what the hell is going on? is Tim Thomas really THAT awful? is he like actually making the rest of the team worse? ... I dont understand how this isn't a top NBA team. what do they lack? besides a coach.. but that didn't stop them last year.
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what the hell is going on? is Tim Thomas really THAT awful? is he like actually making the rest of the team worse? ... I dont understand how this isn't a top NBA team. what do they lack? besides a coach.. but that didn't stop them last year.
[QUOTE=geeWiz15]what the hell is going on? is Tim Thomas really THAT awful? is he like actually making the rest of the team worse? ... I dont understand how this isn't a top NBA team. what do they lack? besides a coach.. but that didn't stop them last year.[/QUOTE]
I wonder if the Clippers are having buyers remorse. Thomas played one good half a season, with arguably the best point guard in the game today, one of the most explosive offenses, and that warrants a big deal?
how much pricier was radmanovic? should have kept him around.
[quote=geeWiz15]what the hell is going on? is Tim Thomas really THAT awful? is he like actually making the rest of the team worse? ... I dont understand how this isn't a top NBA team. what do they lack? besides a coach.. but that didn't stop them last year.[/quote]
I predicted when the season began that Tim Thomas would be deemed a bust in the Clippers forum, which was obviously met with obvious animosity. I stand by my prediction.
:pimp:
[QUOTE=geeWiz15]what the hell is going on? is Tim Thomas really THAT awful? is he like actually making the rest of the team worse? ... I dont understand how this isn't a top NBA team. what do they lack? besides a coach.. but that didn't stop them last year.[/QUOTE]
it's pretty obvious, last year was a fluke and I saw this one coming.
I still like Livingston though, the guys a player.
I was contemplating if any team would be stupid enough to give him a huge deal to "reward" him, and I thought, "no, surely no team is that foolhardy." Then it appeared Phoenix would in fact be that stupid, but somehow, the Clippers took the fall for them instead. Looks like the Clippers will always find a way to be, well, the Clippers. Giving Thomas a deal longer than a year or two was insanity at its finest.
TT's alright... just a role player now, he'll come around.
Problem is Dunleavy has not defined roles, EB is playing like a B;tch and Sam is one year older.
However, Livingston is finally coming around, he's been looking like a young Penny the last few games... so if that hopefully continues I think they can put it together and at least make the playoffs.
Like I've said before, the West is just tougher this year then the last when the Jazz, Rockets and Nuggets were sucking due to injuries.
The kings are crap, too....the pacific division is goin down :(
Mike Dunleavy is getting exposed as a coach.
First of all, the teams best player(at this moment at least) is sitting on the bench as a sixth man and I honestly think that Quinton Ross is overrated. People say how much of a great defender is, but Tony Parker had no problem with Q Ross's "great defense". Ross should go to the bench with Maggette starting.
Mike Dunleavy, as far as I know, is the main problem. He doesn't even draws up an offense. He just puts matchup advantages and makes them go one on one. At least that's what it looks like. The Clippers have very talented individuas that can play as a team, they just need someone to emphasize that. I think the organization needs to get rid of Mike Dunleavy and hire someone like Rick Adelman. At this point, it's hard to see who out there is worse than Dunleavy. The Clippers better do it NOW while it's still early in the season.
If firing Dunleavy doesn't work, than the Clippers should be in need of a change up. At first I loved it, but now I think it was the dumbest idea to give Kaman that extension. This guy has "play for money" written right on him as far as I'm concerned. I haven't seen him to jack sh!t all season. Are the Clippers allowed to trade kaman yet or do they have to wait till summer time since it's the first year of his new contract? I forget about a lot og the trade restrictions. Sofokolis Schortsanitis will play for the Clippers next season and he's the type of center the Clippers should replace Kaman with. If not, then trade Kaman to a team with a week inside for a strong draft pick and draft a center. Maybe the Clipper's crappy season might be a blessing in desquise(errhmm, Greg Oden). I think Greg Oden and EB would make a nice front court duo.
If the Clippers continue to play like this when february comes, they should tank the rest of the season and jump in the Greg Oden sweepstakes. Oden will be a streight up superstar and that's a type of player the Clippers have been missing since McAdoo(05-06 EB was a fluke).
