Did Michael Jordan have a true weakness?

[White Chocolate]

Scoring- career 30.1 PPG

Shooting- shot over 50% 6 times

Defense- career 6.2 RPG(had an 8 RPG season), 2.3 SPG(once had 3.2), 1.5+ BPG twice

Leadership- extremely clutch, Bulls never lost a series with home court

3 point shooting- in seasons with at least 90 3 pointers made, never shot less than 37.4%

Playmaking- career 5.3 APG, averaged 6+ APG 3 times

Health- in his years as a Bull(minus 1994-95), played in 92.3% of his team's games


Honestly, did the man have one single weakness on the basketball court?

[Loki]

No, he didn't. He had areas where he was not as great as he was in every other area (namely 3-point shooting), but even those weren't "weaknesses," because for something to be a "weakness," it needs to be something that could be exploited. Jordan can and would knock down 3's if you let him.

In every season Jordan attempted more than a miniscule number of threes ('90, '93, '96, though the latter was at the shorter line), he shot it in the mid-upper 30's. He also shot 38.5-40.3% from deep in the playoffs from '91-'96, including 38.9% on 4 threes attempted per game in the '93 playoffs. This suggests that Jordan was a rhythm three point shooter -- whenever he took a good amount, he made a good amount. He explicitly stated several times that he never wanted to take a lot of threes because it would detract from his definition of his game, and the evidence seems to bear out the fact that it was a conscious decision rather than a shortcoming, since when he took more, he made more.

Who knows how Jordan's 3FG% would have looked if he worked on it and attempted 5+ threes per game for several seasons? I have no doubt he'd be a mid-30's shooter at the very least, since this is what the evidence suggests.

[highwhey]

gambling?

[starface]

gambling?


thats win.

[worldbefree]

I saw a documentary on him back in the day when analysts, etc were criticizing his 3point shooting so he spent the entire summer working on his 3ball. He was truly dedicated.

[bdreason]

Killing his dad took him out for one year.











I know, that was low.

[shaoyut]

hes not that good at 3 point shooting

[Loki]

hes not that good at 3 point shooting

That wasn't (nearly) a "weakness." See my post above for an explanation.

[1987_Lakers]

3 point shooting

He sucked so much that the NBA shortened the 3 point shot so Jordan can improve in that area.:)

[Loki]

3 point shooting

He sucked so much that the NBA shortened the 3 point shot so Jordan can improve in that area.:)

Another misinformed poster. And yeah, they shortened it for him despite the fact that he was coming off one of the best 3FG% seasons of his career and shot it at 40% in the playoffs on a good volume of attempts. Oh yeah, and they knew he was retiring, too, yet still did it. Makes perfect sense.

[White Chocolate]

hes not that good at 3 point shooting


Yes, that's not a strong spot for Mike. But, it still wasn't a weakness. Once he regularly starting shooting 3s, he was 37-40%.

[1987_Lakers]

Another misinformed poster. And yeah, they shortened it for him despite the fact that he was coming off one of the best 3FG% seasons of his career and shot it at 40% in the playoffs on a good volume of attempts. Oh yeah, and they knew he was retiring, too, yet still did it. Makes perfect sense.

I was obviously joking.:rolleyes:

[Loki]

I was obviously joking.:rolleyes:

I knew you were joking about them moving the line in for him, but I've heard many people actually state the same thing, which is why I took the time to debunk it. When I said you were misinformed, I meant in regards to his 3-pt shooting being an actual weakness, which I felt you were saying sincerely.

[AllenIverson3]

Yes, that's not a strong spot for Mike. But, it still wasn't a weakness. Once he regularly starting shooting 3s, he was 37-40%.


dont look at his percentage from the 3 point line look at how many he made!

[White Chocolate]

dont look at his percentage from the 3 point line look at how many he made!


It's not about how many you make. Quality > quantity. In other words, efficiency is far more important than making a ton of shots.

[DCL]

yeah, he was so "weak" at shooting 3's that he was invited to a 3-point shooting contest during all-star break.

[72-10]

The answer to the question is no.

[72-10]

It's not about how many you make. Quality > quantity. In other words, efficiency is far more important than making a ton of shots.

Today's players could learn a thing or two from this.

[PainDog]

No, he didn't. He had areas where he was not as great as he was in every other area (namely 3-point shooting), but even those weren't "weaknesses," because for something to be a "weakness," it needs to be something that could be exploited. Jordan can and would knock down 3's if you let him.

In every season Jordan attempted more than a miniscule number of threes ('90, '93, '96, though the latter was at the shorter line), he shot it in the mid-upper 30's. He also shot 38.5-40.3% from deep in the playoffs from '91-'96, including 38.9% on 4 threes attempted per game in the '93 playoffs. This suggests that Jordan was a rhythm three point shooter -- whenever he took a good amount, he made a good amount. He explicitly stated several times that he never wanted to take a lot of threes because it would detract from his definition of his game, and the evidence seems to bear out the fact that it was a conscious decision rather than a shortcoming, since when he took more, he made more.

