Why are many basketball fans so obsessed with rankings?

Of all of the sports I've followed and have been a part of informed discussions/message boards, it seems like basketball is the sport with the fan following that's the most obsessed with RANKINGS.

Why?

Why is it that this sport inspires so many "fans" (at least, those on this website) to blindly sing the praises of their favorite player(s)and to aimlessly bad-mouth and and criticize others?

Many of the people on this website seem to not actually care about discussing basketball; rather, they seem to be content rambling on and on about any certain player's placement on "the GOAT list," a completely abstract, hypothetical type of ranking system, which many people seem to regard as some sort of omnipotent, end-all be-all final judgment of a player's true merit.

I ask you, is this constant arguing ever going to accomplish anything? When did the fans become so fixated on mindlessly comparing every little facet of one player to another?

Why do we continue to endlessly over-analyze these players to the most minute, inconsequential detail, only to use these observations and details to belittle other players and posters with differing opinions?

Why is it that no other sport seems to have this problem (at least, not to the degree to which it is manifested on this board)?

Will we ever be able to simply appreciate all of the great players that have impacted the beautiful game of basketball in their own ways, without devolving into constant argument?

[B][SIZE="7"]Kobe>MJ[/SIZE][/B]

[QUOTE=AlphaWolf24][B][SIZE="7"]Kobe>MJ[/SIZE][/B][/QUOTE]

That's nice.

Basketball fans more obessed with rankings? Are u sure? Compared with football (college or pro), I think that we are normal. Plus it is fun.

[QUOTE=JellyBean]Basketball fans more obessed with rankings? Are u sure? Compared with football (college or pro), I think that we are normal. Plus it is fun.[/QUOTE]

Football fans aren't anywhere near as obsessed with ranking individual players as NBA fans are.

Why are many basketball fans so obsessed with rankings?

well IMO i think it is because 1 player can have so much impact on a basketball game unlike say football or baseball. For example a superstar in basketball can win one game by himself by scoring 60+ points. thats why people are so obsess with ranking players in basketball

and if u are talking about team ranking then basketball fans dont usually go crazy over team rankings, cuz everyone knows its Lakers/Celtics then bulls then everyone else in term of rankings

I feel you OP. Basketball is the one sport where opinions = "facts". I've seen baseball fans debate who the GOAT is (Ruth vs Cobb), football fans debate who the best RB was (Payton vs Sanders) and while the arguments can get heated, they rarely cross the line and get personal/disrespectful (from what I've seen at least). Nor do they trigger the amount of trolling that almost go hand in hand with basketball discussions.

[IMG]http://i56.tinypic.com/2jfg08h.gif[/IMG]

[QUOTE=The-Legend-24][IMG]http://i56.tinypic.com/2jfg08h.gif[/IMG][/QUOTE]

I'd be insulted if you, of all people, DID take the time to read it.

So, thank you very, very much.

I agree super pippen. But whts most frustrating is the inconsistancy. Some people like to credit only the best players on championship teams. But when the same best players loose, its the teams fault.

People tend to mistake the term "best" and "accomplished" as being the same.

Context is never considered. Neither are roles. And I've never really seen people get so miniscule when rating players, like I've seen on this board. I've seen, and find myself arguing over which jordan was better, I've seen stupid terms like "peak prime".

Its just crazy

[QUOTE=SuperPippen]
Why do we continue to endlessly over-analyze these players to the most minute, inconsequential detail, only to use these observations and details to belittle other players and posters with differing opinions?
[/QUOTE]

in my case... i call it... correcting the incorrect statements / opinions with FACTS........

without any data / facts there would be just a bunch of kids in here throwing opinions like farts in the sky....

I'd say most fans of sports argue over some kind of ranking or legacies. It's fun to think about things like "Which player is better? Rose or Durant? LeBron or Kobe?" It's a game some of us here have a passion for and care about.

Also, I do get your point though. It does get a bit silly. I mean, the way we set artificial standards for where a player ranks is a bit weak. Like if Kobe wins another ring he jumps into the top five, but if not he stays at #7. Either way, he's the same player. I'm not sure that really having six rings versus just five changes what he really is.

