah, as a coach.

[L.Kizzle]

Steve Kerr is gonna make it

As a player? I'm specifically talking players.

[sdot_thadon]

It's especially crazy when some of those same people probably said Derrick Rose won't make the hall of fame a few years back ironically.

[Kblaze8855]

Because multiple non all stars made it as players. Michael Cooper just made it while almost never starting. The year he started the most games of his career it was less starts for the Lakers than Larry Sprigs who nobody reading this remembers existing.

He had a career worth remembering but he’s in the hall as a player without so much as international accolades or a spectacular college career either. You can come in and list his accomplishments as if the kinda people here don’t know he was a top defender on the showtime lakers but he definitely lends credibility to the argument it doesn’t take much to get in.

KC Jones at least won an absurd number of titles and won 2 in college and a gold medal as well(every single one of them on all 3 levels being with Bill Russell was apparently not held against him).

Coop won a lot as a very important player on a great team…but guys like him dilute it.

[L.Kizzle]

Because multiple non all stars made it as players. Michael Cooper just made it while almost never starting. The year he started the most games of his career it was less starts for the Lakers than Larry Sprigs who nobody reading this remembers existing.

He had a career worth remembering but he’s in the hall as a player without so much as international accolades or a spectacular college career either. You can come in and list his accomplishments as if the kinda people here don’t know he was a top defender on the showtime lakers but he definitely lends credibility to the argument it doesn’t take much to get in.

KC Jones at least won an absurd number of titles and won 2 in college and a gold medal as well(every single one of them on all 3 levels being with Bill Russell was apparently not held against him).

Coop won a lot as a very important player on a great team…but guys like him dilute it.
True about Coop and KC, but it's only those guys.
KC claim to fame might he the beat perimeter defender of his era. Coop, not so much.

[sdot_thadon]

Also can't discount the standards evolving over time being the reason some guys got in that maybe wouldn't today.

[L.Kizzle]

Also can't discount the standards evolving over time being the reason some guys got in that maybe wouldn't today.
Who would you name? Besides the guys I listed, I can't see anyone to remove. Maybe someone like Guy Rodgers.

[L.Kizzle]

It's especially crazy when some of those same people probably said Derrick Rose won't make the hall of fame a few years back ironically.

MVP should make you automatic. If you're the best player in any given year in the greatest league than you're in.

[John8204]

I feel like the Basketball Hall of Fame looks for a reason to include you...while the Baseball Hall of Fame looks for a reason to exclude you. Personally I prefer the Basketball Hall of Fame because I know what a Hall of Famer looks like...baseball Hall of Fame..Todd Helton is a hall of famer but Don Mattingly isn't?

https://www.notinhalloffame.com/

[Axe]

Because the standards in making it can either be so low or random. Having that said, i feel like andre iguodala is gonna make it someday for having a very successful career. Even though he's not really as talented on the floor as many superstars who are much more prominent in the league.

[iamgine]

I think what "Anyone" means is, as long as you have something the voters like, you can get in even though your level as a player is so much lower.

Like, maybe one day Jrue makes it to the HOF. He's clearly not even at the level of random stars like Tyrese Haliburton or Donovan Mitchell, who are not all time talent themselves.

[Xiao Yao You]

I think what "Anyone" means is, as long as you have something the voters like, you can get in even though your level as a player is so much lower.

Like, maybe one day Jrue makes it to the HOF. He's clearly not even at the level of random stars like Tyrese Haliburton or Donovan Mitchell, who are not all time talent themselves.

Theres more to the game than scoring. Ill take jrue over mitchell just like team usa did :facepalm

[iamgine]

Theres more to the game than scoring. Ill take jrue over mitchell just like team usa did :facepalm

Me too.

[Nowoco]

It has lots of very good players in it and not just all-time greats.

Mitch Richmond and Chris Webber for example were very good players but not all-time greats. As soon as you let guys like that in it then it takes the gloss of the actual genuine ATGs.

Adding guys like Michael Cooper 25 years after they retire just further makes a mockery of it. What was it about Coop that wasn't good enough to get it at the time that suddenly changed in the following years? What it really came down to is "if xxxx is in then Coop should be in". Its just a watered down diluted mess at this point. And that's before you get to guys like Kukoc being in.