Who knows how Jordan's 3FG% would have looked if he worked on it and attempted 5+ threes per game for several seasons? I have no doubt he'd be a mid-30's shooter at the very least, since this is what the evidence suggests.

Man dude...first reply to the thread and you summed up everything I was going to say....

[PainDog]

yeah, he was so "weak" at shooting 3's that he was invited to a 3-point shooting contest during all-star break.

I mean, I wouldnt really bring this up because he did rather poor in the 3-point contest with a score of only 5.....

[plowking]

He couldn't handle getting quintuple teamed very well.

[One of Shemps Kids]

yeah, he was so "weak" at shooting 3's that he was invited to a 3-point shooting contest during all-star break.


...and he scored an all-time low at the contest :roll:

[trig]

His sperm. Because his freakish athleticm didnt transfer to his sons. Not even his height hehe

[PainDog]

His sperm. Because his freakish athleticm didnt transfer to his sons. Not even his height hehe

Thats true..HAHAHA...

[Jordandunk23]

The answer to the question is no.

:rockon:

[72-10]

His sperm. Because his freakish athleticm didnt transfer to his sons. Not even his height hehe

No one else in his family is tall...

[gpfanz]

gambling?

he can afford it. So its his strength rather as he has the financial means to do so :lol

[Loki]

Early in his career, outside shooting was his weakness. It's amazing to think that the two seasons he averaged 37.1 and 35.0 ppg, he only had 19 3-pointers over those two seasons. And he played 82 games both of those seasons..

However, later on in his career, especially after his first retirement, he became a good outside shooter.

Jordan was one of, if not the best, shooter from 21 feet and in by 1991 (age 26-27). I didn't say so, Sports Illustrated did. They called him the best shooter 21 feet and in in the league in 1991. He was deadly from 19-20 feet and in even by his third season (1987), 1988 at the latest. By 1990 he shot 38% on threes. Watch any of his 40+ point games between '85-'90 (which occurred roughly once every 3-4 games and you'll see that he did the majority of his damage via his lethal midrange game. Jordan at age 24-25 was light years beyond guys like Lebron/Wade as a shooter inside 22 feet. Light years. Again, weaknesses are things that can be exploited -- Jordan even in his first couple of years would rain 14-19 foot jumpers on you all day if you gave it to him.

It's simply false to act like Jordan "became" a great shooter after his first retirement. He was a top 3-4 midrange shooter all-time by 1992, which means that he was a great shooter from inside 22 feet even before that.

[gotbacon23]

he failed to sweep every playoff series that he played in. pathetic.

[sixerfan82]

he failed to sweep every playoff series that he played in. pathetic.

dont forget all them regular season games he lost

[gotbacon23]

dont forget all them regular season games he lost

seriously. he didn't have a single undefeated regular season in his ENTIRE career. and we are supposed to think he is the best?

[WillyJakk]

On court: No
Off court: White Women

[Manute for Ever!]

On court: No
Off court: White Women

And Kobe tried to immitate him again :D

[White Chocolate]

And Kobe tried to immitate him again :D


:roll: Oh, the irony.

[WillyJakk]

And Kobe tried to immitate him again :D
:roll::roll::roll::roll::roll::roll::roll:

[VanillaThunder]

no matter how hard he tried he couldn't lose a playoff series from 91-98 without retiring.. thats weak if you ask me

[jjayfive]

no weakness......jordan lost a step and perfected the fade jumper (unstoppable).....:bowdown:

[Da_Realist]

No, he didn't. He had areas where he was not as great as he was in every other area (namely 3-point shooting), but even those weren't "weaknesses," because for something to be a "weakness," it needs to be something that could be exploited. Jordan can and would knock down 3's if you let him.

In every season Jordan attempted more than a miniscule number of threes ('90, '93, '96, though the latter was at the shorter line), he shot it in the mid-upper 30's. He also shot 38.5-40.3% from deep in the playoffs from '91-'96, including 38.9% on 4 threes attempted per game in the '93 playoffs. This suggests that Jordan was a rhythm three point shooter -- whenever he took a good amount, he made a good amount. He explicitly stated several times that he never wanted to take a lot of threes because it would detract from his definition of his game, and the evidence seems to bear out the fact that it was a conscious decision rather than a shortcoming, since when he took more, he made more.

Who knows how Jordan's 3FG% would have looked if he worked on it and attempted 5+ threes per game for several seasons? I have no doubt he'd be a mid-30's shooter at the very least, since this is what the evidence suggests.

