The Luka-AD Trade: Not As Lopsided As It Seems

[Full Court]

Everyone's talking like the Lakers made out like bandits here, but I'm not so sure. On paper, sure, but I think the Mavs may actually be slightly better and the Lakers the same or slightly worse.

The Mavs had nothing for the Celtics in the finals last season. It really wasn't even very competitive. There's no reason to think they'd have any better success this year if they were to make it out of the West (which is a big if). One of their biggest shortcomings was defensive holes. And let's be honest: Luka is a massive defensive hole. AD is a DPOY-level player, and Luka's offense isn't so much better than AD's that it makes up for the defense gap between the two players. Of course, the big question as always is if AD an stay uninjured. But really you can say the same thing about Luka.

On the Lakers side, they have nobody who can really fill AD's role. Jaxson Hayes? Lol. They sorely need a good big now. I'm sure they're banking on becoming an offensive juggernaut with Luka, and that's certainly a good possibility. Luka draws double teams, and they figure Lebron will get lots of easy buckets. Plus, Luka can come through in the clutch. But they also lost a good shooter and defender in Christie. Markeiff Morris is a poor substitute. Not sure the offensive boost they'll get from adding Luka will make up for the defensive loss of AD and Christie.

There's also an intangible question with the Lakers. AD appeared to be ok playing the beta role on the team and getting scapegoated and crapped on by Lebron fans. How will Luka react when he starts getting blamed for Lebron dragging the team down? We don't know, but there could be potential team chemistry issues here.

At any rate, this trade did make things more interesting if nothing else.

[1987_Lakers]

Of course OP has this terrible take

[Full Court]

Of course OP has this terrible take

I guess we'll see, won't we?


https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Fmedia.tenor.com%2F0Fb96XLGQ3wAAAA C%2Fplot-twist-roll-safe.gif&f=1&nofb=1&ipt=cde5696e79880ea3cdb4bc02859f95a2922a63476a17b1 c0bc327e92c2875ce6&ipo=images

[AlternativeAcc.]

Mavs got slightly worse overall, and hemmoraged their future by giving away a top 3 player in the world entering the peak of his powers for an aging, often injured center.

They gave away a guy whose skillet translates beautifully to playoff basketball. It's funny people talk about Luka falling short in the finals with a clearly worse roster as if they didn't overachieve in the first place.

This dumb mindset is why the trade happened. Luka Doncic is a generational player at the peak of his powers and they got worse in the short term (playoff wise) and now have no future.

Kyrie has only ever had success with alphas like Luka and Lebron. Just an insane gamble to think Davis can fill that void

[bison]

Mavs fans are right to be upset about giving Luka away, but let’s not act like getting a once-in-generation defender who can also score and playmake is simply a ‘consolation prize’. I have been watching the lakers every night for years and I can say AD is mvp caliber as much as Luka. He is the glue to lakers defense and if you can unlock him on offense, then it’s all over: he is the key to winning a ring.


Great analysis btw Full Court :applause: real hoop fans recognize AD’s game.

[Full Court]

Mavs fans are right to be upset about giving Luka away, but let’s not act like getting a once-in-generation defender who can also score and playmake is simply a ‘consolation prize’. I have been watching the lakers every night for years and I can say AD is mvp caliber as much as Luka. He is the glue to lakers defense and if you can unlock him on offense, then it’s all over: he is the key to winning a ring.


Great analysis btw Full Court :applause: real hoop fans recognize AD’s game.

:cheers:

[ShawkFactory]

The short-sightedness is real :lol

At this very moment it’s perhaps even or close to it, but this significantly shortens the Mavericks’ window and lengthens the Lakers’.

[tpols]

You would think they traded Luka for a bum or role player or something. 26/12/3 on great efficiency with elite defense superstar. AD has been better than Luka this year as well.

[1987_Lakers]

The short-sightedness is real :lol

At this very moment it’s perhaps even or close to it, but this significantly shortens the Mavericks’ window and lengthens the Lakers’.

This

People here are just thinking short term. This will be a robbery 3-5 years from now

[Kblaze8855]

It isn’t particularly lopsided at all from a straight total basketball everyone healthy perspective. The issue is age and usual health. Luka is 25. It’s like trading late 2000s Lebron for late 2000s Kevin Garnett or Dirk. Not quite since AD will likely be elite longer but…along those lines.

The ages and potential are what make it a head scratcher. If they have some unknown inside info on his health? Might even it out.