For the genuine GOATs, it's almost embarrassing to be doing a speech with Dino Radja standing behind you ready to go next. For the borderline HoFers, its under a cloud of people thinking you shouldn't be there. So it's neither one thing or the other.

[L.Kizzle]

It has lots of very good players in it and not just all-time greats.

Mitch Richmond and Chris Webber for example were very good players but not all-time greats. As soon as you let guys like that in it then it takes the gloss of the actual genuine ATGs.

Adding guys like Michael Cooper 25 years after they retire just further makes a mockery of it. What was it about Coop that wasn't good enough to get it at the time that suddenly changed in the following years? What it really came down to is "if xxxx is in then Coop should be in". Its just a watered down diluted mess at this point. And that's before you get to guys like Kukoc being in.

For the genuine GOATs, it's almost embarrassing to be doing a speech with Dino Radja standing behind you ready to go next. For the borderline HoFers, its under a cloud of people thinking you shouldn't be there. So it's neither one thing or the other.
It Mitch Richmond and Webber aren't Hall of Fame players, then the Hall would literally have like 80 players in it. Maybe less than that. Because if a guy like Chris Webber isn't a Hall of Famer than is Pistol Pete one, or Kevin McHale?

[John8204]

It Mitch Richmond and Webber aren't Hall of Fame players, then the Hall would literally have like 80 players in it. Maybe less than that. Because if a guy like Chris Webber isn't a Hall of Famer than is Pistol Pete one, or Kevin McHale?

Well basketball also count college and Pete is one of the greatest college players of all-time. Chris Webber being borderline in anyone's mind though is baffling to me. In this generation he would have been an MVP winner

1993–94 Golden State 76 76 32.1 .552 .000 .532 9.1 3.6 1.2 2.2 17.5
1994–95 Washington 54 52 38.3 .495 .276 .502 9.6 4.7 1.5 1.6 20.1
1995–96 Washington 15 15 37.2 .543 .441 .594 7.9 5.0 1.8 .6 23.7
1996–97 Washington 72 72 39.0 .518 .397 .565 10.3 4.6 1.7 1.9 20.1
1997–98 Washington 71 71 39.6 .482 .317 .589 9.8 3.8 1.6 1.7 21.9
1998–99 Sacramento 42 42 40.9 .486 .118 .454 13.0* 4.1 1.4 2.1 20.0
1999–00 Sacramento 75 75 38.4 .483 .284 .751 10.5 4.6 1.6 1.7 24.5
2000–01 Sacramento 70 70 40.5 .481 .071 .703 11.1 4.2 1.3 1.7 27.1
2001–02 Sacramento 54 54 38.4 .495 .263 .749 10.1 4.8 1.7 1.4 24.5
2002–03 Sacramento 67 67 39.1 .461 .238 .607 10.5 5.4 1.6 1.3 23.0
2003–04 Sacramento 23 23 36.1 .413 .200 .711 8.7 4.6 1.3 .9 18.7
2004–05 Sacramento 46 46 36.3 .449 .379 .799 9.7 5.5 1.5 .7 21.3
2004–05 Philadelphia 21 21 33.4 .391 .267 .776 7.9 3.1 1.2 .9 15.6
2005–06 Philadelphia 75 75 38.6 .434 .273 .756 10.0 3.4 1.4 .8 20.2
2006–07 Philadelphia 18 18 30.2 .387 .400 .643 8.3 3.4 1.0 .8 11.0
2006–07 Detroit 43 42 29.7 .489 .333 .636 6.7 3.0 1.0 .6 11.3

2015–16 Denver 80 55 21.7 .512 .333 .811 7.0 2.4 1.0 .6 10.0
2016–17 Denver 73 59 27.9 .577 .324 .825 9.8 4.9 .8 .8 16.7
2017–18 Denver 75 73 32.6 .500 .396 .850 10.7 6.1 1.2 .8 18.5
2018–19 Denver 80 80 31.3 .511 .307 .821 10.8 7.3 1.4 .7 20.1
2019–20 Denver 73 73* 32.0 .528 .314 .817 9.7 7.0 1.2 .6 19.9
2020–21 Denver 72* 72* 34.6 .566 .388 .868 10.8 8.3 1.3 .7 26.4
2021–22 Denver 74 74 33.5 .583 .337 .810 13.8 7.9 1.5 .9 27.1
2022–23† Denver 69 69 33.7 .632 .383 .822 11.8 9.8 1.3 .7 24.5
2023–24 Denver 79 79 34.6 .583 .359 .817 12.4 9.0 1.4 .9 26.4