Compensating for something. Probably a small *****.

By arguing for or against players, I learn things about the players. It's also a good practice in logic.

On a higher level, it's a case for reasonable judgement, something severely lacking in post-modern society.
For me it's a relief that people can actually agree on things that are heavily subjective. It's also a relief we actually can discuss these things in a somewhat intelligent manner*

*When it comes to other topics, people either really don't know anything about it, even though they like they think they do (like discussing gender roles, where too many people take a naturalist-deterministic stance, which is highy revisionist. Think: men-are-hunters-bullcrap), or they have agendas based on bullcrap and will never change their mind, no matter how much logic and facts you throw at them (example: free market supporters), or there's the belief-wild card, which makes discussions impossible (think: discussing embryo testing)

Because thats all they can talk about?

Because vast majority of people here are mad d[I][/I]i[I][/I]ck-riders. These aren't really basketball fans. They are fans of a player, at a level where you start to think that basketball is secondary to the hero-worship.

For reasons that probably had to do with some character flaw, these people have decided to take a [B]team[/B] game and ignore its most basic precept. They treat it as tennis, boxing, Formula 1 racing, or any other individual sport. They couldn't care less about the team. Their hero is in competition with everyone. Opposing players, naturally. Teammates for playing time and the alpha-dog role on the team. Referees, David Stern...you name it. These people only watch games because they have someone to root for. The only time they'll watch other teams is when there is some sort of an agenda. Usually, it's to watch some perceived rival of their hero, hoping he'd fail. We're talking a complete inability to watch the games as a neutral, enjoying the action itself.

Of course these people have a pathological need to compare players. They identify with and live through them. Browse through any Kobe vs MJ, LeBron vs Kobe or whatever other player comparison thread and tell me you don't get the feeling that these people feel that if their hero is better than someone else's, it somehow positively reflects on themselves.

Rankings players is a good way to dig up the past and reminisce about it. It's a form of nostalgia.

No harm in that.

Talking of which, here's the top 100 of all-time: [url]http://basketballjournalist.blogspot.com/2011/07/ranking-top-100-players-in-nba-history.html[/url]

And here's the top 100 if we put every NBA player in the same draft: [url]http://basketballjournalist.blogspot.com/2011/08/nbas-ultimate-fantasy-draft.html[/url]

:pimp:

[QUOTE=RobertdeMeijer]By arguing for or against players, I learn things about the players. It's also a good practice in logic.

On a higher level, it's a case for reasonable judgement, something severely lacking in post-modern society.
For me it's a relief that people can actually agree on things that are heavily subjective. [b]It's also a relief we actually can discuss these things in a somewhat intelligent manner[/b][/QUOTE]

:oldlol:

Whew. Thanks for the laugh.

[QUOTE=SuperPippen]Of all of the sports I've followed and have been a part of informed discussions/message boards, it seems like basketball is the sport with the fan following that's the most obsessed with RANKINGS.

Why?

Why is it that this sport inspires so many "fans" (at least, those on this website) to blindly sing the praises of their favorite player(s)and to aimlessly bad-mouth and and criticize others?

Many of the people on this website seem to not actually care about discussing basketball; rather, they seem to be content rambling on and on about any certain player's placement on "the GOAT list," a completely abstract, hypothetical type of ranking system, which many people seem to regard as some sort of omnipotent, end-all be-all final judgment of a player's true merit.

I ask you, is this constant arguing ever going to accomplish anything? When did the fans become so fixated on mindlessly comparing every little facet of one player to another?

Why do we continue to endlessly over-analyze these players to the most minute, inconsequential detail, only to use these observations and details to belittle other players and posters with differing opinions?

Why is it that no other sport seems to have this problem (at least, not to the degree to which it is manifested on this board)?

