Kobe says European players more skilled than Americans, blames AAU

[url]http://espn.go.com/los-angeles/nba/story/_/id/12114523/kobe-bryant-says-european-players-more-skilled-americans-blames-aau[/url]


Kobe Bryant believes European basketball players are more skillful than American basketball players, and says it's a growing trend that can be blamed on the greed and coaching at the AAU level.

[COLOR="DarkGreen"]"I just think European players are just way more skillful,"[/COLOR] Bryant said Friday night after the Los Angeles Lakers' 109-106 loss to the Memphis Grizzlies. [COLOR="DarkGreen"]"They are just taught the game the right way at an early age. ... They're more skillful. It's something we really have to fix. We really have to address that. We have to teach our kids to play the right way."[/COLOR]

Bryant was quick to point the finger for the decline of skilled players in the United States.

[COLOR="DarkGreen"]"AAU basketball,"[/COLOR] Bryant said. [COLOR="DarkGreen"]"Horrible, terrible AAU basketball. It's stupid. It doesn't teach our kids how to play the game at all so you wind up having players that are big and they bring it up and they do all this fancy crap and they don't know how to post. They don't know the fundamentals of the game. It's stupid."[/COLOR]

Bryant was born in Philadelphia, but when he was 6, his father, former NBA player Joe Bryant, moved the family to Italy to continue his playing career. Kobe spent his childhood in Europe until Joe retired in 1991 and moved the family back to the United States.

[COLOR="DarkGreen"]"When you have limitations and you understand your limitations and you stay within yourself, you can be great,"[/COLOR] Kobe Bryant said. [COLOR="DarkGreen"]"You know what you can do and what you can't do. In America, it's a big problem for us because we're not teaching players how to play all-around basketball. That's why you have Pau and Marc [Gasol], and that's the reason why 90 percent of the Spurs' roster is European players, because they have more skill."[/COLOR]

Bryant smiled when asked what type of player he would have become if his family had never moved to Italy and he hadn't learned how to play the game in Europe.

[COLOR="DarkGreen"]"I probably wouldn't be able to dribble with my left and shoot with my left and have good footwork,"[/COLOR] Bryant said. [COLOR="DarkGreen"]"I was kind of fortunate because when I was growing up in Italy, the Red Auerbachs and the Tex Winters and all those great coaches were doing clinics and camps in Europe. They were teaching all the club coaches, and the club coaches were following their advice and their fundamentals like the bible, and they were teaching all of us kids that type of stuff. Me, Manu [Ginobili] and all these guys that grew up around that same time, we're a product of that. It's a big difference."[/COLOR]

Bryant had a simple solution to the problem.

[COLOR="DarkGreen"]"Teach players the game at an early age and stop treating them like cash cows for everyone to profit off of,"[/COLOR] he said. [COLOR="DarkGreen"]"That's how you do that. You have to teach them the game. Give them instruction."[/COLOR]

But Bryant, who holds an annual summer basketball camp, also was quick to point out that any solution involving changing the current culture of AAU basketball won't happen overnight.

[COLOR="DarkGreen"]"That's a deep well because then you start cutting into people's pockets,"[/COLOR] Bryant said. [COLOR="DarkGreen"]"People get really upset when you start cutting into their pockets because all they do is try to profit off these poor kids. There's no quick answer."[/COLOR]

[img]http://i.imgur.com/79c7dOg.png[/img]

Kobe thought everyone had an Italian villa

Already a thread on this

Knowledgebe strikes again

[QUOTE=JohnFreeman]Kobe thought everyone had an Italian villa[/QUOTE]

Why so salty?