It would have to be pretty bad to top ADs history though. But AD and Kyrie still make for a good team. And they weren’t gonna win as they were anyway. Maybe they didn’t wanna spend 360 million to lose and deal with health issues on top of it.

[SouBeachTalents]

I understand the LeBron agenda will always push people to make absurd statements, but anyone trying to consider this an even trade is so shortsighted it's ridiculous.

I have to see what the Lakers do to shape up this roster, so they very well may end up not even improving with the trade this year. And even if it improves the defense, I think this still makes the Mavs worse even in the short run in the playoffs.

Long term, this is an indefensibly bad trade for Dallas, they just swapped a 25 year old ATG who took them to the Finals last year for a, while still great, worse player who's injury prone and 31.

Even if the Mavs wanted to unload Luka, they could have undoubtedly gotten a better return for him than this. Full Court & tpols are fools for thinking Dallas didn't get fleeced on this one, and like I said, they're only claiming otherwise because they're so engaged in their agenda, which is ironic because this trade will probably barely even impact LeBron. Not only is he on his way out at 40, I wouldn't even be surprised if he gets moved before the trade deadline.

[tpols]

Only a Lebron stan like southbeach could turn this into a Lebron topic.

But if Dallas got "fleeced" wouldn't we all be repping Luka like you guys are? Since that's Lebrons new MVP caliber help?

But we aren't because we know this is gonna end in disaster for you guys. Lakers aren't winning anything with that style and no defense. People forget but after Dallas got Gafford and PJ their defense became elite despite Luka. Mavs don't go anywhere last year without that defense. And LA is about to have a bottom ranked D.

[Full Court]

Only a Lebron stan like southbeach could turn this into a Lebron topic.

But if Dallas got "fleeced" wouldn't we all be repping Luka like you guys are? Since that's Lebrons new MVP caliber help?

But we aren't because we know this is gonna end in disaster for you guys. Lakers aren't winning anything with that style and no defense. People forget but after Dallas got Gafford and PJ their defense became elite despite Luka. Mavs don't go anywhere last year without that defense. And LA is about to have a bottom ranked D.

Yeah, this is what I was gonna say. Really dumb post by SouBeachTalents. If I was trying to make this into some anti-Lebron agenda, then wouldn't I be parroting the narrative that this is the most one-sided trade ever and that Lebron now has more help than anyone in the history of the sport? Lol.

[ShawkFactory]

Yeah, this is what I was gonna say. Really dumb post by SouBeachTalents. If I was trying to make this into some anti-Lebron agenda, then wouldn't I be parroting the narrative that this is the most one-sided trade ever and that Lebron now has more help than anyone in the history of the sport? Lol.


Once again the underperforming Lakers get bailed out before the end of the trade deadline. :roll: 3ball called it. No excuses now. Tell me they're not title favorites.

You in the main thread :lol

[Full Court]

You in the main thread :lol

I was just poking at the Bronies. You know it's all in fun.

[90sgoat]

Mavs might not be significantly worse in terms of results.

Luka wasn't winning a ring with that team, Kyrie couldn't deliver in the finals and they are worse for losing DJJ.

AD has massive impact when offense and defense is combined, but Kyrie+AD is also not going to win a ring alone.

Mavs of course have given up enormous fan earnings over the next 10 years. As a business decision it is an awful one.

Which suggests to me, that Luka has told them he isn't going to stay with them.

[ArbitraryWater]

listen I dont think the Mavs will be bad.

Kyrie and AD is an interesting duo, theyll be a winning team, and might even upset a higher seed in the playoffs.


But their ceiling has been absolutely crushed now.

There will be no more finals appearances and Id be shocked if this team would make a WCF.


Its just an absurd trade.


Nothing of this kind has ever been done before.

[tpols]

listen I dont think the Mavs will be bad.

Kyrie and AD is an interesting duo, theyll be a winning team, and might even upset a higher seed in the playoffs.


But their ceiling has been absolutely crushed now.

There will be no more finals appearances and Id be shocked if this team would make a WCF.


Its just an absurd trade.


Nothing of this kind has ever been done before.


Their ceiling was dead regardless. The Mavs are a play in team right now and Luka hasn't played basketball since December. Hes fat, rich, and doesnt give af. They were literally a 1st round exit this year with Luka any way.

Last year was kind of a fluke tbh. While Boston had the easiest path of all time, Dallas path wasn't strong either.

