Proof that Reaves is borderline All-NBA and Lebron is holding him back

[3ba11]

.

2025 Reaves WITH Lebron................... 18.2 on 44% (https://www.statmuse.com/nba/ask/austin-reaves-stats-with-lebron-james-this-season)
2025 Reaves WITHOUT Lebron............. 28.5 on 48% (https://www.statmuse.com/ask?query=austin+reaves+stats+without+lebron+james +this+season&preferred_domain=nba&direct=true&l=&t=1742133986573)

2024 Reaves WITH Lebron'...,............... 15.2 on 47% (https://www.statmuse.com/nba/ask/austin-reaves-stats-with-lebron-james-last-season)
2024 Reaves WITHOUT Lebron........,.... 19.5 on 53% (https://www.statmuse.com/nba/ask/austin-reaves-stats-without-lebron-james-last-season)


Austin Reaves is clearly a borderline All-NBA player and should easily be an all-star by now - he averaged 29/9/7 without Lebron this season (18 ppg with Lebron), so it's only Lebron holding him back.. This is similar to Bosh, Love, Hughes, Jamison, Westbrook, Ingram and others cratering alongside Lebron.. The massive gap in performance for all these guys (20-40% lower ppg and apg alongside Lebron) contrasts with the Pippen's scoring barely declining alongside MJ (5-10%), while his assists increased 15%.

And we know why Lebron's teammates crater alongside him, while Jordan's teammates play near their career highs (capacity)... It's because Lebron's skillset of primary ballhandling at high scoring levels entails many unassisted buckets/solo missions that leave teammates standing in spot-up roles (increases their assisted rate), which lowers their apg and ppg.. Lower teammate assists causes low assist teams over time, and therefore deficits in team assists for every playoff loss of Lebron's career.

Since deficits in team assists occurred in literally every series loss of his playoff career, Lebron's skillset of imposing spot-up roles, low assist teams and the associated bad chemistry/teammate performance is the primary weakness of his game, in addition to turnovers, FT's, offensive rebounds, clutch efficiency (choking) and competitive mindset (colludes and allows disrespect).. Ultimately, Lebron's "ball-dominator" skillset of imposing spot-up roles prevents elite roster construction, young player development, and good chemistry/teammate performance, so he can't win with normal rosters of 1 franchise player or produce the best basketball as 1st option (dynasty or dominant champion), aka 0 for 12 (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?520804-le50-000&p=14986534&viewfull=1#post14986534).

[ShawkFactory]

True. Get Lebron and Luka out of there and let’s see how far he can take a team. Spoiler alert…it won’t be much.

[SouBeachTalents]

True. Get Lebron and Luka out of there and let’s see how far he can take a team. Spoiler alert…it won’t be much.
Meanwhile, Pippen lead the Bulls to 55 wins without Jordan.

[Nb1]

Lost 4 straight with Bron injured and Reaves takiing over after a 8 game winning streak :facepalm

Lakers are praying Bron comes back healthy, they would be last in the league without him.

[Chick Stern]

Meanwhile, Pippen lead the Bulls to 55 wins without Jordan.*

*during the weakest NBA era

[RRR3]

Austin Reaves :roll: :roll: :roll:


LeBron ruined poor Snivelly’s life.

[Keno]

more like lebron elevated reaves into this monster, GOAT :applause:

[Wardell Curry]

Friendly reminder that Bradley Beal got a max contract from the Wizards with a no trade clause.

[Full Court]

True. Get Lebron and Luka out of there and let’s see how far he can take a team. Spoiler alert…it won’t be much.

You mean because of how far Lebron has taken them the last four years?

[Neal Romer]

Whats interesting about the Lakers is the fact that they...



This post is hidden behind a pay wall. Please see site administrator to unlock content.

[Im so nba'd out]

https://i.postimg.cc/QdBxq8LF/X9VOgk9.jpg

[Full Court]

Whats interesting about the Lakers is the fact that they...

Agree 100%. Blew my mind when I saw that.

[FKAri]

1993 Pippen WITH MJ................... 18.6 on 48%
1994 Pippen WITHOUT MJ............. 22.0 on 52%

[Phoenix]

Player 1
Year 1: 8/4/2 46/17/58
Year 2: 14/5/4 48/27/67
Year 3: 17/7/5 49/25/68
Year 4: 18/7/6 52/31/71

'Developed'


Player 2
Year 1: 7/3/2 46/32/84
Year 2: 13/3/3 53/40/86
Year 3: 16/6/4 49/37/85
Year 4: 19/6/4 44/36/87

'Held back'

[RRR3]

Player 1
Year 1: 8/4/2 46/17/58
Year 2: 14/5/4 48/27/67
Year 3: 17/7/5 49/25/68
Year 4: 18/7/6 52/31/71

'Developed'


Player 2
Year 1: 7/3/2 46/32/84
Year 2: 13/3/3 53/40/86
Year 3: 16/6/4 49/37/85
Year 4: 19/6/4 44/36/87

'Held back'
:roll:

[RRR3]

Duh-uh-uh-uh-uh-uhhhh-uhhhhhh-uhhhh
:roll:

[3ba11]

Player 1
Year 1: 8/4/2 46/17/58
Year 2: 14/5/4 48/27/67
Year 3: 17/7/5 49/25/68
Year 4: 18/7/6 52/31/71

'Developed'


Player 2
Year 1: 7/3/2 46/32/84
Year 2: 13/3/3 53/40/86
Year 3: 16/6/4 49/37/85
Year 4: 19/6/4 44/36/87

'Held back'


Reaves peak capability is 29/9/7 without Lebron, so Lebron craters him to 18/7/5 and no all-star, while Pippen reached his peak PPG + APG alongside Jordan and reached all-star.

Secondly, AD joined the team at the same time as rookie Reaves in 2020 and lifted a lottery team to champion.. So AD developed Reaves by being the highly-assisted player and all-time assist target that put the ball in Reaves' hands, while Lebron is the solo mission ball-dominator that puts Reaves in the corner and reduced his assists

[SouBeachTalents]

Player 1
Year 1: 8/4/2 46/17/58
Year 2: 14/5/4 48/27/67
Year 3: 17/7/5 49/25/68
Year 4: 18/7/6 52/31/71

'Developed'


Player 2
Year 1: 7/3/2 46/32/84
Year 2: 13/3/3 53/40/86
Year 3: 16/6/4 49/37/85
Year 4: 19/6/4 44/36/87

'Held back'
Kill shot.

