Peak Alonzo Mourning or Peak Dwight Howard

I mean Howard's peak thus far vs Mourning's peak, not a prediction of how good Howard could be.

[B]2000 Alonzo Mourning[/B]
[B]Regular Season-[/B] 21.7 ppg, 9.5 rpg, 1.6 apg, 3.7 bpg, 0.5 spg, 2.7 TO, 55.1 FG%, 71.1 FT%, 3.9 PF, 34.8 mpg, 79 games
[B]Playoffs-[/B] 21.6 ppg, 10 rpg, 1.4 spg, 3.3 bpg, 0.2 spg, 2.4 TO, 48.4 FG%, 66.7 FT%, 4 PF, 37.6 mpg, 10 games

[B]Notable games[/B]
43 points, 16 rebounds, 5 blocks, 13/14 FG, 17/24 FT in a win vs New Jersey
37 points, 11 rebounds, 8 blocks, 15/23 FG, 7/10 FT in a win vs Sacramento

[B]Playoffs[/B]
20 points, 9 rebounds, 3 assists and 9 blocks on 9/16 shooting to open up the first round with a win over Detroit
29 points, 13 rebounds and 5 blocks on 12/20 shooting in a game 7 loss during the Eastern Division Semi-Finals vs the Knicks.

1st in blocks, 3rd in FG%, 11th in rebounding and 15th in scoring

Defensive Player Of The Year, All-NBA Second Team, 3rd in MVP voting

52-30 record, 2nd in the Eastern Conference, lost in the Eastern Conference Semi-Finals.

The Team's defensive rating was 101(7th in the league), they allowed 91.3 ppg(4th in the league) and opponents shot 42.2%(2nd in the league)

[B]2009 Dwight Howard[/B]
[B]Regular Season-[/B] 20.6 ppg, 13.8 rpg, 1.4 apg, 2.9 bpg, 1 spg, 3 TO, 57.2 FG%, 59.4 FT%, 3.4 PF, 35.7 mpg, 79 games
[B]Playoffs-[/B] 20.3 ppg, 15.3 rpg, 1.9 apg, 2.6 bpg, 0.9 spg, 2.9 TO, 60.1 FG%, 63.6 FT%, 4.4 PF, 39.3 mpg, 23 games

[B]Notable games[/B]
45 points, 19 rebounds, 8 blocks, 16/23 FG, 13/18 FT in a win vs Charlotte
32 points, 21 rebounds, 3 assists, 11/15 FG, 10/18 FT in a win vs Indiana
30 points, 19 rebounds, 3 assists, 10 blocks, 12/21 FG, 6/13 FT in a win vs OKC

[B]Playoffs[/B]
Opened up the playoffs with 31 points and 16 rebounds on 11/13 shooting and 9/12 from the line in a game 1 loss to Philadelphia
36 points, 11 rebounds and 3 blocks on 12/16 shooting and 12/14 from the line in a game 3 loss to Philadelphia
24 points and 24 rebounds on 8/14 shooting and 8/12 from the line in a game 5 victory vs Philadelphia
23 points, 22 rebounds and 3 blocks on 9/16 shooting and 5/12 from the line in a game 6 victory over Boston in the Eastern Division Semi-Finals
30 points and 14 rebounds on 14/20 shooting in a game 1 win over Cleveland in the Eastern Conference Finals
27 points, 14 rebounds, 4 assist and 3 blocks on 10/16 shooting and 7/9 from the line in a game 4 victory over Cleveland. Howard scored 10 points in overtime
40 points, 14 rebounds and 4 assists on 14/21 shooting and 12/16 from the line in the clinching game 6 vs Cleveland.
16 points, 21 rebounds and a finals record 9 blocks on 5/12 shooting and 6/14 from the line in a game 4 loss vs the Lakers

1st in rebounding, 1st in blocks, 4th in FG% and 18th in scoring

Defensive Player Of The Year, All-NBA First Team, 4th in MVP voting

59-23 record, 3rd in the Eastern Conference, Lost in the Finals

The team had a defensive rating of 101.9(best in the league), they allowed 94.4 ppg(6th in the league) and opponents shot 43.3% against them(3rd in the league)

[B]My analysis[/B]

[B]Offense-[/B] both players produced at similar levels, however Mourning was more skilled with better moves including a fadeaway in the post, a face up jumper and a jump hook that was more consistent than Howard's. He was also one of the quicker centers when he faced up and I'd say a better passer(though Mourning wasn't a standout passer). On the other side, Howard was a much better rebounder which created scoring opportunities, and his superior athleticism made him available for more alley oops. Like Mourning, Howard could also face up and drive to the basket or hit a running hook with either hand and occasionally a nice spin move. However, Mourning's footwork was better. But Howard did get teams into foul trouble more frequently.

