What is the best defensive comparison for Cooper Flagg?

[Im Still Ballin]

Who do you think is the best defensive comparison for Cooper? Here's a rough list of the most impactful defensive wings of the 21st century (ranked by career age-adjusted defensive RAPM:)

- Paul George
- Luc Mbah a Moute
- Andre Roberson
- Metta World Peace (Ron Artest)
- Andre Iguodala
- Bruce Bowen
- Jonathan Isaac
- Thabo Sefalosha
- Michael Kidd-Gilchrist
- Justise Winslow
- Robert Covington
- Shane Battier
- LeBron James
- Luol Deng
- Herbert Jones
- Jayson Tatum
- Kawhi Leonard
- Shawn Marion
- Jimmy Butler
- Gerald Wallace
- OG Anunoby
- Gerald Wallace
- Josh Smith
- Andrei Kirilenko
- Danny Green
- Trevor Ariza
- Mikal Bridges
- Otto Porter Jr.
- Aaron Gordon
- P.J. Tucker
- Tayshaun Prince

Some 20th-century names might include Scottie Pippen and Bobby Jones.

Shot-blocking is a big part of Cooper's defensive game. Going by blocks per game/per possession and BLK%, Kirilenko, Josh Smith, Jonathan Isaac, and Shawn Marion stand out among those names. Robert Covington and Gerald Wallace blocked a lot of shots at times. Shane Battier was a solid shot-blocker, especially at Duke.

Kirilenko has the greatest shot-blocking peak: 7.03 BLK% in 2005-06. He's probably the greatest shot-blocker who played lots of minutes at SF. The top 250 all-time BLK% seasons are full of Cs, PFs, C/PFs, and PF/Cs. 5 of them belong to Kirilenko, 4 to Josh Smith, and 1 to Bo Outlaw.

These are Cooper's measurements according to this new J Kyle Mann video:


- 6'8.25" height in shoes (6'7" barefoot?)
- 206 pounds
- 6'11.75" wingspan
- 8'10" standing reach
- 8.6" hand length
- 9.6" hand width

That's... a little underwhelming if these numbers are true. He looks longer than that to me, but that could just be his flexibility, quick leaping, and overall fluidity of movement. I was hoping he'd be closer to Kirilenko (6'9", 7'4") and Ingram (6'8", 7'3", 9'1.5") in anthropometry.

He's more in line with Andre Iguodala (6'5.75", 6'11", 8'9.5"), Shane Battier (6'8.25", 6'10.5", 8'9"), Robert Covington (6'6.25", 7'1.75", 8'10"), Jayson Tatum (6'8", 6'11", 8'10.5"), Paul George (6'7.75", 6'11.25", 8'11"), and Josh Smith (6'7", 7'0", 8'10.5").

Going to take the numbers with a grain of salt for now. But even if accurate, it's enough size to work with. Small differences in measurements aren't what makes or breaks a prospect. Sometimes I and perhaps others can be a little pedantic concerning measurements. Game footage reigns supreme.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SKMtlv3DjfE

[Im Still Ballin]

You wonder how good a wing whose defense is more impactful than his offense can be.

According to age curve-adjusted career RAPM, Paul George is the highest-ranked two-way wing whose defense is more impactful than his offense: +6.5 per 100 [+2.8 offense; +3.7 defense]. Luol Deng is the next, followed by Metta World Peace and Shane Battier.

Kevin Garnett (+9.5 per 100 [+3.1 offense; +6.4 defense), Draymond Green (+6.8 per 100 [+1.5 offense; +5.3 defense]), and Rasheed Wallace (+5.7 per 100 [+1.6 offense; +4.1 defense]) are the highest-impact non-centers that fit this qualifier.