Like... do you really think this Mavs team couldn't beat the Clippers without Kawhi? Playoff novices in OKC and a fraudulent Minnestoa team? They could do that if Kyrie and AD are healthy easily. That is a big If, but Luka is hurt too so it's a moot point.

[ArbitraryWater]

Their ceiling was dead regardless. The Mavs are a play in team right now and Luka hasn't played basketball since December. Hes fat, rich, and doesnt give af. They were literally a 1st round exit this year with Luka any way.

Last year was kind of a fluke tbh. While Boston had the easiest path of all time, Dallas path wasn't strong either.

Like... do you really think this Mavs team couldn't beat the Clippers without Kawhi? Playoff novices in OKC and a fraudulent Minnestoa team? They could do that if Kyrie and AD are healthy easily. That is a big If, but Luka is hurt too so it's a moot point.


What are you talking about? Mavs made WCF or more 2 of the last 3 years and their team was only getting stronger.

They had a decade+ of contention ahead of them with luka at the helm.

Mavs were a juggernaut.

[tpols]

What are you talking about? Mavs made WCF or more 2 of the last 3 years and their team was only getting stronger.

They had a decade+ of contention ahead of them with luka at the helm.

Mavs were a juggernaut.

The mavs are a juggernaut?

They're literally 2 games away from being 10 seed. They haven't been shit this year and there's no telling if that would continue.

[ArbitraryWater]

The mavs are a juggernaut?

They're literally 2 games away from being 10 seed. They haven't been shit this year and there's no telling if that would continue.

Oh yea sorry their last 3 years of luka sample size are clearly completely overriden by these 45 games into the new season of which half have been spent without luka, never minding the fact that the Mavs have always started slow even in their successful years. Theyre btw also 3 games out from the 4th seed, nice try.

Clearly nothing there to hang onto.

[AlternativeAcc.]

Their ceiling was dead regardless. The Mavs are a play in team right now and Luka hasn't played basketball since December. Hes fat, rich, and doesnt give af. They were literally a 1st round exit this year with Luka any way.

Last year was kind of a fluke tbh. While Boston had the easiest path of all time, Dallas path wasn't strong either.

Like... do you really think this Mavs team couldn't beat the Clippers without Kawhi? Playoff novices in OKC and a fraudulent Minnestoa team? They could do that if Kyrie and AD are healthy easily. That is a big If, but Luka is hurt too so it's a moot point.

So according to you they are ****ed in the short term abyways.. so getting a first round pick in 2029 for Luka is a win?

What are you even arguing here?

[90sgoat]

The mavs are a juggernaut?

They're literally 2 games away from being 10 seed. They haven't been shit this year and there's no telling if that would continue.

Yep, the truth is that the trades they made for Grimes, Klay and that other guy were at best going sideways.

Luka seemed fed up with the constant rotation of role players to fit into the system.

[ILLsmak]

The short-sightedness is real :lol

At this very moment it’s perhaps even or close to it, but this significantly shortens the Mavericks’ window and lengthens the Lakers’.

Neither team has a window. Maybe Dallas is getting Jimmy Butler, too.


-Smak

[tpols]

Neither team has a window. Maybe Dallas is getting Jimmy Butler, too.


-Smak

If that happened a:

Kyrie
Klay
Butler
AD
Gafford / Lively

rotation would qualify as a super team.

[Proctor]

Their ceiling was dead regardless. The Mavs are a play in team right now and Luka hasn't played basketball since December. Hes fat, rich, and doesnt give af. They were literally a 1st round exit this year with Luka any way.

Last year was kind of a fluke tbh. While Boston had the easiest path of all time, Dallas path wasn't strong either.

Like... do you really think this Mavs team couldn't beat the Clippers without Kawhi? Playoff novices in OKC and a fraudulent Minnestoa team? They could do that if Kyrie and AD are healthy easily. That is a big If, but Luka is hurt too so it's a moot point.
Delusional. If you wanna troll go ahead and troll but don't do it in some classic ISH threads. You sound like a moron.

[tpols]

Delusional. If you wanna troll go ahead and troll but don't do it in some classic ISH threads. You sound like a moron.

Dallas is the 8 seed right now. Thats not trolling, its facts.

And they play Cleveland today as massive 13 point underdogs 2 games out of the 11 seed.

They weren't going to do this year what they did last year.

[ShawkFactory]

Dallas is the 8 seed right now. Thats not trolling, its facts.

And they play Cleveland today as massive 13 point underdogs 2 games out of the 11 seed.

They weren't going to do this year what they did last year.

