How many guys in history had a top 15 player at 3rd option

[3ba11]

Magic (once)
Lebron (twice)
Curry (once)
Kemp (once)

Anyone else?

[Wardell Curry]

:roll:

[Full Court]

This year Lebron is the third option.

[StrongLurk]

OP hasn't make good posts in a decade, total choker.

[sdot_thadon]

OP hasn't make good posts in a decade, total choker.

Low efficiency chucker by posting standards. If he was a player who would be his comp? I'm not sure we've ever seen this level of high volume ineptitude.

[ImKobe]

Chris Bosh
Kevin Love
Austin Reaves

I count 3.

[sdot_thadon]

Chris Bosh
Kevin Love
Austin Reaves

I count 3.

Reeves wasnt an allstar. If he can manage all nba then you guys might have a point. Not sure how likely that is given the low accuracy nature of these takes.

[ImKobe]

Reeves wasnt an allstar. If he can manage all nba then you guys might have a point. Not sure how likely that is given the low accuracy nature of these takes.

You could argue he's been top 15 post-ASB. Didn't do as much early in the season when they had Dlo also on top of AD being AD and Bran doing his thing. He's averaged 23/5/5 on 47/38/92 splits in 28 games since that Philly game where AD got injured and played his last game as a Laker.

[ShawkFactory]

Reeves wasnt an allstar. If he can manage all nba then you guys might have a point. Not sure how likely that is given the low accuracy nature of these takes.

He could make 3rd team since Brunson and Dame aren't going to hit the 65-game mark.

Given that, from a guards standpoint you have:

1st Team- SGA, Mitchell
2nd Team- Steph, Cade, Ant
3rd Team- Some combination of Jalen Williams, Garland, Booker and Reaves

Obviously he isn't a top 15 player overall but if he finishes really strong and the Lakers grab the 2 seed then it's possible he's 3rd team.

[hateraid]

How many players had the best 3 point shooter in the league, best defensive player, best rebounder, best small forward, and best coach at the same time?

Jordan x 3

[Kblaze8855]

Even putting aside how stupid the idea of Austin being top 15 at the moment is…

Your ridiculous topics Asking if such such has ever happened do at least give me something to think about…

And as usual, the answer is going to be far more common than you want it to be.

You could limit this discussion just to Boston Celtics and have a good list. And not even the ones you think of first. Forget Russell Hondo Cousy, Sam Jones, and whoever being on the same team. Even forget the famous bird Celtic lineups.

Tiny Archibald was all NBA second team with bird while Robert Parish was fourth and seventh and MVP voting in back-to-back years.

JoJo White, Dave Cowens and John Havlicek were all NBA at the same time before they even had a third team. And two of them were finals mvps and the other was league mvp. I suspect Cousy, Sharman, and Ed McCauley who they traded for Russell might apply as well.

I could probably make a top five list of time this has happened using nothing but the Boston Celtics.

[Real Men Wear Green]

I would love to see a Lakers-Celtics Finals where Austin Reaves is AllNBA and Jaylen Brown is not.

[3ba11]

Even putting aside how stupid the idea of Austin being top 15 at the moment is…

Your ridiculous topics Asking if such such has ever happened do at least give me something to think about…

And as usual, the answer is going to be far more common than you want it to be.

You could limit this discussion just to Boston Celtics and have a good list. And not even the ones you think of first. Forget Russell Hondo Cousy, Sam Jones, and whoever being on the same team. Even forget the famous bird Celtic lineups.

Tiny Archibald was all NBA second team with bird while Robert Parish was fourth and seventh and MVP voting in back-to-back years.

JoJo White, Dave Cowens and John Havlicek were all NBA at the same time before they even had a third team. And two of them were finals mvps and the other was league mvp. I suspect Cousy, Sharman, and Ed McCauley who they traded for Russell might apply as well.

I could probably make a top five list of time this has happened using nothing but the Boston Celtics.