[RRR3]

Kill shot.
I don't think there's a LeBron-related thread he's made in which he hasn't got destroyed in. Maybe that's his intention though

[3ba11]

Kill shot.


Only if you're satisfied with a wrong answer and want to claim victory anyway

Reaves's peak is 29/9 but only 18/5 with Lebron, while Pippen's highs were the same with or without Jordan.. And AD is responsible for the little growth that Reaves had.

But go ahead and pretend you won even though you were destroyed and made to look dumb as usual.

[3ba11]

I don't think there's a LeBron-related thread he's made in which he hasn't got destroyed in. Maybe that's his intention though


Yes keep pretending - the OP numbers are what they are - Lebron destroys Reaves compared to Reaves' true capability (30 ppg)

[RRR3]

Only if you're satisfied with a wrong answer and want to claim victory anyway

Reaves's peak is 29/9 but only 18/5 with Lebron, while Pippen's highs were the same with or without Jordan.. And AD is responsible for the little growth that Reaves had.

But go ahead and pretend you won even though you were destroyed and made to look dumb as usual.
You were voted the most destroyed poster in basketball discussions in the board's history :lol

[Phoenix]

Bullshit, bullshit, spinning in circles, yadda yadda, more bullshit.



Best thing you've said in the thread.

[SouBeachTalents]

I don't think there's a LeBron-related thread he's made in which he hasn't got destroyed in. Maybe that's his intention though
This is true, but it goes well beyond LeBron-related topics. I think we can all remember the way he completely humiliated himself calling Curry the most overrated ever to top 5 in a span of 2 weeks.

[RRR3]

This is true, but it goes well beyond LeBron-related topics. I think we can all remember the way he completely humiliated himself calling Curry the most overrated ever to top 5 in a span of 2 weeks.
True but I feel like there are times he hasn't been embarrassed when he decided to talk about something besides LeBron so I didn't want to speak definitively.

[sdot_thadon]

Only if you're satisfied with a wrong answer and want to claim victory anyway

Reaves's peak is 29/9 but only 18/5 with Lebron, while Pippen's highs were the same with or without Jordan.. And AD is responsible for the little growth that Reaves had.

But go ahead and pretend you won even though you were destroyed and made to look dumb as usual.

Boi you got nuked, go sit in the corner and watch these posters ridicule you for another stupid ass thread. Congrats.

[Phoenix]

I love how Austin Reaves' '29/9 capacity without Lebron' is a 7 game sample size, bolstered by two games of 45 and 37 where neither Lebron or Luka were playing, so he's literally the only consistent offensive weapon. And this is supposed to be inarguable evidence that he would drop those numbers( which are basically MVP stats) over 82 games being a teams defensive focus night in, night out.

If Dalton Knecht has a better 2nd year, since AD will have missed most of his rookie season we can then look forward to Dorian-Finny Smith being credited for his development.

[RRR3]

I love how Austin Reaves' '29/9 capacity without Lebron' is a 7 game sample size, bolstered by two games of 45 and 37 where neither Lebron or Luka were playing, so he's literally the only consistent offensive weapon. And this is supposed to be inarguable evidence that he would drop those numbers( which are basically MVP stats) over 82 games being a teams defensive focus night in, night out.

If Dalton Knecht has a better 2nd year, since AD will have missed most of his rookie season we can then look forward to Dorian-Finny Smith being credited for his development.
LeBron drove Snivelly insane long ago, he's just foaming at the mouth atp.

[Full Court]

:roll:


I don't think there's a LeBron-related thread he's made in which he hasn't got destroyed in. Maybe that's his intention though


You were voted the most destroyed poster in basketball discussions in the board's history :lol


True but I feel like there are times he hasn't been embarrassed when he decided to talk about something besides LeBron so I didn't want to speak definitively.


LeBron drove Snivelly insane long ago, he's just foaming at the mouth atp.

:roll: WOW! Just look at this epic bitch fit.

No wonder he's neck and neck for biggest loser on ISH.

:lebronamazed:

[ShawkFactory]

You mean because of how far Lebron has taken them the last four years?

Hmm. You might have stumped me there.

Think what the Lakers were when Bron was out half the year and then multiply that by 2. Basically, the Austin Reaves Lakers would be fighting for the 12th seed in the conference.

[Full Court]

Hmm. You might have stumped me there.

Think what the Lakers were when Bron was out half the year and then multiply that by 2. Basically, the Austin Reaves Lakers would be fighting for the 12th seed in the conference.

The Lakers have a waayyyyyyyy better team than when Lebron sat out half a year. Come on, man, you know that.

[ShawkFactory]

The Lakers have a waayyyyyyyy better team than when Lebron sat out half a year. Come on, man, you know that.

Ahhh got ya. So Lebron missed almost half the year in 2022 on a bad team and they didn’t make the playoffs. Makes sense.

Glad you cleared that one up for me buddy :cheers:

[SouBeachTalents]

Ahhh got ya. So Lebron missed almost half the year in 2022 on a bad team and they didn’t make the playoffs. Makes sense.

Glad you cleared that one up for me buddy :cheers:
No, they were actually a superteam in 2022. This current team is way better than that one is what he's saying.

[PeroAntic]

Ultimately, op is a massive idiot. Thinks basketball is only about ppg/apg and constantly compares apples and oranges with no regard for context. Just shut up already you oblivious fool.

[Full Court]

Ahhh got ya. So Lebron missed almost half the year in 2022 on a bad team and they didn’t make the playoffs. Makes sense.

Glad you cleared that one up for me buddy :cheers:

2022 weren't a bad team by any stretch of the imagination. Let me rephrase that. They SHOULDN'T have been a bad team. They were the most underachieving team in the history of the sport. (KD's Nets were the second most underachieving, but that's neither here nor there)

And yes, this Lakers team is even better. Happy to help you out.

[ShawkFactory]

2022 weren't a bad team by any stretch of the imagination. Let me rephrase that. They SHOULDN'T have been a bad team. They were the most underachieving team in the history of the sport. (KD's Nets were the second most underachieving, but that's neither here nor there)

And yes, this Lakers team is even better. Happy to help you out.

Oh damn. Why do you think they underachieved?

[Full Court]

Oh damn. Why do you think they underachieved?