They were 26-23 literally on this day last year.

Currently 26-23.

[Proctor]

Dallas is the 8 seed right now. And they play Clevelabd today as massive 13 point underdogs 2 games out of the 11 seed.

They weren't going to do this year what they did last year.
Predicting a team to not return to the Finals isn't exactly going out on a limb.

You talk out of both sides of your ass more than anyone here. Like the seed they are right now is indicative of what their ceiling was. You know damn well they improved from last year and you know damn well if you pay attention to the NBA that they had OKC's number. They have been sonning them this year even without Luka. I'm sure that doesn't matter to you since apparently you have an interest in minimizing OKC as well to make your narrative.

[tpols]

Predicting a team to not return to the Finals isn't exactly going out on a limb.

It's way beyond that though. Luka is hurt, they're 2 games away from the 11 seed, and they are playing Cleveland today.

Forget the Finals... they may not have even made the playoffs at that rate. This is all factual information.

[Neal Romer]

Dallas is the 8 seed right now. Thats not trolling, its facts.

And they play Cleveland today as massive 13 point underdogs 2 games out of the 11 seed.

They weren't going to do this year what they did last year.

Theres no guarantee they repeat that success this year, but with playoff Luka? The ceiling is at least higher.

I think the Mavs are going to struggle to score in the playoffs.

This is a three point shooting league. Luka shoots threes, and creates threes at a higher level than Davis by far. Davis and Gafford in the paint is nice defensively on paper, but in practice how much good does that do when teams spread around the three point line and fire away? This isnt 1997. It's nice if a guy can defend the paint AND shoot on offense, like a KP, Thicc Vicc or Chet Code. But AD isnt a floor spacer like that. He's shooting his career average from three this year, 29.9%.

Again, this isnt 2004. You cant just throw a bunch of defensive players together and go win a title. You gotta be able to shoot that thang. And create opportunities for other guys to shoot that thang. That isnt AD's game, and it's not Gafford or Lively's either. PJ Washington *kinda* but not at any elite level. So theres definitely some questions.

[tpols]

Theres no guarantee they repeat that success this year, but with playoff Luka? The ceiling is at least higher.

I think the Mavs are going to struggle to score in the playoffs.

This is a three point shooting league. Luka shoots threes, and creates threes at a higher level than Davis by far. Davis and Gafford in the paint is nice defensively on paper, but in practice how much good does that do when teams spread around the three point line and fire away? This isnt 1997. It's nice if a guy can defend the paint AND shoot on offense, like a KP, Thicc Vicc or Chet Code. But AD isnt a floor spacer like that. He's shooting his career average from three this year, 29.9%.

Again, this isnt 2004. You cant just throw a bunch of defensive players together and go win a title. You gotta be able to shoot that thang. And create opportunities for other guys to shoot that thang. That isnt AD's game, and it's not Gafford or Lively's either. PJ Washington *kinda* but not at any elite level. So theres definitely some questions.

The ceiling on having to play the Nuggets or more prime OKC in the playoffs 1st round is very low though.

They got the Kawhi-less Clippers last year. There's no ceiling in that. They were going to lose and they most certainly are still going to lose at a similar spot with AD as they would have if they never made the trade. Unless you think it's a guarantee Luka solos Denver and the Thunder.

[tpols]

The Cavs are up 56-21 on Dallas right now.

:biggums:

[ShawkFactory]

The Cavs are up 56-21 on Dallas right now.

:biggums:

Yea I mean it's what, 18 hours after a blindsiding trade like that? I'm sure everyone is a little shell-shocked at the moment.

Gafford, Lively, Kyrie, and Washington also aren't playing.

[1987_Lakers]

The Cavs are up 56-21 on Dallas right now.

:biggums:

Dallas has a bunch of guys who are out. No Kyrie too I believe

[Proctor]

The Cavs are up 56-21 on Dallas right now.

:biggums:

No Kyrie, no Gafford, no Lively, no Washington, obviously no Luka. Only their C team. Another gotcha for you?

:biggums:

[tpols]

Dallas has a bunch of guys who are out. No Kyrie too I believe

I know but that is still absurd. They gave up 60 points in a little over a quarter. Never seen a game thrown this hard but I guess they're all shell shocked.

[Full Court]

Incredible how that Full Court guy just keeps ending up being right. :lol


:lebronamazed:

[gengiskhan]

you could see it.

AD when healthy has won some sort of astrix ring.

what has Luka won in his life.

now that he is 40. I mean "going on" 40.