Pau Gasol vs. Dirk Nowitzki

Who is the better player? He has had the better career thus far? Who had the better peak? They play the same position and are similar in age (Dirk is 31, Gasol 29).

[B][U]Dirk Nowitzki[/U][/B]

2007 MVP
4x all-NBA first team
3x all-NBA second team
2x all-NBA third team
3x Top 3 in MVP voting
7x top 10 in MVP voting
8x all-star
Led his team to nine straight 50+ win seasons

[B][U]Pau Gasol
[/U][/B]

1x all-NBA third team
2x all-star
2002 Rookie of the Year
2009 NBA champion

[B]Stats[/B]

[U]Dirk[/U]

Career: 23/9/3
Peak: 27/9/3 (probably not his best season but statistically his best year)

[U]Pau[/U]

Career: 19/9/3
Peak: 21/10/3 (not his best season but statistically his best year)

I go with Dirk for all three. Dirk is top 40 all-time imo.

this post is as pointless as a MJ vs. corey brewer comparison

Dirk Nowitzki's offensive game is slightly better than Pau Gasol's, but Dirk limits himself from the outside a lot. While Pau has a more consistent and efficient offensive game.

Pau Gasol is the better defender compared to Nowitzki.

Nowitzki is the better overall player, Gasol is the player I want on my team as a complimentary player to another player because he doesn't need the ball to be effective.

Give me Pau Gasol please.

As a first option it is clearly Dirk. More explosive offensively and much improved defensively. People forget that just last year, Pau Gasol was still considered soft, even by many Laker fans.

As a second option, I feel Dirk is slightly hurt in this comparison because we simply haven't ever seen Dirk as a second option outside of his first 2 years. If you have a Kobe/Lebron/Wade, I would say Pau/Dirk are probably around equal. If you have a legit center, give me Dirk 10/10 times.

The overrating of Gasol is getting quite out of hand. Very good player, but not top 10 in the league. I currently have Dirk at 4 based on his play this season.

[QUOTE=Meticode]Dirk Nowitzki's offensive game is slightly better than Pau Gasol's, but Dirk limits himself from the outside a lot. While Pau has a more consistent and efficient offensive game.

Pau Gasol is the better defender compared to Nowitzki.

Nowitzki is the better overall player, Gasol is the player I want on my team as a complimentary player to another player because he doesn't need the ball to be effective.

Give me Pau Gasol please.[/QUOTE]
I never understood this logic about "x player is better, but I want x player on my team" when not talking about a specific team.

It's one thing if a person is asking for example... which would fit better, Dirk or Pau for the Lakers, but when we are just comparing 2 players, give me the best player 10 times out of 10. Also.... even in situational comparison, give me the better player 9 times out of 10. Give me Wade & LeBron over Wade & Dirk, or whatever. I'd always rather have the best players and adjust the role players around them if need be.

Dirk is a top 5 player this year, Gasol is top10. There is the answer: Dirk is better. Speaking of their careers, NBA-wise it's Dirk. In the FIBA compteitions it's Gasol, due to having had a better team. (Both of them play very well at international events.)

This comparison will get worse in the future, because Dirk operates as the #1 and Pau as te #2 option. Not the same roles. Defensively, Pau is better and he is a bit more efficient with the ball. Basketball IQ is high in both instances, slight edge to Gasol.

Still, overall I take Dirk. He is a top50 player of all time for sure. Let's see how he ends his career to get into more details.

International players = Da niceorz

[QUOTE=beasted86]I never understood this logic about "x player is better, but I want x player on my team" when not talking about a specific team.

It's one thing if a person is asking for example... which would fit better, Dirk or Pau for the Lakers, but when we are just comparing 2 players, give me the best player 10 times out of 10. Also.... even in situational comparison, give me the better player 9 times out of 10. Give me Wade & LeBron over Wade & Dirk, or whatever. I'd always rather have the best players and adjust the role players around them if need be.[/QUOTE]

There are players better than other players, but some players I just feel will never win a championship as a main player on their team with their play-style. Allen Iverson is a good example. I don't think Dirk will ever win a championship with the way he plays as the main option on a team. Pau is never going to be a main option (even though he was for a while with the sub-par Grizzlies) and he pretty much knows his role.

In saying that Dirk is the better player, but I'd still want Pau Gasol on my team over Dirk because a seven footer who plays away from the basket like a shooting guard isn't what usually wins championships. That's how I feel.

Gasol>>>insert PF...