28-year (97-24) lifetime age curve-adjusted RAPM for players with a 2.5-4.0 career average position:

LeBron James: +10.1 [+7.3 off; +2.8 def]
Kawhi Leonard: +7.1 [+4.8 off; +2.3 def]
Jayson Tatum: +6.9 [+4.4 off; +2.5 def]
Draymond Green: +6.8 [+1.5 off; +5.3 def]
Paul George: +6.5 [+2.8 off; +3.7 def]
Giannis Antetokounmpo: +6.4 [+3.4 off; +3.0 def]
Detlef Schrempf: +6.4 [+5.1 off; +1.3 def]
Kevin Durant: +6.1 [+5.2 off; +0.9 def]
Paul Pierce: +6.1 [+4.0 off; +2.1 def]
Franz Wagner: +5.5 [+3.1 off; +2.4 def]
Vince Carter: +5.1 [+3.9 off; +1.2 def]
Jimmy Butler: +5.0 [+3.0 off; +2.0 def]
Charles Barkley: +4.6 [+5.6 off; -1.0 def]
Luol Deng: +4.3 [+1.6 off; +2.7 def]
Toni Kukoc: +4.3 [+3.0 off; +1.3 def]
Paul Millsap: +4.2 [+2.3 off; +1.9 def]
Lamar Odom: +4.0 [+1.1 off; +2.9 def]
Metta World Peace: +3.9 [+0.6 off; +3.3 def]
Shane Battier: +3.9 [+1.1 off; +2.8 def]
Andrei Kirilenko: +3.8 [+2.1 off; +1.7 def]
Otto Porter Jr: +3.7 [+2.5 off; +1.2 def]
Bo Outlaw: +3.7 [-0.7 off; +4.4 def]
Rashard Lewis: +3.7 [+3.0 off; +0.7 def]
Andre Iguodala: +3.7 [+0.4 off; +3.3 def]
Scottie Pippen: +3.5 [+2.8 off; +0.7 def]
Khris Middleton: +3.4 [+2.8 off; +0.6 def]
Tracy McGrady: +3.4 [+3.7 off; -0.3 def]
Josh Howard: +3.3 [+1.7 off; +1.6 def]
Herbert Jones: +3.3 [+0.6; +2.7 def]
Michael Kidd-Gilchrist: +3.1 [+0.2 off; +2.9 def]
Shawn Marion: +3.0 [+1.0 off; +2.0 def]
Robert Horry: +3.0 [-0.4 off; +3.6 def]
Jonathan Isaac: +2.9 [-0.2 off; +3.1 def]
Aaron Gordon: +2.9 [+1.8 off; +1.1 def]
Robert Covington: +2.9 [+0.1 off; +2.8 def]
Danny Green: +2.9 [+1.5 off; +1.4 def]
Dan Majerle: +2.9 [+1.5 off; +1.4 def]
Danilo Gallinari: +2.7 [+2.7 off; +0.0 def]
Peja Stojakovic: +2.7 [+3.3 off; -0.7 def]
Tyrone Corbin: +2.6 [+1.1 off; +1.5 def]
Hedo Turkoglu: +2.5 [+1.6 off; +0.9 def]
Tari Eason: +2.4 [+0.5 off; +1.9 def]
DeMarre Carroll: +2.4 [+1.0 off; +1.4 def]
Jerome Kersey: +2.4 [-0.7 off; +3.1 def]
Gerald Wallace: +2.4 [+0.5 off; +1.9 def]
Mikal Bridges: +2.4 [+1.1 off; +1.3 def]
Joe Ingles: +2.3 [+1.4 off; +0.9 def]
Grant Hill: +2.3 [+2.5 off; -0.2 def]
Andre Roberson: +2.2 [-1.1 off; +3.3 def]
Javonte Green: +2.2 [+1.4 off; +0.8 def]
Brian Cardinal: +2.2 [+1.1 off; +1.1 def]
Chris Mullin: +2.2 [+1.9 off; +0.3 def]
Gordon Hayward: +2.1 [+2.2 off; -0.1 def]
Kenrich Williams: +2.0 [+0.5 off; +1.5 def]
OG Anunoby: +2.0 [+0.1 off; +1.9 def]
Dillon Brooks: +2.0 [+0.1 off; +1.9 def]
Thaddeus Young: +1.9 [+1.0 off; +0.9 def]
Luc Mbah a Moute: +1.8 [-1.8 off; +3.6 def]
Royce O'Neale: +1.8 [+0.3 off; +1.5 def]
Thabo Sefalosha: +1.8 [-1.3 off; +3.1 def]
Jared Dudley: +1.8 [+0.2 off; +1.6 def]
Mike Dunleavy: +1.7 [+0.7 off; +1.0 def]
Anthony Edwards: +1.7 [+1.7 off; +0.0 def]
Mario Elie: +1.6 [+0.5 off; +1.1 def]
Lugentz Dort: +1.6 [+0.7 off; +0.9 def]