[B]Defense-[/B] Both were the best shot blockers in their respective seasons, but Mourning was even better. Both were intimidating presences who changed games even without blocking a shot because they contested everything combined with long wingspans. However, that also made both of them foul prone. Mourning was a superior post defender as well, IMO, but Howard's rebounding can't be ignored. It also has to be mentioned that Mourning played with better defenders including a legit power forward who was a good defensive player and rebounder. But rebounding is part of defense and Howard easily wins there.

[B]Conclusion-[/B] Howard may have had a more successful season, but I think Mourning was a little better due to his more polished game, that's really the difference here because it's close.

Mourning was slightly better... more effective in his prime... however Dwight is only 24 and I don't think we've seen his best season yet.

[QUOTE=ShaqAttack3234]

[B]Conclusion-[/B] Howard may have had a more successful season, [B]but I think Mourning was a little better due to his more polished game[/B], that's really the difference here because it's close.[/QUOTE]

How foolish... :facepalm

Anyways, what is their season FG attempt?

Good post and question. I thought Mourning hands down, but then read this. and was like hmm...interesting. I'm going to Mourning, by just a little bit.

[QUOTE=Rose]Good post and question. I thought Mourning hands down, but then read this. and was like hmm...interesting. [B]I'm going to Mourning, by just a little bit.[/B][/QUOTE]

Are you also deceived?

Alonzo would break you're nose if you went up against him while Dwight will probaly just smile at you. Zo was a tough SOB who took no nonsense from anyone.Plus Zo atleast had a pretty realiable jumper on him along with some good low post scoring ability with a few moves and had a nice hook shot.

Their impact on the court was pretty much equal, but Zo was a much more skilled offensive player while being slightly worse on the boards and equal on D. If I'm buiding a team I take Zo.

Mourning was a better defensive and offensive player, while Howard was the better rebounder.

Dwight Howard has not hit his peak, so you can't say yet. If you just go by what he has done so far, then Mourning is slightly better, but that is unfair since you can look at Alonzo's entire career, and we only have the first few years for Dwight.

Dwight Howard is only 24 years old. He has not even gotten his man body yet. When he hits 27-28, then you can start making the comparison.

All you fools need to take your [B]sunglasses off[/B] and look closely at their stats!!!

:wtf:

[QUOTE=ronnymac]Alonzo would break you're nose if you went up against him while Dwight will probaly just smile at you. Zo was a tough SOB who took no nonsense from anyone.Plus Zo atleast had a pretty realiable jumper on him along with some good low post scoring ability with a few moves and had a nice hook shot.[/QUOTE]

I agree that Zo is more intense which is the other thing that gives him the edge, but Dwight hands out plenty of hard fouls and has been called a dirty player by some.

[QUOTE=Sarcastic]
Dwight Howard is only 24 years old. He has not even gotten his man body yet. When he hits 27-28, then you can start making the comparison.[/QUOTE]

Hopefully, he can still get better. Working with Olajuwon couldn't have hurt, but he did take a step backwards last season after improving in each of his first 5 years.

[QUOTE=ronnymac]Alonzo would break you're nose if you went up against him while Dwight will probaly just smile at you. Zo was a tough SOB who took no nonsense from anyone.Plus Zo atleast had a pretty realiable jumper on him along with some good low post scoring ability with a few moves and had a nice hook shot.[/QUOTE]

Dwight is a christian, so no. He is not a cocky arrogant SOB..
and yes he will smile and still dunk on your ass.

[QUOTE=Bladers]All you fools need to take your [B]sunglasses off[/B] and look closely at their stats!!!

:wtf:[/QUOTE]
We don't need stats to know who's better.

[url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VLPpvSkbRjc[/url]

Big Zo all day. :pimp:

[QUOTE=BFRESH44][url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VLPpvSkbRjc[/url]

Big Zo all day. :pimp:[/QUOTE]

:pimp:

[QUOTE=BFRESH44][url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VLPpvSkbRjc[/url]

Big Zo all day. :pimp:[/QUOTE]

Dwight had a 45 point game, and he's only 24. He'll hit 50 sooner or later.

[QUOTE=Bladers]Dwight is a christian, so no. He is not a cocky arrogant SOB..
and yes he will smile and still dunk on your ass.[/QUOTE]
It's called intensity. He instilled fear into his opponents. I still remember the shiner he gave pippen in the 97-98 playoffs where he just flattend him which pretty much lifted the whole heat team who won that game 3 but still lost the series.

