Barkley: ""I do think he can be better than Michael," Barkley said."

[QUOTE]"I do think he can be better than Michael," Barkley said. "I thought I would never compare somebody to Michael Jordan. But this guy, LeBron James, he does everything well. Michael did everything well. LeBron James is just bigger, stronger, faster. That's the only difference."

Barkley makes his comments on the first episode of NBA TV's "Open Court," to debut Tuesday at 11 p.m. ET. The series features a round-table discussion of NBA TV and TNT commentators. They include Shaquille O'Neal, Reggie Miller, Kenny Smith, Steve Smith, Chris Webber, Steve Kerr and Ernie Johnson.[/QUOTE]

[url]http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/8461397/charles-barkley-thinks-lebron-james-better-michael-jordan[/url]

He can pass Jordan, but I'm sure he isn't passing KOBE!

Lebron is not faster than Jordan.

:facepalm :facepalm :facepalm

[QUOTE=Segatti]He can pass Jordan, but I'm sure he isn't passing KOBE![/QUOTE]
U are right! :cletus:

[QUOTE=ripthekik]:D :D :D [/QUOTE]

:cheers:

theres another "open court" season?

swwwwweet

You're a ****ing idiot if you don't think LeBron can pass Jordan.

Also, I love Open Court. Gonna DVR this whole season. good lookin out OP.

Yes he CAN, that doesn't make it likely

You know, I don't have anything against LeBron, but people need to chill out... :facepalm

There are four active players with GOAT potential (Kobe, Duncan, LeBron, Durant), though it's extremely unlikely that any of them will pull it off. Kobe and Duncan have done the most, but have fewer opportunities remaining. Durant has done some great things since coming into the league, but it's too difficult to project what's going to happen. LeBron has a shot as well, but he just won his first championship and there's a lot of uncertainty with regards to how many more he can win.

Just my $0.02...

[QUOTE=fpliii]You know, I don't have anything against LeBron, but people need to chill out... :facepalm

There are four active players with GOAT potential (Kobe, Duncan, LeBron, Durant), though it's extremely unlikely that any of them will pull it off. Kobe and Duncan have done the most, but have fewer opportunities remaining. Durant has done some great things since coming into the league, but it's too difficult to project what's going to happen. LeBron has a shot as well, but he just won his first championship and there's a lot of uncertainty with regards to how many more he can win.

Just my $0.02...[/QUOTE]

Huh? I think there's no chance Kobe and Duncan can become GOAT unless they all of a sudden become greater players then they ever were and keep it up for a few years.

[QUOTE=guy]Huh? I think there's no chance Kobe and Duncan can become GOAT unless they all of a sudden become greater players then they ever were and keep it up for a few years.[/QUOTE]

If either of them won FMVP (legitimately) then it would be a discussion at least.

[QUOTE=eliteballer][url]http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/8461397/charles-barkley-thinks-lebron-james-better-michael-jordan[/url][/QUOTE]

Lebron may be bigger, faster, and stronger and all that. But he sure as hell isn't going to better than Jordan.

[QUOTE=fpliii]You know, I don't have anything against LeBron, but people need to chill out... :facepalm

There are four active players with GOAT potential (Kobe, Duncan, LeBron, Durant), though it's extremely unlikely that any of them will pull it off. Kobe and Duncan have done the most, but have fewer opportunities remaining. Durant has done some great things since coming into the league, but it's too difficult to project what's going to happen. LeBron has a shot as well, but he just won his first championship and there's a lot of uncertainty with regards to how many more he can win.

Just my $0.02...[/QUOTE]


I think you can realistically cross Kobe and Duncan off that list. Unless they can improve upon their prime selfs - which I find unlikely - and somehow maintain that for 3-4 years, or continue their current level for another 10, I don't see it happening.

so barkley believes bron can win 7 rings as the man?

[QUOTE=stallionaire]You're a ****ing idiot if you don't think LeBron can pass Jordan.

Also, I love Open Court. Gonna DVR this whole season. good lookin out OP.[/QUOTE]
I think ur the idiot for thinking he has a shot

Lebron already has more failures and lows than Jordan had in his entire carer, especially in the playoffs. And at that level, it matters.

[QUOTE=guy]Huh? I think there's no chance Kobe and Duncan can become GOAT unless they all of a sudden become greater players then they ever were and keep it up for a few years.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=DatAsh]I think you can realistically cross Kobe and Duncan off that list. Unless they can improve upon their prime selfs - which I find unlikely - and somehow maintain that for 3-4 years, or continue their current level for another 10, I don't see it happening.[/QUOTE]

I'm just trying to name everybody who has even a remote shot at being considered GOAT (except for guys who haven't been in the league long enough). The likelihoods are very small for some, but there's still a remote possibility that needs to be addressed.

He is capable of passing Mike, talent-wise. Yet he won't.

Charles Barkley just says whatever pops into his head at the time, he never thinks things through. It might make him entertaining to some, but it makes him lousy as a credible analyst.