Bruce Bowen: +1.6 [-1.6 off; +3.2 def]
Chris Boucher: +1.5 [+1.2 off; +0.3 def]
Obi Toppin: +1.5 [+2.4 off; -0.9 def]
Kyle Korver: +1.5 [+1.0 off; +0.5 def]
P.J. Tucker: +1.4 [+0.3 off; +1.1 def]
Dorian Finney-Smith: +1.3 [+0.6 off; +0.7 def]
Paolo Banchero: +1.3 [+2.5 off; -1.2 def]
Ronnie Brewer: +1.3 [-0.4 off; +1.7 def]
Jae Crowder: +1.3 [+0.6 off; +0.7 def]
Matt Barnes: +1.2 [+1.4 off; -0.2 def]
Joe Johnson: +1.2 {+2.1 off; -0.9 def]
Duncan Robinson: +1.2 [+1.8 off; -0.6 def]
Jamario Moon: +1.2 [+0.4 off; +0.8 def]
Jerome Williams: +1.1 [+0.1 off; +1.0 def]
Ryan Bowen: +1.1 [-1.9 off; +3.0 def]
Keegan Murray: +1.1 [+2.1 off; -1.0 def]
Sam Hauser: +1.1 [-0.1 off; +1.2 def]
Justise Winslow: +1.1 [-1.8 off; +2.9 def]
Boris Diaw: +1.1 [-0.2 off; +1.3 def]
Michael Porter Jr.: +1.1 [+1.8 off; -0.7 def]
Bogdan Bogdanovic: +1.1 [+1.6 off; -0.5 def]
Danny Granger: +1.1 [+1.1 off; +0.0 def]
Darius Miles: +1.1 [-0.3 off; +1.4 def]
Jalen Williams: +1.1 [+0.7 off; +0.4 def]
Matt Bullard: +1.1 [+2.9 off; -1.8 def]
Antawn Jamison: +1.0 [+3.0 off; -2.0 def]
Ime Udoka: +1.0 [-1.0 off; +2.0 def]
Anthony Tolliver: +1.0 [+0.4 off; +0.6 def]
Brandon Ingram: +1.0 [+1.8 off; -0.8 def]
Danny Ferry: +1.0 [+0.4 off; +0.6 def]
Popeye Jones: +0.9 [+1.0 off; -0.1 def]
Josh Hart: +0.9 [+1.0 off; -0.1 def]
Isaac Bonga: +0.9 [-2.1 off; +3.0 def]
Chris Copeland: +0.9 [+2.6 off; -1.7 def]
Al-Farouq Aminu: +0.8 [-0.9 off; +1.7 def]
Quintin Richardson: +0.8 [+0.3 off; +0.5 def]
Carmelo Anthony: +0.8 [+2.7 off; -1.9 def]
Tayshaun Prince: +0.8 [-0.3 off; +1.1 def]
Rudy Gay: +0.7 [+0.2 off; +0.5 def]
Josh Smith: +0.7 [-1.1 off; +1.8 def]
Chris Mills: +0.7 [-1.4 off; +2.1 def]
Walt Williams: +0.7 [+0.2 off; +0.5 def]
Eduardo Najera: +0.6 [-0.7 off; +1.3 def]
Jamal Mashburn: +0.6 [-0.3 off; +0.9 def]
Vladimir Radmanovic: +0.6 [+0.2 off; +0.4 def]
Chandler Parsons: +0.6 [+0.8 off; -0.2 def]
Jaylen Brown: +0.5 [+0.0 off; +0.5 def]
Byron Russell: +0.5 [-0.6 off; +1.1 def]
Stephen Jackson: +0.5 [+0.6 off; -0.1 def]
Trevor Ariza: +0.5 [-0.9 off; +1.4 def]
Nicolas Batum: +0.4 [+1.6 off; -1.2 def]
DeMar DeRozan: +0.4 [+1.7 off; -1.3 def]
Keith Askins: +0.3 [-1.2 off; +1.5 def]
James Posey: +0.3 [-1.0 off; +1.3 def]
Scott Burrell: +0.3 [-1.9 off; +2.2 def]
Clifford Robinson: +0.3 [+0.2 off; +0.1 def]
Landry Fields: +0.3 [-0.6 off; +0.9 def]
Dale Ellis: +0.3 [+2.4 off; -2.1 def]
Max Strus: +0.2 [+0.2 off; +0.0 def]
Larry Johnson: +0.2 [-1.2 off; +1.4 def]
Luke Walton: +0.2 [-0.5 off; +0.7 def]
Chase Budinger: +0.2 [+0.6 off; -0.4 def]
Kyle Anderson: +0.2 [-1.7 off; +1.9 def]
Scott Padgett: +0.1 [-1.3 off; +1.4 def]
Deni Avdija: +0.1 [-0.3 off; +0.4 def]
Chris Johnson: +0.1 [-0.5 off; +0.6 def]
Furkan Korkmaz: +0.1 [+0.1 off; +0.0 def]
James Jones: +0.1 [+0.3 off; -0.2 def]

