Distance traveled per 48 minutes - Lebron's is a league-bottom 3.0 miles

(Lebron is on 13th page of 14): [url]http://stats.nba.com/tracking/#!/player/speed/?sort=DIST_48&dir=1&Season=2014-15&SeasonType=Regular%20Season[/url]

Harden is also at a league-bottom 3.0 miles.. Chris Paul's is at 3.1 miles.. Westbrook's is 3.3.. All the heavy ball-dominators are < 3.5 miles.. And they're stats are identical in the playoffs.

Otoh, all the high-assisted, off-ball players are > 3.5 miles.. Korver, Danny Green, Kawhi Leonard, Klay Thompson, Steph Curry - all the off-ball players have over 3.5 miles traveled per 48 minutes, which means [I]off-ball players travel almost 20% further than Lebron every 48 minutes[/I].

So don't be fooled into thinking ball-dominators are expending more energy with their playground style because they're not - they're actually traveling a shorter distance than everyone else, which is remarkable since ball-dominators have the highest time of possession.. The low distance traveled coupled with high time of possessions means that Chris Paul, Lebron, and other ball-dominators spend a lot of time just standing around with the ball.
.

Are you ever going to make a thread that's not about Jordan/LeBron?

[QUOTE=SouBeachTalents]Are you ever going to make a thread that's not about Jordan/LeBron?[/QUOTE]

That is his specialty. 3ball is a scientist. Why would you ask a biochemist to write about astrophysics?

3ball's MJ obsession sometimes overshadow his very good thread ideas.
And this is a very good thread idea with perfect execution.
Facts, no biases, just straight up murdering fools.
You should always be like this, friend

And he still cramps up:facepalm

had no idea dudes running around screens travelled more distances

[QUOTE=SugarHill]had no idea dudes running around screens travelled more distances[/QUOTE]
Seems counterintuitive, but it actually isn't.

And the fact that ball-dominators travel a shorter distance than everyone else is particularly remarkable since ball-dominators have the highest [I]time of possession[/I].

The low distance traveled along with high time of possession means that Chris Paul, Lebron, and all ball-dominators spend a lot of time just standing around with the ball... which is confirmed pretty clearly by a cursory eye test.

[QUOTE=3ball](Lebron is on 13th page of 14): [url]http://stats.nba.com/tracking/#!/player/speed/?sort=DIST_48&dir=1&Season=2014-15&SeasonType=Regular%20Season[/url]

Harden is also at a league-bottom 3.0 miles.. Chris Paul's is at 3.1 miles.. Westbrook's is 3.3.. All the heavy ball-dominators are < 3.5 miles.. And they're stats are identical in the playoffs.

Otoh, all the high-assisted, off-ball players are > 3.5 miles.. Korver, Danny Green, Kawhi Leonard, Klay Thompson, Steph Curry - all the off-ball players have over 3.5 miles traveled per 48 minutes, which means [I]off-ball players travel almost 20% further than Lebron every 48 minutes[/I].

So don't be fooled into thinking ball-dominators are expending more energy with their playground style because they're not - they're actually traveling a shorter distance than everyone else, which is remarkable since ball-dominators have the highest time of possession.. The low distance traveled coupled with high time of possessions means that Chris Paul, Lebron, and other ball-dominators spend a lot of time just standing around with the ball.
.[/QUOTE]
You're melting down because Curry runs 0.5 miles more per game than LeBron?

Kevin Durant runs pretty much the same as LeBron, BTW. Kobe as well (the sample size is small though).

[QUOTE=3ball]Seems counterintuitive, but it actually isn't.

And the fact that ball-dominators travel a shorter distance than everyone else is particularly remarkable since ball-dominators have the highest [I]time of possession[/I].

The low distance traveled along with high time of possession means that Chris Paul, Lebron, and all ball-dominators spend a lot of time just standing around with the ball... which is confirmed pretty clearly by a cursory eye test.[/QUOTE]
You've never watched a game of basketball, have you?

[QUOTE=aj1987]

You're melting down because Curry runs 0.5 miles more per game than LeBron?

[/quote]
0.5 miles is a ton - it's 20% more than Lebron every game..

And it isn't just Curry - it's ALL off-ball players - Korver, Danny Green, Kawhi, etc.. Off-ball players travel about 20% further in games than ball-dominators like Lebron, Harden, CP3, etc.

So the notion that Lebron expended so much energy "running the show" for Cleveland is proven wrong by the stats... The stats also prove that even though ball-dominators travel the least distances in games, they still have the highest time of possession, which proves they stand around a lot.

Its called [I]navigational efficiency[/I], getting the most production with the [I]least amount of steps[/I]

LeBron is the most navigational efficient player in the league, no player produces more per step than him.


OP wouldnt understand

[QUOTE=warriorfan]That is his specialty. 3ball is a scientist. Why would you ask a biochemist to write about astrophysics?[/QUOTE]


Right? Right?

You don't ask Michelangelo to explain the Theory of Relativity.

You don't ask Bill Gates to paint the Mona Lisa.

You don't ask Stevie Wonder to race in the Daytona 500.

And you don't ask rent freeball to discuss anything other than MJ vs Lebron.

Running mile is not that tiring but attacking the basket and getting hit is a lot more tiring. Running more is not guaranteed to create more physical exertion. Their is more than that to the equation. Like jumping, fighting for position, shooting, defending, at asking the basket. All you are saying is that off ball players run more.