[QUOTE=ShaqAttack3234]

[B]Conclusion-[/B] Howard may have had a more successful season, but I think Mourning was a little better due to his more polished game, that's really the difference here because it's close.[/QUOTE]
I'm pretty sure everybody already thinks that. So basically you posted a bunch of stats and accomplishments only to state the complete obvious.

When mourning came out of college he was truely a rookie in a mans world.
MJ got into his head so much , that Zo had to work on his game as well as his mental makeup.

Howard came out of school , and showed immediately that he can be an impact player.
Right now Howard has not reached his peak , because his team does not judicisly feed him the ball as the Lakers did with Shaq.
---------------
Howards peak may never come unless he starts getting more touchs and his mental makeup changes as well.
==================
I take mourning for a couple of reasons , he worked on his game to be a POWER player in a 6'10" build. His rebound prowls were under rated because many times I saw tip outs , box outs allowing other players to get the board.
And finally two other legit reasons , HIS DEFENSE.
Never in serious foul trouble in his peak , played most big men straight up , and he owns a ring.
Tell me he was not important in that championship run , and you hav no idea what basketball is all about. The better play from Zo backing up Shaq , and team continuity.

IT's up to Howard to peak , demand the ball , and garner a ring as a champion.

I also truly believe that that the 1999/Lockout year MVP award belongs to Zo....Yes homer. Fvck Karl Malone's puss ass. :pimp:

I'd take the guy who was naturally a better offensive player, meaning he was more comfortable/expected to take closer to 15 or more shots a game, versus maybe 10-12 shots a game which I feel Howard is more prone to with Orlando still being a competitor. Shot blocking I feel is close to a wash, but I can't see Mourning in his peak being reduced to having a 1-6 FG game in the Finals against Pau and Bynum, even though I don't consider him an elite offensive player (he had his fair share of low scoring games too). Mourning had a usage-% of nearly 30% in that playoff run, and generally had a higher % (than Howard's playoff runs) in every post season prior to that. Mourning was also sharing boards with a solid big man in PJ Brown who averaged roughly 10 boards in the RS, and 8 boards in the post season. On Howard's team, there's really nobody even close to approaching those averages on rebounds, his starting PF averages about 5-7 three point attempts per game, and hangs around on the perimeter. I hate talking raw numbers though, it turns into more of a fantasy-debate (arguing over over miniscule differences in stats). Mourning I feel was just the better, smarter, more aggressive and tougher player, even if his team-results weren't wowing. Still though, he won a championship averaging over a block a game in about 10 minutes per at a pretty old age (which is irrelevant in this thread, but still an achievement).

I'm going with Zo by a bit too.

The difference being that Zo could warp defenses more. They look pretty comparible by the numbers as far as offensive production goes, but Zo was more inclined to force you a double team. And more inclined to get you a hoop on his own. Howard is a much better rebounder, in fact Howard is a much better rebounder than all but about a half dozen players in the history of the league. But I actaully hold that against him a bit offensively. He's getting full offensive rebound more than Zo did over their careers. If he could demand the ball and wasn't free to attack the glass offensively that wouldn't be the case. And don't undervalue the fact that Zo was a competent FT shooter and Howard is awfull.

Defensively it's close, but I'd give the nod to Howard a bit. Zo was a monster patrolling the lane. Even moreso than Howard when it came to defending the rim. However it's close, and like I said, Howard is an all time rebounder, and the fact that Howard can be that good a rebounder and still go after blocks that aggressively is astounding.

He's got to get to the point where you can give him the ball when you need a bucket and he can get one regardless of what's thrown at him. In the end I'd take Zo's slightly larger advantage offensively over Howards slight edge defensively.

I don't even have to think for 5 seconds before I pick Zo. Zo had twice the heart that Dwight "Smiley" Howard has. Dwight doesn't want the pressure in the big game while Zo is the one putting the pressure on the other team in the big game.

[QUOTE=LAClipsFan33]Dwight doesn't want the pressure in the big game while Zo is the one putting the pressure on the other team in the big game.[/QUOTE]

Now this is just false, go look at OT of game 4 in the '09 ECF when he scored 10 points or game 6 when he set the tone by outrunning everyone, working harder for rebounds, demanding the ball and delivering with 40 points to send his team to the finals.

I pick Zo too, but big game performances are not an argument for him over Dwight.

[QUOTE=ShaqAttack3234]Now this is just false, go look at OT of game 4 in the '09 ECF when he scored 10 points or game 6 when he set the tone by outrunning everyone, working harder for rebounds, demanding the ball and delivering with 40 points to send his team to the finals.

