Statistical Analysis of 40-year MJ and Lebron's 40-point games

[3ba11]

.
JORDAN..... 43/10/3/4/1 on 60%.. +9.. 1 TO.. 43 of 89 pts (49%)..... facing East champ and #1 defense
LEBRON..... 42/17/8/1/1 on 56%.. +7.. 3 TO.. 42 of 120 pts (35%)... facing lottery team and #9 defense


Without watching the game and just looking at the stats, we see that Lebron's threes were mostly unassisted ("lullaby" 3's), while his 2's were mostly assisted (transition).. We know that most of his 2's were transition because 33% of his points were transition (14 pts), while 18 pts were threes, so that leaves only 10 pts in the halfcourt, 8 of which were FT's - this leaves exactly 1 two-point field goal in the halfcourt..

This is weak offensive diversity in the halfcourt that won't be able to synergize with Luka.. Opponents can just get back on defense to cut down on his transition and understand that he likes the lullaby threes.. It's a tactic that bad 1-on-1 players use to score - if you don't believe me, just play someone that has trouble scoring and watch them try to lull you to sleep before taking a quick shot, smh

[IllegalD]

.
JORDAN..... 43/10/3/4/1 on 60%.. +9.. 1 TO.. 43 of 89 pts (49%)..... facing East champ and #1 defense
LEBRON..... 42/17/8/1/1 on 56%.. +7.. 3 TO.. 42 of 120 pts (35%)... facing lottery team and #9 defense


Without watching the game and just looking at the stats, we see that Lebron's threes were mostly unassisted ("lullaby" 3's), while his 2's were mostly assisted (transition).. We know that most of his 2's were transition because 33% of his points were transition (14 pts), while 18 pts were threes, so that leaves only 10 pts in the halfcourt, 8 of which were FT's - this leaves exactly 1 two-point field goal in the halfcourt..

This is weak offensive diversity in the halfcourt that won't be able to synergize with Luka.. Opponents can just get back on defense to cut down on his transition and understand that he likes the lullaby threes.. It's a tactic that bad 1-on-1 players use to score - if you don't believe me, just play someone that has trouble scoring and watch them try to lull you to sleep before taking a quick shot, smh

Excellent analysis as usual, brother.

Keep schooling these TikTok kiddies about real ball. :banana::dancin:lebroncry::hammertime:

[StrongLurk]

No one thinks of Lebron more than OP over these last two decades...his biggest fan.

Also your OP breakdown isn't even correct. You'd know if you watch the games, heck even just watch the highlights :roll:

[ShawkFactory]

I think he had 3 baskets off of transition 2s. 2 of those were steals by him.

[StrongLurk]

I think he had 3 baskets off of transition 2s. 2 of those were steals by him.

His whole OP premise about Lebron's game is totally wrong.

OP also tried to use FG% instead of EFG% or TS% to try to make MJ look better. OP is seriously such a damn loser, bro is even older than LeBron :roll:

[90sgoat]

3ball is back, dropping stats and taking names, triggering Lebronies.

[1987_Lakers]

.
JORDAN..... 43/10/3/4/1 on 60%.. +9.. 1 TO.. 43 of 89 pts (49%)..... facing East champ and #1 defense
LEBRON..... 42/17/8/1/1 on 56%.. +7.. 3 TO.. 42 of 120 pts (35%)... facing lottery team and #9 defense


Without watching the game and just looking at the stats, we see that Lebron's threes were mostly unassisted ("lullaby" 3's), while his 2's were mostly assisted (transition).. We know that most of his 2's were transition because 33% of his points were transition (14 pts), while 18 pts were threes, so that leaves only 10 pts in the halfcourt, 8 of which were FT's - this leaves exactly 1 two-point field goal in the halfcourt..

This is weak offensive diversity in the halfcourt that won't be able to synergize with Luka.. Opponents can just get back on defense to cut down on his transition and understand that he likes the lullaby threes.. It's a tactic that bad 1-on-1 players use to score - if you don't believe me, just play someone that has trouble scoring and watch them try to lull you to sleep before taking a quick shot, smh

Facing Curry, who you have as a top 5 player ever.