No matter what, the players the Clippers should keep no matter what should be Maggette, Brand, and Livingston.
Reasons?
Maggette and Brand have been with the team almost since day one(pretty much). And also, Brand and Maggette are great role players to have, especially if you have the possibility of someone like oden coming in.
Livingston is getting better and would be nice to have for the future, although I am getting a little pessimistic about this guy these days. he had a few good games, but I want to see how this guy does by the end of the season.
Hopefully (atleast) the Wolves will be at the 11th pick(Clippers pick if that happens... top 10 protected). I'm sure the Clippers can draft a nice shooter or something. Maybe the Clippers an use it on Marcus Williams, Daequan Cook or Marco Belinelli. If the Clippers are bad enough(top 5 draft pick), draft Hasheem Thabeet if they can't get Greg Oden. If the Clippers can't get a good enough draft pick, trade up by using kaman and maybe Mobley or something.
Do whatever that will be a step to the right direction.
A starting line-up like this could really be refreshing
C- Greg Oden
F- Elton Brand
F- Corey Maggette
G- Marcus Williams
G- Shaun Livingston
And to think I was being laughed at and called a homer during the off-season when I said the Clips did nothing to improve and the Lakers would have a better record. I'll have the last laugh on this one. You really though contract whore Tim Thomas would take this team to the next level huh? :oldlol:
The Clippers were already a good team that didn't need to improve. Thomas isn't the reason why the Clippers suck. The reason is Mike Dunleavy and his BS matchup game. Why don't you watch a Clipper game and actually see why they are not doing so well.
Everyone blames their coach when their roster isn't good, look at the Knicks.
clipps, what is dunleavy doing so different from last year?
You guys played well without magette most of last year too. Him off the bench can't be anything but a boon for you guys since you didn't have that advantage last year. Now if he's being pissy about it and causing team chem issues that is a different story, but I really haven't read anything about clipps having those kinds of problems so far.
[QUOTE=clipps]The Clippers were already a good team that didn't need to improve. Thomas isn't the reason why the Clippers suck. The reason is Mike Dunleavy and his BS matchup game. Why don't you watch a Clipper game and actually see why they are not doing so well.[/QUOTE]
I've been to 3 Clipper games this season (Philly, Lakers, Miami) and only missed 2-3 games so far. The reason they aren't doing good is because their offense is terrible, they just give the ball to Cassell and Mobley and they go 1 on 1 and jack up perimeter shots, there's no ball movement on that team. Defense is solid just like last year but their offense is painful to watch. Maggette comes in, drives and gets some FT attempts and gives the team a spark off the bench only to be put back on the bench so Ross the elite defensive player can come in and get 30 minutes a game even when they are not playing teams with good perimeter players, I just don't get it. And yes the Tim Thomas signing was horrible, hate to tell you I told you so but the guy is notorious for being a contract year whore, was like that in Milwaukee, same way in PHX, he gets his contract and turns back into a lazy bum, how hard is that to predict?
Other than the coach?
EB looks like KVH out there.
Kaman is playing like he's worth 52 cents.
The Clippers' best performing player is their sixthman. That alone lets you know that the coach doesn't get it.
TT is taking a vacation.
Sam Cassell is a year older
Quinton Ross is an overrated defender
James Singleton should be playing but isn't.
I'm sure it's not completely TT's fault that the Clippers suck. If you watch the team, the whole damn team looks like piss. The only ones that atleast look like they play correctly are Maggette, Mobley and Livingston.
Come on, Greg Oden, please save us. Bring Marcus Williams with you.