[QUOTE=chocolatethunder]Already a thread on this[/QUOTE]Yeah but Euorleague is posting in that one... He got all excited because Kobe said something positive about international players and jizzed all over the place


AAU has been a mess for sometime now... i think it's great there's a place the kids can get that much basketball in on a year round basis but the financial side is really creepy and most these kids float from club to club so there's no time to teach them basketball basics

not unlike college ball where the coaches only have a gifted player for a year so why bother teaching the fundamentals when you barely have enough time to teach him the system

[img]http://i.imgur.com/rBcEXie.png[/img]

[img]http://i.imgur.com/gzkPLmw.png[/img]

[url]https://twitter.com/DraftExpress/status/551429058014494721[/url]
[url]https://twitter.com/DraftExpress/status/551429447736635395[/url]

Somebody tell Kobe that Manu is from Argentina. :oldlol:

[QUOTE=JohnMax][img]http://i.imgur.com/rBcEXie.png[/img]

[img]http://i.imgur.com/gzkPLmw.png[/img]

[url]https://twitter.com/DraftExpress/status/551429058014494721[/url]
[url]https://twitter.com/DraftExpress/status/551429447736635395[/url][/QUOTE]
:bowdown:

[QUOTE=JohnMax][img]http://i.imgur.com/rBcEXie.png[/img]

[img]http://i.imgur.com/gzkPLmw.png[/img]

[url]https://twitter.com/DraftExpress/status/551429058014494721[/url]
[url]https://twitter.com/DraftExpress/status/551429447736635395[/url][/QUOTE]
Somebody's butthurt:oldlol:

Kobe is far worse than AAU teaching kids being a selfish shot chucker when you don't have the talent to be one is OK.

Educationbe

Teachthegametherightwaybe

[QUOTE=SamuraiSWISH]Being an assistant coach in AAU, I agree there is some alarming aspects about it, and even feels a bit corrupt. Much more a product or feeder system than it is a teaching tool to actually improve kids. Before I even joined the first thing I told our program leader was I want to bring back to basket skills back. But in this basketball climate it's difficult, and isn't the sexiest thing to teach kids.

We cheat our kid athletes out of aspects of the game because everyone out there is out for themselves. Everyone is trying to be a ball in hand star player.

But American lack of skills? Besides Kobe not including himself, what is he talking about?

LeBron (his court vision, passing alone makes him uniquely elite skilled)
Durant (Amazing shooter, ball handler @ 6'11)
CP3 (Possibly the best all around PG ever, both sides of ball)
Steph Curry (Best shooter of all-time?)
K. Love (Ridiculously skilled, smaller white, American Gasol)
Anthony Davis (a do it all PF who can handle the ball)

Some of these guys are of the most skilled of all-time, accompanied with elite bodies or athleticism. That's why Americans are better. Not simply due to athleticism. It's the lethal combination of that inherent genetic lottery with great skills.[/QUOTE]
He was probably talking about Lin.

Being an assistant coach in AAU, I agree there is some alarming aspects about it, and even feels a bit corrupt. Much more a product or feeder system than it is a teaching tool to actually improve kids. Before I even joined the first thing I told our program leader was I want to bring back to basket skills back. But in this basketball climate it's difficult, and isn't the sexiest thing to teach kids.

We cheat our kid athletes out of aspects of the game because everyone out there is out for themselves. Everyone is trying to be a ball in hand star player.

But American lack of skills? Besides Kobe not including himself, what is he talking about?

LeBron (his court vision, passing alone makes him uniquely elite skilled)
Durant (Amazing shooter, ball handler @ 6'11)
CP3 (Possibly the best all around PG ever, both sides of ball)
Steph Curry (Best shooter of all-time?)
K. Love (Ridiculously skilled, smaller white, American Gasol)
Anthony Davis (a do it all PF who can handle the ball)

Some of these guys are of the most skilled of all-time, accompanied with elite bodies or athleticism. That's why Americans are better. Not simply due to athleticism. It's the lethal combination of that inherent genetic lottery with great skills.

Kobe grew up in Italy, as an American, playing a caricature of our entire game because he was raised exclusively on MJ Come Fly w/ Me tapes.

Those tweets are correct, LeBron plays a more well rounded all-around game than Kobe offensively. Besides the lack of comparable post foot work, how is LeBron not every bit as talented if not more than Kobe?

