NBA TV Ratings Are Terrible, Are People Just Done With This Era?

[Soundwave]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ygDe5zh9TsU

Have people just given up on this modern brand of jacking up 3s non-stop and minimal defensive play? Because the NBA's ratings are swirling the toilet bottom.

[Phoenix]

I just watched that video 2 days ago funny enough.

To answer your question:

- 3point spamming
- Streaming
- perceived lack of competitiveness/rivalries
- People tired of old stars/new stars haven't taken over yet
- Injuries/load management

All reasons playing a part to greater or lesser degree. Also, it seems like since covid there's just less interest in alot of things than before. Movies for example, I was struggling to think of what blockbuster films came out this summer.

[highwhey]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ygDe5zh9TsU

Have people just given up on this modern brand of jacking up 3s non-stop and minimal defensive play? Because the NBA's ratings are swirling the toilet bottom.

why is zion wearing a lakers hat?

[Neal Romer]

I really dont think the threes has that much to do with it.

People say threes are boring, the league added threes because people thought twos were boring. Nobody wants to watch George Mikan spam this scoop shot every other possession and miss most of them.


https://youtu.be/BC9dBb5ErQ4?si=iJo0HnkKTVJFbhcW

Same with Kareem's skyhook. It's cool to see now because it's a novelty. You really wanna spend an evening watching him take 20 of them?

It's not the threes. The grass is always greener on the other side so you think you want it the other way, but youd eventually get sick of the other way. Peoples interest will just naturally ebb and flow. What is this assumption that the public will be glued to basketball every year? It's not just about the product itself, it's about what else is going on with viewers. What other programs are out there, what the weather is like, what the economy is like, what the cultural trends are.

The NBA does have some shit it should want to clean up REGARDLESS of the ratings. But I dont think a six week period of dismal ratings means the game needs a drastic overhaul. Of course most humans are prisoners of the moment and it's natural to think the sky is falling. But I wouldnt rush to bury the NBA just yet.

[Neal Romer]

I do think the NBA has diluted the value of its product by maintaining 82 games in an era where people just have so many other options and shorter attention spans.

The NFL is thriving because theres only 17 games per team and every one is a huge deal (assuming at least one team is in playoff contention).

The NBA has too many games for anyone to have a sense of urgency. And they all make way more guaranteed money than other athletes so it compounds that lack of urgency.

But the NBA doesnt wanna give up revenue. It wants you to be a sucker and suck its product each and every day. Suck it real good. Suck the NBA so they can get richer and richer and richer. Mmmmm, suck suck suck suck suck.

[sdot_thadon]

Yeah streaming is up near the top of the list for sports in general. That and this being an era where we are swamped with so much content it's impossible to consume even a fraction of it all. Basketball fans still watch basketball just not on the platforms they track viewership. I'm sure there's a few old school fans that are "done" with this era because they don't play like we saw growing up. But honestly that's just called growing out of an interest and it happens to aging men lol.

[Phoenix]

I very rarely catch a full regular game nowadays. I'll either watch the 2nd half or highlights. I really struggle to get through a full game unless I'm really interested in the teams and it's a good game going on. Playoffs is a different matter, but watching right now or in January when everyone is just trying to get to the all-star break? Meh...

[Kblaze8855]

The Comparison to Karine is that even when hooks were fairly common place, he was the only player who played that way. Three-pointers themselves are not inherently uncertain Ing. It’s the fact that it is whatever everyone is doing and in largely the same way. Doesn’t help that these days players will pass up what has always been viewed as exciting which is a dunk or an aggressive finish around the basket to pass out for three. Players are literally running down on the fast break and not taking layups to pass out for breeze. I can show it to you. If there is any hindrance at all, quite a few players won’t even attempt to go to the basket.

The analytics will tell you dunk is still better than a three you almost never miss a dunk Three more than two so the heads of these players, some of them have all common sense.

The nba was a game of matchups and different styles. Now there is basically one style and the winner is just who shoots better that night.

if every single team were trying to shoot 50 iso hooks a game, even when they potentially could go in and make a spectacular play, people would get tired of it.

But Kareem was the only one. Gervin was the only one who would spam finger rolls. You can pull up games and see him shoot 12 of them. Here’s about 9 of them



https://youtu.be/jVPyiARpyOg?si=xkJ5XYe680N4usDg




Stockton and Malone would run the same plays. People were repetitive, but teams all did different things. Watching run tmc play Denver is an entirely different game than the Cavs playing the Bulls.

Now it’s just different ways to get a corner three….or settle for an off the dribble three…and if nobody is in the paint drive…and hope someone collapses for a kickout 3.

The only variety is as a fallback plan. For the most part at least.

it’s the downside of optimization. Once there is one way to play, everybody plays it.

[Neal Romer]

The Comparison to Karine is that even when hooks were fairly common place, he was the only player who played that way. Three-pointers themselves are not inherently uncertain Ing. It’s the fact that it is whatever everyone is doing and in largely the same way. Doesn’t help that these days players will pass up what has always been viewed as exciting which is a dunk or an aggressive finish around the basket to pass out for three. Players are literally running down on the fast break and not taking layups to pass out for breeze. I can show it to you. If there is any hindrance at all, quite a few players won’t even attempt to go to the basket.

The analytics will tell you dunk is still better than a three you almost never miss a dunk Three more than two so the heads of these players, some of them have all common sense.

The nba was a game of matchups and different styles. Now there is basically one style and the winner is just who shoots better that night.

if every single team were trying to shoot 50 iso hooks a game, even when they potentially could go in and make a spectacular play, people would get tired of it.

But Kareem was the only one. Gervin was the only one who would spam finger rolls. You can pull up games and see him shoot 12 of them. Stockton alone would run the same plays. People were repetitive, but teams all did different things. Watching run tmc play Denver is an entirely different game than the Cavs playing the Bulls.

Now it’s just different ways to get a corner three….or settle for an off the dribble three…and if nobody is in the paint drive…and hope someone collapses for a kickout 3.

The only variety is as a fallback plan. For the most part at least


Thats fair. But as I mentioned in another thread recently, teams still do get their shots off in different ways. The Lakers dont use AD the same way the Nuggets use Jokic. And the Kings use Sabonis in a different way than both. Giddey doesnt play point the same as Morant. Giannis and Jimmy Butler dont have the same game.

At the end of the day, does it really make a difference in the brain reward mechanism if half the shots going up from 23 feet go up from 19 feet instead? I dont really buy that the lack of long twos has a serious impact on whether people are engaged. The Celtics offense IS boring but I dont think the Thunder's is. Or the Warriors. Etc.

[Kblaze8855]

Well no two players are the same. Hell no two plays are the same. If I show you five Stockton to Malone pick and rolls they would all look different. But if I show you 110 and then show it to you 82 times a year You would get the feeling you were watching the same thing over and over and lose interest.

There is just very little difference in the general approaches. And fundamentally basketball has always been about get close and put the ball in the basket and now it’s about fake getting close to get the ball far from the basket. Superficially it’s always been a repetitive thing. But all sports are. But within the confines of something that is naturally repetitive, they have beaten even more of the Individuality out.