Pretty sure the preseason odds had them winning the West and had them second to win the title.

Would you not call failing to make even the play-in underachievement?

[sdot_thadon]

Oh damn. Why do you think they underachieved?

You're going to have to help him out here, he's a bit as they say "slow".

[RRR3]

You're going to have to help him out here, he's a bit as they say "slow".
He's genuinely the stupidest person on this board right now by quite a distance, which is REALLY saying something. Well coin24 is arguably dumber but he doesn't really post. Of the active posters though? No one can "outdumb" Full Court. Case in point, he's almost going to certainly respond to what I just wrote with some variation of "THIS BRONIE FLUFFER HAVING A BITCH FIT :roll:"

[Full Court]

He's genuinely the stupidest person on this board right now by quite a distance, which is REALLY saying something. Well coin24 is arguably dumber but he doesn't really post. Of the active posters though? No one can "outdumb" Full Court. Case in point, he's almost going to certainly respond to what I just wrote with some variation of "THIS BRONIE FLUFFER HAVING A BITCH FIT :roll:"


:roll: He knows he's a Bronie fluffer having a bitch fit, and he just can't stop himself.

It has to do with his abnormally high estrogen levels. The truth sure hurts.

:lebronamazed:

[Full Court]

You're going to have to help him out here, he's a bit as they say "slow".

I guess you've got nothing on the below, huh?


Pretty sure the preseason odds had them winning the West and had them second to win the title.

Would you not call failing to make even the play-in underachievement?


:roll: This is too easy.

[1987_Lakers]

https://i.postimg.cc/QdBxq8LF/X9VOgk9.jpg

You are being too generous, most of these LeBron haters haven't been laid in years.

[ShawkFactory]

Pretty sure the preseason odds had them winning the West and had them second to win the title.

Would you not call failing to make even the play-in underachievement?

I didn't say it was or wasn't an underachievement. You said it was, so I'm asking you why you think they underachieved. Like what caused the underachievement.

[sdot_thadon]

I guess you've got nothing on the below, huh?




:roll: This is too easy.

Aka:


uh i cant answer the question.....therefore i am the winner.

What a dunce. The fact you know the preseason odds also tells us you knew what the odds shifted to and why. You can either play stupid or be stupid. Still stupid.

[tpols]

I do wonder what would happen if you let Reaves play the "Luka" role. He clearly has elite, dynamic QB ability an can score from anywhere. Like an athletic J̌eff Hornacek with a handle.

[sdot_thadon]

I do wonder what would happen if you let Reaves play the "Luka" role. He clearly has elite, dynamic QB ability an can score from anywhere. Like an athletic J̌eff Hornacek with a handle.

He'd hold his own but there's still levels to this thing.

[Phoenix]

I do wonder what would happen if you let Reaves play the "Luka" role. He clearly has elite, dynamic QB ability an can score from anywhere. Like an athletic J̌eff Hornacek with a handle.

That's funny you mention him, because I was trying to think of an old school version of Reaves and that's who I thought of ( I actually looked up some youtube clips last night as a refresher). Hornachek had a lot of weird, quirky off the wrong foot layups and floaters though, and more of a natural shooter especially in the mid-range coming off screens/catch and shoots.

[RRR3]

Reaves is solid but without LeBron’s guidance he would be a scrub.

This is what snivelly says about MJ And Pippen btw.

[StrongLurk]

Pip went 6/6 in the finals. No one in the 3-point era has done better than that.

[Hey Yo]

Pip went 6/6 in the finals. No one in the 3-point era has done better than that.

LeBron has his own dynasty as first option going 3 for 5 with 3 fmvp's from 2012-2016

[Phoenix]

The best part of this is 3bot giving AD the credit for 'developing' Reaves. For one, it assumes that Reaves given time and experience wasn't going to become a very good player on his own merits, regardless of who he played with. Second, the assertion and I quote:

"AD developed Reaves by being the highly-assisted player and all-time assist target that put the ball in Reaves' hands"

How can Lebron being a ball-dominator and Reaves having the ball in his hands, sharing the same court on the same team, be mutually inclusive? By definition if someone is dominating the ball, no-one else is going to have it long enough to develop anything from a facilitating standpoint. So what is the argument here? That Reaves overcame Lebron's ball dominance to develop some exclusive synergy with AD, and this in turn solely elevated Reaves as a playmaker? Bear in mind that Reaves is a career 4apg player, so how many times per game has he connected with AD over the years? Let's not forget that AD missed like 70 games during Reaves first two seasons, and Reaves wasn't even a regular starter until his third year. It takes an incredible level of mental gymnastics to mindfukk oneself in thinking there's any logic in an 'AD developed Reaves' argument.

[RRR3]

The best part of this is 3bot giving AD the credit for 'developing' Reaves. For one, it assumes that Reaves given time and experience wasn't going to become a very good player on his own merits, regardless of who he played with. Second, the assertion and I quote:

"AD developed Reaves by being the highly-assisted player and all-time assist target that put the ball in Reaves' hands"

How can Lebron being a ball-dominator and Reaves having the ball in his hands, sharing the same court on the same team, be mutually inclusive? By definition if someone is dominating the ball, no-one else is going to have it long enough to develop anything from a facilitating standpoint. So what is the argument here? That Reaves overcame Lebron's ball dominance to develop some exclusive synergy with AD, and this in turn solely elevated Reaves as a playmaker? Bear in mind that Reaves is a career 4apg player, so how many times per game over has he connected with AD over the years? Let's not forget that AD missed like 70 games during Reaves first two seasons, and Reaves wasn't even a regular starter until his third year. It takes an incredible level of mental gymnastics to mindfukk oneself in thinking there's any logic in an 'AD developed Reaves' argument.
Once you realize snivelly is retarded things make more sense. He's shockingly stupid.

[Full Court]

I didn't say it was or wasn't an underachievement. You said it was, so I'm asking you why you think they underachieved. Like what caused the underachievement.

Ah, are you actually interested in my take on it, or are you trolling?

[ShawkFactory]

Ah, are you actually interested in my take on it, or are you trolling?

Well YOU’RE trolling always, and I’m curious to hear you break it down, yes.

[Full Court]

Well YOU’RE trolling always, and I’m curious to hear you break it down, yes.