MJ discusses the 3pt shot (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hXkwuTRImqs)

[twolvesfan]

Scoring- career 30.1 PPG

Shooting- shot over 50% 6 times

Defense- career 6.2 RPG(had an 8 RPG season), 2.3 SPG(once had 3.2), 1.5+ BPG twice

Leadership- extremely clutch, Bulls never lost a series with home court

3 point shooting- in seasons with at least 90 3 pointers made, never shot less than 37.4%

Playmaking- career 5.3 APG, averaged 6+ APG 3 times

Health- in his years as a Bull(minus 1994-95), played in 92.3% of his team's games


Honestly, did the man have one single weakness on the basketball court?
gambling:no:

[WADE MONEY]

MJ discusses the 3pt shot (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hXkwuTRImqs)

well said :applause:

[halffttime]

he couldnt dunk.. :lol

[Glove_20]

Jordan was not a good 3 point shooter for most of his career. People bring out that when he attempted a lot, he made them. Well the reason he didn't attempt so many (and make so many) early in his career was simply because he wasn't good enough.

What's the number one reason ALL NBA players don't take that many 3s? Because they can't make them. It's really that simple. And if you think he could've made them, even when he attempted them he shot a low % early in his career.

It's another story if he worked on his 3 point shoot or not. That's irrelevant to this topic. Just because you don't work at a certain aspect of the game, doesn't mean we can't call it a weakness. Of course it's going to be a weakness if you don't work on that aspect of the game.






So really, 3 point shooting was a weakness for Jordan most of his career. There is no way around this. He didn't take them because he couldn't make them.

[Da_Realist]

Jordan was not a good 3 point shooter for most of his career. People bring out that when he attempted a lot, he made them. Well the reason he didn't attempt so many (and make so many) early in his career was simply because he wasn't good enough.

What's the number one reason ALL NBA players don't take that many 3s? Because they can't make them. It's really that simple. And if you think he could've made them, even when he attempted them he shot a low % early in his career.

It's another story if he worked on his 3 point shoot or not. That's irrelevant to this topic. Just because you don't work at a certain aspect of the game, doesn't mean we can't call it a weakness. Of course it's going to be a weakness if you don't work on that aspect of the game.

So really, 3 point shooting was a weakness for Jordan most of his career. There is no way around this. He didn't take them because he couldn't make them.

So is 3 pt shooting considered a weakness for Hakeem Olajuwon or Kareem?

What difference does it make if it can't be exploited? MJ couldn't shoot with his toes either but it's not considered a weakness.

[db23]

Jordan was not a good 3 point shooter for most of his career. People bring out that when he attempted a lot, he made them. Well the reason he didn't attempt so many (and make so many) early in his career was simply because he wasn't good enough.

What's the number one reason ALL NBA players don't take that many 3s? Because they can't make them. It's really that simple. And if you think he could've made them, even when he attempted them he shot a low % early in his career.

It's another story if he worked on his 3 point shoot or not. That's irrelevant to this topic. Just because you don't work at a certain aspect of the game, doesn't mean we can't call it a weakness. Of course it's going to be a weakness if you don't work on that aspect of the game.






So really, 3 point shooting was a weakness for Jordan most of his career. There is no way around this. He didn't take them because he couldn't make them.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hXkwuTRImqs

[Glove_20]

So is 3 pt shooting considered a weakness for Hakeem Olajuwon or Kareem?

What difference does it make if it can't be exploited? MJ couldn't shoot with his toes either but it's not considered a weakness.
Of course it's a weakness for Kareem and Hakeem, simply because they were well below average at it.

Exploitation has nothing to do with it being a weakness or not. If the player wasn't good at, or it was a "weak" part of their game, then its a weakness.

And :oldlol: at the toe example, don't tell me I have to show you why that's irrelevant to this topic.


If it's a weak part of your game, it's a weakness. If a player could score 40ppg on 60% shooting, simply by just making any kind of jump shot, but not being able to do anything else, I'd still call dribbling/passing weakness on the offensive end for that player, because he isn't good at it.

[Glove_20]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hXkwuTRImqs
Yeah and?

Early in his career he was not a good 3 point shooter. First of all this is not early in his career. 2nd of all, he simply couldn't make 3s early in his career. What's so hard to understand about that? Why would anyone take 3s if they can't make them? That's how it was for Jordan. He couldn't make them. It's probably true he didn't try to improve his 3 point shooting, but that doesn't change the fact that he was a bad 3 point shooter.

[Da_Realist]

Of course it's a weakness for Kareem and Hakeem, simply because they were well below average at it.

Exploitation has nothing to do with it being a weakness or not. If the player wasn't good at, or it was a "weak" part of their game, then its a weakness.

And :oldlol: at the toe example, don't tell me I have to show you why that's irrelevant to this topic.