I made a topic years ago with a bunch of examples of different sets and team play styles and people got the wrong impression thinking I was saying it was a better way to play. You can watch the Mid90s Nuggets move the ball 12 or 15 times in what looks like a box, and a layup. You can watch the Rockets post and repost and repost. You could watch teams that took a stupid number of long twos and occasional threes. They were Princeton offenses. The triangle. Even on defense, there were radically different approaches. The sonics or the Celtics or the Knicks might be going full court press for half the game.

You go win wondering how your team is going to deal with a Pitino team that will full court press like it’s college.

Mike Fratello or Lenny Wilkens might try to make it a 88-82 finish if he can. Don Nelson doesn’t mind if it’s 160 to 150. And if he plays Doug Moe or cotton Fitzimmons they are game.

There were radically different matchups all over the league That would change drastically overtime.

I don’t think basketball is going to change from here. I think teams are going to try to shoot even more threes like the Celtics and we’re going to start seeing games with 60 to 70% threes.


https://i.ibb.co/6D3h61D/IMG-0404.gif

They just don’t give a ****

[Phoenix]

The 3pointer has pretty much killed the need to be the better team in rebounds, assists, turnover rate, all the 'keys to the game' x's and 'o's. A team can be losing the entire game, get hot from 3 in the 4th and eek out a win. Doesn't matter their shit was getting pushed in for 3 quarters.....we've all seen it.

[ArbitraryWater]

I dont really watch many games anymore. Only in the playoffs.

The 3 has killed it.

Mikan finger rolls and Kareem skyhooks are a weird comparison to that.

But what do you mean by NBA TV? Thats a particular channel.

Youre refering to NBA broadcasts as a whole.

[Phoenix]

The NBA has definitely become more homogenized in style and approach to the game. Hell, even outside the NBA when I see videos of players in a random summer game or whatever, I swear everyone has the same looking bag of iso dribble moves and step-backs. Alot of individuality has been lost.

[90sgoat]

I'm definitely done with the NBA regular season. I'm done with tatted primadonnas who don't want to play and who don't care. I'm done with Fat Luka.

The Olympics sealed it for me. It was so much better basketball, superior in every way including presentation. The NBA is a shit product ran by the players.

[L.Kizzle]

I do think the NBA has diluted the value of its product by maintaining 82 games in an era where people just have so many other options and shorter attention spans.

The NFL is thriving because theres only 17 games per team and every one is a huge deal (assuming at least one team is in playoff contention).

The NBA has too many games for anyone to have a sense of urgency. And they all make way more guaranteed money than other athletes so it compounds that lack of urgency.

But the NBA doesnt wanna give up revenue. It wants you to be a sucker and suck its product each and every day. Suck it real good. Suck the NBA so they can get richer and richer and richer. Mmmmm, suck suck suck suck suck.
MLB plays 100+ games every season. Why would the NBA delete games.
It's been 82 games since 1964 I believe when there was like 1p teams. So it's triple teams but we should remove games.

[Phoenix]

MLB plays 100+ games every season. Why would the NBA delete games.
It's been 82 games since 1964 I believe when there was like 1p teams. So it's triple teams but we should remove games.

One could argue there's more options now than in 1964, mind you I don't follow baseball anymore so I couldn't tell you about the quality of their product. The quantity may not be a big issue if the actual product on the floor is good, but the growing opinion is that it isn't.

[Neal Romer]

MLB plays 100+ games every season. Why would the NBA delete games.
It's been 82 games since 1964 I believe when there was like 1p teams. So it's triple teams but we should remove games.


I dunno if MLB's model revolves around TV viewership as much. These mother****ers play games at like 1 pm on weekdays ffs. Also guys dont load manage/skip games as much to my knowledge.

[SouBeachTalents]

I think there's a few key factors for this

1. Load management, don't really have to go into detail on this.

2. The 82 game schedule. With more entertainment options than ever before, plus a generation of kids with an attention span that's used to consuming 15 second videos, people just aren't going to have interest in tuning into games that they know hold virtually no significance. No one wants to watch the first quarter of your hometown team playing the Wizards in November.

3. International players ruling the league. I think it's more difficult for American fans to tune in and care about the league when the majority of the truly elite players are foreign. Jokic/Giannis/Luka will just not carry the same appeal as LeBron/Kobe/Wade or LeBron/Curry/KD.

4. Every team playing the exact same way. Go back 20 years ago, watching a Suns game was a completely different experience than watching a Pistons game. Today every single team plays exactly the same, just spam 3's and layups almost every possession. The lack of a diverse playing style between teams makes watching less interesting.

[Phoenix]

The league has also been pussified and it takes away from the character of the league. MJ, Shaq, Barkley, Reggie, Ewing, Magic, Bird, even someone like Rodman....these guys all had unique personalities and quirks. Everything now seems so sterile by comparison.

[Kblaze8855]

Th Not caring enough to play really did more damage than the style of play for me personally. I’m always watch NBA games even when I didn’t expect to enjoy the style of play. It’s just on in the background. But a lot of that was having the ability to pull up the days games And know what offered potential to be interesting. The low ball movement iso style of the early 2000s Wasn’t as appealing to me as the better ball movement the deeper teens of my childhood could afford to use.


But….


If the Lakers are playing the 76ers, I know barring a legitimate injury. They can’t possibly play through. I’m at least going to see Iverson and go at it. They were competitors and they wanted to play whale against each other. Paul Pierce wanted to get out there and play when McGrady was the opponent. Could potentially be hurt? Sure.

But you never got the impression that somebody like Iverson or Kobe didn’t care if they could perform or not. It wasn’t just killing time to get to the games that mattered. They played like all the games mattered. A lot of these guys? Even the competitors like a Jimmy Butler? He might not play against a big matchup just because he doesn’t give a shit. That’s what Riley was calling him out about. Shaq wanted to play against David Robinson because he wanted to prove a point. Hakeem wanted Ewing. Kevin Garnett wanted to play against Duncan.

You wouldn’t get every matchup because yes people do get hurt. But that caliber of player would never leave you with the impression they could go today in this potentially good game but they’re deciding it doesn’t matter.

Embiid and his type are just the worst thing that happened to the sport. If you’re hurt, you hurt. Do not sacrifice your career earning potential for fans who don’t understand that you can’t see every real injury. By all means, take care of yourself. But when you take it to the point that you feel fine and you aren’t gonna suit up, why am I even checking to see if you have a game I might want to watch?

Load management and the disregard of the regular season(Which fans absolutely contributed to heavily with decades of saying the regular season doesn’t matter) making it impossible for me to care what games are being played at the moment. I’m only gonna keep making sure I’m home by eight only to hear at 7:45 some guy who is just fine isn’t even gonna suit up against his Direct superstar matchup because he doesn’t feel like it.

A lot of the mamba mentality is bullshit but somebody like Kobe wanted to play against other stars and other good teams and you need some of that. All these players idolize him and go out and be the exact opposite.

[Neal Romer]

Th Not caring enough to play really did more damage than the style of play for me personally. I’m always watch NBA games even when I didn’t expect to enjoy the style of play. It’s just on in the background. But a lot of that was having the ability to pull up the days games And know what offered potential to be interesting. The low ball movement iso style of the early 2000s Wasn’t as appealing to me as the better ball movement the deeper teens of my childhood could afford to use.


But….


If the Lakers are playing the 76ers, I know barring a legitimate injury. They can’t possibly play through. I’m at least going to see Iverson and go at it. They were competitors and they wanted to play whale against each other. Paul Pierce wanted to get out there and play when McGrady was the opponent. Could potentially be hurt? Sure.