[B]Good shit, I agree with his premise/point.[/B]

[QUOTE=SamuraiSWISH]Being an assistant coach in AAU, I agree there is some alarming aspects about it, and even feels a bit corrupt. Much more a product or feeder system than it is a teaching tool to actually improve kids. Before I even joined the first thing I told our program leader was I want to bring back to basket skills back. But in this basketball climate it's difficult, and isn't the sexiest thing to teach kids.

We cheat our kid athletes out of aspects of the game because everyone out there is out for themselves. Everyone is trying to be a ball in hand star player.

But American lack of skills? Besides Kobe not including himself, what is he talking about?

LeBron (his court vision, passing alone makes him uniquely elite skilled)
Durant (Amazing shooter, ball handler @ 6'11)
CP3 (Possibly the best all around PG ever, both sides of ball)
Steph Curry (Best shooter of all-time?)
K. Love (Ridiculously skilled, smaller white, American Gasol)
Anthony Davis (a do it all PF who can handle the ball)

Some of these guys are of the most skilled of all-time, accompanied with elite bodies or athleticism. That's why Americans are better. Not simply due to athleticism. It's the lethal combination of that inherent genetic lottery with great skills.

Kobe grew up in Italy, as an American, playing a caricature of our entire game because he was raised exclusively on MJ Come Fly w/ Me tapes.

Those tweets are correct, LeBron plays a more well rounded all-around game than Kobe offensively. Besides the lack of comparable post foot work, how is LeBron not every bit as talented if not more than Kobe?[/QUOTE]


LeBron is the perfect example of aau ball.. The biggest best kid that got to handle it all game and doesn't know how to play a lick off ball and has poor footwork/inconsistent post skills.

knew he'd pin it on big men

[B]"they bring it up and they do all this fancy crap
and they don't know how to post"[/B]


as with most things there's pros and cons but at
the end of most days , , talent kicks skills ass
9 times out of 10 . . . this game will always
be about talent and aau is just a place
for that talent to grow and develop

only when euros come over with extraordinary
talent atop the skills will this make any sense

until then i'll stick with aau and kids like

anthony davis
dem cousins
chris bosh
etc


interesting comment section:

[B]Most people have a problem with AAU because the coaches are black. The best players of the past 20 years have been AAU superstars. Nobody is complaining about all the Catholic schools these guys play for and make millions for every year. Nobody is complains about the NCAA that makes billions off of their backs just AAU. AAU is fine and the top 1000 players in the world 950 are AAU superstars.[/B]

[QUOTE=SamuraiSWISH]Being an assistant coach in AAU, I agree there is some alarming aspects about it, and even feels a bit corrupt. Much more a product or feeder system than it is a teaching tool to actually improve kids. Before I even joined the first thing I told our program leader was I want to bring back to basket skills back. But in this basketball climate it's difficult, and isn't the sexiest thing to teach kids.

We cheat our kid athletes out of aspects of the game because everyone out there is out for themselves. Everyone is trying to be a ball in hand star player.

[/QUOTE]

Amen

[QUOTE=aau]knew he'd pin it on big men

[B]"they bring it up and they do all this fancy crap
and they don't know how to post"[/B]


as with most things there's pros and cons but at
the end of most days , , talent kicks skills ass
9 times out of 10 . . . this game will always
be about talent and aau is just a place
for that talent to grow and develop

only when euros come over with extraordinary
talent atop the skills will this make any sense

until then i'll stick with aau and kids like

anthony davis
dem cousins
chris bosh
etc


interesting comment section:

[B]Most people have a problem with AAU because the coaches are black. The best players of the past 20 years have been AAU superstars. Nobody is complaining about all the Catholic schools these guys play for and make millions for every year. Nobody is complains about the NCAA that makes billions off of their backs just AAU. AAU is fine and the top 1000 players in the world 950 are AAU superstars.[/B][/QUOTE]


Kobe is completely wrong here.

EVERY team in Europe, Asia, South America import a black American to be their main post player.

Why would they take guys from an inferior talent pool to patrol the paint and score inside for them?