[90sgoat]

Ron Artest caught my eye here.

I think Cooper has a unique and rare body type, where he is tall, but not lanky, strong, with wide shoulders and long arms, but still a solid core.

Which reminds me of Ron Artest who was also deceptively long and strong.

[ralph_i_el]

From what I've seen, he's ridiculously good at preventing guys from getting advantage off the ball, and he's an elite timing/angles/athleticism help defender. He's excellent 1-on-1, but his biggest impact is as a team defender. Johnathan Isaac is a good comparison, even though he's got a bit less length.

[DJMcDonald]

He will have a Gerald Wallace type career

[Carbine]

He's not going to be any better of a defender than Banchero.

[Manny98]

He will have a Gerald Wallace type career

He's not going to be any better of a defender than Banchero.



:facepalm

[DJMcDonald]

:facepalm

Gerald Wallace was a good player.


https://youtu.be/6CMwV9BkBs0?si=auE-AQKj5hBTdSXA

[Im Still Ballin]

Gerald Wallace had a seven-year stretch averaging 16.4 ppg, 7.5 rpg, 2.4 apg, 1.8 spg, 1.1 bpg, 2.3 topg on 50.4% eFG, 56.2% TS (104.1 TS+). Put up 2.5 steals and 2.1 blocks over 55 games in 2005-06! 3.7 STL% and 4.7 BLK%. He was a pretty nice player.

You'd hope for a projected number one pick Cooper could be more though, particularly on offense.

[Neal Romer]

Body type wise, with those high squared shoulders and help-side explosiveness, Id say he reminds me of Shawn Marion most.

[Im Still Ballin]

Things appear to be going well. He won the Duke beep test:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8GvDgE_Hk8U

[Im Still Ballin]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sk9e3CUN76g&pp=ygUUY29vcGVyIGZsYWdnIGRlZmVuc2U%3D

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xFDr202Zy0E

[Im Still Ballin]

Josh Smith was a nice defender.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AyIu19uPXJo

[ralph_i_el]

He will have a Gerald Wallace type career

Gerald Wallace with a notch better offense and no career-impacting injuries is a HoF player imo.

[Im Still Ballin]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LZeZFu7D9C0

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=imFyMj4wxqo

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7iC2m75Xbo8

[Im Still Ballin]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OMdWfyy0-FA

[ralph_i_el]

From what I've heard, Smith was a very high IQ player to go along with the athleticism, but didn't necessarily take the training/prep as seriously as he might have. A polished/locked in Josh Smith might not be a disappointing outcome for Flagg. Flagg is already a better FT shooter than Smith ever became, so that bodes well for him being at least respected as a shooter in the league.