But you never got the impression that somebody like Iverson or Kobe didn’t care if they could perform or not. It wasn’t just killing time to get to the games that mattered. They played like all the games mattered. A lot of these guys? Even the competitors like a Jimmy Butler? He might not play against a big matchup just because he doesn’t give a shit. That’s what Riley was calling him out about. Shaq wanted to play against David Robinson because he wanted to prove a point. Hakeem wanted Ewing. Kevin Garnett wanted to play against Duncan.

You wouldn’t get every matchup because yes people do get hurt. But that caliber of player would never leave you with the impression they could go today in this potentially good game but they’re deciding it doesn’t matter.

Embiid and his type are just the worst thing that happened to the sport. If you’re hurt, you hurt. Do not sacrifice your career earning potential for fans who don’t understand that you can’t see every real injury. By all means, take care of yourself. But when you take it to the point that you feel fine and you aren’t gonna suit up, why am I even checking to see if you have a game I might want to watch?

Load management and the disregard of the regular season(Which fans absolutely contributed to heavily with decades of saying the regular season doesn’t matter) making it impossible for me to care what games are being played at the moment. I’m only gonna keep making sure I’m home by eight only to hear at 7:45 some guy who is just fine isn’t even gonna suit up against his Direct superstar matchup because he doesn’t feel like it.

A lot of the mamba mentality is bullshit but somebody like Kobe wanted to play against other stars and other good teams and you need some of that. All these players idolize him and go out and be the exact opposite.


I remember it was I think... two seasons ago where Zion was still out with an "injury" down the stretch as the Pelicans were fighting for playoff positioning, I think they were a play-in team at that time. And Zion was asked about his progress and he openly said "Physically Im fine, Im recovered, Im just not there mentally yet."

I was floored.

And actually the same thing happened with Jamal Murray, and even Derrick Rose I think at one point. Where they were fully recovered from ACL injury, cleared by doctors, able to do everything they were expected to do... but they continued to sit out because they were supposedly like "traumatized" by the thought of getting hurt again or something and needed time to feel mentally ready to play.

It's insane that guys like that get paid hundreds of millions of dollars. The whole concept of sports ultimately stems from Coliseum shit. We wanna see tough mother****ers battle.

Nowadays half the league needs a personal therapist to travel by their side on road trips.

The affluenza is real. The people who have it the easiest are somehow the most shook. It's pathetic and no one wants to see it.

[Kblaze8855]

Guy like Rose don’t really bother me. Same for Grant Hill and Penny. Or Bill Walton. Guys who got hurt and were obviously never the same. Rose for one tore his ACL and then had three further meniscus tears. Both knees were ****ed. So I can see how he would feel like being cleared by doctors doesn’t necessarily mean he’s right. he came back from his first injury played 10 games and was out another year. Grant Hill was trying to tough it out and play in the playoffs with an injury the doctors told him was merely pain management not something he could make worse. Then he made it worse and nearly died on an operating table and spent 4 years recovering.

Major shit like that I understand. Come back when you feel right.

When you arent out with a serious injury to begin with? Or when you’re out here, acknowledging plans to skip huge chunks of games for the rest of your career no matter how you are feeling physically?

That’s when you damage fanhood. It’s just hard to root for somebody like that.

Bill Walton? OK. He tried to gut it out and come back as well when the doctors told him he also couldn’t make it worse. Literally broke his foot in half on a rebound. Didn’t have a healthy season for six or seven years. That’s just life being a bitch.

But a lot of these guys just have straight up maintenance plans and decide they just don’t care to play because it’s generally better on the human body to take a bunch of days off. And of course it is. But if you don’t give a ****, you can’t expect the fans to do it.

[Real Men Wear Green]

Good news: KP is back. Celtics with 78 at the half. Now everyone can be happy.

[90sgoat]

3. International players ruling the league. I think it's more difficult for American fans to tune in and care about the league when the majority of the truly elite players are foreign. Jokic/Giannis/Luka will just not carry the same appeal as LeBron/Kobe/Wade or LeBron/Curry/KD.

I don't understand this though, the international players are who makes the league at all watchable and I include Embiid and Shai in this.

American players are carbon copies of each other, have no personality in their game and compensate for it by tattoos and ugly hairstyles.

All the (black) american players are lanky 3 point shooters basically and clearly have been cultivated since a young age to maximize their chance of going pro, not to play to develop their unique traits and their unique personality on the floor.

The only american player with personality is Ant.

[Airupthere]

Good news: KP is back. Celtics with 78 at the half. Now everyone can be happy.

Not everyone. Watch Mask the Embiid.

[Phoenix]

None of the upcoming stars have gotten to the point where you either love or hate them enough to tune in. Say what you will about Lebron, whether you tune in to watch him win or lose, he drives conversations. Kobe drove conversations. We were actually spoiled to have their careers intersect. They both garnered massive followings and that drove interest, especially casually, and the casual market is what drives the numbers. You knew the names Lebron and Kobe even if you've never watched a game in your life. The names 'Jokic', 'Luka' and 'Giannis' are know to sports fans but those names haven't permeated the zeitgeist of pop culture and/or as far as national profiles. We expected someone else(s) would come along to drive the conversations as we've seen really since Bird and Magic, but that person hasn't appeared yet. I really don't think Wemby will have any wide appeal, because who the hell can picture themselves as a 7'4 specimen ( I suppose one would make the same argument about Lebron. He's a genetic freak). That is Steph's appeal, a fit but average looking guy, reasonably tall but not otherwordly. He gives you the impression he's something to strive for ( even though odds are high he's 1:1 in terms of what he does).

[Real Men Wear Green]

Not everyone. Watch Mask the Embiid.

He enjoys a good excuse for Philly failure. Win win win.

[Axe]

Because the all-time greats drafted from 00s and early 10s are slowly on a downhill now.

[Soundwave]

Say what you want about Kobe, but I think that's the type of player the NBA so badly needs right now.

Being so upset that Vince Carter was getting a lot of attention that you play in a game injured to try and show him up.

Taking LeBron defensively at an all-star game and blocking his shot twice in a row.

Tearing his achilles but staying on the court to shoot a free throw and walking off on his own power.

This dude was obsessed with playing and being great, to such an extent it would sometimes become a detriment (ie: feuds with Shaq).

[sdot_thadon]

I'm not one to care about a man's approach to his job as much as his results, so im not clamorong for type X of player to be in the league. The stars we have now are plenty competitive in the big spots. Maybe the money these guys make in this era has taken the hunger away from some of them. And the league has had well over 20 years of a few detrimental strategies: tanking for top picks, load management and minutes restrictions, ect. They are all the norm now and take meaning away from games that already struggled to have importance like a Tuesday in January. Maybe it's also the thought that some teams with great fan bases have been terrible or hanging from the ledge of terrible for a long time too?

[Phoenix]

For the first time in a while the 3 biggest markets ( Boston, LA, NY) all have good to great teams which we really haven't seem in some time. That's an even bigger indictment on the league as far as national interest. Mind you, I think the Knicks need a bigger name. ANT would blow up on the Knicks, or Ja(if he can curb the off-court stuff).