[QUOTE=Charles Barkley- post-"The Decision"]He

[QUOTE=Owl]Charles Barkley just says whatever pops into his head at the time, he never thinks things through. It might make him entertaining to some, but it makes him lousy as a credible analyst.


[url]http://sportsradiointerviews.com/2010/07/15/barkley-wouldnt-have-chased-championship-at-age-25/[/url]

There's no consistency and no thought going into what he says.[/QUOTE]

That was his immediate and emotional response to the decision and how it made him feel about Lebron's competitiveness or whatever, more so than his judgement of Lebron as player.

As far as his judgement of Lebron as a player, he's always though of him as an amazing player (though he has of course criticized Lebron when he deserved it...like in the 2011 Finals).

Jordan isn't god. I'm pretty sure another player WILL pass him up at some point.

[QUOTE=Segatti]He can pass Jordan, but I'm sure he isn't passing KOBE![/QUOTE]

[IMG]http://oi53.tinypic.com/34rtwyh.jpg[/IMG]

If Lebron can win 4 or 5 rings while being this dominant he absolutely has a case as the GOAT so not sure why people bitch about stuff like this. Sure Jordan was a killer and Lebron was mentally weak but bottom line is production, success and impact and Lebron is already there with Jordan in two of them. Once he has more career and individual success.. another decade as an elite player could push him to that top spot.

[QUOTE=Clippersfan86]If Lebron can win 4 or 5 rings while being this dominant he absolutely has a case as the GOAT so [B][SIZE="5"]not sure why people bitch about stuff like this.[/SIZE][/B] Sure Jordan was a killer and Lebron was mentally weak but bottom line is production, success and impact and Lebron is already there with Jordan in two of them. Once he has more career and individual success.. another decade as an elite player could push him to that top spot.[/QUOTE]

It's because a lot of people here hate Lebron.

Also, like in politics, and everything else in life, people here have aligned themselves with a particular other player (Jordan, Kobe, Wilt, etc.) who they feel is the GOAT. As such, for whatever reason, even though these players will never give a shit about them, they take any slight PERSONALLY.

[QUOTE=OldSchoolBBall]Lebron already has more failures and lows than Jordan had in his entire carer, especially in the playoffs. And at that level, it matters.[/QUOTE]

True, you pretty much have to have the perfect career to pass Jordan. So, hypothetically speaking if Lebron does win X amount of MVPs/titles and he's compared to Jordan, ppl will still bring up his '11 Finals performance/ his '10 Celtics performances etc.

LeBron's probably the best player since MJ, but he's not better.

[QUOTE=Vragrant]True, you pretty much have to have the perfect career to pass Jordan. So, hypothetically speaking if Lebron does win X amount of MVPs/titles and he's compared to Jordan, ppl will still bring up his '11 Finals performance/ his '10 Celtics performances etc.[/QUOTE]

Thing is, Jordan didn't have a perfect career. He failed multiple times before he started winning. Probably the two players who have had anything close to "perfect" careers are Bill Russell and Magic.

I'm trying to figure out how Lebron has already supplanted Kobe Bryant because of 1 championship. I mean, people have pretty much thrown out Kobe in an all-time great discussion because of the fact that Lebron is "bigger, stronger, and faster" as if that should be a deciding factor in a Lebron vs. Jordan discussion.

[QUOTE=SpecialQue]Thing is, Jordan didn't have a perfect career. [B]He failed multiple times before he started winning.[/B] Probably the two players who have had anything close to "perfect" careers are Bill Russell and Magic.[/QUOTE]
The Bulls losing to superior teams doesn't mean MJ failed individually.

[QUOTE=SpecialQue]Thing is, Jordan didn't have a perfect career. He failed multiple times before he started winning. Probably the two players who have had anything close to "perfect" careers are Bill Russell and Magic.[/QUOTE]

How does Magic have a more perfect career than Jordan ?

Jordan has more individual awards, rings, accolades, and had more impressive title runs by 3-peating with 2 completely different teams.

And when you say Jordan failed multiple times before he started winning... these were the teams he lost too in his career in the playoffs:

1985 Bucks: Very good team
1986 Celtics: One of the greatest teams of all-time, NBA Champions
1987 Celtics: NBA Finalist, great team
1988 Pistons: NBA Finalist
1989 Pistons: One of the greatest teams of all-time, NBA Champions
1990 Pistons: NBA Champions
1995 Magic: NBA Finalist

Also, Jordan had less help than Magic did when he started of his career. Magic started his career with reigning 5-time MVP in Kareem, better than any player Jordan ever played with. I get what your saying if your talking clearly about winning and getting to the Finals... then I understand. I just don't think he had a better career than Jordan overall.

I agree with Bill Russell, though. While, many people exaggerate his HOF's... truth is, if it wasn't for his greatness and the legendary 8-peat, more than half of them don't make it in the HOF. Bob Cousy and John Havlicek would the only ones considered to get in the HOF because of their individual play and pioneering/legacy.