Nowitzki have had the better career.

But if i had to pick one to start a franchise, Id choose Pau... Gasol is a better rounded player and more important, Gasol is a PF/C that plays like a PF/C with a fantastic back to the basket game, Im not a big fan of jump shooting big man.

[QUOTE]I don't think Dirk will ever win a championship with the way he plays as the main option on a team.[/QUOTE]

In his defense, he came close to doing it. His team was extremely close to going up 3-0 in the NBA finals. Yeah, part of the reason they lost was he underperformed but there were also some questionable call late in games, particularly Game 3. Dirk has never won a ring as the main scoring option but one can certainly envision him doing so.

I would pick Dirk over Gasol.
Dirk can burn you from outside as well as in the post. He is always the first option. Gasol is not bad as the first option but he is even better as a second option. He fits in so well with the Lakers. Both are high IQ players.

For Roundball: I would also pick Dirk or Gasol over Amare anyday.

[QUOTE=Roundball_Rock]In his defense, he came close to doing it. His team was extremely close to going up 3-0 in the NBA finals. Yeah, part of the reason they lost was he underperformed but there were also some questionable call late in games, particularly Game 3. Dirk has never won a ring as the main scoring option but one can certainly envision him doing so.[/QUOTE]
Okay.

[QUOTE=Meticode]Okay.[/QUOTE]

How many players today do you believe have the ability to lead their teams to a championship as the #1 (scoring) option? Dirk probably is a top 5 player right now. Only Kobe, Lebron (who performed far worse than Dirk when he got to the finals) and Wade?

[QUOTE]For Roundball: I would also pick Dirk or Gasol over Amare anyday.[/QUOTE]

:mad:

[QUOTE=Roundball_Rock]How many players today do you believe have the ability to lead their teams to a championship as the #1 (scoring) option? Dirk probably is a top 5 player right now. Only Kobe, Lebron (who performed far worse than Dirk when he got to the finals) and Wade?[/quote]

Not many, but he didn't win it. And I feel he never will win it as a #1.

Dirk all day, everyday. He's underrated as hell.

[QUOTE=Roundball_Rock]Who is the better player? He has had the better career thus far? Who had the better peak? They play the same position and are similar in age (Dirk is 31, Gasol 29).

[B][U]Dirk Nowitzki[/U][/B]

2007 MVP
4x all-NBA first team
3x all-NBA second team
2x all-NBA third team
3x Top 3 in MVP voting
7x top 10 in MVP voting
8x all-star
Led his team to nine straight 50+ win seasons

[B][U]Pau Gasol
[/U][/B]

1x all-NBA third team
2x all-star
2002 Rookie of the Year
2009 NBA champion

[B]Stats[/B]

[U]Dirk[/U]

Career: 23/9/3
Peak: 27/9/3 (probably not his best season but statistically his best year)

[U]Pau[/U]

Career: 19/9/3
Peak: 21/10/3 (not his best season but statistically his best year)

I go with Dirk for all three. Dirk is top 40 all-time imo.[/QUOTE]

Dirk = Pierce and Gasol = Kobe

[QUOTE=ProfessorMurder]Dirk all day, everyday. He's underrated as hell.[/QUOTE]

I think that first round loss permanently ruined his reputation.

[QUOTE=Bodhi]I think that first round loss permanently ruined his reputation.[/QUOTE]

True, unfortunately.

[QUOTE=pierce2008mvp]Dirk = Pierce and Gasol = Kobe[/QUOTE]

I love these equations. Here are a few others to consider:

Garnett = Telfair, Duncan = Livingston, Shaq = Big Mac, T-Mac = Little John, You = Bugs Bunny

I would pick Gasol. Both are top 8 players in the league, although Gasol is more complete, he is a better rebounder, a better defender, a better blocker and a better assister. Nowtizki is a better shooter and a better scorer

Gasol is more a team player. Nowitzki is more a star. Give me Gasol before. Give me before prime Manu Ginobili than Carmelo Anthony too

[QUOTE=Bodhi]I think that first round loss permanently ruined his reputation.[/QUOTE]


It did but that Mavs team was not that great.. Dirk played great that season and had his team overperform.. Dirk is better.. But I take Gasol if I need a complimentary player...

Dirk for all three and Dirk if I need to start a franchise from scratch but if I need a complementary big and already have a high scoring perimeter player like Wade or Kobe, I take Gasol because I would rather have a great low post player who is a good passer then a great high post player who is average player. If I have a center like Bogut or Howard who plays in the low post, I take Dirk though. Both are great players though.