[Im Still Ballin]

From what I've heard, Smith was a very high IQ player to go along with the athleticism, but didn't necessarily take the training/prep as seriously as he might have. A polished/locked in Josh Smith might not be a disappointing outcome for Flagg. Flagg is already a better FT shooter than Smith ever became, so that bodes well for him being at least respected as a shooter in the league.

There was an article about Cooper that dropped the other day. It included some shooting numbers for Cooper:

https://www.noceilingsnba.com/p/new-man-on-campus-cooper-flagg


Where the questions start to arise with Flagg are on the offensive end. To be clear, most of these are just questions—typical nitpicks that come with being a top prospect. I wouldn’t classify any of these as concerns; they’re just things I’m curious about how they’ll develop going forward.

The biggest question that most people will have about Flagg’s offense is his shot. The biggest “issue” is that it just kind of looks funky. There are surely some mechanical tweaks that Flagg can/should make, there always are, but he’s gotten incrementally better as a shooter every year. While his mechanics may not be aesthetically pleasing, they are consistent, and the numbers have been solid.

Last year at Montverde, Flagg took 56.9% of his jumpers (74 attempts) from three. On these attempts, he shot 39.2%, ranked in the 78th percentile in PPP, shot 37.7% off the catch, and shot 42.9% off the dribble. Flagg also shot 39.3% on all two-point attempts, 43.2% from inside 17 feet, and 31.6% on long two-point attempts. Nearly all of these numbers are up from last year, combined with his 79.6% free throw percentage and quality floater (45% and 72nd percentile in PPP), suggesting that at worst, Flagg should be an average shooter.

...

The other area of question with Flagg’s offense is his ability to be a consistent on-ball creator. This last year at Montverde, only 11.6% of his possessions came in isolation and as the pick-and-roll ball handler. Flagg did rank in the 96th and 89th percentile respectively, but the volume on those play types is very low. Flagg doesn’t have an overly dynamic handle, but it is tight, and he doesn’t really struggle to get to his spots. He’s patient, rarely forces it, and his high release allows him to consistently get off tough looks.

...

If you’re hoping for Flagg to turn into a shifty, dynamic on-ball creator, you’ll probably be disappointed. Instead, Flagg profiles as someone who will score within the flow of the offense, make the right decision, get his shot in a pinch when needed, and operate more as a secondary creator. With Montverde, Flagg was mostly used as an incredibly efficient play finisher and connector as he ranked in the 81st percentile in transition scoring, 73rd percentile spotting up, 91st percentile on offensive rebounds, and 83rd percentile on cuts. Those were his four most common play types that accounted for 65.9% of his possessions.

With Maine United, though, Flagg was on-ball much more as 22.2% of his possessions came in isolation and pick-and-roll (compared to 11.6% with Montverde), and he ranked in the 69th and 83rd percentiles, respectively. Flagg has the capacity to occasionally be that on-ball creator; he’s just more effective doing it as the secondary or tertiary option.

What’s really fun about Flagg’s offensive versatility, though, is how consistently he combines his on and off-ball skills within the same possession. Here, Flagg does a great job of attacking the close out and collapsing the defense. After he draws two help defenders, he makes the right read and kicks out to his teammate. As the ball swings, Flagg does a great job of establishing position on the block, which allows him to secure the offensive rebound. Without hesitation, he knocks down the midrange fade away.

...

We got a glimpse of it in that clip, but one of the most underrated aspects of Flagg’s game is his passing. With Montverde, Flagg ranked in the 94th percentile in PPP with assists included, averaged just over four assists per game, had a turnover rate of just 11.1%, and had an assist-to-turnover ratio of 2.53. When it comes to decision-making, connective passing, and floor awareness, there aren’t many players in this class who are as impressive as Flagg, especially at his position.

It isn’t always overtly flashy, but Flagg’s playmaking doesn’t need to be. As long as his decision-making and passing accuracy continue to look like they have, teammates will adore playing with him. Here, Flagg is set up in the opposite corner and runs a Chicago action (pin down screen into a dribble handoff). As he receives the handoff, Flagg uses a hang dribble to get the help defender to switch while also staring down Derik Queen on the role, which causes both his defender and the weak side defender to collapse to Queen. Flagg takes what the defense gives him, kicks back to Asa Newell, and sets up the wide-open three.