Your biggest counter is to bring up a team from the 60's and a 2-pointer league with 8 teams - we know this isn't a viable response and makes my point look pretty good.

And MVP voting has nothing to do with player rankings.. MVP is based on "surprise factor", so the media will look for the slightest surprise (like SGA winning briefly with an injured team, or Pippen surprising in 94') and the voting is based on that.. But at no point has SGA been more valuable than Jokic, and at no point was Pippen ever a top 3 player.

Accordingly, Robert Parish was never a top 15 player alongside Bird and this is common knowledge... Either way, having a top 15 player as 3rd option it isn't "common" because the only examples provided are the OP and a team from the 60's, or stretching Parish to be a top 15 player (he wasn't)

[ShawkFactory]

When your biggest counter is to bring up a team from the 60's and 2-pointer basketball, this isn't a viable response and makes my point look pretty good.

And MVP voting has nothing to do with player rankings.. MVP is based on "surprise factor", so the media will look for the slightest surprise (like SGA winning briefly with an injured team, or Pippen surprising in 94') and the voting is based on that.. But at no point has SGA been more valuable than Jokic, and at no point was Pippen ever a top 3 player.

Accordingly, Robert Parish was never a top 15 player alongside Bird and this is common knowledge... Either way, having a top 15 player as 3rd option it isn't "common" because the only examples provided are the OP and a team from the 60's, or stretching Parish to be a top 15 player (he wasn't)

:lol

[SouBeachTalents]

Rodman was top 15 in 1996, so Jordan's another example.

[3ba11]

Rodman was top 15 in 1996, so Jordan's another example.


Rodman wasn't a top 40 player in 1996

[ShawkFactory]

Rodman wasn't a top 40 player in 1996

15th in MVP voting in 1996.

[hateraid]

Rodman was top 15 in 1996, so Jordan's another example.

One can argue so was Ron Harper. Harper > Reeves

[3ba11]

15th in MVP voting in 1996.


Weak troll

Shaq, Hakeem, Robinson, Ewing, Alonzo, Tim Hardaway, Payton, Kemp, Schrempf, Drexler, MJ, Pippen, Penny, Hill, Miller, Stockton, Malone, Barkley, KJ, Vin Baker, Kidd, Webber, Richmond, Strickland, Sprewell, Mutombo, Magic, Larry Johnson

that's 30 guys right there

[3ba11]

One can argue so was Ron Harper. Harper > Reeves


Harper was a 7 ppg scorer in 1995 before MJ returned... Many injuries made him a shell and this was widely-known and common knowledge at the time - no one viewed Harper as an offensive threat anymore.

[ShawkFactory]

Weak troll

Shaq, Hakeem, Robinson, Ewing, Alonzo, Tim Hardaway, Payton, Kemp, Schrempf, Drexler, MJ, Pippen, Penny, Hill, Miller, Stockton, Malone, Barkley, KJ, Vin Baker, Kidd, Webber, Richmond, Strickland, Sprewell, Mutombo, Magic, Larry Johnson

that's 30 guys right there

?

It's a fact that he was 15th in MVP voting in 1996.

[SouBeachTalents]

15th in MVP voting in 1996.
15th in MVP voting
Rebounding champ
7th in DPOY
1st Team All-Defense

Was doing this in the playoffs while getting legitimate consideration for FMVP


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NdZn8epqnKo&ab_channel=NobodyTouchesJordan


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=98R_SCHiSUY&ab_channel=LamarMatic

Definitely a strong argument for top 15.

[3ba11]

?

It's a fact that he was 15th in MVP voting in 1996.


MVP voting isn't a player ranking... And you know this, so why would you even bring it up?

Of course, anytime your argument is the opinion of a few dozen journalism majors (media awards), then you have nothing.. Why would I use Skip Bayless and Rachel Nichols' opinion as my argument?.. Yet that's what your doing.. So all my arguments stand - Skip and Rachel can't bring them down.