Will we ever be able to simply appreciate all of the great players that have impacted the beautiful game of basketball in their own ways, without devolving into constant argument?[/QUOTE]

Excellent post. I have been blessed to have watched, first-hand, every great player since the early 60's. Instead of appreciating what so many of them brought to the game, there seems to be way too much "bashing" of them. I have been a life-long Laker fan (well, since 1968-69), but two of my most memorable seasons were in following a group of relative "no-names" in the Warriors of 74-75 and 75-76. Virtually no one would have anticipated that team, which was just ripped apart before the season, to become a champion. And their playoff run was one of the most remarkable in history, too. They had to overcome a 3-2 series deficit, and a late game deficit in that game six, to win the WCF's. Then, they staged four straight 4th quarter comebacks to sweep the heavily-favored Bullets for the title. The following season, they romped the best record in the league, but they constantly came from behind to win games. I recall listening to a radio broadcast on the way to my night classes, and they were down by 20 at the half against Detroit. When I returned, I was amazed that they had not only won that game, but by 31 points. And, in a bit of irony, they were then stunned by the 40-42 Suns in the WCF's.

My point being...that was one of the few times in my life where I really didn't have a huge rooting interest in the game. Wilt had retired a couple of seasons before, and my Lakers quickly went downhill. So, I just enjoyed objectively watching the game in those years, and found it to be every bit as enjoyable.

And I grew up hating Russell and the Celtics. And later, Bird and the Celtics. And, I'm sorry to say, it has only been in the last few years that I have come to respect and appreciate what they accomplished. Same with Koufax, Mantle, Montana (yes, I despised him for years), and some others. And when I look back on my many years of following sports...I have to ask myself, would those games back then have been as memorable without Russell and Bird? Hell no. They would have been like watching a routine Lakers-Clippers game now. Those players made the game's great, in both winning and losing. I can't recall lower points in my sporting life than the '68 Sixers and the '84 Lakers, nor a higher "high" than the '67 Sixers and the '85 Lakers.

The bottom line...enjoy these great players. They make the games worth watching, win or lose. And, sadly, the years fly by, and their careers come to an end way too soon. 10 years from now, Lebron will be an old veteran, playing on his last legs, and there will be a new rising star who will be the rage. And there will be those here on this forum claiming that a prime Jordan would be a scrub in that league. 25 years from now, the youth of that generation will be laughing at the vintage footage of MJ, and they will be comparing him to Cousy.

So, prepare yourselves now. It will come. In the meantime, enjoy the moment.

[QUOTE=ThaRegul8r]:oldlol:

Whew. Thanks for the laugh.[/QUOTE]

Define irony.

[QUOTE=jlauber]Excellent post. I have been blessed to have watched, first-hand, every great player since the early 60's. Instead of appreciating what so many of them brought to the game, there seems to be way too much "bashing" of them. I have been a life-long Laker fan (well, since 1968-69), but two of my most memorable seasons were in following a group of relative "no-names" in the Warriors of 74-75 and 75-76. Virtually no one would have anticipated that team, which was just ripped apart before the season, to become a champion. And their playoff run was one of the most remarkable in history, too. They had to overcome a 3-2 series deficit, and a late game deficit in that game six, to win the WCF's. Then, they staged four straight 4th quarter comebacks to sweep the heavily-favored Bullets for the title. The following season, they romped the best record in the league, but they constantly came from behind to win games. I recall listening to a radio broadcast on the way to my night classes, and they were down by 20 at the half against Detroit. When I returned, I was amazed that they had not only won that game, but by 31 points. And, in a bit of irony, they were then stunned by the 40-42 Suns in the WCF's.

My point being...that was one of the few times in my life where I really didn't have a huge rooting interest in the game. Wilt had retired a couple of seasons before, and my Lakers quickly went downhill. So, I just enjoyed objectively watching the game in those years, and found it to be every bit as enjoyable.

