Would Bird basically be a slightly shorter Jokic in this era (2017-now).
Jokic this past year.
Per 100 Possessions:
38/15.5/12, 130 ORTG, 31.3 PER, 64.7 TS%, 11.7 BPM.
For all measures, Jokic had an ABSURD regular season. He was also his usual superstar self in the playoffs.
Peak Larry Bird (84-88).
Per 100 Possessions:
34/12/8, 119 ORTG, 26.1 PER, 58.8 TS%, 8.7 BPM.
Re: Would Bird basically be a slightly shorter Jokic in this era (2017-now).
You're comparing statistics from entirely different circumstances.
Jokic is an awesome player, but he isn't as mean as Bird was. Both great players... its just a short sighted comparison given we don't know how Jokic career will pan out.
Re: Would Bird basically be a slightly shorter Jokic in this era (2017-now).
Jokic does remind me of Bird. Their games are pretty similar. Jokic benefits from his extra size and the better spacing in this era.
In past I think jokic was too unselfish. This year he finally became more aggressive looking for his shot. Quite an impressive season and fun guy to watch.
Re: Would Bird basically be a slightly shorter Jokic in this era (2017-now).
That seems like an incredibly flawed way to look at things
Per 100 Possessions
'21 Embiid: 44/16/4 121 ORTG 30.3 PER, 64%TS, 7.2 BPM
'00 Shaq: 38/18/5 115 ORTG 30.6 PER, 58%TS, 9.3 BPM
'94 Hakeem: 34/14/4 109 ORTG 25.3 PER, 57%TS, 6.8 BPM
This would suggest Embiid was better than 2 of the greatest peaks ever last season
Re: Would Bird basically be a slightly shorter Jokic in this era (2017-now).
[QUOTE=SouBeachTalents;14441743]That seems like an incredibly flawed way to look at things
Per 100 Possessions
'21 Embiid: 44/16/4 121 ORTG 30.3 PER, 64%TS, 7.2 BPM
'00 Shaq: 38/18/5 115 ORTG 30.6 PER, 58%TS, 9.3 BPM
'94 Hakeem: 34/14/4 109 ORTG 25.3 PER, 57%TS, 6.8 BPM
This would suggest Embiid was better than 2 of the greatest peaks ever last season[/QUOTE]
I mean...mpg should play a factor too. I think Per 100 Poss can be used if players are playing 30+ mpg, it takes out pace a bit.
Also...I'm pretty sure Embiid is tied or even slightly ahead of Michael Jordan for points per minute for his career...but Embiid does play only 30.6 mpg for his career.
Even without Per 100, Jokic has massive raw stats while also being HIGHLY efficient from the field. Also his game is very similar to Bird's so I think they deserve a comp.
Also the 80's was a far faster pace/easier to score than the mid 90's-05 so I think we can still compare the 80's to now.
Re: Would Bird basically be a slightly shorter Jokic in this era (2017-now).
Joker is the closest thing we've seen to a 7 foot center version of Bird. Many point to Luka as the point guard version of Bird. But to be frank, I see more Bird in Joker to be honest. The efficiency and being able to dominate from a stationary position or off a bounce or two is VERY SIMILAR to Bird.
But MJ and Bird were the top two most feared scorers on the planet at one point. AND at the same time Bird was among the top 3 passers in the league. And an epic triple double threat. So Bird in today's league would be in contention for the best player in the league. As great as Joker is, he's more of a top 8-10 guy in the league.
A shorter version of Joker is selling Bird short. Bird is the pinnacle of his position in the HISTORY of hoops. Joker has a LONG WAY TO GO to be on that level among centers. Now in terms of offensive skill (scoring skillset, passing, handles), Joker is the MOST SKILLED center ever it's looking like. Hasn't done it for long, but we can't deny his offensive skillset.
Re: Would Bird basically be a slightly shorter Jokic in this era (2017-now).