[3ba11]

15th in MVP voting
Rebounding champ
7th in DPOY
1st Team All-Defense

Was doing this in the playoffs while getting legitimate consideration for FMVP


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NdZn8epqnKo&ab_channel=NobodyTouchesJordan


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=98R_SCHiSUY&ab_channel=LamarMatic

Definitely a strong argument for top 15.


Spot-duty is role player stuff like top 200 player stuff, and nowhere near top 15..

You guys are desperate, which proves how right I am.. .You guys fell for a fraud... aka he was inept with normal rosters of 1 franchise player, so he needed the rare top 15 third option, but still rarely won and never produced great teams/dynasties.

[RRR3]

Horace Grant in 1992: 3rd in WS/48, 10th in BPM, 9th in VORP, 16th in PER. All stats OP uses to make arguments :lol

[ShawkFactory]

MVP voting isn't a player ranking... And you know this, so why would you even bring it up?

Of course, anytime your argument is the opinion of a few dozen journalism majors (media awards), then you have nothing.. Why would I use Skip Bayless and Rachel Nichols' opinion as my argument?.. Yet that's what your doing.. So all my arguments stand - Skip and Rachel can't bring them down.

Okay Mr. "The East All Star Center" :lol

If Reaves happens to make 3rd team all-nba I now know not to expect these top 15 type talks from you :rockon:

[3ba11]

Horace Grant in 1992: 3rd in WS/48, 10th in BPM, 9th in VORP, 16th in PER. All stats OP uses to make arguments :lol


Aahh the desperation as 3ball proves again that Lebron is a fraud.

[3ba11]

Okay Mr. "The East All Star Center" :lol

If Reaves happens to make 3rd team all-nba I now know not to expect these top 15 type talks from you :rockon:


all-stars are voted on by fans (starters) and coaches (bench), so yes, I respect the opinion of millions of fans around the world over a few dozen journalism majors... And obviously the coaches actually voted in Mo and Zydrunas, who came off the bench - so they're totally legit good players.. Mo was viewed as a fantastic player before joining Lebron and lifting a 45 win loser to 66 win league favorite - his spacing opened up Lebron's stiff arm game so he could be MVP - lebron needs an all-star spacer to win 60 & MVP (09', 13').. of course, only MJ had seasons with MVP + title + scoring title + 1st team defense (4 times).

[Duffy Pratt]

Wilt was the fourth option on the Lakers when they won the Championship.

Chet Walker was an all-star when Wilt won with the sixers.

[Kblaze8855]

Your biggest counter is to bring up a team from the 60's and a 2-pointer league with 8 teams - we know this isn't a viable response and makes my point look pretty good.

And MVP voting has nothing to do with player rankings.. MVP is based on "surprise factor", so the media will look for the slightest surprise (like SGA winning briefly with an injured team, or Pippen surprising in 94') and the voting is based on that.. But at no point has SGA been more valuable than Jokic, and at no point was Pippen ever a top 3 player.

Accordingly, Robert Parish was never a top 15 player alongside Bird and this is common knowledge... Either way, having a top 15 player as 3rd option it isn't "common" because the only examples provided are the OP and a team from the 60's, or stretching Parish to be a top 15 player (he wasn't)


The problem is you just…don’t know very much. And that’s fine. Not everyone cares about history. But if you don’t…it’s better to not talk about it. Every topic you make about how many times such and such has happened is just nonsense aimed at people who don’t know enough to respond. I’m not in that demographic. I usually just let you be but I was in the car waiting for this woman to finish her waxing appointment and limited it to one team off the top of my head.

If I cared enough to apply myself we would be here all day.

You never have a valid point with these. Every topic. It’s all just hoping the people reading don’t know better and don’t care enough to look into it. I usually know better even without looking into it. But like I said…I’m not your target audience. I don’t forget anything and I often have nothing better to do. Like this:




all-stars are voted on by fans (starters) and coaches (bench), so yes, I respect the opinion of millions of fans around the world over a few dozen journalism majors...




It’s contradictory to a great number of your previous takes. But if nobody calls you on it with receipts you can pretend otherwise.