[QUOTE=LakersDynasty]I've been to 3 Clipper games this season (Philly, Lakers, Miami) and only missed 2-3 games so far. The reason they aren't doing good is because their offense is terrible, they just give the ball to Cassell and Mobley and they go 1 on 1 and jack up perimeter shots, there's no ball movement on that team. Defense is solid just like last year but their offense is painful to watch. Maggette comes in, drives and gets some FT attempts and gives the team a spark off the bench only to be put back on the bench so Ross the elite defensive player can come in and get 30 minutes a game even when they are not playing teams with good perimeter players, I just don't get it. And yes the Tim Thomas signing was horrible, hate to tell you I told you so but the guy is notorious for being a contract year whore, was like that in Milwaukee, same way in PHX, he gets his contract and turns back into a lazy bum, how hard is that to predict?[/QUOTE]
A lot of that is the coach trying to go with his matchups. He throws a weird matchup(EB, Thomas, Livingston, Cassell, Mobley, or Kaman, brand, Thomas, Maggette, Livingston, or whatever), and tells them to take an advantage. So you have 4 players standing around and one player trying to expose the defense, which works when you have an offense going, players are cutting, setting picks, etc. but that doesn't work when 4 players stand around and 1 player goes one on 5. The Clippers haven't been going to their bread and butter play of a pick n roll between Cassell/Livingston and Brand, setting him up with the open jumper which was money last year. It would still be money this year, but he's afraid to take it. He's been pump faking, hesitating, passing it back out when he should have passed it. I'll admit that I wasn't that happy about TT either, I just tried to be optimistic about it. But he's not the main problem. I don't know about you, but I think Ross is a very overrated defender, which is another problem with Dunleavy. He is so in love with Ross, at the same time, obviously has problems with maggette. That's why you have Ross over Maggette in the first place. Ross is the one that starts because of his "bruce Bowen like" defense, but on offense, he can't do anything. And Ross really isn't that great a defender that we like to say he is. his defensive assignments, FOR SOME REASON some how have season high games against him. I remember(I'm sure you remember as well), when Ross would get raved on how great he was at defense, then Kobe kills him, but when Shaun Livingston, the "inexperienced" defender compared to Ross packs Kobe twice.
I'm sure coaches on other teams are baffled on Ross starting over Maggette. I'm sure as hell am. Every time Maggette plays, he shows why he should be starter, and when I see Ross play, he shows why he should be on the bench playing a max of 20 minutes.
Dunleavy needs to cool it with the f'd up matchups and start drawing up an offense for the team to run.
[QUOTE=geeWiz15]what the hell is going on? is Tim Thomas really THAT awful? is he like actually making the rest of the team worse? ... I dont understand how this isn't a top NBA team. what do they lack? besides a coach.. but that didn't stop them last year.[/QUOTE]
Its early.....thats almost saying my Bulls suck....if they are playing this way at all-star break then you should be worried!
^^^^I agree with what you said, basically why I believe they are not doing good. Livingston is a better defender than Ross, when Ross got the starting job last year towards the end of the season and in the playoffs I figured it would be a temporary thing until Corey fully recovers from his injury, and in the Nuggets series I thought it was because of Melo that Ross got the starting job, but now we're 18 games into the season and it still hasn't changed. That's not the only thing holding them back though, they need more ball movement and less 1 on 1 isolation plays, which we already agreed on.
That's what I'm saying. If the clippers play like this by all-star break, I hope they tank and draft Greg Oden. At least get SOMETHING in return for this crap season.
[QUOTE=Mahmoud]I was contemplating if any team would be stupid enough to give him a huge deal to "reward" him, and I thought, "no, surely no team is that foolhardy." Then it appeared Phoenix would in fact be that stupid, but somehow, the Clippers took the fall for them instead. Looks like the Clippers will always find a way to be, well, the Clippers. Giving Thomas a deal longer than a year or two was insanity at its finest.[/QUOTE]
Exactly what I thought! Its the Jerome James classic!!!
The Clips management will always be ****!
It's ironic, Clipps, that you blame Q. Ross for Parker going off when this was the one game of the year where our supposed "best player" (please tell me you don't actaully believe that) started in the place of Ross... Hmm...
The idea that signing Tim Thomas hurt the team is absurd. TT is just a role player, and a good one. We didn't sign him to be a superstar.
Clippers are losing because Brand isn't the same player as last year and neither is Cassell. Kaman and Livingston haven't stepped up to fill that vaccuum.
I don't like Dunleavy's micromanaging, 1v1 offense either but we managed to win with it last year.