And I grew up hating Russell and the Celtics. And later, Bird and the Celtics. And, I'm sorry to say, it has only been in the last few years that I have come to respect and appreciate what they accomplished. Same with Koufax, Mantle, Montana (yes, I despised him for years), and some others. And when I look back on my many years of following sports...I have to ask myself, would those games back then have been as memorable without Russell and Bird? Hell no. They would have been like watching a routine Lakers-Clippers game now. Those players made the game's great, in both winning and losing. I can't recall lower points in my sporting life than the '68 Sixers and the '84 Lakers, nor a higher "high" than the '67 Sixers and the '85 Lakers.

The bottom line...enjoy these great players. They make the games worth watching, win or lose. And, sadly, the years fly by, and their careers come to an end way too soon. 10 years from now, Lebron will be an old veteran, playing on his last legs, and there will be a new rising star who will be the rage. And there will be those here on this forum claiming that a prime Jordan would be a scrub in that league. 25 years from now, the youth of that generation will be laughing at the vintage footage of MJ, and they will be comparing him to Cousy.

So, prepare yourselves now. It will come. In the meantime, enjoy the moment.[/QUOTE]

Yep, I know that feeling!

I guess that's what people do when there is an abundant of talent and nothing else to do.

People should stop arguing and appreciate the fact that we have so many amazing players in the league.

[QUOTE=AlphaWolf24][B][SIZE="7"]Kobe>MJ[/SIZE][/B][/QUOTE]
[IMG]http://abload.de/img/footballwelkerstare1n7srb.gif[/IMG]

[QUOTE=All Net]Because thats all they can talk about?[/QUOTE]

Like half the people on this site.

Interesting thread topic...how would you guys rank this thread against other ISH critical threads?

[B]Basketball is subjective based on the individual. Where in other sports there is generally clear cut line of greatness and elite. Some of it is haggled upon but there isnt a great stock in the matter. Basketball is more childish and opinionated. There is more bias towards what ever rank you want to justify. I guess thats what makes Football and Baseball so great to talk about awesome team sports. Its the sport itself and cherish the greatest moments and reverence the great players of the past where in basketball they are discredited.[/B]

[QUOTE=SuperPippen]Of all of the sports I've followed and have been a part of informed discussions/message boards, it seems like basketball is the sport with the fan following that's the most obsessed with RANKINGS.

Why?

Why is it that this sport inspires so many "fans" (at least, those on this website) to blindly sing the praises of their favorite player(s)and to aimlessly bad-mouth and and criticize others?

Many of the people on this website seem to not actually care about discussing basketball; rather, they seem to be content rambling on and on about any certain player's placement on "the GOAT list," a completely abstract, hypothetical type of ranking system, which many people seem to regard as some sort of omnipotent, end-all be-all final judgment of a player's true merit.

I ask you, is this constant arguing ever going to accomplish anything? When did the fans become so fixated on mindlessly comparing every little facet of one player to another?

Why do we continue to endlessly over-analyze these players to the most minute, inconsequential detail, only to use these observations and details to belittle other players and posters with differing opinions?

Why is it that no other sport seems to have this problem (at least, not to the degree to which it is manifested on this board)?

Will we ever be able to simply appreciate all of the great players that have impacted the beautiful game of basketball in their own ways, without devolving into constant argument?[/QUOTE]
Baseball is just as bad. The uninformed usually always believe Babe Ruth was the best to ever play the game. They would be wrong.

[QUOTE=Rameek][B]Basketball is subjective based on the individual. Where in other sports there is generally clear cut line of greatness and elite. Some of it is haggled upon but there isnt a great stock in the matter. Basketball is more childish and opinionated. There is more bias towards what ever rank you want to justify. I guess thats what makes Football and Baseball so great to talk about awesome team sports. Its the sport itself and cherish the greatest moments and reverence the great players of the past where in basketball they are discredited.[/B][/QUOTE]


That's why the NFL has better ratings than NBA.

[QUOTE=COnDEMnED]Baseball is just as bad. The uninformed usually always believe Babe Ruth was the best to ever play the game. They would be wrong.[/QUOTE]
[B]Perfect example of a misguided opinion with an NBA mindset...[/B]

[QUOTE=Rameek][B]Perfect example of a misguided opinion with an NBA mindset...[/B][/QUOTE]
It's neither misguided nor an opinion.