I could. But I choose not to. I’ve gotten over correcting you for the most part. It just accomplishes nothing. You don’t care if you’re right or wrong or consistent or not. Just here to make noise for one particular agenda and don’t appear to tire of it.

But I tired of correcting it long ago.

Its entirely possible we don’t even speak again before 2026. So enjoy that.

[3ba11]

The problem is you just…don’t know very much. And that’s fine. Not everyone cares about history. But if you don’t…it’s better to not talk about it. Every topic you make about how many times such and such has happened is just nonsense aimed at people who don’t know enough to respond. I’m not in that demographic. I usually just let you be but I was in the car waiting for this woman to finish her waxing appointment and limited it to one team off the top of my head.

If I cared enough to apply myself we would be here all day.

You never have a valid point with these. Every topic. It’s all just hoping the people reading don’t know better and don’t care enough to look into it. I usually know better even without looking into it. But like I said…I’m not your target audience. I don’t forget anything and I often have nothing better to do. Like this:





It’s contradictory to a great number of your previous takes. But if nobody calls you on it with receipts you can pretend otherwise.

I could. But I choose not to. I’ve gotten over correcting you for the most part. It just accomplishes nothing. You don’t care if you’re right or wrong or consistent or not. Just here to make noise for one particular agenda and don’t appear to tire of it.

But I tired of correcting it long ago.

Its entirely possible we don’t even speak again before 2026. So enjoy that.


^^^ All this writing, whining and snivelling just because I pointed out that a tiny handful of players were lucky enough to have top 15 players at 3rd option, while Lebron is the only guy that enjoyed this rare luxury twice (and maybe even 3 times according to some people itt).

smh, try to enjoy the rest of your day without crying too hard about this fact.. I'm sorry that it caused all the ISH regs to meltdown so badly... Wipe your nose and try to have a good rest of the day, smh

[tpols]

Top 15 gets dicey because there's usually not a big difference between #15 and the next 10 guys after that.

[3ba11]

Top 15 gets dicey because there's usually not a big difference between #15 and the next 10 guys after that.


top 15 is top 15

Love was actually top 10 and a lot of people had him top 5 before he joined Lebron.. there was even top 3 talk and comparisons to larry bird on the most prominent NBA boards.

so it's pretty clear-cut... a tiny handful of guys enjoyed a top 10 or top 15 guy at 3rd option, while Lebron is the only guy that appears to have had this luxury more than once.

[sdot_thadon]

top 15 is top 15

Love was actually top 10 and a lot of people had him top 5 before he joined Lebron.. there was even top 3 talk and comparisons to larry bird on the most prominent NBA boards.

so it's pretty clear-cut... a tiny handful of guys enjoyed a top 10 or top 15 guy at 3rd option, while Lebron is the only guy that appears to have had this luxury more than once.

And there was even more discussion all over basketball fandom about Love being an empty stats bum. The truth was likely somewhere in the middle of the 2 extremes I'd imagine.

[Hey Yo]

He could make 3rd team since Brunson and Dame aren't going to hit the 65-game mark.

Given that, from a guards standpoint you have:

1st Team- SGA, Mitchell
2nd Team- Steph, Cade, Ant
3rd Team- Some combination of Jalen Williams, Garland, Booker and Reaves

Obviously he isn't a top 15 player overall but if he finishes really strong and the Lakers grab the 2 seed then it's possible he's 3rd team.
Brunson looking to play for the 65gm mark.


https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/jalen-brunson-injury-update-knicks-star-likely-to-return-this-weekend-meet-65-game-threshold-per-reports/

[3ba11]

We can forget about the "close calls" like Austin Reaves, who someone could argue is a top 15 guy... We only need to look at the sure things, such as Love, Bosh, Worthy, and anyone else that most people already agree is top 15 - so these might be the only 3 guys in 3-pointer history.

[Axe]

OP hasn't make good posts in a decade, total choker.
Sounds just like the narcissistic mongoloid above you, who trolls a lot like a flaming homosexual too.