[QUOTE=bizil;14441755]Joker is the closest thing we've seen to a 7 foot center version of Bird. Many point to Luka as the point guard version of Bird. But to be frank, I see more Bird in Joker to be honest. The efficiency and being able to dominate from a stationary position or off a bounce or two is VERY SIMILAR to Bird.
But MJ and Bird were the top two most feared scorers on the planet at one point. AND at the same time Bird was among the top 3 passers in the league. And an epic triple double threat. So Bird in today's league would be in contention for the best player in the league. As great as Joker is, he's more of a top 8-10 guy in the league.
A shorter version of Joker is selling Bird short. Bird is the pinnacle of his position in the HISTORY of hoops. Joker has a LONG WAY TO GO to be on that level among centers. Now in terms of offensive skill (scoring skillset, passing, handles), Joker is the MOST SKILLED center ever it's looking like. Hasn't done it for long, but we can't deny his offensive skillset.[/QUOTE]
I think it's safe to say Jokic could have a 10-year prime at a superstar level barring injury.
Idk where he will actually peak since he sucks at defense, but just talking offense he might be the most "skilled" center of all time.
Re: Would Bird basically be a slightly shorter Jokic in this era (2017-now).
[QUOTE=SouBeachTalents;14441743]That seems like an incredibly flawed way to look at things
Per 100 Possessions
'21 Embiid: 44/16/4 121 ORTG 30.3 PER, 64%TS, 7.2 BPM
'00 Shaq: 38/18/5 115 ORTG 30.6 PER, 58%TS, 9.3 BPM
'94 Hakeem: 34/14/4 109 ORTG 25.3 PER, 57%TS, 6.8 BPM
This would suggest Embiid was better than 2 of the greatest peaks ever last season[/QUOTE]
Embiid is a beast and he had butler in 2019 wow how come he didn't win the title that year?
Re: Would Bird basically be a slightly shorter Jokic in this era (2017-now).
[QUOTE=HBK_Kliq_2;14441814]Embiid is a beast and he had butler in 2019 wow how come he didn't win the title that year?[/QUOTE]
Embiid averaged only 18 ppg that series shooting 37% because he was being guarded by a former DPOY who was in his head.
Re: Would Bird basically be a slightly shorter Jokic in this era (2017-now).
Given the size difference Id say yeah their games are pretty similar. Joker is obviously bigger but keep in mind the league is bigger now too. Before 2003 it was pretty much a few superstar giants and a bunch of auto mechanics and grocery boys. The league got much more competitive around the time Bron came in.
Re: Would Bird basically be a slightly shorter Jokic in this era (2017-now).
Walton is a better comparisson to Joker (without the defense ofcourse).
Re: Would Bird basically be a slightly shorter Jokic in this era (2017-now).
I like the healthy Bill Walton option.
Bird with the freedom to shoot as many 3s as he wanted in today's game would need a rule to stop him.
Same with Rick Barry, World B. Free, Maravich...
Re: Would Bird basically be a slightly shorter Jokic in this era (2017-now).
I don't get the Watlon comp really. Bill was much more athletic and a much better defender. And Bill didn't function as a point center type of player. Even though he was a great passer. For me, Duncan is the closest we've seen to a Walton type of player. Duncan and Jokic BOTH are more dominant scorers than Bill though. Frankly, I think a 7 foot version of Bird is a pretty damn good comp. And even though he was a bit taller than Jokic, pre injury Sabonis would have been similar IF he made it to the league at that time.
Re: Would Bird basically be a slightly shorter Jokic in this era (2017-now).
Re: Would Bird basically be a slightly shorter Jokic in this era (2017-now).
Bird is only 7 cm shorter than Jokic.
He is 8 cm taller than Draymond.
If he played in this era he could probably play as PF/C.
We can call him:
Jokic with better shooting, scoring, ball handling
Or
Durant with less athleticism but better playmaking, rebounding
[IMG]https://i.ibb.co/rvsNtvC/images-q-tbn-ANd9-Gc-Si-Y5787-V4-Up-F7fhggx-AIFBft-VHVni-Tkf-PQ-usqp-CAU.jpg[/IMG]