Nuff said.

[SouBeachTalents]

3ball is back, dropping stats and taking names, triggering Lebronies.
Let's see you keep this same lapdog energy when he turns his autistic attention to Luka :lol

[StrongLurk]

3ball is back, dropping stats and taking names, triggering Lebronies.

OP is a Lebronie though...OP talks about the king more than anyone...

[tpols]

How did Austin Reaves get 16 free throws last night? He made more FTs than the entire Golden State team combined.

:biggums:

This is what I'm saying when Luka comes back they're just going to be marched to the line more than any team in NBA history. Austin Reaves and Luka are both master foul baiters and floppers and Lebron ain't too far behind.

[1987_Lakers]

How did Austin Reaves get 16 free throws last night? He made more FTs than the entire Golden State team combined.

They kept fouling him

Warriors are #28 in FT attempts. They don't attack the basket alot.

[tpols]

They kept fouling him

Warriors are #28 in FT attempts. They don't attack the basket alot.

The Lakers hold a historical FTA advantage on the entire NBA the past few years with AD and Lebron.

AD was actually good at embellishing contact and falling to get free throws which is why he's always banged up, but Luka is on another level and Reaves kind of is too.

It's going to be another historical differential.

[sdot_thadon]

Without watching the game and just looking at the stats, we see that ...
Your post doest matter. Because if you watched the game, or even the highlights you'd understand why we all think you're high....or retarded. In this game Lebron was creating the same type of shots for himself Mj did in his game youve referenced.....except from 5-10 feet further out. Not to mention all the other absurb things Lebron did in this game. Apples to potatoes my boy.

[Phoenix]

lol.

[SouBeachTalents]

It's crazy how much better LeBron is at 40 than Jordan.

[3ba11]

It's crazy how much better LeBron is at 40 than Jordan.


League Averages (https://www.basketball-reference.com/leagues/NBA_stats_per_game.html)

2025.... 113.9 ortg.. 113.2 ppg.. 99.0 pace.. 57.5 TS.. Lebron 42 of 120 pts (35%) vs 25-25 team and #9 defense
2003.... 103.6 ortg.... 95.1 ppg.. 91.0 pace.. 51.9 TS.. Jordan 43 of 89 pts.. (48%) vs 38-17 team and #1 defense


^^^^ So Lebron's peak performance at 40 is a joke compared to MJ's.

In addition to having inferior peak performance at 40, Lebron never dropped 51 and 45 in back-to-back games at 38 years old like Jordan did against the East champs (Nets) and Hornets.. Of course, Jordan 3-peated with 41 ppg, which is the goat peak..

[3ba11]

I think he had 3 baskets off of transition 2s. 2 of those were steals by him.


League Averages (https://www.basketball-reference.com/leagues/NBA_stats_per_game.html)

2025.... 113.9 ortg.. 113.2 ppg.. 99.0 pace.. 57.5 TS.. Lebron 42 of 120 pts (35%) vs 25-25 team and #9 defense
2003.... 103.6 ortg.... 95.1 ppg.. 91.0 pace.. 51.9 TS.. Jordan 43 of 89 pts.. (48%) vs 38-17 team and #1 defense


^^^^ So Lebron's peak performance at 40 is a joke compared to MJ's.

In addition to having inferior peak performance at 40, Lebron never dropped 51 and 45 in back-to-back games at 38 years old like Jordan did against the East champs (Nets) and Hornets.. Of course, Jordan 3-peated with 41 ppg, which is the goat peak..

[ShawkFactory]

It's crazy how much better LeBron is at 40 than Jordan.