[Full Court]

Sounds just like the narcissistic mongoloid above you, who trolls a lot like a flaming homosexual too.

Ooooooooooo, Bitch Tits is triggered again. :roll:







Axe is an autistic outcast

Cause here's what's the matter

He's a bitch fit throwing moron

And smells worse than toilet water


So true. :lol

[Axe]

We can forget about the "close calls" like Austin Reaves, who someone could argue is a top 15 guy... We only need to look at the sure things, such as Love, Bosh, Worthy, and anyone else that most people already agree is top 15 - so these might be the only 3 guys in 3-pointer history.
Yep, top 15 for someone who still lacks all-star selections until now. (https://i.ibb.co/SxWM8PC/IMG-20230805-073843.jpg)

[ILLsmak]

This year Lebron is the third option.

haha, nice.

-Smak

[John8204]

Plenty of people...hell

John Stockton was the third option on the Jazz
Bill Russell was the third or fourth option on the Celtics
George Mikan had Jim Pollard as his third option
I don't know how you want to divide Wilt/West/Baylor and Reed/Frazier/Monroe
Wilt have Neil Johnston in Philadelphia for a cup of coffee
Bob Pettit had Slater Martin or Cliff Hagan

[3ba11]

Plenty of people...hell

John Stockton was the third option on the Jazz
Bill Russell was the third or fourth option on the Celtics
George Mikan had Jim Pollard as his third option
I don't know how you want to divide Wilt/West/Baylor and Reed/Frazier/Monroe
Wilt have Neil Johnston in Philadelphia for a cup of coffee
Bob Pettit had Slater Martin or Cliff Hagan


Your examples of top 15 from an 8-team league mean nothing and demonstrate low intelligence, while your Stockton example is pure desperation, so I win the thread - this is more evidence that Lebron is a fraud since he's one of 2 guys in 3-pointer history with a clear-cut top 15 player at 3rd option (him and Magic), while Lebron is the only guy that had it twice... You can live in denial if you want, but I prefer to know what is going to happen, such as ball-dominators never winning with normal rosters of 1 franchise player, and never producing great teams/dynasties.

[John8204]

Your examples of top 15 from an 8-team league mean nothing and demonstrate low intelligence, while your Stockton example is pure desperation, so I win the thread - this is more evidence that Lebron is a fraud since he's one of 2 guys in 3-pointer history with a clear-cut top 15 player at 3rd option (him and Magic), while Lebron is the only guy that had it twice... You can live in denial if you want, but I prefer to know what is going to happen, such as ball-dominators never winning with normal rosters of 1 franchise player, and never producing great teams/dynasties.


How many guys in history had a top 15 player at 3rd option

Do you not understand how the word "history" works, you don't get to pick and choose when NBA history starts. You could have said...in the last 40 years...or after the merger. You could have said for half of the league because really that's what you wanted to say.

You have other options...I don't know how you can argue John Stockton wasn't the third options...some seasons he was the fourth. You could also extend this to Jason Kidd, Kevin Garnett, Steve Nash,

[Manny98]

How many superstars had a team so stacked that they win 55+ games without them

MJ

Can't think of anybody else :confusedshrug:

Both the Cavs and Heat went from title contenders to lottery without LeBron

[SouBeachTalents]

How many superstars had a team so stacked that they win 55+ games without them

MJ

Can't think of anybody else :confusedshrug:

Both the Cavs and Heat went from title contenders to lottery without LeBron
This is true, that's a near KD on the Warriors level luxury.

[SouBeachTalents]

I know he does it intentionally to bait a response, but just so many good ones in that post

Pippen's 14.5 gets rounded down to 14

He leaves out WS where Pippen has a substantial advantage

And he'll make no mention of how Kukoc's 19 ppg came on 17 shots and a blistering 49%TS. He's trying to hype up a high volume, inefficient 19 ppg on a 13 win team. Like I said, he genuinely argues like a casual fan does, going strictly off ppg to determine how good a player is :lol

And of course, the ultimate crux is if he were to use that same criteria to compare LeBron to players he considers better than him like Kobe, Bird & Curry, LeBron would absolutely wipe the floor with them lol

[3ba11]

.
.