[L.Kizzle]

Well basketball also count college and Pete is one of the greatest college players of all-time. Chris Webber being borderline in anyone's mind though is baffling to me. In this generation he would have been an MVP winner

1993–94 Golden State 76 76 32.1 .552 .000 .532 9.1 3.6 1.2 2.2 17.5
1994–95 Washington 54 52 38.3 .495 .276 .502 9.6 4.7 1.5 1.6 20.1
1995–96 Washington 15 15 37.2 .543 .441 .594 7.9 5.0 1.8 .6 23.7
1996–97 Washington 72 72 39.0 .518 .397 .565 10.3 4.6 1.7 1.9 20.1
1997–98 Washington 71 71 39.6 .482 .317 .589 9.8 3.8 1.6 1.7 21.9
1998–99 Sacramento 42 42 40.9 .486 .118 .454 13.0* 4.1 1.4 2.1 20.0
1999–00 Sacramento 75 75 38.4 .483 .284 .751 10.5 4.6 1.6 1.7 24.5
2000–01 Sacramento 70 70 40.5 .481 .071 .703 11.1 4.2 1.3 1.7 27.1
2001–02 Sacramento 54 54 38.4 .495 .263 .749 10.1 4.8 1.7 1.4 24.5
2002–03 Sacramento 67 67 39.1 .461 .238 .607 10.5 5.4 1.6 1.3 23.0
2003–04 Sacramento 23 23 36.1 .413 .200 .711 8.7 4.6 1.3 .9 18.7
2004–05 Sacramento 46 46 36.3 .449 .379 .799 9.7 5.5 1.5 .7 21.3
2004–05 Philadelphia 21 21 33.4 .391 .267 .776 7.9 3.1 1.2 .9 15.6
2005–06 Philadelphia 75 75 38.6 .434 .273 .756 10.0 3.4 1.4 .8 20.2
2006–07 Philadelphia 18 18 30.2 .387 .400 .643 8.3 3.4 1.0 .8 11.0
2006–07 Detroit 43 42 29.7 .489 .333 .636 6.7 3.0 1.0 .6 11.3

2015–16 Denver 80 55 21.7 .512 .333 .811 7.0 2.4 1.0 .6 10.0
2016–17 Denver 73 59 27.9 .577 .324 .825 9.8 4.9 .8 .8 16.7
2017–18 Denver 75 73 32.6 .500 .396 .850 10.7 6.1 1.2 .8 18.5
2018–19 Denver 80 80 31.3 .511 .307 .821 10.8 7.3 1.4 .7 20.1
2019–20 Denver 73 73* 32.0 .528 .314 .817 9.7 7.0 1.2 .6 19.9
2020–21 Denver 72* 72* 34.6 .566 .388 .868 10.8 8.3 1.3 .7 26.4
2021–22 Denver 74 74 33.5 .583 .337 .810 13.8 7.9 1.5 .9 27.1
2022–23† Denver 69 69 33.7 .632 .383 .822 11.8 9.8 1.3 .7 24.5
2023–24 Denver 79 79 34.6 .583 .359 .817 12.4 9.0 1.4 .9 26.4
I said Pistol Pete on purpose because has a storied Collegiate career as well and was a better pro than Maravich.

[iamgine]

It Mitch Richmond and Webber aren't Hall of Fame players, then the Hall would literally have like 80 players in it. Maybe less than that. Because if a guy like Chris Webber isn't a Hall of Famer than is Pistol Pete one, or Kevin McHale?

The HOF is watered down in the eyes of some because the voters have no standard about the level of player.

Got a great college resume? You might get in. Get a gold medal? You might get in. Got a great international resume? You might get in. Got a few titles as role player? You might get in. I wouldn't be surprised if they induct Rafer Alston.

Not saying it's wrong, it just means being in the HOF doesn't mean you're a top level player.

[L.Kizzle]

The HOF is watered down in the eyes of some because the voters have no standard about the level of player.

Got a great college resume? You might get in. Get a gold medal? You might get in. Got a great international resume? You might get in. Got a few titles as role player? You might get in. I wouldn't be surprised if they induct Rafer Alston.