Failbe
Dumbbe
Bitterbe
Notarealbrothabe

[QUOTE=JtotheIzzo]Kobe is completely wrong here.

EVERY team in Europe, Asia, South America import a black American to be their main post player.

Why would they take guys from an inferior talent pool to patrol the paint and score inside for them?

Failbe
Dumbbe
Bitterbe
Notarealbrothabe[/QUOTE]


trust if kobe had a son he'd be playing aau ball
and the youtubes would be numerous

lil chucky , , ballhog junior , , lil bean shooter

funny thing is they crack on aau but all we ever see
is the finished product . . . . we didn't see the long
gangly uncoordinated kid that came into the gym
couldn't walk and chew gum at the same time

hours days months and years of training and traveling
with kids - no charge in most cases cause it's mostly
low income families - the kid turns up and becomes
a player . . . everybody and they momma gets
praise - youth coaches n trainers catch shit

idiots can bite

[QUOTE=JtotheIzzo]Kobe is completely wrong here.

[B]EVERY team[/B] in Europe, Asia, South America import a black American to be their main post player.

Why would they take guys from an inferior talent pool to patrol the paint and score inside for them?

Failbe
Dumbbe
Bitterbe
Notarealbrothabe[/QUOTE]:oldlol:

[QUOTE=SamuraiSWISH]

LeBron (his court vision, passing alone makes him uniquely elite skilled)

[/QUOTE]
court vision... lol... anyone can have court vision if they dribble the ball 12 times first and survey the floor for half the shot clock.

truthfully, now that lebron isn't the super-quick player he once was, it is suboptimal for a forward to impinge on the duties of the guards by dominating the ball as much as he does - his level of overall domination no longer justifies him creating a suboptimal environment where guards must be relegated to lesser roles... he's better off on the block at this point in his career, especially with love floor-spreading.

and since lebron dominates the ball more than a lot of point guards and more than any other wing, his assist numbers aren't impressive... they are barely above average for such a massive ball-dominator... guys like chris paul, steve nash, magic johnson and others are GREAT passing ball-dominators... lebron is not.


[QUOTE]

how is LeBron not every bit as talented if not more than Kobe

[/QUOTE]
well, he can't slide between defenders like kobe and his drives are much more predictable because he needs a larger, more straight-away lane to drive... he can't just drive at any moment he chooses and he can't change direction an unlimited number of times like kobe... he has to wait for an opening more and use more screens to get in the lane than kobe - these things make him more exploitable than kobe and his game less adjustable than kobe.

also, there is the issue of scoring versatility and elite skill in various offensive categories - when it comes to scoring, lebron is good at a lot of things, but great at nothing... otoh, kobe was great at a lot of aspects of scoring... for example, lebron can't get 40 playing strictly off-ball like kobe.. lebron can't get 40 shooting all mid-range jumpshots like kobe.

[QUOTE=aau]

talent kicks skills ass

[/QUOTE]
is that why the pistons beat the lakers in the 80's?

is that why the bulls beat the blazers, suns, and sonics?

is that why detroit beat LA in 2004?

is that why the spurs beat the heat?

is that why dallas beat the heat?

[QUOTE]

9 times out of 10 . . .

[/QUOTE]
except when the talent is close (which is most of the time in championship games), then the superior skills win 10 out of 10 times... :confusedshrug:

talent really only kicks skills ass when you are talking about one level versus a lower level, like a college team vs a high school team... or maybe the best teams in the nba vs the worst...

I think the "lack of skill" argument about today's NBA players is blown completely out of proportion. The skills haven't diminished, they've changed..and they're not unskilled compared to international players, they're just less reliant on skills..doesn't mean it's not there. There are less traditional bigs with complete back to the basket games..and that has something to do with teaching, and some to do with the league's style of play evolving and changing..but it's not like today's NBA era is filled with a bunch of unskilled scrubs that are just athletic freaks or something.. This whole argument to me is the era discussion equivalent of saying Wade isn't skilled because he doesn't have great range on his jumper. It's just way too narrow a view.