I pick Zo too, but big game performances are not an argument for him over Dwight.[/QUOTE]

And what did he do against the Lakers ? Fold like a lawn chair and get dominated by Pau Gasol for half the series. He looked like he wanted to cry mid game. Sure he looked like a beast against Varejo and Zydrunas "My knees don't bend" Illgauskus, not so much against Pau Gasol. LOL Howard was supposed to be the beast and Pau the softie. Pau made Dwight his b*tch.

Zo is better, end of story.

Only reason Howard's numbers are the way they are, is because he goes up against nobodies and today's big men are all to busy trying to be small forwards instead of playing the post.

Most of Howard's game consists of he using his size and athleticism. And there isn't that many big men today anyway.

Like somebody mentioned, Zo was a leader and he'd rip your throat out if he had too. Meanwhile Howard would just smile.

[QUOTE=LAClipsFan33]And what did he do against the Lakers ? Fold like a lawn chair and get dominated by Pau Gasol for half the series. He looked like he wanted to cry mid game. Sure he looked like a beast against Varejo and Zydrunas "My knees don't bend" Illgauskus, not so much against Pau Gasol. LOL Howard was supposed to be the beast and Pau the softie. Pau made Dwight his b*tch.[/QUOTE]

Zo's number 1 seed Heat lost to the 8th seed Knicks and a 36 year old Ewing on one leg outplayed him in the deciding 5th game in Miami and Zo managed just 8 rpg for the series while a hobbled, old Ewing thoroughly outplayed him.

See how easy that is? Lets not act like Zo was just rolling through the playoffs and didn't have his disappointing games and series.

[QUOTE=andgar923]Zo is better, end of story.

Only reason Howard's numbers are the way they are, is because he goes up against nobodies and today's big men are all to busy trying to be small forwards instead of playing the post.

Most of Howard's game consists of he using his size and athleticism. And there isn't that many big men today anyway.

Like somebody mentioned, Zo was a leader and he'd rip your throat out if he had too. Meanwhile Howard would just smile.[/QUOTE]

Howard's mental toughness is questionable. I think if he went head to head with Mourning he'd get intimidated. When Zo knew he was in your head he'd rip your heart out and eat it in front of you. I don't think Dwight would ever want this matchup.

[QUOTE=ShaqAttack3234]Zo's number 1 seed Heat lost to the 8th seed Knicks and a 36 year old Ewing on one leg outplayed him in the deciding 5th game in Miami and Zo managed just 8 rpg for the series while a hobbled, old Ewing thoroughly outplayed him.

See how easy that is? Lets not act like Zo was just rolling through the playoffs and didn't have his disappointing games and series.[/QUOTE]

Pat Ewing's heart >> Pau Gasol's heart

Losing to Ewing and getting punked by Gasol are totally different situations

Do you think Zo would ever get punked by Gasol ?

seriously i don't understand this thread, we have already talk about that shaqattack, but Mourning do everything better than howard.
i'm sorry but they don't play in the same court.
first, you take a "peak" of Zo in 2000. okay he was awarded this year but mainly because there were only 2 great centers in 2000. young alonzo was imo more impressive and he had to battle against young mutombo, shaq, prime robinson and olajuwon.
it's like howard, he is DPOY but there is no center anymore, it's a bit normal he has more rebounds than the others!? if he played in 95 he would be the 5th best defensive center of the league, so far away from a DPOY title.

i really don't agree with this "little edge" for zo and no more with the comparison.

[QUOTE=Bladers]All you fools need to take your [B]sunglasses off[/B] and look closely at their stats!!!

:wtf:[/QUOTE]

...And you need to stop looking at stats and watch 'Zo play, especially in a league that contained more centres than just himself.

[QUOTE=LAClipsFan33]Pat Ewing's heart >> Pau Gasol's heart

Losing to Ewing and getting punked by Gasol are totally different situations

Do you think Zo would ever get punked by Gasol ?[/QUOTE]

Gasol in 2009 was a much, much better player than an injured 36 year old Ewing. There's nothing to suggest Zo was a better big game performer.

[QUOTE=LAClipsFan33]Pat Ewing's heart >> Pau Gasol's heart

Losing to Ewing and getting punked by Gasol are totally different situations

Do you think Zo would ever get punked by Gasol ?[/QUOTE]

He was 36!

C'mon man now you're just reaching. If you pick Zo, just pick him, don't look for reasons to discredit Dwight.