If it's a weak part of your game, it's a weakness. If a player could score 40ppg on 60% shooting, simply by just making any kind of jump shot, but not being able to do anything else, I'd still call dribbling/passing weakness on the offensive end for that player, because he isn't good at it.

We have two different definitions of "weakness". Just because someone can't shoot from the balcony doesn't mean it's a weakness, unless his inability to do this stopped him from being as effective on the court as he possibly could have.

Secondly, as Jordan stated, he didn't shoot a lot of 3's because he thought it took away from his game. Not because he couldn't do it. Had he tried to be a better 3 pt shooter he would have become more passive, less efficient and not as involved in the game. So I consider it a strength that he decided not to incorporate the 3pt shot as a major tool in his arsenal.

[FindingTim]

It's not about how many you make. Quality > quantity. In other words, efficiency is far more important than making a ton of shots.

Gheorghe Muresan and his league leading field goal percentages beg to differ.

[Glove_20]

We have two different definitions of "weakness". Just because someone can't shoot from the balcony doesn't mean it's a weakness, unless his inability to do this stopped him from being as effective on the court as he possibly could have.

Secondly, as Jordan stated, he didn't shoot a lot of 3's because he thought it took away from his game. Not because he couldn't do it. Had he tried to be a better 3 pt shooter he would have become more passive, less efficient and not as involved in the game. So I consider it a strength that he decided not to incorporate the 3pt shot as a major tool in his arsenal.
1. Well I guess than we just have 2 different definitions. I just don't see how you can be "weak" on a certain aspect of your game, and that shouldn't be called a weakness. :confusedshrug:
So do players like John Stockton not have a weakness either in your definition?

2. And once again, he didn't take that many 3s because he couldn't make them early in his career. Evidence is shown for this because of his low %s when he did take them. It's not like he was shooting 40% but didn't take that many.

[NuggetsFan]

Baseball.

[kentatm]

it would have been interesting to see how he played with refs that didnt allow him to do whatever the hell he wanted...

[OldSchoolBBall]

Jordan was not a good 3 point shooter for most of his career. People bring out that when he attempted a lot, he made them. Well the reason he didn't attempt so many (and make so many) early in his career was simply because he wasn't good enough.

There's no question that he wasn't a good 3-pt shooter early in his career, but by 1990 (age 26-27) he had become proficient (38% on 3 threes per game that year). As I noted earlier, the evidence suggests that MJ was a rhythm 3-point shooter, since in every season he took more than a trifling amount of three, he made 35-40+% of them (including postseasons). I think that, after 1989, he could have consistently been at 33-36% if he chose to take lots of threes, because that's what the evidence shows me.

[Timmeh]

His weakness is his decision making on draft night. Thread over.

[The Magic Man]

it would have been interesting to see how he played with refs that didnt allow him to do whatever the hell he wanted...


See Lebron/ D Wade

[The Joker]

His weakness was Scottie Pippen.

[bleedinpurpleTwo]

weakness?
he can't hit a baseball.

[madmax]

it would have been interesting to see how he played with refs that didnt allow him to do whatever the hell he wanted...
exactly...he was untouchable on basketball court. I clearly remember plenty of bogus calls he constantly was getting, he had his share of star treatment, just like nowadays superstars

[OldSchoolBBall]

exactly...he was untouchable on basketball court. I clearly remember plenty of bogus calls he constantly was getting, he had his share of star treatment, just like nowadays superstars

Yeah, he was "untouchable," which is why he averaged just 7.8 FTA/gm from age 26-30. :oldlol:

[stephanieg]

Come on Loki. Mike was getting Kobe/Wade calls during the second threepeat, if nothing else. That's where this sorta thing came from in the first place. Go up for the shot, whistle. Teehee, you bumped my elbow. You bad, bad man. MJ had as many free throws as Karl Malone in both finals. Or close to it, I haven't looked it up in awhile. That's a joke, especially since Rodman was tackling him.

[Da_Realist]

Come on Loki. Mike was getting Kobe/Wade calls during the second threepeat, if nothing else. That's where this sorta thing came from in the first place. Go up for the shot, whistle. Teehee, you bumped my elbow. You bad, bad man. MJ had as many free throws as Karl Malone in both finals. Or close to it, I haven't looked it up in awhile. That's a joke, especially since Rodman was tackling him.

Jordan played more in the post during the second three-peat. He was effectively a post player. So it makes sense that he would get more calls than he did when he was on the wing more in his younger years.

[stephanieg]

Hey, that's cool. I just don't want to ever see you complaining about Kobe getting fouled on fade aways where it doesn't look like the defender is anywhere close to him. Hmmm, maybe a body bump. Maybe. Right?

[andgar923]

exactly...he was untouchable on basketball court. I clearly remember plenty of bogus calls he constantly was getting, he had his share of star treatment, just like nowadays superstars

A star getting calls?