[quote]James Singleton should be playing but isn't.[/quote]
word! that's the type of guy the Wizards could use as our first forward off the bench. if you guys are going to waste him trade him here. was he second round pick? then that's where I want my MLE going. I like Singleton. when Maggs was injured last year he was getting a double double like every game.
[QUOTE]That's what I'm saying. If the clippers play like this by all-star break, I hope they tank and draft Greg Oden.[/QUOTE]
People have to remember. We're talking about the Clippers here. They're a jinxed franchise. Whoever thought they could be a good team is kidding themsevles. They're not tanking, they're just bad.
Kaman playing like trash. (He already got his money)
Brand playing like a scrub.
Cassell playing like an old man. Well he's an old man.
I always liked Q, but what;s going on? He's soft this year with NO D!
Who else?
Last year the Clippers had their best record in franchise history, yet to be identical to the Lakers season. Clippers will have a good season once in a while, but that;s it.
Clippers needs a good season once in awhile to bring in new bandwagon fans, sell some tickets. Than lose again..
I guess it aint cool to wear Clippers gear anymore, back on the Lakers bandwagon. Like all the other weirdo Clippers fans...whacked!
[QUOTE=LakersRuleTheNBA]People have to remember. We're talking about the Clippers here. They're a jinxed franchise. [/QUOTE]
You know if clipps don't recover this year than you might just be right. There is no reason beyond any locker room issues (If any) that they should be so bad right now. They started out with a home friendly schedule too!
Clippers are struggling cos their 2nd best player doesn't start and gets inconsistent PT...
[QUOTE=konex]Clippers are struggling cos their 2nd best player doesn't start and gets inconsistent PT...[/QUOTE]
But they played without him and Livingston just fine last year. If anything those two should boost their performance.
[quote=LakersDynasty]^^^^I agree with what you said, basically why I believe they are not doing good. Livingston is a better defender than Ross, when Ross got the starting job last year towards the end of the season and in the playoffs I figured it would be a temporary thing until Corey fully recovers from his injury, and in the Nuggets series I thought it was because of Melo that Ross got the starting job, but now we're 18 games into the season and it still hasn't changed. That's not the only thing holding them back though, they need more ball movement and less 1 on 1 isolation plays, which we already agreed on.[/quote]
Why does Corey's name keep coming up in trade rumors? I just saw another one yesterday. I don't get it.
:pimp:
[QUOTE]But they played without him and Livingston just fine last year. If anything those two should boost their performance.[/QUOTE]
Clipps last year = Sonics the year before. Several contract year players. It was an aberration..
Maggs needs to have a defined role on this team. Q-Ross ain't that good on D to relegate him to the bench...
[QUOTE=Darius]It's ironic, Clipps, that you blame Q. Ross for Parker going off when this was the one game of the year where our supposed "best player" (please tell me you don't actaully believe that) started in the place of Ross... Hmm..[/QUOTE]
What does that have to do with Tony Parker going off. Q Ross was still guarding Parker a lot of the times and still got owned. Q ross is so overrated. And yes, so far this season, Maggette has been the most effective player on the team. He needs to start. I'm tired of Dunleavy's BS.
The reasons why the Clips are sucking right down is just poor game-planning decision, and add-in that the players have a total lack of confidence and just lack heart and toughness. That's what happens when you lose in embarassing fashion the way the Clips lost to the Spurs last night. Nothing to do being "jinxed" or some other BS like that. You either have it or you don't. As far I'm concerned, everybody is to blame...the coaches and the players.
wow, clipps have a rough start with 20 games in and you already got fans saying "tank"...and you have the balls to call lakers fans "non real fans"
[QUOTE=konex]Clipps last year = Sonics the year before. Several contract year players. It was an aberration..
Maggs needs to have a defined role on this team. Q-Ross ain't that good on D to relegate him to the bench...[/QUOTE]
yeah that is possible. The last time they made the playoffs under Larry Brown and everyone said they're finally ready for the big time, didn't they pull the same disappearing act the next season?
Anyway its still a long time to go. They are loaded with talent and still have a decent record. Lakers were teetering at .500 for most of last season too. So all it takes is a run to make the playoffs. But even if they do, they'd be a disappointment because everyone was expecting them to be one of the best amongst the second tier western teams.