It really is! He's been playing at an elite level these last couple of weeks. 31/10/10 on 72% TS

[3ba11]

It really is! He's been playing at an elite level these last couple of weeks. 31/10/10 on 72% TS


Since the "personal break" to get juiced up

It's a fact that the DEA was targeting a major PED distributor and this distributor was followed by investigators on multiple occasions to meetings with Randy Mims, the bestie of Lebron (Mims is literally "that guy" and the right hand man of Lebron since childhood).. The distributor admitted to investigators that he provided testosterone, HCG and blood draws to Mims for "weight loss".. Since Mims wasn't the target of the investigation, the DEA didn't investigate further regarding Mims but we know the "weight loss" excuse is a lie because a normal guy like Mims can go to a regular doctor for those exact items - the only reason he would access the black market is to protect a pro athlete... And btw, it wasn't just any black market - it was the biggest supplier of PED's to athletes ever.. Remember, Chael Sonnen wasn't joking about the EPO - there's ample evidence that he's the Lance Armstrong of the NBA but everyone is cool with it because they like him and think he doesn't cheat on his wife.. But carry on believing that Lebron is clean.. It's a free country

[SouBeachTalents]

It really is! He's been playing at an elite level these last couple of weeks. 31/10/10 on 72% TS
Those are damn near peak MJ numbers :D

[3ba11]

Those are damn near peak MJ numbers :D


^^^ which he never even achieved in his prime, thereby confirming that he's got gear on and also that it's a vastly easier era (as the numbers show above).

[3ba11]

Your post doest matter. Because if you watched the game, or even the highlights you'd understand why we all think you're high....or retarded. In this game Lebron was creating the same type of shots for himself Mj did in his game youve referenced.....except from 5-10 feet further out. Not to mention all the other absurb things Lebron did in this game. Apples to potatoes my boy.


If Jordan had teammates to score 65% of the points (instead of 52%) and a league that averaged 114 ppg (instead of 91), then he would have many 43 point games and far better stats than Lebron has right now.

[ShawkFactory]

Those are damn near peak MJ numbers :D

MJ never was that efficient, but I see your point!

[3ba11]

MJ never was that efficient, but I see your point!


MJ was never had a drive-heavy and ball-dominant skillset that boosts efficiency but reduces teammates to spot-up role, thereby preventing elite roster construction and requiring league-wide fraud/WWE to compete.

[RRR3]

MJ never was that efficient, but I see your point!
True and he definitely never faced as much defensive attention or the crazy level of competition LeBron is facing night in and night out.

[ShawkFactory]

MJ was never had a drive-heavy and ball-dominant skillset that boosts efficiency but reduces teammates to spot-up role, thereby preventing elite roster construction and requiring league-wide fraud/WWE to compete.

40 year old MJ went 12-18 with the Wizards despite having a former scoring champion and that guy Larry Hughes.

[sdot_thadon]

If Jordan had teammates to score 65% of the points (instead of 52%) and a league that averaged 114 ppg (instead of 91), then he would have many 43 point games and far better stats than Lebron has right now.

I don't understand how in TF that relates to the quoted, you're one weird dude. As I said in my previous post had you watched the game you'd see Lebron set him self up.for eerily similar jumpers to Mjs game you're parroting, yet from further away from the basket. Not to mention several dunks and homerun passes to teammates for easy buckets....oh and 17 boards. He showed up in a big way.

[sdot_thadon]

Those are damn near peak MJ numbers :D

No wonder he's been scaring 3ball shitless for more than a decade straight.

[SouBeachTalents]

MJ never was that efficient, but I see your point!
This is true, so slightly better than peak MJ. And he's doing this shit at 40.

[StrongLurk]

Lebron at 40:
26/8/9, 63.6 TS%, 22.6 gamescore, 122 ORTG

MJ at 40:
22/7/3, 50.3 TS%, 15.1 gamescore, 102 ORTG

Lebron has been the GOAT for a long time now. We can stop beating this dead horse.

[3ba11]

Lebron at 40:
26/8/9, 63.6 TS%, 22.6 gamescore, 122 ORTG

MJ at 40:
22/7/3, 50.3 TS%, 15.1 gamescore, 102 ORTG

Lebron has been the GOAT for a long time now. We can stop beating this dead horse.