You don't say!!!

[Da_Realist]

Hey, that's cool. I just don't want to ever see you complaining about Kobe getting fouled on fade aways where it doesn't look like the defender is anywhere close to him. Hmmm, maybe a body bump. Maybe. Right?

No complaints about Kobe not getting calls on his fadeaway... Sure. I think I can handle that. :D

[Glove_20]

There's no question that he wasn't a good 3-pt shooter early in his career, but by 1990 (age 26-27) he had become proficient (38% on 3 threes per game that year). As I noted earlier, the evidence suggests that MJ was a rhythm 3-point shooter, since in every season he took more than a trifling amount of three, he made 35-40+% of them (including postseasons). I think that, after 1989, he could have consistently been at 33-36% if he chose to take lots of threes, because that's what the evidence shows me.
Well he shot just 31% in 92 and 27% in 93. Below average if you ask me, 3 point shooting was still considered a "weak" part of his game, therefore a weakness.

[97 bulls]

i dont understand how kobe can shoot 1 percenatge point higher than jordan for their respective careers and it be called a strength for kobe and a weakness for MJ.

[andgar923]

i dont understand how kobe can shoot 1 percenatge point higher than jordan for their respective careers and it be called a strength for kobe and a weakness for MJ.

Because that's the only thing they can dwell on.

[97 bulls]

Because that's the only thing they can dwell on.
lol you learn something new every day

[c_az_a]

i dont understand how kobe can shoot 1 percenatge point higher than jordan for their respective careers and it be called a strength for kobe and a weakness for MJ.

Kobe shoots alittle over 2.5% than LeBron. Decimal form 0.025. Here's analogy. The way they hype Kobe three point shooting over LeBron would be parallel to hyping Steve Nash free throw percentage to Shaq. The way they hype Kobe as the best NBA basketball player doesn't hide the fact that he was never earned the NBA Finals Most Valuable Player (out of 5 attempts).

[97 bulls]

Kobe shoots alittle over 2.5% than LeBron. Decimal form 0.025. Here's analogy. The way they hype Kobe three point shooting over LeBron would be parallel to hyping Steve Nash free throw percentage to Shaq. The way they hype Kobe as the best NBA basketball player doesn't hide the fact that he was never earned the NBA Finals Most Valuable Player (out of 5 attempts).
i see your point. but im not trying to start a kobe vs MJ war. i dont see 3pt shooting as a weakness for either of them. im just saying that to be honest, they are about the same in 3pt shooting, but for some reason jordans is considered a weakness.

[OldSchoolBBall]

Well he shot just 31% in 92 and 27% in 93. Below average if you ask me, 3 point shooting was still considered a "weak" part of his game, therefore a weakness.

Huh? Jordan shot 36% on threes in 1993, and 39% on 4 three-point attempts per game in the '93 playoffs. Not sure where you get 27% from.

About 1992, it goes back to my point about him doing just fine whenever he attempted more than a trifling number of threes after 1989. He attempted around 1 3FGA per game in '92 as compared to 3 per game in 1993.

1990: 38% on 3 threes per game
1993: 36% on 3 threes per game

He also shot 38.5+% in the '91-'93 playoffs, including 39% on nearly 4 threes per game in the '93 postseason, as noted above. In addition, he shot 37.4/42.7% on threes in '96 and '97 on 3.2/3.6 3FGA/gm, respectively, though that gets complicated because the line was moved in those two seasons.

[andgar923]

Huh? Jordan shot 36% on threes in 1993, and 39% on 4 three-point attempts per game in the '93 playoffs. Not sure where you get 27% from.

About 1992, it goes back to my point about him doing just fine whenever he attempted more than a trifling number of threes after 1989. He attempted around 1 3FGA per game in '92 as compared to 3 per game in 1993.

1990: 38% on 3 threes per game
1993: 36% on 3 threes per game

He also shot 38.5+% in the '91-'93 playoffs, including 39% on nearly 4 threes per game in the '93 postseason, as noted above. In addition, he shot 37.4/42.7% on threes in '96 and '97 on 3.2/3.6 3FGA/gm, respectively, though that gets complicated because the line was moved in those two seasons.


But.... but... I thought he played with a shorter 3pt line his entire career?

[97 bulls]

[/U][/B]

But.... but... I thought he played with a shorter 3pt line his entire career?
yeah, i think we can put this 3pters as a weakness nonsense to bed. MJ is the only player to be great in all facets of basketball.

[Diesel J]

Scoring- career 30.1 PPG

Shooting- shot over 50% 6 times

Defense- career 6.2 RPG(had an 8 RPG season), 2.3 SPG(once had 3.2), 1.5+ BPG twice

Leadership- extremely clutch, Bulls never lost a series with home court

3 point shooting- in seasons with at least 90 3 pointers made, never shot less than 37.4%

Playmaking- career 5.3 APG, averaged 6+ APG 3 times

Health- in his years as a Bull(minus 1994-95), played in 92.3% of his team's games


Honestly, did the man have one single weakness on the basketball court?