[sdot_thadon]

For the first time in a while the 3 biggest markets ( Boston, LA, NY) all have good to great teams which we really haven't seem in some time. That's an even bigger indictment on the league as far as national interest. Mind you, I think the Knicks need a bigger name. ANT would blow up on the Knicks, or Ja(if he can curb the off-court stuff).

But I think only one of those 3 has true championsbip aspirations at this point in the season and probably over the last 3 seasons. Football has a more open field of possibility for contenders than the NBA. We kind of know ahead of time when our teams arent winning shit lol.

[Real Men Wear Green]

For the first time in a while the 3 biggest markets ( Boston, LA, NY) all have good to great teams which we really haven't seem in some time. That's an even bigger indictment on the league as far as national interest. Mind you, I think the Knicks need a bigger name. ANT would blow up on the Knicks, or Ja(if he can curb the off-court stuff).
The Celtics were blamelessly bad for ratings last year. Not about the playing style so much as they don't have the marquee names and they didn't have a rival last season. Tatum and Brown can become more popular (Tatum already has a million ads) but finding a team that can push them to Game 7 is a bigger problem. If that rival is out there unfortunately it's not New York or the Lakers, it's OKC or Cleveland. If the conspiracy theorists that think the league is rigged for big markets are right then the Knicks or Lakers will get a lopsided trade before the season ends. Knicks need a great defensive big while Lakers need a prime superstar and/or 2 more good two-way roleplayers to challenge Boston. If this season is like last season it will be fun for Celtic fans and no one else.

[Phoenix]

But I think only one of those 3 has true championsbip aspirations at this point in the season and probably over the last 3 seasons. Football has a more open field of possibility for contenders than the NBA. We kind of know ahead of time when our teams arent winning shit lol.

This is true lol...

[Phoenix]

The Celtics were blamelessly bad for ratings last year. Not about the playing style so much as they don't have the marquee names and they didn't have a rival last season. Tatum and Brown can become more popular (Tatum already has a million ads) but finding a team that can push them to Game 7 is a bigger problem. If that rival is out there unfortunately it's not New York or the Lakers, it's OKC or Cleveland. If the conspiracy theorists that think the league is rigged for big markets are right then the Knicks or Lakers will get a lopsided trade before the season ends. Knicks need a great defensive big while Lakers need a prime superstar and/or 2 more good two-way roleplayers to challenge Boston. If this season is like last season it will be fun for Celtic fans and no one else.

I haven't seen Tatum in any ads funny enough, granted I don't watch much TV. I've seen Jokic and Giannis pop up from time to time...

[Real Men Wear Green]

I haven't seen Tatum in any ads funny enough, granted I don't watch much TV. I've seen Jokic and Giannis pop up from time to time...
I'm sure to see him more living in Boston but off the top of my head hhe has deals with Jordan, Gatorade, SoFi, Ruffles (which he naturally doesn't eat), some cologne, Amica.

[Soundwave]

The spamming of 3s is a big problem though in the entertainment value of the game. Teams shooting literally 50 threes a night is getting ridiculous.

[sdot_thadon]

The Celtics were blamelessly bad for ratings last year. Not about the playing style so much as they don't have the marquee names and they didn't have a rival last season. Tatum and Brown can become more popular (Tatum already has a million ads) but finding a team that can push them to Game 7 is a bigger problem. If that rival is out there unfortunately it's not New York or the Lakers, it's OKC or Cleveland. If the conspiracy theorists that think the league is rigged for big markets are right then the Knicks or Lakers will get a lopsided trade before the season ends. Knicks need a great defensive big while Lakers need a prime superstar and/or 2 more good two-way roleplayers to challenge Boston. If this season is like last season it will be fun for Celtic fans and no one else.

I think the current crop of stars are good enough, but i think this era will never allow for the type of worship stars of older eras enjoyed. Social media and content saturation kills most of the mystique surrounding these guys now and more hand wringing and daily scrutiny doesn't really allow the average fan to appreciate anything anymore. A guy goes for 70 the 1st thing we see is weak era so and so woulda had 90. Nba Fandom is toxic af nowadays just look around this place for starters lol.

[sdot_thadon]

The spamming of 3s is a big problem though in the entertainment value of the game. Teams shooting literally 50 threes a night is getting ridiculous.

The game is still entertaining, it's just different. The older guys are just feeling the same way the previous eras felt watching Mike and friends iso the hell out of their team ball game. Shooting more 3s is just a natural progression and it's going to continue with guys coming up working on step back 3s, pull up 3s, and turn around jumpers from 3 as a normal part of their games. It's evolution.

[Real Men Wear Green]

The spamming of 3s is a big problem though in the entertainment value of the game. Teams shooting literally 50 threes a night is getting ridiculous.

It's a problem but if the games are competitive with the ultimate outcome in doubt people don't mind the similarity so much. Almost every great offense in the NFL is about an good or great QB with varying level of running ability and yet no one complains because the games are still highly competitive.

[Soundwave]

The game is still entertaining, it's just different. The older guys are just feeling the same way the previous eras felt watching Mike and friends iso the hell out of their team ball game. Shooting more 3s is just a natural progression and it's going to continue with guys coming up working on step back 3s, pull up 3s, and turn around jumpers from 3 as a normal part of their games. It's evolution.

Falling TV ratings tells me not everyone is a fan.

If that's the evolution of the game, then so are the lower TV ratings and lack of interest that follow it.

You can say it's no different from the iso-era/Jordan era, but those periods caused a massive boom in TV viewership and interest in the NBA.

[Wally450]

4. Every team playing the exact same way. Go back 20 years ago, watching a Suns game was a completely different experience than watching a Pistons game. Today every single team plays exactly the same, just spam 3's and layups almost every possession. The lack of a diverse playing style between teams makes watching less interesting.

I think this is it for me. I could get behind a Suns Mavericks high scoring game back in 2006, or how the Celtics would counter the Magic's shooting in 2009. Different play styles enticed the viewer. Nowadays it really is just a chuckfest.

[sdot_thadon]

Falling TV ratings tells me not everyone is a fan.

If that's the evolution of the game, then so are the lower TV ratings and lack of interest that follow it.

You can say it's no different from the iso-era/Jordan era, but those periods caused a massive boom in TV viewership and interest in the NBA.

You're trying to compare things straight up as if conditions are the same. Big thing? Streaming has changed the whole landscape of viewership. Back then to watch a game all you needed was network tv for the most part and some games here and there on basic cable. Now almost all the games require subscription to watch. Cord cutters say screw that lol. This era has way more distractions and there's a huge lack of worship celebrities used to get. Now we just see them as guys that hoop. We pick apart their every fart like we're neighbors when before stars were untouchable attractions. You're old enough to understand how apples to oranges this is.

And while you make a decent point the ratings don't seem to be affecting tv deals nor player contracts, so there's that as well. The money is coming in somehow.

[Phoenix]

Falling TV ratings tells me not everyone is a fan.

If that's the evolution of the game, then so are the lower TV ratings and lack of interest that follow it.

You can say it's no different from the iso-era/Jordan era, but those periods caused a massive boom in TV viewership and interest in the NBA.