Lebron's numbers are worse when we account for era, such as today's league allowing 18 more ppg and 10 more points per 100

And we're only talking peak performance - everything else is just context.. So when we compare their 40-point games, we see that MJ's was easily superior by virtue of 43 of 89 points vs 42 of 120, and it was against better opposition and tougher defensive format.

[StrongLurk]

Lebron's numbers are worse when we account for era, such as today's league allowing 18 more ppg and 10 more points per 100

And we're only talking peak performance - everything else is just context.. So when we compare their 40-point games, we see that MJ's was easily superior by virtue of 43 of 89 points vs 42 of 120, and it was against better opposition and tougher defensive format.

Wrong, plus MJ at 40 was playing 6 more minutes per game than Lebron at 40. Lebron is just better.

[SouBeachTalents]

Lebron at 40:
26/8/9, 63.6 TS%, 22.6 gamescore, 122 ORTG

MJ at 40:
22/7/3, 50.3 TS%, 15.1 gamescore, 102 ORTG

Lebron has been the GOAT for a long time now. We can stop beating this dead horse.
This is true, this debate's been over for a while now, it's only growing more lopsided with time.

[3ba11]

Wrong, plus MJ at 40 was playing 6 more minutes per game than Lebron at 40. Lebron is just better.


Just the fact that you need his performance at 40 shows the existing case of his prime years is insufficient.

But getting carried to a title by Luka this year or AD in 2020 doesn't add to a goat case... And getting swept in the WCF doesn't add to it either.

[ShawkFactory]

Just the fact that you need his performance at 40 shows the existing case of his prime years is insufficient.

But getting carried to a title by Luka this year or AD in 2020 doesn't add to a goat case... And getting swept in the WCF doesn't add to it either.

You're the one who made the thread :lol

[jlip]

I just read that LeBron is now both the youngest and the oldest player to have scored 40 points in a NBA game. Greatest "peaks" can be argued, but no player has been as consistently great for as long as he has been in league history. Only Kareem rivals him in that.

[3ba11]

.
Highest PPG for DPOY seasons

Jordan...... 35 ppg
Hakeem.... 27 ppg






Greatest "peaks" can be argued,





^^^ that's just something people say, but I never hear anyone make the case for Lebron's peak and why it's the goat peak.

We all know that Jordan's 41 ppg to 3-peat is the goat peak, or peak media accolades like MVP/DPOY (shown above)... But I've never heard a case made for Lebron's peak.. People just like to say "it's debatable" but then never actually make any case for it.. It's because it doesn't exist.






but no player has been as consistently great for as long as he has been in league history. Only Kareem rivals him in that.





Playing at a lower level for longer means..... literally nothing in the goat debate

[sdot_thadon]

.
Highest PPG for DPOY seasons

Jordan...... 35 ppg
Hakeem.... 27 ppg
^^ that's just something people say, but I never hear anyone make the case for Lebron's peak and why it's the goat peak.
Oh you mean the season they had to give Mj stunt double stats to help his case? And I've heard plenty arguments for Lebron having the greatest peak, hell he's been so good for so long that sub-arguments exist about when his peak actually occurred.


.Playing at a lower level for longer means..... literally nothing in the goat debate
Even if you believe Mj was better, it would be almost impossible to argue he wasnt (at bare minimum) nipping at his heels. That said almost double the amount of time at a marginally lower lever is probably better tbh. MJ was great and depending on the angle, definitely arguably the goat. But Lebron has done more than enough for his case to be just as strong. It's done, the fact that you're still here sifting through his stats at 40 should tell you everything you need to know.

[3ba11]

Oh you mean the season they had to give Mj stunt double stats to help his case? And I've heard plenty arguments for Lebron having the greatest peak, hell he's been so good for so long that sub-arguments exist about when his peak actually occurred.