Promising shooting percentages.

[Manny98]

Gerald Wallace was a good player.


https://youtu.be/6CMwV9BkBs0?si=auE-AQKj5hBTdSXA

He's a good player but Cooper is a generational talent

[Manny98]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sk9e3CUN76g&pp=ygUUY29vcGVyIGZsYWdnIGRlZmVuc2U%3D

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xFDr202Zy0E

Can guard 1-5 at an elite level :bowdown:

Haven't seen this level of defensive versatility since Miami LeBron days

[DJMcDonald]

He's a good player but Cooper is a generational talent

He must not be that good. A nice rule of thumb is that whatever you say will be wrong given your piss poor basketball knowledge.

[Manny98]

He must not be that good. A nice rule of thumb is that whatever you say will be wrong given your piss poor basketball knowledge.
That's why I have made over £5000 this past season on NBA picks :oldlol:

[Im Still Ballin]

I'm trying to find a source for the Cooper measurements from the J Kyle Mann video. I don't buy those numbers. I've been comparing him to footage of Aaron Gordon and Paul George in HS/college and Cooper just looks way wider and longer in the arms. Both AG and PG had smaller-sized hands too so it's nothing to do with hand length.

The only thing I can think of is that maybe Cooper is shorter than we think. But he looked relatively close to Tatum (6'8" barefoot) in height when standing next to him.

My money is still on a 7'1" to 7'2"-ish wingspan. 7'3" is probably a stretch. Kevon Looney numbers would be the absolute dream: 6'8" barefoot, 7'3.5" wingspan, 9'2" standing reach. I don't think he's that but you never know...

[Neal Romer]

In these high school videos the advantage he has is he's usually the tallest guy out there without trading off any athleticism.

He's gonna be a good NBA athlete but he's not gonna have a height advantage over everyone on the court. So

I still see Franz Wagner. Good combo of size, power, speed, motor, and decent all around skills (except shooting for Wagner) that does a little bit of everything.

If Flagg is Wagner with a solid three point shot, thats a very good player. All Star caliber. But not like... GOAT.

I know OP's question is about defensive impact but I think thats a little harder to predict. Plus in today's game hes mostly gonna be chasing guys around the perimeter. He's not gonna be guarding Luis Scola or LaMarcus Aldridge playing 14 feet from the basket. Hes gonna be guarding PJ Washington and Karl Anthony Town playing 23 feet from the basket. So hesnot gonna have as many chances to block helpside like a Josh Smith or an AK47 did in their day. Or so I would assume.

[Im Still Ballin]

In these high school videos the advantage he has is he's usually the tallest guy out there without trading off any athleticism.

He's gonna be a good NBA athlete but he's not gonna have a height advantage over everyone on the court. So

I still see Franz Wagner. Good combo of size, power, speed, motor, and decent all around skills (except shooting for Wagner) that does a little bit of everything.

If Flagg is Wagner with a solid three point shot, thats a very good player. All Star caliber. But not like... GOAT.

I agree with the overall sentiment. Have to temper expectations and be realistic. I think his defense, diverse skill set in transition and the half-court setting, and general basketball IQ, feel, and intangibles give him a relatively safe "floor." I think his bust potential is less than others, which is nice.


I know OP's question is about defensive impact but I think thats a little harder to predict. Plus in today's game hes mostly gonna be chasing guys around the perimeter. He's not gonna be guarding Luis Scola or LaMarcus Aldridge playing 14 feet from the basket. Hes gonna be guarding PJ Washington and Karl Anthony Town playing 23 feet from the basket. So hesnot gonna have as many chances to block helpside like a Josh Smith or an AK47 did in their day. Or so I would assume.

Probably true. Hard to say though. Jonathan Isaac and Robert Covington are two comparable wing/combo forwards who have blocked a lot of shots in recent years. Isaac has a career 5.4 BLK% with 7.2% (34 games) and 7.1% (58 games) seasons. Covington with a 5.7 BLK% (22 games) in Houston and a 4.0 BLK% (74 games) with LAC.