As much as I've shat on the 3pointer in recent days, I think its overuse is lower down the list than other things ( the perception of coddled stars, piracy streaming, load management, etc). It's just another version of NBA basketball, end of the day. The early 2000s were pretty ugly with teams like Detroit and Indiana grinding out 70-68 outcomes, but people still hung around and this was right after Jordan's glory years. I do think there is something to be said about the excess of options we have at our disposal entertainment-wise nowadays. In other words, if you were to take the modern NBA game (not the ancillary stuff around it, just the floor product) and place it in 2000, it likely isn't going to suffer major ratings dips. You'll obviously have people complaining about too many 3s, but I don't think it would cause the floor to fall out in terms of fan interest. There's alot of other things going on that causing people to nope out.

[Real Men Wear Green]

The stars not being reliable to show up in the regular season is a definite problem. Consider that Philly is a featured team and yet just about every one of their games the stars have disappointed.

[Phoenix]

This era has way more distractions and there's a huge lack of worship celebrities used to get. Now we just see them as guys that hoop. We pick apart their every fart like we're neighbors when before stars were untouchable attractions.


There's also this, and it's not just related to sports but celebrity culture in general. Social media has de-mystified celebrities, their lives are out there for all to see nowadays which has humanized them. Now they're just seen as out of touch 1 percenters thinking their opinion on who to vote for matters. I mean, I don't know if you saw it but a group of 'Avengers'( Scarlett Johannson, Robert Downey, Chris Evans, etc) got on a group call to push for voting Kamala Harris. Not only was the way they were acting extremely cringe, but the entire thing reeked of a bygone era when famous people lived 'above us' and had some sway and influence.

I was telling my wife the other day that when Arnold and Tom Cruise pass on, and throw in a few other names from that era, that's pretty much it. Gen Z don't give a fukk about celebrities like that, in fact they're more likely to worship some random tik toker with 20 millions followers nowadays.

[sdot_thadon]

There's also this, and it's not just related to sports but celebrity culture in general. Social media has de-mystified celebrities, their lives are out there for all to see nowadays which has humanized them. Now they're just seen as out of touch 1 percenters thinking their opinion on who to vote for matters. I mean, I don't know if you saw it but a group of 'Avengers'( Scarlett Johannson, Robert Downey, Chris Evans, etc) got on a group call to push for voting Kamala Harris. Not only was the way they were acting extremely cringe, but the entire thing reeked of a bygone era when famous people lived 'above us' and had some sway and influence.

I was telling my wife the other day that when Arnold and Tom Cruise pass on, and throw in a few other names from that era, that's pretty much it. Gen Z don't give a fukk about celebrities like that, in fact they're more likely to worship some random tik toker with 20 millions followers nowadays.
Definitely. You get it. I don't think it's possible to build stardom to that level anymore. The last of that era will get to live forever in their fans hearts. The ones from this era? Nah lol.

[Soundwave]

Celebrities also told people to vote against George W. Bush 20 years ago and Bush still won a second term term (and is today very unpopular), so it's not like that is some magical new phenomenon. They were pro-Obama and he won twice too. Fact is Americans just flip flop between the two parties back and forth and will likely continue to do so. If shit is still expensive in 4 years (and it probably will be), a Democrat will win.

More to this topic though here is another video, this one more on a player like Ant who shoots a ton of 3s


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SEiFhFpAf6w

[Phoenix]

Celebrities also told people to vote against George W. Bush 20 years ago and Bush still won two terms (and is today very unpopular), so it's not like that is some magical new phenomenon.

That's kind of the point being made. That age-old thing of using famous people to influence and push agendas is dying out, whether it worked previously or otherwise. This upcoming generation ain't about some overpaid Hollywood schmuck giving advice.

[Soundwave]

That's kind of the point being made. That age-old thing of using famous people to influence and push agendas is dying out, whether it worked previously or otherwise. This upcoming generation ain't about some overpaid Hollywood schmuck giving advice.

Or the NBA just doesn't have to date many compelling/marketable players today.

Shohei Ohtani barely speaks English and he caused a large surge in World Series TV ratings, Caitlyn Clark caused a large surge in WNBA ratings. Taylor Swift of all people has caused a surge in NFL TV ratings with the last Superbowl having sky high ratings.

Maybe just maybe also the idea of an NBA superstar who spams 3s is getting tiresome in itself.

Would Michael Jordan have been a massive star if he was a perimeter based player instead of having the spectacular in the air moves, dunks that even non-basketball fans could watch and sit in awe of?

Would Charles Barkley have been a big marketing star without the intense in your face physicality, battling down low, elbowing people in the face, spitting on people, etc. etc. that made his game interesting to watch? If a player's play style there's less of a chance said player will becoming a big marketing draw.

Probably not. Steph Curry was a neat novelty, but I don't think fans are really attracted to every guy (including like 7 footers) camping behind the 3 point line all game long. It's not interesting to watch.

I think that is part of the problem too.

[Lebron23]

Or the NBA just doesn't have to date many compelling/marketable players today.

Shohei Ohtani barely speaks English and he caused a large surge in World Series TV ratings, Caitlyn Clark caused a large surge in WNBA ratings. Taylor Swift of all people has caused a surge in NFL TV ratings with the last Superbowl having sky high ratings.

Maybe just maybe also the idea of an NBA superstar who spams 3s is getting tiresome in itself.

Would Michael Jordan have been a massive star if he was a perimeter based player instead of having the spectacular in the air moves, dunks that even non-basketball fans could watch and sit in awe of?

Would Charles Barkley have been a big marketing star without the intense in your face physicality, battling down low, elbowing people in the face, spitting on people, etc. etc. that made his game interesting to watch? If a player's play style there's less of a chance said player will becoming a big marketing draw.

Probably not. Steph Curry was a neat novelty, but I don't think fans are really attracted to every guy (including like 7 footers) camping behind the 3 point line all game long. It's not interesting to watch.

I think that is part of the problem too.

You never play basketball in your entire life. I slap you back to Jordan's butt

[Lebron23]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ygDe5zh9TsU

Have people just given up on this modern brand of jacking up 3s non-stop and minimal defensive play? Because the NBA's ratings are swirling the toilet bottom.

That negro is unathletic. Looks like he was a bench warmer in their recreational league

[Phoenix]

Or the NBA just doesn't have to date many compelling/marketable players today.

Shohei Ohtani barely speaks English and he caused a large surge in World Series TV ratings, Caitlyn Clark caused a large surge in WNBA ratings. Taylor Swift of all people has caused a surge in NFL TV ratings with the last Superbowl having sky high ratings.

Maybe just maybe also the idea of an NBA superstar who spams 3s is getting tiresome in itself.

Would Michael Jordan have been a massive star if he was a perimeter based player instead of having the spectacular in the air moves, dunks that even non-basketball fans could watch and sit in awe of?

Would Charles Barkley have been a big marketing star without the intense in your face physicality, battling down low, elbowing people in the face, spitting on people, etc. etc. that made his game interesting to watch? If a player's play style there's less of a chance said player will becoming a big marketing draw.

Probably not. Steph Curry was a neat novelty, but I don't think fans are really attracted to every guy (including like 7 footers) camping behind the 3 point line all game long. It's not interesting to watch.

I think that is part of the problem too.

I won't argue with that, the players generally are less marketable because there is generally less mystique, and the NBA has spent the last two decades after the JailBlazers and the Palace melee branding a cleaner image. So the players in general are comparatively wooden by the standards of Dennis Rodman and Charles Barkley.