Not saying it's wrong, it just means being in the HOF doesn't mean you're a top level player.
I will say there are a lot of great college players who had so-so NBA career that are not in. Someone like a Sidney Wicks dominated college and wasn't a slouch in the NBA. Led UCLA to some crazy record post Kareem and pre Walton. He's probably never even been nominated.

[iamgine]

I will say there are a lot of great college players who had so-so NBA career that are not in. Someone like a Sidney Wicks dominated college and wasn't a slouch in the NBA. Led UCLA to some crazy record post Kareem and pre Walton. He's probably never even been nominated.

No one doubt that.

[John8204]

The HOF is watered down in the eyes of some because the voters have no standard about the level of player.

Got a great college resume? You might get in. Get a gold medal? You might get in. Got a great international resume? You might get in. Got a few titles as role player? You might get in. I wouldn't be surprised if they induct Rafer Alston.

Not saying it's wrong, it just means being in the HOF doesn't mean you're a top level player.

Would you rather it be like Baseball where the standards are so wild and out there that half the inductees are coaches, owners, umps, and media.

[iamgine]

Would you rather it be like Baseball where the standards are so wild and out there that half the inductees are coaches, owners, umps, and media.
I don't have preference tbh. I'm just explaining why people say "anyone" can make it.

[nayte]

Nowoco had a point with the Micheal Cooper thing.there needs to be some limit

[L.Kizzle]

Nowoco had a point with the Micheal Cooper thing.there needs to be some limit
If other players similar to Mike Cooper get in, that will be a problem. Let's hope the committee takes a close look at his induction. Because then you will have Tony Allen and Tyson Chandler looking to get in, yet you have peers from Coopers era with multiple All-Star and All-NBA appearances not in. Marques Johnson, Rolando Blackman, Bill Laimbeer, etc.

[RRR3]

How the hell is Marques Johnson not in

[L.Kizzle]

How the hell is Marques Johnson not in

I know he had a drug problem, not sure if that's they reason. Five time All-Star and some All-NBA Teams including a 1st team when the forwards were Bird, Erving, King, Dantley and English as competition.

[John8204]

How the hell is Marques Johnson not in

https://www.notinhalloffame.com/basketball?start=0

This page has six guys ranked ahead of him...

[L.Kizzle]

https://www.notinhalloffame.com/basketball?start=0

This page has six guys ranked ahead of him...

Larry Foust should probably be in. He's the only 8x All-Star not in. Was probably the 2nd best center in the league for a while behind Mikan before Neil Johnston came along. Was the 1st or 2nd beat player on two NBA Finalists teams the Pistons.

I don't think he had a better career than Kemp.

Not sure about Max. Even he was before Larry Foust.

Buck Williams, no

Gus Johnson, no. Although he was the most underrated guard of his era.

Kevin Johnson, debatable.

[ralph_i_el]

I was surprised that Tim Hardaway Sr. was in the hall.

[L.Kizzle]

I was surprised that Tim Hardaway Sr. was in the hall.
Why? Don't think he's worthy? Didn't do enough. The Run-TMC Warriors are all in the Hall.

[ralph_i_el]

Why? Don't think he's worthy? Didn't do enough. The Run-TMC Warriors are all in the Hall.

I think he is, but if he's in, I don't see an argument for why Kevin Love or Klay aren't locks.

[L.Kizzle]

I think he is, but if he's in, I don't see an argument for why Kevin Love or Klay aren't locks.

Well he dir wait like 20 years to get in. I'm sure Love and Klay make it.

[Charlie Sheen]

I feel like the Basketball Hall of Fame looks for a reason to include you...while the Baseball Hall of Fame looks for a reason to exclude you. Personally I prefer the Basketball Hall of Fame because I know what a Hall of Famer looks like...baseball Hall of Fame..Todd Helton is a hall of famer but Don Mattingly isn't?

https://www.notinhalloffame.com/

Could not agree more with this! Hall of fame is a balance between the voters and the players. It works better when that balance of power lies with too many people getting in than voters keeping people out.

[BarberSchool]

Anyone saying dumb sh!t like that, should at the absolute least be blasted in the face with a super soaker, and told “NIGGA THEN WHY ISN’T YOUR SORRY ASS IN THE HALL OF FAME????” In front of their significant other and both parents.