Physical/natural talent can only get you so far in this league. No matter how physically gifted you are, you need to have discernible skill at what you do. Even the freaks like Lebron, Westbrook, Davis, Blake, healthy Rose, etc have clear skill and finesse to their game, whether they apply it regularly or not...be it Lebron's passing ability, Davis and Blake's jumpshot and handles for their size/position, Rose's touch and variety of moves around the rim, Westbrook's ability to stop on a dime and knock down FT line jumpers..and those are the freak athletes who can get by purely on talent if they wanted to..you look at the other stars of the league not gifted with the same physical tools, and the skill level is insane. Curry, KD, CP3, Aldridge, Love, Irving, Harden (as much as I hate him), Cousins, Lillard, Melo, healthy PG, Bosh, etc..these guys are as skilled as they come, whether they perform or not, whether you like them or not.

Did Kobe really fall into the trap?

We have three Europeans.

Our smartest two players are American and South American.

Our two best players are both American.

[QUOTE=Milbuck]

I think the "lack of skill" argument about today's NBA players is blown completely out of proportion. The skills haven't diminished, they've changed..and they're not unskilled compared to international players, they're just less reliant on skills..doesn't mean it's not there.

[/quote]
3-and-D basketball not only sounds like a joke, but it is a joke compared to what kobe is talking about.

i'll never understand the fascination with open shots and one 3-pointer after another - it's just play-finishing, but somehow people like it more than players having to TAKE each other and score ON each other.

btw, i assume that when you say "they are just less reliant on skills", i assume you mean because the spacing generates open shots, so they don't have to use their skills... this is not a good thing.


[quote]

Lebron's passing ability, Davis and Blake's jumpshot and handles for their size/position, Rose's touch and variety of moves around the rim, Westbrook's ability to stop on a dime and knock down FT line jumpers..

Curry, KD, CP3, Aldridge, Love, Irving, Harden (as much as I hate him), Cousins, Lillard, Melo, healthy PG, Bosh, etc..these guys are as skilled as they come, whether they perform or not, whether you like them or not.

[/QUOTE]
the skills you mention here that some of today's star players possess, were STANDARD in previous eras for even middling players - i.e. you cite westbrook's pull-up, mid-range jumpshot... seriously, that is impressive to you?... do you know how standard that was back when they ONLY shot two's?... why do you think the pace was so fast back then?... no need to set up spacing, just do a russell westbrook pull-up every time.

also, other than the very unique KD, every player you mentioned has SEVERAL guys from the 90's that were better:... davis < robinson, hakeem.... blake < malone, barkely ... aldridge < kemp, webber.... cousins < shaq, ewing, alonzo, most good C's or PF's in previous eras.... melo < scottie... lebron < Jordan... bosh < derrick coleman... harden < drexler... westbrook < Payton and Penny... PG < grant hill... got any more for the 90's to crush?

[QUOTE=3ball]is that why the pistons beat the lakers in the 80's?

is that why the bulls beat the blazers, suns, and sonics?

is that why detroit beat LA in 2004?

is that why the spurs beat the heat?

is that why dallas beat the heat?


except when the talent is close (which is most of the time in championship games), then the superior skills win 10 out of 10 times... :confusedshrug:

talent really only kicks skills ass when you are talking about one level versus a lower level, like a college team vs a high school team... or maybe the best teams in the nba vs the worst...[/QUOTE]



hahaha

we talking individual talent and skills as a youth
you bring up professional team competition

miss me dude

[QUOTE=3ball]

also, other than the very unique KD, every player you mentioned has SEVERAL guys from the 90's that were similar player types and better:... davis < robinson, hakeem.... blake < malone, barkely ... aldridge < kemp, webber.... cousins < shaq, ewing, alonzo, most good C's or PF's in previous eras.... melo < scottie... lebron < jordan... bosh < derrick coleman... harden < drexler... westbrook < Payton and Penny... PG < grant hill... got any more for the 90's to crush?