Then there's Jaren Jackson Jr. (6'9.75", 7'5.25", 9'2") and Anthony Davis (6'9.25", 7'5.5", 9'0"). Cooper may be close enough in measurements that, when combined with his AD-like athleticism, he plays a similar defensive role. Big-time shot-blockers that can play both forward positions are rare in any era.

Raw bpg might be less but BLK% might be comparable. BLK% only accounts for two-point FGAs I believe.

[Neal Romer]

I agree with the overall sentiment. Have to temper expectations and be realistic. I think his defense, diverse skill set in transition and the half-court setting, and general basketball IQ, feel, and intangibles give him a relatively safe "floor." I think his bust potential is less than others, which is nice.



Probably true. Hard to say though. Jonathan Isaac and Robert Covington are two comparable wing/combo forwards who have blocked a lot of shots in recent years. Isaac has a career 5.4 BLK% with 7.2% (34 games) and 7.1% (58 games) seasons. Covington with a 5.7 BLK% (22 games) in Houston and a 4.0 BLK% (74 games) with LAC.

Then there's Jaren Jackson Jr. (6'9.75", 7'5.25", 9'2") and Anthony Davis (6'9.25", 7'5.5", 9'0"). Cooper may be close enough in measurements that, when combined with his AD-like athleticism, he plays a similar defensive role. Big-time shot-blockers that can play both forward positions are rare in any era.

Raw bpg might be less but BLK% might be comparable. BLK% only accounts for two-point FGAs I believe.


Yeah but I dont think he's as tall/long as those guys. Isaac, AD, JJJ usually play the anchor defensively, even if they dont get listed as centers dont they? Flagg's standing reach (if listed accurately) is equal to Bron's. I dont *think* he's gonna play the 5 altho I could be wrong. And if hes not he'll likely then be guarding Tatum and KD on the perimeter and so on.

I still expect him to be a good NBA defender, hes only what, 17? His prime doesnt even start for six more years. I just think hes more likely get the occasional chasedown block a la Bron than be a conventional fly-swatter in the paint. Altho who knows.

I dont know what the numbers show but I would guess wings dont get as many blocks per possession these days just bc of the three point proliferation

[Im Still Ballin]

Yeah but I dont think he's as tall/long as those guys. Isaac, AD, JJJ usually play the anchor defensively, even if they dont get listed as centers dont they?

Jaren Jackson Jr. has traditionally played as a weak-side shot-blocking PF next to a drop-coverage center. Jonas Valanciunas, Steven Adams, and now Zach Edey. He's played center in smaller lineups and recently due to injuries. His block numbers were way down this season because he wasn't playing as that weak-side roamer.

Jonathan Isaac (6'10.5", 7'1.25", 9'0.5") has more or less occupied the same role for Orlando. He spent most of his minutes playing in lineups alongside Mo Wagner, Joe Ingles, and Franz Wagner. [13% SF - 87% PF] this past season according to Basketball Reference.

I guess it's semantics somewhat. They're the primary shot-blockers on their teams but they do it from the weak-side/top-down next to a traditional big that sits in the paint deterring shots. This is how Anthony Davis did it up until 2022-23 when he moved full-time to the center position.


Flagg's standing reach (if listed accurately) is equal to Bron's. I dont *think* he's gonna play the 5 altho I could be wrong. And if hes not he'll likely then be guarding Tatum and KD on the perimeter and so on.

Yeah, I don't see Cooper playing center outside of maybe some rare small-ball lineups. He'll split his minutes at PF and SF in some fashion, favoring one or the other depending on his team's personnel and how he develops.

I think a smart team will let him roam free to cause chaos as a weak-side/top-down help defensive threat. His on-ball defense is great but it's his off-ball defense that's special. Finding a healthy balance between being a lock-down defender and free safety will be key.


I still expect him to be a good NBA defender, hes only what, 17? His prime doesnt even start for six more years. I just think hes more likely get the occasional chasedown block a la Bron than be a conventional fly-swatter in the paint. Altho who knows.