The '22 Lakers are a perfect example of a team being less than the sum of their parts. The opposite of synergy. As I pointed out, they were betting favorites to win the West before the season started, so on paper they had a lot of talent. I see a few factors leading to their underachievement. In no particular order:

-Davis didn't have a great year. He also only played 40 games.

-Lebron and Westbrook were terrible together. They didn't mesh at all on the court. Both of them were worse when on the court at the same time as the other.

-Lakers had atrocious defense. Lebron, Carmelo, Westbrook, and Monk were mediocre on the defensive end at best. This was the year that Lebron really started sandbagging on defense. Reaves was a rookie, and his defense sucked too. He's improved a lot since then. AD and Dwight Howard were carrying the entire defensive load...when they were playing.

-Vogel was changing the lineup on a game-by-game basis. It seemed like he was still experimenting post all star break. The team never really had a chance to get into a groove. So even though they had a lot of good shooters and scorers, they never developed the team chemistry to maximize those assets.

That's my take.

[sdot_thadon]

The '22 Lakers are a perfect example of a team being less than the sum of their parts. The opposite of synergy. As I pointed out, they were betting favorites to win the West before the season started, so on paper they had a lot of talent. I see a few factors leading to their underachievement. In no particular order:

-Davis didn't have a great year. He also only played 40 games.

-Lebron and Westbrook were terrible together. They didn't mesh at all on the court. Both of them were worse when on the court at the same time as the other.

-Lakers had atrocious defense. Lebron, Carmelo, Westbrook, and Monk were mediocre on the defensive end at best. This was the year that Lebron really started sandbagging on defense. Reaves was a rookie, and his defense sucked too. He's improved a lot since then. AD and Dwight Howard were carrying the entire defensive load...when they were playing.

-Vogel was changing the lineup on a game-by-game basis. It seemed like he was still experimenting post all star break. The team never really had a chance to get into a groove. So even though they had a lot of good shooters and scorers, they never developed the team chemistry to maximize those assets.

That's my take.

Lebron played only 56 games himself. Their 2 best players .missed a combined 60 something, almost 70 games. That's not underachieving that's unavailable. Stupid is as stupid does full dork.

[Full Court]

Lebron played only 56 games himself. Their 2 best players .missed a combined 60 something, almost 70 games. That's not underachieving that's unavailable. Stupid is as stupid does full dork.

You either have a short memory or you didn't watch the games. The Lakers sucked when Lebron and AD were playing, and they sucked when they weren't playing. Their issues were far deeper than that.

You can keep throwing bitch fits though. It's kind of cute.

[sdot_thadon]

You either have a short memory or you didn't watch the games. The Lakers sucked when Lebron and AD were playing, and they sucked when they weren't playing. Their issues were far deeper than that.

You can keep throwing bitch fits though. It's kind of cute.

And you can keep getting exposed with each reply as always. If your 2 best players don't play enough, how could a team even begin to gel? Find an identity? Set a rotation? I swear some of you guys preoccupation with that dude supersedes any basketball knowledge or even common sense. Who enjoys getting creamed all over a forum everytime they post? Full Dork.

[Full Court]

And you can keep getting exposed with each reply as always. If your 2 best players don't play enough, how could a team even begin to gel? Find an identity? Set a rotation? I swear some of you guys preoccupation with that dude supersedes any basketball knowledge or even common sense. Who enjoys getting creamed all over a forum everytime they post? Full Dork.

:roll: ^Bronie fluffer in a full meltdown. You can keep trying to do damage control all you want, but in '22 Lebron was the only player in the history of the sport to lead a super team to the lottery. Think about it. He led a SUPER TEAM to the LOTTERY.


:lebronamazed:

[sdot_thadon]

:roll: ^Bronie fluffer in a full meltdown. You can keep trying to do damage control all you want, but in '22 Lebron was the only player in the history of the sport to lead a super team to the lottery. Think about it. He led a SUPER TEAM to the LOTTERY.


:lebronamazed:

Wash. Rinse. Repeat. Lose an argument due to lack of mental dexterity and pretend like you won. I've never seen a player cause mental illness in haters like Lebron. No wonder people are starting to believe hes the goat. Now go sit your ass down in the corner somewhere until you've got a proper reply to the discussion.

[3ba11]

Ranked by scoring ability

1. Austin Reaves
2. Garland
3. Jaylen Brown


This shows that the Lakers are BY FAR the most stacked team in the league and it will PERMENANTLY disqualify Luka and Lebron from a top all-time ranking if they don't win this year

[RRR3]

Ranked as scorers

1. Austin Reaves
2. Garland
3. Jaylen Brown


This shows that the Lakers are BY FAR the most stacked team in the league and it will PERMENANTLY disqualify Luka and Lebron from a top all-time ranking if they don't win this year
Your nickname is snivelly.

[3ba11]

Your nickname is snivelly.


And you don't have one because you aren't noteworthy

[RRR3]

And you don't have one because you aren't noteworthy
Being noteworthy for whining constantly is something you’re proud of?

[ShawkFactory]

Ranked by scoring ability

1. Austin Reaves
2. Garland
3. Jaylen Brown


This shows that the Lakers are BY FAR the most stacked team in the league and it will PERMENANTLY disqualify Luka and Lebron from a top all-time ranking if they don't win this year

*Well isn't that convenient for you*- White Goodman

[ImKobe]

Best 3rd option in the league but we been known that.

[Real Men Wear Green]

Best 3rd option in the league but we been known that.
If he is... and Doncic/Davis is an elite player... and they have James...

Why are the Lakers only the seventh-best record in the NBA?

[tpols]

If he is... and Doncic/Davis is an elite player... and they have James...

Why are the Lakers only the seventh-best record in the NBA?

Mostly because their 4-8 rotation has been below average. And injuries throughout the year to their top 3. And playing in a tougher Western conference.

[3ba11]

Mostly because their 4-8 rotation has been below average. And injuries throughout the year to their top 3. And playing in a tougher Western conference.


Poppycock.

The current 4-12 spots have seen 5x the turnover as any other team over the last 6 years, so that part of the rotation is the most tweaked and vetted cast in the league.. So it sounds like you're watching way too much TV.. Get outside or something, smh.. wow.. what a crazy thing to say.. Should we list all the good players that weren't good enough to make that part of the rotation for the Lakers (Dinwiddie, Prince, Drummond, Caruso, KCP - the list is all-but endless)

[RRR3]

Poppycock.