Gasol is also world champion, a european champion, a NBA champion and an Olympic finalist, being the star of a team who really putted in trouble the redream team

Nowitzki doesnt have any major team achievements

[QUOTE=Hyman]Nowitzki doesnt have any major team achievements[/QUOTE]

Neither had the teammates Gasol had. Both internationally and in the NBA.

[QUOTE=Hyman]Gasol is also world champion, a european champion, a NBA champion and an Olympic finalist, being the star of a team who really putted in trouble the redream team

Nowitzki doesnt have any major team achievements[/QUOTE]

Gasol was 0-12 in the playoffs--including his 50 win team getting swept by Dirk's 53 win team (Dirk thoroughly outplayed Gasol too)--before teaming up with Kobe. Gasol is from Spain. Are we to penalize Dirk from being born in Germany and not playing for the great Spanish team?

[QUOTE=Hyman]Gasol is also world champion, a european champion, a NBA champion and an Olympic finalist, being the star of a team who really putted in trouble the redream team

Nowitzki doesnt have any major team achievements[/QUOTE]
Dirk's individual accomplishment's sh!t on Gasol's though and make up for that difference in team accomplishments. Dirk also has never had a coach as good as Phil or a player close to Kobe either. Not to mention, Dirk took a steaming dump on Gasol in the 06 playoffs.

[QUOTE=Roundball_Rock]Gasol was 0-12 in the playoffs--including his 50 win team getting swept by Dirk's 53 win team (Dirk thoroughly outplayed Gasol too)--before teaming up with Kobe. Gasol is from Spain. Are we to penalize Dirk from being born in Germany and not playing for the great Spanish team?[/QUOTE]

Which was the level of spanish basketball before the arrival of Gasol? What would be the level of the spanish NT without Gasol?

With Gasol being a leader and a bunch of scrubs, Memphis made 3 consecutive playoff appearances. Thats a huge succes for a team like them

Moreover Gasol is not today the player he was back in 06. He has evolved a lot, specially in toughness and defense. I dont think that Nowitzki today is a very different player to the one of 06

[QUOTE]Which was the level of spanish basketball before the arrival of Gasol?[/QUOTE]


Pretty good. At Eurobasket:

Gold: 2009
Silver: 1935, 1973, 1983, 1999, 2003, 2007
Bronze: 1991, 2001


Watch the table at the bottom of the page:

[url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spain_national_basketball_team[/url]

[QUOTE=Hyman]Which was the level of spanish basketball before the arrival of Gasol? What would be the level of the spanish NT without Gasol?

With Gasol being a leader and a bunch of scrubs, Memphis made 3 consecutive playoff appearances. Thats a huge succes for a team like them[/QUOTE]

A bunch of scrubs were led to 50 wins by Gasol? Why did he struggle to lead his team to more than 20 wins in the next three years? If he had the Midas touch to take scrubs to 50 wins, something even Jordan could not do, surely he would have used it after 2006. Where was he when it counted in 06' btw? Dirk thrashed him and swept him.

Where was Argentinian basketball before Manu? Manu also has 3 rings. Does Manu>Clyde Drexler since he has far more team accomplishments?

[QUOTE=elementally morale]Pretty good. At Eurobasket:

Gold: 2009
Silver: 1935, 1973, 1983, 1999, 2003, 2007
Bronze: 1991, 2001[/QUOTE]

Without Gasol the spanish NT had never won a major tournament. With him they are current world and european champions, olympic finalists and one of the biggest european national teams ever to exist, in a relative small country where most people arent even interested in basketball (football, cycling, tennis or motorsports have much more TV audience than basketball)

The spanish team has achieved more with Gasol than in all its history. I dont think its something by chance

[QUOTE=Hyman]The spanish team has achieved more with Gasol than in all its history. I dont think its something by chance[/QUOTE]


True.

However, you are comparing that to the German team. Not all time, but in the Dirk-timeframe. Could you please tell me a few active German basketball players w/o looking the names up?

Thank you.

[QUOTE=Roundball_Rock]A bunch of scrubs were led to 50 wins by Gasol? Why did he struggle to lead his team to more than 20 wins in the next three years? If he had the Midas touch to take scrubs to 50 wins, something even Jordan could not do, surely he would have used it after 2006. Where was he when it counted in 06' btw? Dirk thrashed him and swept him.