I dont know what the numbers show but I would guess wings dont get as many blocks per possession these days just bc of the three point proliferation

I think it depends on what type of "wing." A wing used to mean swingman (SG/SF or SF/SG) but seems to refer to an SF/PF or PF/SF these days.

A Kirilenko/Josh Smith/Marion type with shot-blocking utility is a unique commodity. That archetype of combo forward leans more toward the PF position, especially in today's NBA. Jonathan Isaac, Robert Covington, and young Anthony Davis are the best contemporary (2010s onward) comparisons, in my opinion. They're just rare and don't come around too often. In any era.

Even if he's only got a LeBron-sized reach and wingspan he's still got all the elements of a great shot-blocker. Josh Smith (6'7", 7'0", 8'10.5") had basically the same measurements as LeBron (6'7.25", 7'0.25", 8'10.25") but blocked nearly three times as many shots.

Career

LeBron: 0.7 bpg in 37.9 mpg; 0.7 bpg per 36; 1.0 bpg per 100 possessions; 1.6 BLK%
Smith: 1.9 bpg in 32.4 mpg; 2.1 bpg per 36; 3.1 bpg per 100 possessions; 4.5 BLK%

Best three-year peak

LeBron 2008-2010: 1.1 bpg in 39.0 mpg; 1.0 bpg per 36; 1.5 bpg per 100 possessions; 2.2 BLK%
Smith 2005-2007: 2.8 bpg in 34.7 mpg; 2.9 bpg per 36; 4.2 bpg per 100 possessions; 6.1 BLK%

The reason why Josh Smith could block so many more shots than LeBron was due to being a superior two-footed jumper. He was far quicker off two feet, whether from a standstill or off movement. And he could get up higher as well. LeBron was a one-footed leaper who needed more of a wind-up to get off the ground. His two-footed jumping was always lacking in comparison.

Marion and Kirilenko were also exceptional jumping off two feet. Cooper fits this mold so I expect him to be a similarly active shot-blocker.

Flagg's defensive role will probably look somewhat similar to these videos:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=asxcqNEBFRk&ab_channel=OrlandoMagicMoments

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wkyXRJKdSo0&ab_channel=AllBall

[DJMcDonald]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=asxcqNEBFRk&ab_channel=OrlandoMagicMoments

This is it

[Im Still Ballin]

This is it

Isaac is a special defensive talent. The only thing holding him back from being a perennial All-D/DPOY contender guy is health/durability. Orlando had a 105.3 DRtg (-10 rDRtg) when he was on the court this season. If Cooper can be something like that but able to play big minutes that's a generational defender right there.

[DJMcDonald]

Isaac is a special defensive talent. The only thing holding him back from being a perennial All-D/DPOY contender guy is health/durability. Orlando had a 105.3 DRtg (-10 rDRtg) when he was on the court this season. If Cooper can be something like that but able to play big minutes that's a generational defender right there.

I don't agree with any of this.

[Im Still Ballin]

You can see the great two-footed jumping here:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HlgHvmtcOss&ab_channel=FIBA-TheBasketballChannel

[Im Still Ballin]

Toronto Tracy McGrady blocked many shots as a 6'7" to 6'8" wing. 1.4 bpg in 24.7 mpg; 2.1 bpg per 36; 3.1 bpg per 100; 4.2 BLK%.

Some good blocks in this highlight video:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p-Jt2KHu9Wo&ab_channel=icesco415

[DJMcDonald]

Toronto Tracy McGrady blocked many shots as a 6'7" to 6'8" wing. 1.4 bpg in 24.7 mpg; 2.1 bpg per 36; 3.1 bpg per 100; 4.2 BLK%.

Some good blocks in this highlight video:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p-Jt2KHu9Wo&ab_channel=icesco415

Some ISH residents told me he was a bad defender though, that Ray Allen was much better.

[Im Still Ballin]

This video includes all of Rookie Anthony Davis' blocks. Lots of great swats on the perimeter, from the weak-side/as the low-man, and top-down/from the nail area. Most similar to Cooper when he's playing PF alongside Robin Lopez.

I really like a wing-sized AD as a defensive comparison. A couple of inches smaller. Very comparable athleticism/mobility.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=49xI0czYWyc