The current 4-12 spots have seen 5x the turnover as any other team over the last 6 years, so that part of the rotation is the most tweaked and vetted cast in the league.. So it sounds like you're watching way too much TV.. Get outside or something, smh.. wow.. what a crazy thing to say.. Should we list all the good players that weren't good enough to make that part of the rotation for the Lakers (Dinwiddie, Prince, Drummond, Caruso, KCP - the list is all-but endless)
You’re dumb enough to think Drummond is good :lol

















Dim :(

[sdot_thadon]

Ranked by scoring ability

1. Austin Reaves
2. Garland
3. Jaylen Brown


This shows that the Lakers are BY FAR the most stacked team in the league and it will PERMENANTLY disqualify Luka and Lebron from a top all-time ranking if they don't win this year

It must be excruciating for you to watch Lebrons greatness and know that a useless post like this is about as much as you or Mj can do about it. I've never heard of anyone in any sport ever supposedly "disqualified " from a debate until Lebron. He very well may be the goat if that's what it takes to have an upper hand in a discussion about him......

[ImKobe]

If he is... and Doncic/Davis is an elite player... and they have James...

Why are the Lakers only the seventh-best record in the NBA?

Lack of depth and having too many poor defenders out on the court at the same time. 2nd unit has struggled all season and that's even with James leading that pack.

[Real Men Wear Green]

So you can team a first team AllNBA caliber player (Davis/Doncic), an AllNBA player (James) and the best third option in the league together but somehow not be elite because of the second- string point guard?

Is there any value in the big three being better if the team isn't actually better? If these guys were elite you wouldn't have to be making excuses because they would be winning. Somehow you see the importance of defence when it comes time to make excuses but get to ignore it when saying the Lakers have the best big three.

[ImKobe]

So you can team a first team AllNBA caliber player (Davis/Doncic), an AllNBA player (James) and the best third option in the league together but somehow not be elite because of the second- string point guard?

Is there any value in the big three being better if the team isn't actually better? If these guys were elite you wouldn't have to be making excuses because they would be winning. Somehow you see the importance of defence when it comes time to make excuses but get to ignore it when saying the Lakers have the best big three.

They're 42 - 25 despite the injuries and despite not having key role players and Bron/AD for significant stretches in the season and it's not a weak 42 - 25 either they're 19 - 14 vs. teams above .500 which is the 4th best record behind CLE/BOS/OKC.

[Real Men Wear Green]

They're 42 - 25 despite the injuries and despite not having key role players and Bron/AD for significant stretches in the season and it's not a weak 42 - 25 either they're 19 - 14 vs. teams above .500 which is the 4th best record behind CLE/BOS/OKC.
Lots of teams have injuries and could turn to that excuse. The losses vs teams all count regardless of record. That 19-14 gets you absolutely nothing.

[tpols]

So you can team a first team AllNBA caliber player (Davis/Doncic), an AllNBA player (James) and the best third option in the league together but somehow not be elite because of the second- string point guard?

Is there any value in the big three being better if the team isn't actually better? If these guys were elite you wouldn't have to be making excuses because they would be winning. Somehow you see the importance of defence when it comes time to make excuses but get to ignore it when saying the Lakers have the best big three.

It's much more than about the 2nd string point guard and more about... literally 40% of the starting lineup and the whole bench. Which is... half the team.

Combine that with the fact Luka, AD, and Lebron have all missed signifigant time this year as the 1-3.

It doesnt take a rocket scientist to see why they don't have a top seed despite their top end talent.

[Real Men Wear Green]

It's much more than about the 2nd string point guard and more about... literally 40% of the starting lineup and the whole bench. Which is... half the team.

Combine that with the fact Luka, AD, and Lebron have all missed signifigant time this year as the 1-3.

It doesnt take a rocket scientist to see why they don't have a top seed despite their top end talent. The excuse-making continues. Chet Holmgren hasn't missed games? Aaron Gordon hasn't missed games? And you guys love to point at one star player as the reason why a team wins and loses. So here we have 60% of the starting line--up supposed to be the best 60% in the league but no they aren't as good as teams with allegedly inferior cores because of the guys that aren't supposed to have a much impact on winning as the top 3 players.

More excuses incoming I'm sure.

[ImKobe]

Lots of teams have injuries and could turn to that excuse. The losses vs teams all count regardless of record. That 19-14 gets you absolutely nothing.

Reaves is the best 3rd option in the league.

[RRR3]

Reaves is the best 3rd option in the league.
STUMPED :roll: :roll: :roll:

[Full Court]

Wash. Rinse. Repeat. Lose an argument due to lack of mental dexterity and pretend like you won. I've never seen a player cause mental illness in haters like Lebron. No wonder people are starting to believe hes the goat. Now go sit your ass down in the corner somewhere until you've got a proper reply to the discussion.

I made my case, and you refuted none of it. All you can do is get angry and upset by the truth. The fact is, Lebron has done more underachieving in his career than any other "great." That's why you guys are always complaining about his help. You can mad when he doesn't get carried.

But keep on crying. It'll help you feel better. :lol

[Real Men Wear Green]

Reaves is the best 3rd option in the league. The Lakers wouldn't trade him for Evan Mobley?

[RRR3]

The Lakers wouldn't trade him for Evan Mobley?
They'd trade him for Chet Holmgren and Desmond Bane too. Porzingis they would as well if he wasn't constantly injured.

[Real Men Wear Green]

They'd trade him for Chet Holmgren and Desmond Bane too. Porzingis they would as well if he wasn't constantly injured.
I was taking it slowly. Instead of mentioning KP directly I was eventually going to ask him where Reaves would rank in the Celtics' hierarchy. His answer to that question might be good for a laugh.

[3ba11]

The Lakers wouldn't trade him for Evan Mobley?


The Lakers' 3rd option is comparable to OKC's 2nd, which is telling of the Lakers superior talent... This is just like the 16' Cavs, whose 2nd option was good enough to outplay Curry and young MJ to put Luka and Lebron over the top

[tpols]

It's not an excuse... the Lakers have been a rotation of mid to trash 4-8 throughout the year. And their top guys have all factually missed a lot of time on top of that.

Lebron / Luka / Reaves has a very good argument as top trio in the league. They just need to be healthy and playing. Which should be obvious to you.

[Real Men Wear Green]

It's not an excuse... the Lakers have been a rotation of mid to trash 4-8 throughout the year. And their top guys have all factually missed a lot of time on top of that.