BTW, Pau didn't rape him in that series:

Game 1:
DH: 12 (16%)/15/2blks
PG: 16 (58%)/8/2blks

G2:
DH:17 (50%)/16/4 blks
PG:24 (50%)/ 10/1blk

G3:
DH: 21 (83%)/14/2blks
PG: 23 (81%)/3/2blks

G4:
DH: 16 (41%)/21/9blks
PG: 16 (50%)/10/0blks

G5:
DH: 11 (55%)/10/3blks
PG: 14 (66%)/15/4blks

Pau arguably had the better series, but Pau is older and has experience at the stage before. And he most definitely didn't "punk" Howard.

LOL all of Howards accolades really dont mean shit compared to what Zo did.



[url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IYmpPqJLX_Y[/url]


Thats an old man, with a dangling kidney abusing Howard. :lol

[QUOTE=Dwade305]LOL all of Howards accolades really dont mean shit compared to what Zo did.



[url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IYmpPqJLX_Y[/url]


Thats an old man, with a dangling kidney abusing Howard. :lol[/QUOTE]

/Thread

[QUOTE=Dwade305]LOL all of Howards accolades really dont mean shit compared to what Zo did.



[url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IYmpPqJLX_Y[/url]


Thats an old man, with a dangling kidney abusing Howard. :lol[/QUOTE]

LOL, that was 4 years ago!

Dwight was 20 and JUST entering his 3rd year in the league! This is before he became an all-star or anything yet. I bet I could videos of Mourning getting raped when he was younger, too. Doesn't mean much.

Also, LAClipsFan, I saw your post in the other thread. You hate Dwight and didn't have any sort of rebuttal to my last post. Your agenda is open.

[QUOTE=zORi]He was 36!

C'mon man now you're just reaching. If you pick Zo, just pick him, don't look for reasons to discredit Dwight.

BTW, Pau didn't rape him in that series:

Game 1:
DH: 12 (16%)/15/2blks
PG: 16 (58%)/8/2blks

G2:
DH:17 (50%)/16/4 blks
PG:24 (50%)/ 10/1blk

G3:
DH: 21 (83%)/14/2blks
PG: 23 (81%)/3/2blks

G4:
DH: 16 (41%)/21/9blks
PG: 16 (50%)/10/0blks

G5:
DH: 11 (55%)/10/3blks
PG: 14 (66%)/15/4blks

Pau arguably had the better series, but Pau is older and has experience at the stage before. And he most definitely didn't "punk" Howard.[/QUOTE]

Really ? Started out the series with 12 points on 17% shooting. Then he goes on to not outscore Pau even once and he's supposed to be the dominant MVP candidate. He scored 40 in the closeout game against the Cavs and they where hyping him to no end and scores 11 in the closeout game against Gasol. LOL baby nuts Howard :oldlol:

[QUOTE=zORi]Also, LAClipsFan, I saw your post in the other thread. You hate Dwight and didn't have any sort of rebuttal to my last post. Your agenda is open.[/QUOTE]

Yes. I hate Dwight Howard because he's the strongest most athletic big man in the league, but has no heart and refuses to work on his game whatsoever. How can you even like a guy like that ? Waste of talent. His talent should have went to a guy like Dejuan Blair, Luis Scola, or Carl Landry...these guys do a lot with less and Howard is halfass on reaching his potential.

[QUOTE=LAClipsFan33]Really ? Started out the series with 12 points on 17% shooting. Then he goes on to not outscore Pau even once and he's supposed to be the dominant MVP candidate. He scored 40 in the closeout game against the Cavs and they where hyping him to no end and scores 11 in the closeout game against Gasol. LOL baby nuts Howard :oldlol:[/QUOTE]

So the only thing there is to the game is scoring? Dwight struggled to score, but he dominated the glass and kept the Magic in the series with his defense.
You can't say Howard didn't come to play in that series.

[QUOTE=LAClipsFan33]Really ? Started out the series with 12 points on 17% shooting. Then he goes on to not outscore Pau even once and he's supposed to be the dominant MVP candidate. He scored 40 in the closeout game against the Cavs and they where hyping him to no end and scores 11 in the closeout game against Gasol. LOL baby nuts Howard :oldlol:[/QUOTE]

First off, he was near Gasol in every single game, second, he out did him in every single other category, third, wasn't Bynum the one guarding him? Why not compare Bynum to Howard?

Gasol lit up Rashard Lewis. Whoooopdee doo! That's incredible! No other 7-ft Power Forward has done that before! Oh wait....

Pau did better in points, and that's it. Man, stop it, you're about as see through as your silly-ass arguments.