Even if you believe Mj was better, it would be almost impossible to argue he wasnt (at bare minimum) nipping at his heels. That said almost double the amount of time at a marginally lower lever is probably better tbh. MJ was great and depending on the angle, definitely arguably the goat. But Lebron has done more than enough for his case to be just as strong. It's done, the fact that you're still here sifting through his stats at 40 should tell you everything you need to know.


Again, I've never heard a goat peak case made for Lebron.. Nick Wright once said something about being 2nd for DPOY in 2013 and also MVP & FMVP, but MJ was 3rd for DPOY and MVP/FMVP/scoring title in 92', with 35 ppg in Finals (25 for Lebron)... Jordan was also 2nd for DPOY in 93' and 3-peated with 41 ppg... Then of course there's the DPOY/MVP in 88', or 72 wins and FMVP/MVP/scoring title/1st team defense in 96' (and 98').

And you said that Lebron was at least "nipping at Jordan's heels?".. It would take Lebron another 50 years to match Jordan in 40 point games... At it's core, basketball is about putting the ball in the hole, which is why MJ is goat... The fact that he could score goat levels with great ball movement and chemistry/teammate performance is part of the reason he's the goat scorer, in addition to PPG

[1987_Lakers]

Holy shit, 3ball having an epic meltdown over here. :oldlol:

[1987_Lakers]

.
Highest PPG for DPOY seasons

Jordan...... 35 ppg
Hakeem.... 27 ppg

Fake DPOY, people have already gone back and watched the games & stated the NBA gifted him fake steals.

Carry on.

[Chick Stern]

Holy shit, 3ball having an epic meltdown over here. :oldlol:

He is really driving a bro truck

[3ba11]

Fake DPOY, people have already gone back and watched the games & stated the NBA gifted him fake steals.

Carry on.


^^^ And numerous people have found that Lebron's assists and turnovers are heavily misstated, such as Angry ol hoops, Uncut Hoops and others - they posted the video footage, yet it means nothing - no one gives a sh*t, just like a few bron fans claiming malarky about Jordan.

Also, all of MJ's Finals opponents are equal or better than the Baby Thunder, old Spurs, 11' Mavs, and Butler's Heat, so Lebron's 4 chips with 2 star teammates is objectively inferior to MJ's 6 chips with 1 star teammate.. And the 98' Jazz actually demolished Duncan's Spurs after sweeping Shaq's 4 all-star Lakers.. So the comp argument holds no water - MJ would sweep any team in history with a 3rd star teammate like Lebron enjoyed from 11-17' (3-4), or a modern Duncan like 20-24' (1-5).

[1987_Lakers]

^^^ And numerous people have found that Lebron's assists and turnovers are heavily misstated, such as Angry ol hoops, Uncut Hoops and others - they posted the video footage, yet it means nothing - no one gives a sh*t, just like a few bron fans claiming malarky about Jordan.

Also, all of MJ's Finals opponents are equal or better than the Baby Thunder, old Spurs, 11' Mavs, and Butler's Heat, so Lebron's 4 chips with 2 star teammates is objectively inferior to MJ's 6 chips with 1 star teammate.. And the 98' Jazz actually demolished Duncan's Spurs after sweeping Shaq's 4 all-star Lakers.. So the comp argument holds no water - MJ would sweep any team in history with a 3rd star teammate like Lebron enjoyed from 11-17' (3-4), or a modern Duncan like 20-24' (1-5).

So you admit MJ's DPOY award is a fraud.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MD2kOti016U&t

[Meticode]

OP mad

[3ba11]

OP mad


No because all my narratives continue to be proven by unfolding events

I've always claimed that bron-ball's bad chemistry requirs the most talent, and this continues to be confirmed with Lebron's latest team-up with an opposing franchise player.. This will be the 4th teammate to carry Lebron, since Wade led the Heat in the 11' Playoffs, while AD carried the Lakers to the 20' Finals and Kyrie outplayed the MVP.. Luka also made the Finals without Lebron, just like Kyrie, Wade and Love.

[Phoenix]

Lol.