Lebron / Luka / Reaves has a very good argument as top trio in the league. They just need to be healthy and playing. Which should be obvious to you.Kristaps Porzingis, the guy you think is the Celtics most important player has missed 35 games. Jrue Holiday, another starter, has missed 16 games. Jaylen Brown has missed 12 games. But somehow they don't need to make these excuses.

[tpols]

Kristaps Porzingis, the guy you think is the Celtics most important player has missed 35 games. Jrue Holiday, another starter, has missed 16 games. Jaylen Brown has missed 12 games. But somehow they don't need to make these excuses.

Yes when you have 5 All Star talents in your starting lineup and a good bench it's much easier to make up for guys missing time.

The Lakers don't have that luxury. Pretty simple.

[Real Men Wear Green]

Yes when you have 5 All Star talents in your starting lineup and a good bench it's much easier to make up for guys missing time.

The Lakers don't have that luxury. Pretty simple.
Porzingis has missed over half the season so far. Holliday is nowhere near making the allstar game and Derrick White had never been close to making allstar. The excuse is still all yours though.

[ImKobe]

The Lakers wouldn't trade him for Evan Mobley?

As a 3rd option on offense he's not better than Reaves right now.

[ImKobe]

Kristaps Porzingis, the guy you think is the Celtics most important player has missed 35 games. Jrue Holiday, another starter, has missed 16 games. Jaylen Brown has missed 12 games. But somehow they don't need to make these excuses.

Maybe because you have an incredibly stacked roster where your guys can afford to miss time lmao.

[ShawkFactory]

As a 3rd option on offense he's not better than Reaves right now.

Lol.

Evan Mobley is an incredibly impactful player in almost every way. He’s a top 20 guy in the league right now.

“On offense” doesn’t matter as much when you’re a 3rd option. The Cavs would laugh if there was a straight up trade offered. And if there happened to be a distraught Cavs team asking for Reaves straight up for Mobley they’d do it and buy every bottle of champagne that exists.

[RRR3]

As a 3rd option on offense he's not better than Reaves right now.
They're about even according to EPM but Reaves isn't good at defense whereas Mobley is arguably the best besides Wemby. Mobley shits on him overall.

[Real Men Wear Green]

As a 3rd option on offense he's not better than Reaves right now.
I'm sure you looked up the numbers before you posted this bs so you know that mobley only averages 1 less point while shooting over 10% better from the field and actually managing a slight lead in three-point percentage. He is an allstar. Was Reaves an allstar? Was he even close to making allstar?

[Real Men Wear Green]

Maybe because you have an incredibly stacked roster where your guys can afford to miss time lmao. So if Reaves was a Celtic where would he rank?

[Axe]

Wash. Rinse. Repeat. Lose an argument due to lack of mental dexterity and pretend like you won. I've never seen a player cause mental illness in haters like Lebron. No wonder people are starting to believe hes the goat. Now go sit your ass down in the corner somewhere until you've got a proper reply to the discussion.
Lmfao have you voted itt yet?

http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?514823-Dumbest-Poster-on-ISH-2023-Edition&styleid=-1

Haven't seen your name in it.

[Full Court]

Lmfao have you voted itt yet?

http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?514823-Dumbest-Poster-on-ISH-2023-Edition&styleid=-1

Haven't seen your name in it.

BITCH FIT


:roll:

Stinky boy is all butthurt about being consensus biggest loser on ISH.


Weep it out, stink weasel.

:lebronamazed:

[ImKobe]

Lol.

Evan Mobley is an incredibly impactful player in almost every way. He’s a top 20 guy in the league right now.

“On offense” doesn’t matter as much when you’re a 3rd option. The Cavs would laugh if there was a straight up trade offered. And if there happened to be a distraught Cavs team asking for Reaves straight up for Mobley they’d do it and buy every bottle of champagne that exists.

That's what "option" means bro we're not talking about defense here. Reaves is well ahead of Mobley as an offensive player it's not even a debate.

[ImKobe]

I'm sure you looked up the numbers before you posted this bs so you know that mobley only averages 1 less point while shooting over 10% better from the field and actually managing a slight lead in three-point percentage. He is an allstar. Was Reaves an allstar? Was he even close to making allstar?

Look at FGA assisted and how much they create for others or the OEPM lol why are we pretending as if they're in the same class as offensive players?

[ImKobe]

Reaves btw is 19th in OFF EPM, all the guys above him are 1st or 2nd options.

[ShawkFactory]

That's what "option" means bro we're not talking about defense here. Reaves is well ahead of Mobley as an offensive player it's not even a debate.

No…YOU were talking about “options” without worrying about anything else. Others are pointing out that it doesn’t matter for the construction of a team.

Is Reaves the highest level 3rd scorer in the league? Arguably. But that means **** all when other teams’ 3rd options do other things way better. Which is more useful to a team and the entire point.

[Real Men Wear Green]

Look at FGA assisted and how much they create for others or the OEPM lol why are we pretending as if they're in the same class as offensive players?I don't know, why are you?

A big getting more assisted baskets than a perimeter player is to be expected. That doesn't mean that the big isn't a good scorer.

But the question wasn't answered: where would Reaves rank if he was on the Celtics?

[ImKobe]

No…YOU were talking about “options” without worrying about anything else. Others are pointing out that it doesn’t matter for the construction of a team.

Is Reaves the highest level 3rd scorer in the league? Arguably. But that means **** all when other teams’ 3rd options do other things way better. Which is more useful to a team and the entire point.

He's the best 3rd offensive option in the league. Not just talking about receiving a pass and shooting the ball but creating offense for himself and others without needing assistance, and he's able to be effective (all-star level play) in a 1st/2nd option role when his teammates are out or injured. And it's not just a RS thing he's shown this in the Playoffs in big pressure moments as well.

[ShawkFactory]

He's the best 3rd offensive option in the league. Not just talking about receiving a pass and shooting the ball but creating offense for himself and others without needing assistance, and he's able to be effective (all-star level play) in a 1st/2nd option role when his teammates are out or injured. And it's not just a RS thing he's shown this in the Playoffs in big pressure moments as well.

Sure..

Is he the most useful 3rd best player on a team? You seem to be missing the point.