...Uhhh... Because sports are competitions and competitions are there to decide who is better. You know what, you're right. They should just abolish stats, championships... hell, don't even keep score. Everyone gets a championship trophy at the end of the season a la a 12 year old ymca league, those guys know what's up.

Also, I'd say boxing is generally more obsessed with all-time rankings and is imo vastly more fun to discuss than individual basketball rankings.

[QUOTE=COnDEMnED]It's neither misguided nor an opinion.[/QUOTE]
[B]Of course it is... You just said "They would be wrong...." This isnt "on" topic.

You can debate it with yourself by yourself. Baseball and Football fans respect previous era's accomplishments the NBA looks to discredit them. [/B]

[B]Also in Baseball and Football people are generally fans of teams and individuals. In Basketball once Jordan came people became fans of individuals if ever teams or allegiances wavered upon time of day or what was eaten in the morning.[/B]

It's not so much rankings as it's just crazy player fans. You have people rooting for there teammates to suck so there favorite guy can look better. People cheering for one guy to have better stats than the other. Everything else seems to come 2nd behind legacy/rankings etc for some online basketball fans.

Rankings are across all sports on the internet. NBA by far has the most player driven player fans with agenda's and bias. Seems to be like one small group of players too, where in other sports you have people who care about the team first and therefore you get way more players getting pushed and less bullshit.

Think because the sport is more individual and the rotations are shorter. WR you have a bunch of guys to rank, C in hockey same, in basketball you have your big/elite guys and that list is pretty short. So you basically have just mass groups stanning like 3-4 players.

[QUOTE]Why is it that no other sport seems to have this problem[/QUOTE]

Because in the other big 3 sports, there's a lot more teammates. Especially in Football when you have offensive players who don't play defense etc..

It's mostly deluded Kobe fans that are butthurt that their sidekick idol isn't as great as they think he is.

[QUOTE=Rameek][B]Of course it is... You just said "They would be wrong...." This isnt "on" topic.

You can debate it with yourself by yourself. Baseball and Football fans respect previous era's accomplishments the NBA looks to discredit them. [/B][/QUOTE]
Baseball fans are just as obsessed with ranking. Know how I know? I just mind ****ed you into arguing with me about where Babe Ruth ranks all time. Hook, line, and sinker as they say. Little effort.

[QUOTE=COnDEMnED]Baseball fans are just as obsessed with ranking. Know how I know? I just mind ****ed you into arguing with me about where Babe Ruth ranks all time. Hook, line, and sinker as they say. Little effort.[/QUOTE]
[B]Someone please point out how arguments work to this lad.

You are mind fukced, FACTS...:lol [/B]

[QUOTE=Rameek][B]Someone please point out how arguments work to this lad.

You are mind fukced, FACTS...:lol [/B][/QUOTE]
Take the loss like a man dude, you got played to prove my point to the OP. Baseball fans are just as guilty as basketball fans. I didn't know who would take the bait, but I knew someone would. I said Ruth wasn't the best ever and you ran in here so fast, you couldn't wait to tell me I was misguided, and that it was my "opinion".

Just accept you got worked and move along. My point to the OP has been proven tenfold.

[QUOTE=COnDEMnED]Take the loss like a man dude, you got played to prove my point to the OP. Baseball fans are just as guilty as basketball fans. I didn't know who would take the bait, but I knew someone would. I said Ruth wasn't the best ever and you ran in here so fast, you couldn't wait to tell me I was misguided, and that it was my "opinion".

Just accept you got worked and move along. My point to the OP has been proven tenfold.[/QUOTE]
[B]Again laddy you obviously dont know what a debate or argument is.... google it. Obviously you dont have the necessary reading comprehension....[/B]

[QUOTE=Rameek][B]Perfect example of a misguided opinion with an NBA mindset...[/B][/QUOTE]

[B]There is no argument there is no debate.... But you can run along assuming victory thats what pure NBA fans do anyways. Everything is an argument or debate. [/B]