[Meticode]

No because all my narratives continue to be proven by unfolding events

I've always claimed that bron-ball's bad chemistry requirs the most talent, and this continues to be confirmed with Lebron's latest team-up with an opposing franchise player.. This will be the 4th teammate to carry Lebron, since Wade led the Heat in the 11' Playoffs, while AD carried the Lakers to the 20' Finals and Kyrie outplayed the MVP.. Luka also made the Finals without Lebron, just like Kyrie, Wade and Love.
There's so much anger in your words.

[HylianNightmare]

Facts

[sdot_thadon]

No because all my narratives continue to be proven by unfolding events

I've always claimed that bron-ball's bad chemistry requirs the most talent, and this continues to be confirmed with Lebron's latest team-up with an opposing franchise player.. This will be the 4th teammate to carry Lebron, since Wade led the Heat in the 11' Playoffs, while AD carried the Lakers to the 20' Finals and Kyrie outplayed the MVP.. Luka also made the Finals without Lebron, just like Kyrie, Wade and Love.

Your narratives are trash. Just read back your own post I'm quoting and see the stupid gold medal mental gymnastics you've got to do just to complete your post. You'd think after a million of them m'fers (posts) you could form a solid thought that doesn't undercut itself by the end of the post.

You do realize the same 2011 playoffs Wade supposedly carried Lebron in are also the same 2011 playoffs that the 1st serious Mj comparisons were born for Lebron right? The days leading into the finals.... so lets just say its implied that Wade carried Lebron in tbe finals....then with AD you shift to carried to the finals obviously because Lebron was the FMVP, ditto with Kyrie you then have lower your argument to outplayed the mvp lol. And the last line? Laughable because Lebron also made the finals himself without any of them, so what does that prove? If you're going to post this much you need to give more effort and give us real shit to discuss.

[Full Court]

Your narratives are trash. Just read back your own post I'm quoting and see the stupid gold medal mental gymnastics you've got to do just to complete your post. You'd think after a million of them m'fers (posts) you could form a solid thought that doesn't undercut itself by the end of the post.

You do realize the same 2011 playoffs Wade supposedly carried Lebron in are also the same 2011 playoffs that the 1st serious Mj comparisons were born for Lebron right? The days leading into the finals.... so lets just say its implied that Wade carried Lebron in tbe finals....then with AD you shift to carried to the finals obviously because Lebron was the FMVP, ditto with Kyrie you then have lower your argument to outplayed the mvp lol. And the last line? Laughable because Lebron also made the finals himself without any of them, so what does that prove? If you're going to post this much you need to give more effort and give us real shit to discuss.

You do realize that Lebron in the 2011 finals was the worst choke job of all time, right? And that it knocked him out of any kind of GOAT contention?

[sdot_thadon]

You do realize that Lebron in the 2011 finals was the worst choke job of all time, right? And that it knocked him out of any kind of GOAT contention?

That's your company line to ride with. Not mine. There's no event that can eliminate someone form goat contention, that's just childish thinking, especially when your talking about a career spanning 2 decades. And incase you've been under a rock the last near 15 years apparently the reports of his goat cases' demise were greatly exaggerated. It's still going strong in 2025 no matter how much you hate it.

[1987_Lakers]

That's your company line to ride with. Not mine. There's no event that can eliminate someone form goat contention, that's just childish thinking, especially when your talking about a career spanning 2 decades. And incase you've been under a rock the last near 15 years apparently the reports of his goat cases' demise were greatly exaggerated. It's still going strong in 2025 no matter how much you hate it.

https://media.tenor.com/A0REOBRcXzcAAAAM/black-boy-reaction.gif

[sdot_thadon]

https://media.tenor.com/A0REOBRcXzcAAAAM/black-boy-reaction.gif

Like seriously what goes through these nimrods' heads that they say he doesn't have a case or it ain't even close.....yet they've been arguing and defending Mjs honor against him for 15 years? It's like standing outside soaking wet, refusing to admit it's raining lol.