NO:pimp:

[Gingereffic]

Scoring- career 30.1 PPG

Shooting- shot over 50% 6 times

Defense- career 6.2 RPG(had an 8 RPG season), 2.3 SPG(once had 3.2), 1.5+ BPG twice

Leadership- extremely clutch, Bulls never lost a series with home court

3 point shooting- in seasons with at least 90 3 pointers made, never shot less than 37.4%

Playmaking- career 5.3 APG, averaged 6+ APG 3 times

Health- in his years as a Bull(minus 1994-95), played in 92.3% of his team's games


Honestly, did the man have one single weakness on the basketball court?



His only weakness was playing for the bulls. He should have been a blazer. Damn it... LOL:hammertime:

[Gingereffic]

:hammerhead: [,QUOTE=andgar923][/U][/B]

But.... but... I thought he played with a shorter 3pt line his entire career?[/QUOTE]



No he played with a shorter line in 96,97. n

[stephanieg]

Jordan's weakness is cold. You know, like the Blob.

[Jacks3]

He wasn't as good shooting off the dribble going right as he was going left.
Average 3-pt shooter.
:banana:

[Gingereffic]

Jordan played more in the post during the second three-peat. He was effectively a post player. So it makes sense that he would get more calls than he did when he was on the wing more in his younger years.



Most people believe MJ got more calls than guys that play now but if you look at free throw attempts per shot taken, I would say players today get to the line way more than MJ. Of course if you are talking about a Rookie Mj than he got to the line alot.. Look at this video and truly see the goat... His speed and ball handling abilities are way above anyone in today's game... Look at the move at 1:24 simply amazing:hammertime:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lusu0lEgb7U

[Gingereffic]

Well he shot just 31% in 92 and 27% in 93. Below average if you ask me, 3 point shooting was still considered a "weak" part of his game, therefore a weakness.



Those are years where he didn't take many three point shots. Most of those shots were taken as a result of shot clock windowns or buzzer beaters. He really didn't use the three point line that much. The league didn't use the three point line as much. Imagine MJ playing now with a power forward and , a small forward and pt guard who had range. He would be dunking all day, or avg close to 10 assists. Mj was the best going to the whole, no one is close.:rockon:

[Diesel J]

Kobe shoots alittle over 2.5% than LeBron. Decimal form 0.025. Here's analogy. The way they hype Kobe three point shooting over LeBron would be parallel to hyping Steve Nash free throw percentage to Shaq.

THat's because they only look or want to remember the games where Kobe is hot and blazing from downtown. In the games where he's not "hot" Kobe isn't that great of a 3pt shooter.

[Jacks3]

i dont understand how kobe can shoot 1 percenatge point higher than jordan for their respective careers and it be called a strength for kobe and a weakness for MJ.
Probably because Kobe took significantly more attempts and still shot a higher %. That's pretty telling.

[andgar923]

He wasn't as good shooting off the dribble going right as he was going left.
Average 3-pt shooter.
:banana:

LOLL

[97 bulls]

Probably because Kobe took significantly more attempts and still shot a higher %. That's pretty telling.
no, kobe SETTLES for all those 3pt attempts. and id call that a weakness for kobe.

[stephanieg]

Most people believe MJ got more calls than guys that play now but if you look at free throw attempts per shot taken, I would say players today get to the line way more than MJ.

League wide FT per FGA has been fairly flat since 1980.

Back when MJ played his biggest competition for FTA per game were big guys like Karl Malone, Hakeem, D-Rob, Shaq, Barkley, and Ewing. Nowadays this list is all populated by perimeter players. Some drive, some don't. They shoot more FTAs than Jordan did, sure, but they're all clumped together + the new rules. But Jordan shot more FTAs than his perimeter peers with the old rules.

Plus, as any respectable LeBron/Kobe hater will tell you, there's a lot more to getting away with murder than FTA. Traveling, hacking, pushing off, using hands, yanking a defender's arms, palming...it's as much about what refs don't call than what they do.

And yeah, Jordan during the '80s was from another planet. I think rookie Jordan is comparable to current LeBron.

[Jacks3]

no, kobe SETTLES for all those 3pt attempts. and id call that a weakness for kobe.
So? We're not discussing Kobe and his weaknesses.

[OldSchoolBBall]

He wasn't as good shooting off the dribble going right as he was going left.

I'm wondering where you pulled that one out from. :oldlol: That's completely false (from watching hundreds of his games) and no one has ever noted any such thing.