[Axe]

That's what "option" means bro we're not talking about defense here. Reaves is well ahead of Mobley as an offensive player it's not even a debate.
You think reaves can lead a team to 60+ wins in the future? Intradesting. (https://i.ibb.co/RpQNPqx/IMG-20221122-211833.jpg)

[Full Court]

You think reaves can lead a team to 60+ wins in the future? Intradesting. (https://i.ibb.co/RpQNPqx/IMG-20221122-211833.jpg)

Lebron's only had the most help of any star in the history of the sport.

"Bu-bu-bu-but it's not enough!!! :cry:"


:roll:

No wonder this idiot is consensus dumbest poster in ISH history.












Not to mention biggest loser. :lol

[Axe]

https://c.tenor.com/no5erjD-jbIAAAAC/tenor.gif
:oldlol:

[Full Court]

The poster Full Court

Sends Axe into snits

With tears falling down

On his little bitch tits









:roll: So so true.

[ImKobe]

I don't know, why are you?

A big getting more assisted baskets than a perimeter player is to be expected. That doesn't mean that the big isn't a good scorer.

But the question wasn't answered: where would Reaves rank if he was on the Celtics?

Mobley is not a better 3rd option but he's a great 2-way player, not one that can take over or run an offense though.

Celtics are stacked KP would be better but he always misses half the season and he'd be a 1st/2nd option in Boston if he was as healthy as JT it's just never the case with him.

RIGHT NOW AR-15 is HIM. That's all that matters.

[sdot_thadon]

I made my case, and you refuted none of it. All you can do is get angry and upset by the truth. The fact is, Lebron has done more underachieving in his career than any other "great." That's why you guys are always complaining about his help. You can mad when he doesn't get carried.

But keep on crying. It'll help you feel better. :lol

This is why public schools are failing the last generation of kids imo. Making a case isn't "drop a stupid unsupported statement until posters goad me into collapsing my own view" that's called being an idiot fella. Model number ID- 10- T. I tried giving you a bit of game but you just run in circles chasing a tail no one can see but you.

Your entire point is to say "the lebron" couldn't lead a team to the Playoffs in season X. Meanwhile in season X Lebron missed 26 games and AD missed 42. At this point, nothing more needs to be said for anyone with functioning braincells, hence the eye of judgmental disappointment most posters here cast upon your username.

[Real Men Wear Green]

Mobley is not a better 3rd option but he's a great 2-way player, not one that can take over or run an offense though. No one runs the offense through the third option, if the offense is run through a guy then by definition he's not the third option. Mobley gives them highly efficient scoring while playing off the ball. Put Reaves on Cleveland and they have to reduce Garland and Mitchell's touches to fit him in and doing so doesn't improve their offense. Put Mobley in LA and you have the lob threat Doncic had been wanting and a guy that would score while still getting his efficient points while Doncic and James dominate the ball.



Celtics are stacked KP would be better but he always misses half the season and he'd be a 1st/2nd option in Boston if he was as healthy as JT it's just never the case with him.Porzingis is a finisher. He's at his best getting assisted baskets from teammates. Post him up when switches have a smaller guy on him for him to shoot over. You don't just walk the ball up the floor and hand it to him regardless of who is guarding him, that's not how you maximize efficiency. You do that if you have a crap team with no options. That's not the Celtics, whether he's healthy or not.

Completely out side from the original discussing but you brought it up.


RIGHT NOW AR-15 is HIM. That's all that matters. Third try: where would "HIM" rank in the Celtic hierarchy?

[sdot_thadon]

Lmfao have you voted itt yet?

http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?514823-Dumbest-Poster-on-ISH-2023-Edition&styleid=-1

Haven't seen your name in it.

Nah I hadn't but holy shit if you cant pick the all stupidty team starting 5 out of that one.:oldlol:

[ShawkFactory]

Mobley is not a better 3rd option but he's a great 2-way player, not one that can take over or run an offense though.

Celtics are stacked KP would be better but he always misses half the season and he'd be a 1st/2nd option in Boston if he was as healthy as JT it's just never the case with him.

RIGHT NOW AR-15 is HIM. That's all that matters.

You are so hard-headed :lol

The better 3rd player is not the better 3rd option for a team? Got it.

[ImKobe]

No one runs the offense through the third option, if the offense is run through a guy then by definition he's not the third option. Mobley gives them highly efficient scoring while playing off the ball. Put Reaves on Cleveland and they have to reduce Garland and Mitchell's touches to fit him in and doing so doesn't improve their offense. Put Mobley in LA and you have the lob threat Doncic had been wanting and a guy that would score while still getting his efficient points while Doncic and James dominate the ball.


Porzingis is a finisher. He's at his best getting assisted baskets from teammates. Post him up when switches have a smaller guy on him for him to shoot over. You don't just walk the ball up the floor and hand it to him regardless of who is guarding him, that's not how you maximize efficiency. You do that if you have a crap team with no options. That's not the Celtics, whether he's healthy or not.

Completely out side from the original discussing but you brought it up.

Third try: where would "HIM" rank in the Celtic hierarchy?

You do when your top 2 guys rest or are out with injuries. Mobley wouldn't be able to take over like that but he's a solid player.

KP can create his own offense and if not for injuries would probably be an All-NBA level player.

Reaves is HIM right now. I don't care about the imaginary scenarios you're coming up with here.

[ImKobe]

You are so hard-headed :lol

The better 3rd player is not the better 3rd option for a team? Got it.

It's like saying Rudy Gobert would be a better 3rd option than Reaves because he's an elite defender. He's not a better offensive player.

Option is a term used for offense.

[sdot_thadon]

It's like saying Rudy Gobert would be a better 3rd option than Reaves because he's an elite defender. He's not a better offensive player.

Option is a term used for offense.

So basically 3rd option < 3rd best player on a team then? Becuase defense has to factor in at some point.

[ShawkFactory]

It's like saying Rudy Gobert would be a better 3rd option than Reaves because he's an elite defender. He's not a better offensive player.

Option is a term used for offense.

I understand what you meant by it. The arguments you are now getting is that that doesn't matter at all when ranking teams.

The Cavs 3rd best player is a better overall player than the Lakers 3rd best player (I'd personally argue that Mobley is at least the second best player on the Cavs but that's neither here nor there). When elementarily ranking teams and "help" as 3ball did that kicked off this discussion that you jumped into, that matters more than who the better 3rd offensive "option" is.