The system that Pippen grew up in (system player):

1998 Kukoc....... 13 ppg.... 17.3 PER... 3.3 BPM... 3.0 VORP.
1998 Pippen...... 19 ppg.... 20.4 PER... 5.0 BPM... 2.9 VORP


No system (true scoring ability):

1999 Kukoc....... 19 ppg.... 18.6 PER... 3.0 BPM... 2.1 VORP
1999 Pippen...... 14 ppg.... 16.8 PER... 2.5 BPM... 2.3 VORP


* Kukoc also led the Bulls in BPM for the 94' Playoffs and was chosen to take the game-winner instead of Pippen on 5 different occasions during 1994 alone... Pippen also averaged 3.0 on 20% in the 4th quarter of the 1994 2nd Round, so Kukoc was almost certainly the one carrying the Bulls in those 4th quarters.







55 wins no context bs





Aside from 1994, 55 wins has never been achieved by a lengthy development of the goat dynasty and 3-peat chemistry, as required to win with the weakest roster in the league, i.e. the only starting lineup without a 2nd scoring option.

So it wasn't a "real" 55 win team that was built from scratch and could win 50 every year, or even more than once.

The Bulls were also the biggest-ever "letdown" game on the schedule of all-time, so they faced sleeping opponents for 82 games until the playoffs when they were dismissed in the 2nd Round.. Then the "real" Bulls without MJ were barely .500 the following year once the honeymoon period of zero expectation was gone... The cratering of the goat dynasty to barely .500 is the biggest drop-off ever.

The Bulls also added a better scorer than Pippen and the closer that MJ never had in 1994 that could average 19/7/5 outside the system (Kukoc), and who led the Bulls in BPM for the 94' Playoffs... Kukoc was also chosen over Pippen to take the game winner 5 times during 1994 alone and his stats demolish Pippen in 1999 outside the system that Pippen grew up in.... He was also 2nd on the Bulls in 4th quarter scoring for the 98' Playoffs, so it's clear that Kukoc was the preferred "go-to" option and closer over Pippen.. Accordingly, since any scorer will replace Pippen as the preferred option, no Pippen-led team can have a 2nd-scoring option in the starting lineup (like we saw in 1994) and therefore needs 3-peat chemistry to keep their head above water.








Both the Cavs and Heat went from title contenders to lottery without Lebron





Lebron left the Cavs and Heat as 2nd Round or record losers, so he didn't leave them with the 3-peat chemistry required to keep their head above water and at least PUT OFF the inevitable embarrassment that the Bulls had in the playoffs and 95' season.

And the 2011 Cavs lost their entire team to injury or trade, such as Shaq, Zydrunas, Varejao, Mo, and Delonte (52 ppg), so it's a complete lie to say they fell to lottery without just Lebron..... And the 2015 Heat were injured but nearly made the 16' ECF.

We all forget that Lebron needed the East all-star center and an acquisition that was better than 1990 Pippen just to make his first playoffs in 2006... MJ would 3-peat with that, but instead we all pretended to be impressed when Lebron made 1 flukey Finals like other 1-star teams were doing, and then averaged 22 on 35% with 6 TO's per game (the worst anyone ever played).

[tpols]

How many superstars had a team so stacked that they win 55+ games without them

MJ

Can't think of anybody else :confusedshrug:

Both the Cavs and Heat went from title contenders to lottery without LeBron

The Heat ended up making the 2nd round of the playoffs in 2016 and that was with no Bosh, just old Wade (who played great).

Same 2nd round the 1994 Chicago Bulls lost in with peak pippen. Not really much of a difference.

But even hardcore Lebron family members would have to admit Wade was better than Pippen. And AD was better than both.