[QUOTE=bokes15]I'm trying to figure out how Lebron has already supplanted Kobe Bryant because of 1 championship. I mean, people have pretty much thrown out Kobe in an all-time great discussion because of the fact that Lebron is "bigger, stronger, and faster" as if that should be a deciding factor in a Lebron vs. Jordan discussion.[/QUOTE]

Of course they're going to disregard Kobe, they know nothing about basketball prior to '03, when Lebron signed with the Cavs. If you listen to them, Kobe is the luckiest SOB to have ever lived. Everything he's done is all cuz of luck and circumstance, not skills. But when it comes to Lebron, if you listen to his idiotic fans, he's already equal to MJ and needs to win one more title to surpass him. And that' supposedly all skills, no luck or circumstance:roll:

I've said this before and I will keep saying it. Basketball personalities (i.e. coaches and former players) do not determine greatness the way fans do. As fans we go to b-ball reference and see how many titles, "rings as the man", MVPs, all defensive teams, statistical titles, and other accolades a player has and then access greatness. Basketball personalities don't do that. They don't say, "Well player X has 2 more "titles as 'the man' and one more MVP than player Y. So player X is better." That's just not what they do. Obviously a player has to have had an impressive career, but b-ball personalities weigh heavily their perceptions of players' "on the court" display of talent and abilities probably more than a couple of additional notches added to the players' resume".

[QUOTE=OldSchoolBBall]Lebron already has more failures and lows than Jordan had in his entire carer, especially in the playoffs. And at that level, it matters.[/QUOTE]

This. Jordan pretty much had a perfect career. Of course, at the beginning his team wasn't good enough but the statistical dominance, 6 rings and 6 FMVPs (in addition to the global impact he had on basketball) will be very difficult to overcome.

Duncan and Kobe have no chance to be better than MJ. Their prime just wasn't anywhere near as dominant.

[QUOTE=jlip]I've said this before and I will keep saying it. Basketball personalities (i.e. coaches and former players) do not determine greatness the way fans do. [B][U]As fans we go to b-ball reference and see how many titles, "rings as the man",[/U][/B] MVPs, all defensive teams, statistical titles, and other accolades a player has and then access greatness. Basketball personalities don't do that. They don't say, "Well player X has 2 more "titles as 'the man' and one more MVP than player Y. So player X is better." That's just not what they do. Obviously a player has to have had an impressive career, but b-ball personalities weigh heavily their perceptions of players' "on the court" display of talent and abilities probably more than a couple of additional notches added to the players' resume".[/QUOTE]

No reasonable NBA fan does that, cuz there's no "special wing" in the HOF for titles like that. It's either a title or nothing. That's something bandwagon Lebron fans do, to try and diminish Kobe's career. Nice try though:applause:

LeBron has a chance, but the rest of his career has to go perfectly.

4-peat
4 x FMVP
5 x MVP
33,000+ points
10,000+ assists and rebounds
DPOY

As crazy as those accomplishments are they are well within the realm of reality for LeBron. If he plays another 11 years (38 years old, 20 years played) he should easily get the points and rebounds, but the assists might be harder to do depending on his role in his 30's.

A 4 peat is a much more impressive feat than a 3peat since it has only happened once in NBA history.

This can all be ruined if he leaves the Heat for any other team than Cleveland. He would then be a ring chaser.

Bron has never been faster or quicker than MJ. Never.

As for strength? Bron is bigger, I don't know if he's STRONGER. People always comment on MJ's unusual strength for his size.

And it doesn't always come from sheer muscle mass, or size.

[QUOTE=SpecialQue]Thing is, Jordan didn't have a perfect career. He failed multiple times before he started winning. Probably the two players who have had anything close to "perfect" careers are Bill Russell and Magic.[/QUOTE]

No, Jordan didn't have failures. He lost. They're two different things. Jordan never had the playoff blunders and poor games/series Lebron has had.

[QUOTE=OldSchoolBBall]No, Jordan didn't have failures. He lost. They're two different things. Jordan never had the playoff blunders and poor games/series Lebron has had.[/QUOTE]
Jordan played what 20 seasons? Jordan went to the finals 6 times in those 20 years meaning he failed 14 times (70% of the time). LeBron's played 9 years and been to the finals 3 times meaning he has failed 6 times 67% of the time. LeBron > Jordan by three percent...

It is not a detriment to lose in the finals. Just look at Jerry West one of the 15 greatest of all time, and ask him if he would trade losing in the finals for first/second round exits.

[QUOTE=OldSchoolBBall]No, Jordan didn't have failures. He lost. They're two different things. Jordan never had the playoff blunders and poor games/series Lebron has had.[/QUOTE]

Never ?

Come on... Jordan is a better playoff performer than LeBron , but to say he never had the playoff blunders and poor games/series like LeBron is a joke. Yes he did.

However, it's minimal and LeBron does have more worse series. That's the difference for me and there is achance LeBron might have another bad series in the playoffs, if not more.

[QUOTE=lilgodfather1]Jordan played what 20 seasons? Jordan went to the finals 6 times in those 20 years meaning he failed 14 times (70% of the time).[/QUOTE]

Jordan played 15 seasons... 6 of 15 and 7 of those years his team had a legit cast to win a title. That's an incredible conversion rate.