[stephanieg]

I'm wondering where you pulled that one out from. :oldlol: That's completely false (from watching hundreds of his games) and no one has ever noted any such thing.

Every announcer I've ever heard says you should force Jordan left, if anything. "He's unstoppable going right. Force him left and he's only unfair."

[Jacks3]

I'm wondering where you pulled that one out from. :oldlol: That's completely false (from watching hundreds of his games) and no one has ever noted any such thing.
He was great going both ways but he was better going left just like any right-handed shooter. Of course it's not a much of a weakness..I just felt like bringing it up.:lol

[Stacey King]

Well he shot just 31% in 92 and 27% in 93. Below average if you ask me, 3 point shooting was still considered a "weak" part of his game, therefore a weakness.

Actually, he shot 27% in 92 (on only 100 attempts; he shot the three much better in the Playoffs, and especially in Game 1 of the Finals :cheers: ) and 35% in 93 (on 230 attempts). He also shot 38% in 90 and 31% in 91.

Not only did you get the numbers wrong, but you failed to mention that he had some solid years from the three point line. Definitely not one of his strong points, but that's not the point. The point is: if you're gonna post stats, do a little research first and make sure it's right/relevant.

[DuMa]

he had a lot of weaknesses. the best thing about jordan, is that he wouldnt let you exploit them. instead, he'd just exploit yours.

[OldSchoolBBall]

THat's because they only look or want to remember the games where Kobe is hot and blazing from downtown. In the games where he's not "hot" Kobe isn't that great of a 3pt shooter.

This applies to Kobe's 2-pt field goals as well. Kobe simply has a much higher variance (divergence from the mean) as compared to a guy like Jordan. Kobe relies on games of extremely good shooting to make up for more nights of poor shooting than Jordan did. Jordan's numbers were closer to his averages in a greater percentage of his games than Kobe's are. This is another way to measure consistency.

[OldSchoolBBall]

yeah, i think we can put this 3pters as a weakness nonsense to bed. MJ is the only player to be great in all facets of basketball.

I wouldn't say he was "great" at three-point shooting, but it definitely wasn't a "weakness" imo. A "weaker part" of his game, sure, since he was excellent at everything else. But based on the available evidence I've posted as well as the number of threes he's hit to tie/win games, beat the shot/game clock, or bring his team back, I think calling it a "weakness" is going too far.

[Diesel J]

This applies to Kobe's 2-pt field goals as well. Kobe simply has a much higher variance (divergence from the mean) as compared to a guy like Jordan. Kobe relies on games of extremely good shooting to make up for more nights of poor shooting than Jordan did. Jordan's numbers were closer to his averages in a greater percentage of his games than Kobe's are. This is another way to measure consistency.

I agree

[97 bulls]

So? We're not discussing Kobe and his weaknesses.
lol wow, arent we defensive

[Jacks3]

lol wow, arent we defensive
I'm not being defensive. :confusedshrug:

[eliteballer]

Shooting. Ya, Jordan's just like Wade where he takes and makes enough to make you think he's a solid shooter, but when you actually look at the percentages of jumpers you see thats not the case.

Don't get me wrong, Jordan was an above average shooter of course. However, he always had the slashing and/or post game to to keep him from being exposed by having to become a volume shooter.

[OldSchoolBBall]

Shooting. Ya, Jordan's just like Wade where he takes and makes enough to make you think he's a solid shooter, but when you actually look at the percentages of jumpers you see thats not the case.

Don't get me wrong, Jordan was an above average shooter of course. However, he always had the slashing and/or post game to to keep him from being exposed by having to become a volume shooter.

You're a freaking joke, dude. :oldlol:

Jordan was a better shooter than Kobe from 21 feet and in by age 26-27, and a better shooter than Kobe from 22 feet and in by age 28. He was a significantly more consistent shooter than Kobe. He's one of the 2 or 3 best midrange shooters of all-time, if not THE best. What a joke. LMAO @ "above average shooter." :oldlol:

[juju151111]

Shooting. Ya, Jordan's just like Wade where he takes and makes enough to make you think he's a solid shooter, but when you actually look at the percentages of jumpers you see thats not the case.

Don't get me wrong, Jordan was an above average shooter of course. However, he always had the slashing and/or post game to to keep him from being exposed by having to become a volume shooter.
If ur talking about 3s you might of a point there, but if your refering to midrange ur a dumbass

[Diesel J]

Shooting. Ya, Jordan's just like Wade where he takes and makes enough to make you think he's a solid shooter, but when you actually look at the percentages of jumpers you see thats not the case.

Don't get me wrong, Jordan was an above average shooter of course. However, he always had the slashing and/or post game to to keep him from being exposed by having to become a volume shooter.


LOL @ this:oldlol:

[VCMVP1551]

As Loki mentioned Jordan was a good 3 point shooter when he wanted to be and he was defintley a volume shooter on 3's, most pure scorers are.