[/QUOTE]
I should mention that all these players are from one season, 1996.

[QUOTE=Haymaker]Somebody tell Kobe that Manu is from Argentina. :oldlol:[/QUOTE]


are you trolling or just stupid?

[QUOTE=tpols]LeBron is the perfect example of aau ball.. The biggest best kid that got to handle it all game and doesn't know how to play a lick off ball and has poor footwork/inconsistent post skills.[/QUOTE]
This.

LeBron has the same "skills" he's had since he was 8. Plays the same damn way.

[QUOTE=SpanishACB]are you trolling or just stupid?[/QUOTE]
Am I missing something?

[QUOTE=Budadiiii]Am I missing something?[/QUOTE]

Manu played from 21 to 26 in Europe. The influences to his game should be obvious; that's clearly what Kobe is talking about, since they were in the same league at the same time... somehow the guy I quote thought Kobe was a geographical retard when in reality he just missed the point himself.

[QUOTE=SpanishACB]Manu played from 21 to 26 in Europe. The influences to his game should be obvious; that's clearly what Kobe is talking about, since they were in the same league at the same time... somehow the guy I quote thought Kobe was a geographical retard when in reality he just missed the point himself.[/QUOTE]
:cheers:

i'm callin bullshit on aau damaging young ballplayers

you've just been given the opportunity of hosting a
prestigious middle school youth camp that starts
on friday and ends on sunday . . . . in terms
of player development what does your
first and final hour look like

you'll have a dunk contest or 3pt shootout along the way
but for the most part it's all about skill development
you'll have 8-10 stations and every kid no matter
how big or small , , skilled or unskilled will do
the same things that everyone else does

from this camp you grab a few kids and form a team
develop them for 4 years to the point you think
they're pretty good . . . . it's the college
viewing period and vegas is offering
bigfoot - the adidas 64 and fab 48

you also get an invite to the salt lake city nationals

hahaha , , , where you goin . . . . . myself
i'm hittin up vegas . . why? cause that's
where the scouts will be . . . . . why?

cause that's where the top talent will be

normally young talent is immature so if they're
looking for kids with good skills to play
a cerebral game and graduate

if that's what you got

go to salt lake

[QUOTE=The Immortal]Seriously I'm having a hard time comprehending what you're writing. Why do you type like that?[/QUOTE]


that's ok , , shouldn't be that difficult

never liked book writings . . . too many words and i'm
already long-winded . . . besides ,, grew up reading
newspaper columns and prefer that format better

[QUOTE=The Immortal]Also, strong username to topic and post ratio..[/QUOTE]


could talk about this all day

got 3 kids in the league and that's just the first batch

of them
one we had to literally kick in the ass just to shoot the ball

hopefully you'll be seeing his lil cousins in a few - the oldest is
playing college ball now (not to put too much on it but the
closest thing to the doctor I've seen) and the youngest
is 15 years old 6'9 240 just started the 9th grade

parents phone hasn't stopped ringing

could post youtubes for days

but i'll wait

didn't mean to turn spiritual and should have said we
instead of I because it's totally a huge team effort

it just grinds me to see the coaches get the shaft when
a lot of times these kids have to live with these guys
oftentimes for a pretty large part of their lives

you guys think it's about getting paid when for the
most part it's all out-of-pocket for the coaches
only a few get the nike or adidas deals

i'ma hop off this soapbox saying the most difficult thing
is keeping them eligible and in school with the hope
they can even get into college because most
can't afford it


that's the main goal for most

I agree with Kobe for the most part except we developed guards here better than anywhere. Generally, Euros are much better skilled but they are very unathletic and soft.

[QUOTE=aau]that's ok , , shouldn't be that difficult

never liked book writings . . . too many words and i'm
already long-winded . . . besides ,, grew up reading
newspaper columns and prefer that format better[/QUOTE]

You write like an AAU produced ball player. You can spell and do flashy things like hyphenate words but you have no idea about the basics such as full stops and capital letters.