[RRR3]

Imagine comparing Mobley to Gobert offensively lmao. ImStupid at it again.

[Real Men Wear Green]

You do when your top 2 guys rest or are out with injuries. Mobley wouldn't be able to take over like that but he's a solid player.

KP can create his own offense and if not for injuries would probably be an All-NBA level player.

Reaves is HIM right now. I don't care about the imaginary scenarios you're coming up with here. And you still aren't answering the question. Reaves is "HIM" but you aren't capable of taking him off he were on the Celtics? Your brain is melting down.

Again, this had nothing to do with the discussion and must be a assumption of you flailing but Porzingis creates good offense when he had a mismatch to exploit. Celtics wouldn't want to throw him the ball twenty times in the paint with Allen and Mobley on his back. But putting him in on pick and roll/pop plays, having him attack non-bigs when they get switched onto him, that leads to great offense so that's how he's used. But why are you focused on on this when it had nothing to do with the discussion?

A team with two guys that normally dominate the ball gets more value out of a third option that plays of the ball. Lakers biggest problem is that have nothing in the paint. Mobley fixes that problem.

[ImKobe]

And you still aren't answering the question. Reaves is "HIM" but you aren't capable of taking him off he were on the Celtics? Your brain is melting down.

Again, this had nothing to do with the discussion and must be a assumption of you flailing but Porzingis creates good offense when he had a mismatch to exploit. Celtics wouldn't want to throw him the ball twenty times in the paint with Allen and Mobley on his back. But putting him in on pick and roll/pop plays, having him attack non-bigs when they get switched onto him, that leads to great offense so that's how he's used. But why are you focused on on this when it had nothing to do with the discussion?

A team with two guys that normally dominate the ball gets more value out of a third option that plays of the ball. Lakers biggest problem is that have nothing in the paint. Mobley fixes that problem.

You can't however find me a 3rd option that has had a better impact on their team's offense this season as Reaves is the only 3rd option in the top 20 on offense when you look at the EPM chart and it's crazy because Lakers are actually worse on offense in the minutes that Lebron's been on the court this year.

Reaves is HIM. Deal with it.

[RRR3]

You can't however find me a 3rd option that has had a better impact on their team's offense this season as Reaves is the only 3rd option in the top 20 on offense when you look at the EPM chart and it's crazy because Lakers are actually worse on offense in the minutes that Lebron's been on the court this year.

Reaves is HIM. Deal with it.
Reaves is not in the top 20 in O-EPM, maybe look at actual EPM instead of predictive next time. Learn to read stat pages before you go about making statements slugger.

[ImKobe]

Reaves is not in the top 20 in O-EPM, maybe look at actual EPM instead of predictive next time. Learn to read stat pages before you go about making statements slugger.

He is still #1 among all 3rd options in the actual tab. Also Lakers are 7 points per 100 better with him on the court meanwhile almost 3 worse with Bran on :(:(:(:(

[tpols]

You are so hard-headed :lol

The better 3rd player is not the better 3rd option for a team? Got it.

The real reason the Cavs are better than the Lakers isn't their top 3. Even if Mobley is > AR, prime Luka and Lebron are > Mitchell and Garland.

Clevelands real advantage lies in the rest of their team ie Jarrett Allen, Hunter, and the bench compared to the Lakers so far this season.

[ShawkFactory]

The real reason the Cavs are better than the Lakers isn't their top 3. Even if Mobley is > AR, prime Luka and Lebron are > Mitchell and Garland.

Clevelands real advantage lies in the rest of their team ie Jarrett Allen, Hunter, and the bench compared to the Lakers so far this season.

Oh I'm aware that it's more nuanced than that. I was just playing along with the silly games here.

[Real Men Wear Green]

You can't however find me a 3rd option that has had a better impact on their team's offense this season as Reaves is the only 3rd option in the top 20 on offense when you look at the EPM chart and it's crazy because Lakers are actually worse on offense in the minutes that Lebron's been on the court this year.

Reaves is HIM. Deal with it.
So aside from you lying about O-EPM (which I honestly don't pay attention to anyway) you still aren't answering the question: what's world Reaves tank on the Celtics?

[RRR3]

He is still #1 among all 3rd options in the actual tab. Also Lakers are 7 points per 100 better with him on the court meanwhile almost 3 worse with Bran on :(:(:(:(
Brickbe wasn’t even good enough to be in the NBA at LeBron’s age.

[ImKobe]

So aside from you lying about O-EPM (which I honestly don't pay attention to anyway) you still aren't answering the question: what's world Reaves tank on the Celtics?

Not sure what you even mean by this but he's on the Lakers in the 3rd option role and he's doing great. People have been saying what I said here for 1-2 months now idk why it's getting you guys so upset.

[Real Men Wear Green]

Typos. "Where would Reaves rank on the Celtics?" Asked this question a few times now.

[ImKobe]

Typos. "Where would Reaves rank on the Celtics?" Asked this question a few times now.

Where would Tatum rank on the Lakers?

[Real Men Wear Green]

Where would Tatum rank on the Lakers?
This season he would have been their best player. But the fit beside James may be awkward. He would be counted on heavily because although Doncic is a better offensive player and James is just as good they both come with the "when healthy" asterisk whereas Tatum could have played almost every game had the Celtics chosen not to rest him. Now when everyone is healthy I'm not sure how the three of them would work it out because three guys can't dominate the ball. But Redisk is a smart coach and would figure out some way to make them all useful. Would certainly be difficult for any team to find three guys to cover those three.

Now where would Reaves rank on the Celtics?

[Axe]

He's genuinely the stupidest person on this board right now by quite a distance, which is REALLY saying something. Well coin24 is arguably dumber but he doesn't really post. Of the active posters though? No one can "outdumb" Full Court. Case in point, he's almost going to certainly respond to what I just wrote with some variation of "THIS BRONIE FLUFFER HAVING A BITCH FIT :roll:"
:yaohappy:

[999Guy]

I knew Reaves was really good when he was visibly putting more pressure on the Nuggets defense than LeBron did in the 2023 WC playoffs.

He’s really scary with the ball because he’s good everywhere. Pull-ups, passing, slashing. Tight handle. Pick and roll savvy.

He could easily be an all-star with the right usage. Kobe Bryant wouldn’t be an all-star playing with Luka and LeBron’s ball pounding. Though obv Luka and LeBron should pound the ball.