Still though, going beyond basketball players social media has killed the infatuation with 'celebrities'. Tik tok stars are more relatable because they are seen as attainable. Anyone with a bright idea, some charisma and the ability to present themselves on a camera has a shot at stardom. Some random, cute half-plowed white blonde on a Friday night can describe her method of d*ck-sucking to keep a man and become a star. Nobody is trying to be the next Tom Cruise, Julia Roberts, Michael Jordan or Lebron James anymore. There's a certain amount of innate talent, genetic gifts mixed with drive to succeed that creates that kind of star. Most people have neither.

[Nowoco]

It's the same reason the ASG ratings have tanked. No-one cares about the RS or the ASG.

There is no such thing as a must watch RS game. Even if its the two hottest teams in the league. Who cares? It only matters when it's the PS. The RS is an overlong, tedious waste of time before the proper stuff happens. It's like a boxing undercard. Sure some hardcore fans want to watch the other bouts but most only tune in for the big fight.

It has precisely nothing to do with the three point revolution. And Adam Silver can try as many of these stupid gimmicks he likes. I ask you when has a sport EVER been saved by gimmicks? It just alienates fans more.

[90sgoat]

When Adam Silver is eventually fired, I think people will realize how trash he was a commissioner.

He's ruined the game and misread the cultural zeitgeist completely. People want players they can relate to, such as Caitlyn Clark. Teams should find ways to become actually anchored in their cities and states. They should sponsor colleges and high schools, they should have tryouts and local events.

The current franchise system is just entertainment. The league should look at how it works in Europe. Lionel Messi was from Argentina, but played since he was a kid for Barcelona.

Think about if Lebron had played for Cavs since he was 12, it would be very different.

[ImKobe]

Product just isn't as good as it used to be. There's no Lebron or Kobe or MJ in this current era. Jokic & Giannis are up there as far as their overall impact goes, but as a product they're just not as entertaining to watch IMO.

Obviously you have a bunch of great players but it's just not the same with the 3PT chucking. Feels like there's more blowouts as well, though I don't have a stat to back this up, but I feel like it's been this way for a while now which is why there's less people tuning in.

[Phoenix]

Product just isn't as good as it used to be. There's no Lebron or Kobe or MJ in this current era. Jokic & Giannis are up there as far as their overall impact goes, but as a product they're just not as entertaining to watch IMO.

Obviously you have a bunch of great players but it's just not the same with the 3PT chucking. Feels like there's more blowouts as well, though I don't have a stat to back this up, but I feel like it's been this way for a while now which is why there's less people tuning in.
.
Hence why the whole 'today's player is more skilled' thing is irrelevant if the product on the floor is worse. They've put so much math into the game as far as advanced metrics and the players have been reprogrammed to seek out 3's at every opportunity, instead of playing intuitive basketball.

[Indian guy]

The NBA has never been the cultural staple the way football or even baseball has been. It badly needs larger-than-life stars ala Magic/Bird/MJ/Kobe/LeBron/Curry for the casual viewer to care. The league currently doesn't have that. It's certainly not lacking in great players, but majority of them are foreign born and simply don't have the celebrity. That's the biggest reason by far for why ratings are down.

After that it's a combination of:

- the way people consume entertainment has completely changed. When you can easily watch anything through a small device on your hand, how motivated are you to sit in front of the TV and watch something that lasts around 3 hours? Not to mention given how accessible highlights/stats/scores are, people are just less likely to invest hours into a game now.

- accurate or not, the league has a terrible image problem - everybody finds it "soft". The complaints ranging from "there's no defense" to "lazy stars randomly sitting out games aka load mgmt". There's a certain bravado people associate sports with and they don't think the current NBA has that.

- the on-court product is not fun. Now, I don't think this has much to do with the ratings decline because I don't think the casual viewer generally understands what's happening on the court (they like stars and story lines), but I do think the 3pt revolution that started about a decade ago has absolutely turned a lot of the hardcore fans off, myself included.

[j3lademaster]

I think a lot of it is accessibility. I remember growing up I can just watch the local team on cable, which was why most people had hometown pride back then too when it came to fandom. Now? I'm done with league pass gouging me and will just get youtubetv when the playoffs come; and if any of you have a better, cheaper option I'm all ears.

[sdot_thadon]

I think a lot of it is accessibility. I remember growing up I can just watch the local team on cable, which was why most people had hometown pride back then too when it came to fandom. Now? I'm done with league pass gouging me and will just get youtubetv when the playoffs come; and if any of you have a better, cheaper option I'm all ears.

This the Rockets away games were on network Tv (WB) I want to say and the home games were on cable subject to blackout if the games don't sell out iirc. Of course we had the NBA on NBC too and WGN on cable so the whole nation could be Bulls stans lol.

[Phoenix]

- the way people consume entertainment has completely changed. When you can easily watch anything through a small device on your hand, how motivated are you to sit in front of the TV and watch something that lasts around 3 hours? Not to mention given how accessible highlights/stats/scores are, people are just less likely to invest hours into a game now.



I think that speaks more to the quality of the product than people's unwillingness to sit through a 2-3 hour game. Per your final point, the on-court product itself is not all that fun and worth the time investment. The players themselves have de-prioritized the regular season. For example, the higher stakes of a 17 game NFL season where every game counts simply makes for more compelling TV. NFL ratings are up, as is Baseball.

Also to your point about storylines, the only real plot right now is the Bronny James saga, and I feel like the narrative around that repels more than attracts. Ditto for the other 'storylines' like load management, cuddled stars etc. Lebron himself as of now is not in the championship picture, there's no Warriors team or other juggernaut ruling over the league to the degree that people want to see them beaten, so there's no particularly compelling stories right now. There's no Lebron/Kobe dynamic with entrenched fanbases driving conversations. That's kind of a self-inflicted wound because the league made it about its stars, so in the absence of any compelling plots, players or rivalries, the NBA does not have all that compelling a product at present, either by its own standards to yesteryear or measured against other popular team sports.

[eliteballer]

It doesn't even look like you're watching pro ball.

It looks like some exhibition.

There's absolutely no defense allowed, the offensive players travel and carry like crazy.

[Druckenmiller]

Nobody wants to watch a game nobody wants to play. Guys are either sitting out or being reprimanded for not playing hard enough or with enough passion.

I knew this thing was in trouble when Wemby — the most marketable and interesting player to come into the game in some time started shooting 15 3s a game.

When even the “alien” 7-6 guy is shooting from half court for no apparent reason the product has turned into a slightly better version of the all star game.

No clear thinking person is going to waste time watching it.

[Meticode]

This is why the NBA is failing. All teams are copy cats and just want to jack up threes because the Warriors finally showed it's achievable to win championships with it, but the problem is most players aren't Steph Curry either...

https://x.com/i/status/1863348210049200575

[Indian guy]

This is why the NBA is failing. All teams are copy cats and just want to jack up threes because the Warriors finally showed it's achievable to win championships with it, but the problem is most players aren't Steph Curry either...

https://x.com/i/status/1863348210049200575

You don't need to be Steph Curry for the 3pter to be the most optimal approach to maximizing your offense. The league shoots it pretty damn well. Record high ORTG every year since 2019....

No, the problem is that it's just bad aesthetics. A game where half the shots are long range ones simply isn't fun to watch.