Q Ross.. god damn him. him and Cassell's horrible shot form are why I hate the Clippers in 2k7. the guy misses every layup and open jumper he gets. I have to play on manual subs just to get his worthless ass of the floor. because I'm too lazy to change the rosters.
[QUOTE=clipps]Mike Dunleavy is getting exposed as a coach.
First of all, the teams best player(at this moment at least) is sitting on the bench as a sixth man and I honestly think that Quinton Ross is overrated. People say how much of a great defender is, but Tony Parker had no problem with Q Ross's "great defense". Ross should go to the bench with Maggette starting.
Mike Dunleavy, as far as I know, is the main problem. He doesn't even draws up an offense. He just puts matchup advantages and makes them go one on one. At least that's what it looks like. The Clippers have very talented individuas that can play as a team, they just need someone to emphasize that. I think the organization needs to get rid of Mike Dunleavy and hire someone like Rick Adelman. At this point, it's hard to see who out there is worse than Dunleavy. The Clippers better do it NOW while it's still early in the season.
If firing Dunleavy doesn't work, than the Clippers should be in need of a change up. At first I loved it, but now I think it was the dumbest idea to give Kaman that extension. This guy has "play for money" written right on him as far as I'm concerned. I haven't seen him to jack sh!t all season. Are the Clippers allowed to trade kaman yet or do they have to wait till summer time since it's the first year of his new contract? I forget about a lot og the trade restrictions. Sofokolis Schortsanitis will play for the Clippers next season and he's the type of center the Clippers should replace Kaman with. If not, then trade Kaman to a team with a week inside for a strong draft pick and draft a center. Maybe the Clipper's crappy season might be a blessing in desquise(errhmm, Greg Oden). I think Greg Oden and EB would make a nice front court duo.
If the Clippers continue to play like this when february comes, they should tank the rest of the season and jump in the Greg Oden sweepstakes. Oden will be a streight up superstar and that's a type of player the Clippers have been missing since McAdoo(05-06 EB was a fluke).
No matter what, the players the Clippers should keep no matter what should be Maggette, Brand, and Livingston.
Reasons?
Maggette and Brand have been with the team almost since day one(pretty much). And also, Brand and Maggette are great role players to have, especially if you have the possibility of someone like oden coming in.
Livingston is getting better and would be nice to have for the future, although I am getting a little pessimistic about this guy these days. he had a few good games, but I want to see how this guy does by the end of the season.
Hopefully (atleast) the Wolves will be at the 11th pick(Clippers pick if that happens... top 10 protected). I'm sure the Clippers can draft a nice shooter or something. Maybe the Clippers an use it on Marcus Williams, Daequan Cook or Marco Belinelli. If the Clippers are bad enough(top 5 draft pick), draft Hasheem Thabeet if they can't get Greg Oden. If the Clippers can't get a good enough draft pick, trade up by using kaman and maybe Mobley or something.
Do whatever that will be a step to the right direction.
A starting line-up like this could really be refreshing
C- Greg Oden
F- Elton Brand
F- Corey Maggette
G- Marcus Williams
G- Shaun Livingston[/QUOTE]
Wait. Are you the asme dude that called the Clippers title contenders, and when I called you delusional last year AND this off-season you called me a Suns homer, a hater, and to basically **** off? Now you are talking about getting Oden when you're not even the top 5 worst teams in the League?
:oldlol:
Yep. The Clippas sucks!
They're beyond horrible..
[QUOTE=BlackVVaves]Wait. Are you the asme dude that called the Clippers title contenders, and when I called you delusional last year AND this off-season you called me a Suns homer, a hater, and to basically **** off? Now you are talking about getting Oden when you're not even the top 5 worst teams in the League?
:oldlol:[/QUOTE]
The Clippers are capable of being title contenders. They just have no heart, energy or effort and they are poorly coached. And if they are gunna suck, they might as well make it worth their while and get in position to draft Oden.
they don't play as a team.
No chemistry, no heart.
All the talent in the world though.