I never heard anyone claiming that Kobe couldn't shoot them, even when his % wasn't that good and he wasn't taking many.

1998-1999 26.7 3P%, 2.0 3PA
1999-2000 31.9 3P%, 2.2 3PA
2000-2001 30.5 3P%, 2.9 3PA
2001-2002 25.0 3P%, 1.6 3PA
2003-2004 32.7 3P%, 3.3 3PA

It's no coincidence that when he started shooting a better % he was taking far more of them. Kobe, like Jordan is a volume shooter on 3's. Yet so many Kobe homers hold this against Michael.

[305Baller]

Jordan had no weaknesses.

:hammertime:

[plowking]

Shooting. Ya, Jordan's just like Wade where he takes and makes enough to make you think he's a solid shooter, but when you actually look at the percentages of jumpers you see thats not the case.

Don't get me wrong, Jordan was an above average shooter of course. However, he always had the slashing and/or post game to to keep him from being exposed by having to become a volume shooter.


Yet Wade is shooting a better percentage then Kobe this year from the midrange...

[Riker]

I never heard anyone claiming that Kobe couldn't shoot them, even when his % wasn't that good and he wasn't taking many.

Kobe had better shot selection. :roll:




Im joking.

This thread is the best. It's like a crystal ball, giving you insight on all the mad haters and their delusional frustrations about a man that screwed their favorite players/teams dreams up.
http://i44.tinypic.com/99zymd.jpg

[305Baller]

Dan Majerle is in that pic?

[Riker]

Dan Majerle is in that pic?

Yeah. Cos he was in Suns finals. Against the Bulls. Kinda important player to them. Second scorer. In their best season. So...you know.

[305Baller]

Yeah I ssaw him play in Miami. Thundaaaah.

[Diesel J]

As Loki mentioned Jordan was a good 3 point shooter when he wanted to be and he was defintley a volume shooter on 3's, most pure scorers are.

I never heard anyone claiming that Kobe couldn't shoot them, even when his % wasn't that good and he wasn't taking many.

1998-1999 26.7 3P%, 2.0 3PA
1999-2000 31.9 3P%, 2.2 3PA
2000-2001 30.5 3P%, 2.9 3PA
2001-2002 25.0 3P%, 1.6 3PA
2003-2004 32.7 3P%, 3.3 3PA

It's no coincidence that when he started shooting a better % he was taking far more of them. Kobe, like Jordan is a volume shooter on 3's. Yet so many Kobe homers hold this against Michael.


Great post but it's because even when Jordan was hot he still didn't run to the 3pt line like KObe does. When Kobe's hot, he'll keep taking them even if they're forced/bad shots... and you'll get a game like the one where he hit 12 3's. Jordan on the other hand would still keep his midrange/drive attack going and would only take the 3 if it was there. So to Kobe homers, Jordan never hitting 12 3's in game means that Kobe is by far a better 3pt shooter.

[nba-jersey-king]

his weakness was his teammates - although they were good and some great, none were on his level which is what he expected of them, he went nuts at them for doing things wrong.

[Scott Pippen]

His weakness was Jerry Krause/Reinsdorf. Same for Pip & Phil Jackson also.

[Riker]

His weakness was Jerry Krause/Reinsdorf. Same for Pip & Phil Jackson also.

Pippen had the most pathetic disgraceful contract in the history of all sports.

[godofgods]

You mean besides women and gambling?

[jstern]

I remember Jordan saying, talking about that he had one weakness, but that he will never say what it is. I've always wondered what it was.

[The_Yearning]

I remember Jordan saying, talking about that he had one weakness, but that he will never say what it is. I've always wondered what it was.

Taking Scottie away from him.

[MakeHistory78]

No.He was perfect at everything at his prime.Even his 3 pt shooting was very good at his prime.
6 3's vs Blazers "The Shrug Game" 1992 NBA Finals Game 1.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zlaL9OhZQoc
6 3's vs Knicks 1993 Eastern Finals Game 4(54 points)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OoVMIZWS_-A

[Sakkreth]

His ego was to big imo, sometimes it's good, but most of the time it's not. Idk if u can count that as weakness.

[asdf1990]

he was too good and got bored of basketball so we couldn't witness the second 8 peat in nba history

[Harison]

Thats the beauty about MJ, he had no real weaknesses. :cheers:

[PurpleChuck]

he was too good and got bored of basketball so we couldn't witness the second 8 peat in nba history

Don't worry, Miami Heat gonna try our best to 8peat for the next decade. We da bess.

[beermonsteroo]

Gambling and women hurt his game at times.

[ZOMG]

His sperm. Because his freakish athleticm didnt transfer to his sons.

Right. :rolleyes:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oKXb8PZtdmQ