[Phoenix]

You don't need to be Steph Curry for the 3pter to be the most optimal approach to maximizing your offense. The league shoots it pretty damn well. Record high ORTG every year since 2019....



There are some teams who really don't shoot it well enough to be spamming 3s. Case in point Orlando takes 38 attempts at only 32%. That's like asking a guy who shoots that percentage to take 10 attempts. I don't think any team shooting 35% or under 'should' be taking more than 30 attempts, but because the league has adopted this style of play everyone HAS to go along or you're automatically shot out of the building.

[Patrick Chewing]

Take away the three point line for a few years. Begin a course correction.

[Lebron23]

It doesn't even look like you're watching pro ball.

It looks like some exhibition.

There's absolutely no defense allowed, the offensive players travel and carry like crazy.

Just like in Kobe's era.

[Soundwave]

Wembanyama is supposed to be the poster child for the future of the league, but even he is now making the 3 point shot a major component of his game ... and it's going to be bad for the NBA.

If the face of your league is a 7'4 guy who's camping out behind the 3 point arc to shoot 3s like he's 6'4 ... I mean fine for him, but it's not going to be bad for viewership. No one wants to see that shit.

I think it's inevitable but the 3 point line may have to be moved back and the corner 3s eliminated entirely.

[Norcaliblunt]

The media, the fans, the internet, message boards and the news industrial complex in general are the problems.

No one actually really wants to watch basketball. They want to talk about it.

Tune into the games and listen to the announcing. It’s non stop talk, talk, and more talk.

Can’t everyone stfu and just watch the games?

Now the players all have podcasts and care more about talking than playing.

It places like this that over analyzed everything which have ruined the NBA product.

[RRR3]

The media, the fans, the internet, message boards and the news industrial complex in general are the problems.

No one actually really wants to watch basketball. They want to talk about it.

Tune into the games and listen to the announcing. It’s non stop talk, talk, and more talk.

Can’t everyone stfu and just watch the games?

Now the players all have podcasts and care more about talking than playing.

It places like this that over analyzed everything which have ruined the NBA product.
Meltdown

[Norcaliblunt]

Meltdown

I honestly think it’s a great point that no one has brought up.

The off season trade and free agent signing news is more exciting than the actual regular season coverage.

A common theme here being mentioned is storylines and narratives.

All that means is people care more about talking sports than actually watching.

When people are more concerned with commenting on a YouTube video than watching it we have problems.

[Real Men Wear Green]

Hard to see how talking about basketball directly leads to a problem with ratings, especially when the sport being discussed world normally only drive up interest and in turn help ratings. I guess that some players could get more caught up in their personal tweets and podcasts than team goals but just about every team has rules to keep players focused during company time.

[Phoenix]

The media, the fans, the internet, message boards and the news industrial complex in general are the problems.

No one actually really wants to watch basketball. They want to talk about it.

Tune into the games and listen to the announcing. It’s non stop talk, talk, and more talk.

Can’t everyone stfu and just watch the games?

Now the players all have podcasts and care more about talking than playing.

It places like this that over analyzed everything which have ruined the NBA product.

Talking about basketball isn't anything new. Over the last quarter century it's moved into social media and message boards but it was always a discussion on the playgrounds, gyms, barber shops, work, etc. I remember being in high school in the 90s arguing about basketball during lunch breaks. We were engaged with the product enough to expend energy arguing about it.

[E_Stamkos]

Take away the three point line for a few years. Begin a course correction.

I'd rather see a per quarter or half, 3ball shot limit as opposed to an outright removal.

I used to be able to sit through a game between any two teams. Now, I can't be bothered. I miss the days when a 50 spot felt special. Now you got borderline rotation players jacking up 7+ 3pa, without reproach.

To each their own, and at risk of sounding like an old head... The modern game does nothing to hold my interest.

PS - I hate every single one of you and wish you all nothing but the worst

[mr4speed]

I think that speaks more to the quality of the product than people's unwillingness to sit through a 2-3 hour game. Per your final point, the on-court product itself is not all that fun and worth the time investment. The players themselves have de-prioritized the regular season. For example, the higher stakes of a 17 game NFL season where every game counts simply makes for more compelling TV. NFL ratings are up, as is Baseball.

Also to your point about storylines, the only real plot right now is the Bronny James saga, and I feel like the narrative around that repels more than attracts. Ditto for the other 'storylines' like load management, cuddled stars etc. Lebron himself as of now is not in the championship picture, there's no Warriors team or other juggernaut ruling over the league to the degree that people want to see them beaten, so there's no particularly compelling stories right now. There's no Lebron/Kobe dynamic with entrenched fanbases driving conversations. That's kind of a self-inflicted wound because the league made it about its stars, so in the absence of any compelling plots, players or rivalries, the NBA does not have all that compelling a product at present, either by its own standards to yesteryear or measured against other popular team sports.

Great post!! I think a big part of this is also on the players themselves, meaning the players not caring about games. The fans can see it and sense it. If the players do not care to compete why would I ever watch? The all star game is a microcosm of this topic. Larry Bird and others have even asked the players IN PERSON, to step it up and look what happened. All the gimmicks like the in season tournament, the special lights on the floor, none of that will work until the players themselves want to compete.

[tontoz]

Nobody wants to watch a game nobody wants to play. Guys are either sitting out or being reprimanded for not playing hard enough or with enough passion.

I knew this thing was in trouble when Wemby — the most marketable and interesting player to come into the game in some time started shooting 15 3s a game.

When even the “alien” 7-6 guy is shooting from half court for no apparent reason the product has turned into a slightly better version of the all star game.

No clear thinking person is going to waste time watching it.



Wemby has attempted 15 3s once in his career. He is averaging 9.2 3s per game this season, 5.5 per game last season.

When you have to exaggerate that much to make your point it just shows you don't have one.

[Norcaliblunt]

None of y’all watch every single game yet y’all all comment and can’t wait to talk about them.

That’s the problem.

You can’t even sit through a broadcast without the announcer bringing up off the court or celebrity BS.

Y’all want WWE. Entertainment.

This is a real sport. When the analytics and actual real life strategy interfere with your “entertainment” y’all trip.

Lmao.

[Real Men Wear Green]

You are complaining about basketball being discussed on a basketball message board?

[Norcaliblunt]

You are complaining about basketball being discussed on a basketball message board?

I’m saying y’all have more influence on this stuff than y’all think.

Y’all complaining while not even watching the games impacts shit.

I mean how many west coast teams have you actually watched start to finish this year?

Probably none but you wanna act like an expert.

[Real Men Wear Green]

I’m saying y’all have more influence on this stuff than y’all think.

Y’all complaining while not even watching the games impacts shit.

I mean how many west coast teams have you actually watched start to finish this year?

Probably none but you wanna act like an expert.

You complain about everyone making ignorant assumptions and see no irony in making your own ignorant assumptions about everyone. FYI I have watched whole games of both the Lakers as well as the Warriors and I don't pretend to be an expert on every team. You're wrong on both counts.

[Norcaliblunt]

You complain about everyone making ignorant assumptions and see no irony in making your own ignorant assumptions about everyone. FYI I have watched whole games of both the Lakers as well as the Warriors and I don't pretend to be an expert on every team. You're wrong on both counts.


So you don’t think narrative, storyline, markets, brand building, or any outside forces have anything to do with basketball ratings? Nothing outside the actual game matters at all?