Where was Argentinian basketball before Manu? Manu also has 3 rings. Does Manu>Clyde Drexler since he has far more team accomplishments?[/QUOTE]

I havent seen Clyde Drexler play. But Manu is one of the best 10 players to play the game in the last decade for sure

In his prime twice the player Carmelo Anthony has ever been

[QUOTE=Roundball_Rock]A bunch of scrubs were led to 50 wins by Gasol? Why did he struggle to lead his team to more than 20 wins in the next three years? If he had the Midas touch to take scrubs to 50 wins, something even Jordan could not do, surely he would have used it after 2006. Where was he when it counted in 06' btw? Dirk thrashed him and swept him.

Where was Argentinian basketball before Manu? Manu also has 3 rings. Does Manu>Clyde Drexler since he has far more team accomplishments?[/QUOTE]

Were not Memphis a bunch of scrubs?

Is not this Memphis team, much more talented than Gasol's memphis team was.

Do u have any doubt that if Pau replaced Randolph at Memphis, they would become real finals of conference contenders?

[QUOTE=Hyman]The spanish team has achieved more with Gasol than in all its history. I dont think its something by chance[/QUOTE]

The same thing can be said about Manu and the Argentinian team, which won an Olympic gold.

[QUOTE]I havent seen Clyde Drexler play. But Manu is one of the best 10 players to play the game in the last decade for sure

In his prime twice the player Carmelo Anthony has ever been[/QUOTE]

Ok. How about Chris Paul? Gasol has far more team accomplishments than him. There is an age difference between them. Yao? Yao was always considered a better player, was an elite player but Gasol has more team success.

[QUOTE]Were not Memphis a bunch of scrubs?[/QUOTE]

Gasol was not even all-NBA third team that year and received 0 MVP votes. That is odd if indeed he carried scrubs to 50 wins. Gasol is not the type of player who can lead scrubs to 50 wins (think Kareem, Bird, Russell). Look at Wade. He can barely get his scrubs to .500 and Wade is far superior to Gasol (although Gasol has more team accomplishments than Wade as well). If Gasol carried scrubs he would have done it in subsequent years as well. What happened? Gasol remained Gasol. Why the decline from a 50 win team to a perennial 20 win team?

[QUOTE=Roundball_Rock]The same thing can be said about Manu and the Argentinian team, which won an Olympic gold.



Ok. How about Chris Paul? Gasol has far more team accomplishments than him. There is an age difference between them. Yao? Yao was always considered a better player, was an elite player but Gasol has more team success.[/QUOTE]

Its impossible to compare Gasol with Chris Paul. Chris Paul is much younger and in my opinion, he can be one of the best guards ever. He has definitely a very long carreer, and his peak is highers than Gasol

[QUOTE=Roundball_Rock]
Gasol was not even all-NBA third team that year and received 0 MVP votes. That is odd if indeed he carried scrubs to 50 wins. Gasol is not the type of player who can lead scrubs to 50 wins (think Kareem, Bird, Russell). Look at Wade. He can barely get his scrubs to .500 and Wade is far superior to Gasol (although Gasol has more team accomplishments than Wade as well). If Gasol carried scrubs he would have done it in subsequent years as well. What happened? Gasol remained Gasol. Why the decline from a 50 win team to a perennial 20 win team?[/QUOTE]

Theres a thing called motivation

[QUOTE=Hyman]Theres a thing called motivation[/QUOTE]

Gasol decided to quit? This is the first I have heard about this. Where did you get the idea that Gasol, whose production remained the same and actually slightly improved, decided to mail it in a la Vince Carter because a 50 win team got owned by Dirk's 53 win team? If he was unmotivated his production didn't reflect it.

How about Yao vs. Gasol? They are about the same age. Yao is, or at least was before Gasol went to LA, considered a much better individual player but Gasol has more team success.

[QUOTE=Hyman]Without Gasol the spanish NT had never won a major tournament. With him they are current world and european champions, olympic finalists and one of the biggest european national teams ever to exist, in a relative small country where most people arent even interested in basketball (football, cycling, tennis or motorsports have much more TV audience than basketball)

The spanish team has achieved more with Gasol than in all its history. I dont think its something by chance[/QUOTE]
Class comedy. Of course they won cause of Gasol and all the other spanish players who played in the NBA or were going to the NBA were only that good cause of Gasol. :roll:

Name one german player who plays an important role on a Euroleague contender.

You are so full of ****.

Give me Dirk Nowitzki 24/7.

Dirk >>>> Gasol