I’ve been around long enough tohear the complaints about hand checking and excessive defensive. Now it’s the opposite.

All just narrative and talking heads talking.

It was too much D 30 years and too much O now.

That’s on fans talking.

[Phoenix]

None of y’all watch every single game yet y’all all comment and can’t wait to talk about them.

That’s the problem.


Lmao.

Nobody watches 'every single game'. That would literally be impossible, so not sure what you're getting at.

[Real Men Wear Green]

So you don’t think narrative, storyline, markets, brand building, or any outside forces have anything to do with basketball ratings? Nothing outside the actual game matters at all?

I’ve been around long enough tohear the complaints about hand checking and excessive defensive. Now it’s the opposite.

All just narrative and talking heads talking.

It was too much D 30 years and too much O now.

That’s on fans talking.

You're assuming the fan reaction is the problem when it may just be a symptom or at the least is far from being the source of all problems. If a shooter is passing the ball the wrong way with his guide hand, someone points out the flaw and the shooter tries to fix it by shooting without a goid hand do we blame the observer for ruining his shot?

It's very possible that the ratings dying is an overreaction to modern trends and the dominance of the NFL and things will be fine once football season is over. It's possible that the NBA is just waiting for the storyline to change and things will be fine. But they're are legit basketball fans in this thread that are saying what they don't like about the game today. That's not them killing the NBA, that's not liking 3-point spam. People have always expressed preferences.

[Norcaliblunt]

Nobody watches 'every single game'. That would literally be impossible, so not sure what you're getting at.

That’s literally why commenting on this stuff makes you stupid.

If you haven’t watched every game what good is your opinion?

Honestly no other message boards or fandom works this way.

Imagine music, movie, or literature fans taking anyone seriously who didn’t actually listen, watch, or read the work?

But sports any one can comment without even witnessing.

That’s the problem!!!

Stephan A Smith DOESNT even WATCH THE GAMES!!!!!?

Let that settle.

[Phoenix]

That’s literally why commenting on this stuff makes you stupid.

If you haven’t watched every game what good is your opinion?

Honestly no other message boards or fandom works this way.

Imagine music, movie, or literature fans taking anyone seriously who didn’t actually listen, watch, or read the work?

But sports any one can comment without even witnessing.

That’s the problem!!!

Stephan A Smith DOESNT even WATCH THE GAMES!!!!!?

Let that settle.

So basically, only people who've read every single book, watched every single game, watched every single movie, have the right to discuss it. When we know there is absolutely no way anyone could ever do this, or has ever done this. Do you watch every game? I'll answer that for you. No you don't, so why are you here?

[Norcaliblunt]

So basically, only people who've read every single book, watched every single game, watched every single movie, have the right to discuss it. When we know there is absolutely no way anyone could ever do this, or has ever done this. Do you watch every game? I'll answer that for you. No you don't, so why are you here?


No I don’t watch every game, so I don’t make threads on the “state or health of basketball” like a drug fiend beyact.

In fact I could care less about its ratings. Like why the hell would I give a shit about its ratings? I watch the games, I get entertained, I move on.

Y’all are like wannabe network executives actually caring about the ratings. That’s bitch.

I don’t care how much anyone is making off anything.

That’s corny.

[Phoenix]

No I don’t watch every game, so I don’t make threads
on the “state or health of basketball” like a drug fiend beyact.

In fact I could care less about its ratings. Like why the would I give a shit about its ratings? I watch the games, I get entertained, I move on.

Y’all are like wannabe network executives actually caring about the ratings. That’s bitch.

I don’t care how much anyone is making off anything.

That’s corny.

I have a lifelong interest in the NBA and so yes I'm going to talk about the ratings because I find the direction the league is heading interesting. Doesn't mean at the end of the day I can't and don't unplug from it or that I 'give a shit' about it as if it impacts my life.

People are gonna talk about the things they want to talk about. If you don't like the conversation or think none of us are qualified to discuss it, then do the same thing you do after watching a game. Move on. Nobody's forcing you to engage if you find the topic stupid and nobody will notice or care if you don't. 'Bitch' is trying to gatekeep what you think people should be talking about.

[Norcaliblunt]

I have a lifelong interest in the NBA and so yes I'm going to talk about the ratings because I find the direction the league is heading interesting. Doesn't mean at the end of the day I can't and don't unplug from it or that I 'give a shit' about it as if it impacts my life.

People are gonna talk about the things they want to talk about. If you don't like the conversation or think none of us are qualified to discuss it, then do the same thing you do with the games. Move on. Nobody's forcing you to engage and nobody will notice or care if you don't. 'Bitch' is trying to gatekeep what you think people should be talking about.

And that’s all my point is…..People tripping on ratings ruin the game.

Point blank period end of discussion.

[Phoenix]

And that’s all my point is…..People tripping on ratings ruin the game.

Point blank period end of discussion.

Nobody's tripping, except you. This conversation seems to be a real issue for you.

Bye.

[Norcaliblunt]

Y’all tripping on the ratings 20 plus years ago because “defense” was too much literally led to where we are.

Just stfu.

[Phoenix]

And we're back. The 'end of discussion' declaration didn't make it 10 minutes.

We gonna keep talking about it, just to piss you off.

[Jasper]

best bballers on the planet... I think the league is doing just as well as the billion dollar football industry.

[Jasper]

I just watched that video 2 days ago funny enough.

To answer your question:

- 3point spamming
- Streaming
- perceived lack of competitiveness/rivalries
- People tired of old stars/new stars haven't taken over yet
- Injuries/load management

All reasons playing a part to greater or lesser degree. Also, it seems like since covid there's just less interest in alot of things than before. Movies for example, I was struggling to think of what blockbuster films came out this summer.

dune2

[Axe]

They shouldn't. A lot of international talents today are a lot better compared to ones from the watered-down, expansion era 90s.

[Soundwave]

dune2

There's were strikes that delayed a lot of movies, but Deadpool & Wolverine.

[Phoenix]

There's were strikes that delayed a lot of movies, but Deadpool & Wolverine.

Lol, and that's the one movie I saw in the theatre this year. :oldlol: Completely forgot about it....

[coin24]

The quality of the game is trash, the players don’t care, it’s all about money, commentators are excruciating to listen to, bricking 3 after 3…

Overall it’s just boring to watch.. it’s very rare for a regular season game to be watchable now

[bullettooth]

If anyone's watching the refs rig the game for the Lakers against the Hawks.....

THIS is why ratings are down.

[Nowoco]

Someone on a previous page made a good point about the way media is consumed now. Short, on demand videos are what people want and have the attention span for.

But adding to that, the NBA, maybe more than any other sport, is about narratives. The PS is about who chokes, who wins, which star beats which star. The narratives are just as important as the actual on court play. Some people ONLY watch some games BECAUSE of the narrative, because its going to be the hot topic on the following days talk/radio shows and they want to be involved.

This is another reason why people don't give a shit about the RS. Say you watch a random RS game, the Mavs vs the Nets. Who is going to be talking about that game? On TV, on Twitter, on here, in real life? No-one. What contribution is watching that game going to have to your life when no-one is talking about it? It's an irrelevant memory of a meaningless game. Even if it was great game with a buzzer beater, who cares? That's the problem. Too many games, too little interest and it all feeds off itself.