GOAT navigation efficiency, OP? :eek:
:oldlol:

[QUOTE=TripleA]


Their is more than that to the equation. Like [B]jumping, fighting for position, shooting, defending, at asking the basket[/B]. All you are saying is that off ball players run more.


[/QUOTE]
kawhi does all that plus he runs an additional half mile a game.
.

Their are so many factors that we can simply say that Lebron does not expend as much energy as off ball players. If isolated every variable except for distance ran and test their energy expenditure than you can that Lebron does not expend energy but you cannot so your analysis is bias. Also Lebron plays much more minutes than those players and is older so those are other variables in this analysis. If you going to look at basketball scientifically you have to take your analysis a step at a time.

Still 3 miles more than I run in a day.

[QUOTE=TripleA]


[IMG]http://cdn.makeagif.com/media/5-16-2015/NlRpyo.gif[/IMG]


[IMG]http://cdn.makeagif.com/media/5-16-2015/R29T3G.gif[/IMG]


Their are so many factors that we can simply say that Lebron does not expend as much energy as off ball players. If isolated every variable except for distance ran and test their energy expenditure than you can that Lebron does not expend energy but you cannot so your analysis is bias.


[/QUOTE]
Again, Kawhi does all the things you say Lebron does, AND he runs an extra 1/2 mile per game.

And as you can see from the gifs above, scoring off-ball uses more energy than just running a longer distance.


[QUOTE=TripleA]

Also Lebron plays much more minutes than those players

[/QUOTE]
The stat measures PER 48 MINUTES - so playing time has nothing to do with it.. Stop being biased and turning a blind eye to the facts.

is op retarded? do u really think a half mile over a 48 minute basis is that tiring? it's not the running part that's tiring. i can run around a basketball court for 48 minutes with little to no trouble.

Damn, I guess JJ Redick > LeBron.

[QUOTE=3ball]Again, Kawhi does all the things you say Lebron does, AND he runs an extra 1/2 mile per game.

And as you can see from the gifs above, scoring off-ball uses more energy than just running a longer distance.



The stat measures PER 48 MINUTES - so playing time has nothing to do with it.. Stop being biased and turning a blind eye to the facts.[/QUOTE]

What facts your facts mean nothing without actually testing. You acting like your hypothesis is fact. For it to be fact you have actually test by isolating the variables. Kawhi might do the same things but you have to test it to consider it to be considered facts. You are trying to act like a scientist but you are just using observations that are not rooted in cold hard statistics to make your point.

[QUOTE=LoneyROY7]


[IMG]http://cdn.makeagif.com/media/8-03-2015/P5BrOZ.gif[/IMG]


[B]Damn, I guess JJ Redick > LeBron.[/B]


[/QUOTE]
For athletic players like MJ, off-ball play often requires MORE athleticism than ball-dominance does.
.

sounds like GOAT-tier navigation effiency paired with an excellent equal-opportunity running style

[QUOTE=Trollsmasher]


[IMG]http://cdn.makeagif.com/media/7-10-2015/LfHlds.gif[/IMG]


sounds like GOAT-tier navigation effiency paired with an excellent equal-opportunity running style


[/QUOTE]
In addition to running an extra half mile per game, elite off-ball play requires the elite athleticism seen above, along with superior skill and smarts.

Accordingly, it's much harder than today's AAU, playground-style ball-dominance..

Look at the gif above - MJ's relentless off-ball game created an assist for Toni and increased the playmaking capacity of the team.. His off-ball game allowed his teammates to partake in the playmaking process, which made them bigger threats and increased strategic options... Hence, 6/6... :applause: :bowdown:

[QUOTE=3ball]0.5 miles is a ton - it's 20% more than Lebron every game..

And it isn't just Curry - it's ALL off-ball players - Korver, Danny Green, Kawhi, etc.. Off-ball players travel about 20% further in games than ball-dominators like Lebron, Harden, CP3, etc.

So the notion that Lebron expended so much energy "running the show" for Cleveland is proven wrong by the stats... The stats also prove that even though ball-dominators travel the least distances in games, they still have the highest time of possession, which proves they stand around a lot.[/QUOTE]
Nope. It's closer to 15%.

Korver, Green, Curry, etc.. What do they all have in common? They constantly run around screens to get open for a 3. That's why they run more than most players. Kobe, LeBron, KD, etc. don't need to. That's not their game. Also, those players are like 50lbs lighter than LeBron. If you still can't figure it out, I can't help you.

[QUOTE=aj1987]


[IMG]http://cdn.makeagif.com/media/9-13-2015/LJ8raP.gif[/IMG]

[IMG]http://cdn.makeagif.com/media/7-10-2015/LfHlds.gif[/IMG]


Nope. It's closer to 15%.

Korver, Green, Curry, etc.. What do they all have in common? They constantly run around screens to get open for a 3. That's why they run more than most players. Kobe, LeBron, KD, etc. don't need to. That's not their game. Also, those players are like 50lbs lighter than LeBron. If you still can't figure it out, I can't help you.


[/QUOTE]
In addition to running an extra half mile per game, elite off-ball play FOR ATHLETIC PLAYERS requires the elite athleticism seen above, along with superior skill and smarts.

Accordingly, it's much harder than today's AAU, playground-style ball-dominance.

Look at the gif above where MJ dunks on Shaq - MJ's relentless off-ball game created an assist for Toni, which made him a bigger threat, and increased the playmaking capacity of the team.. His off-ball game allowed him to achieve elite stats within an equal-opportunity offense that was run well enough to go 6/6.
.

.
[B]Thread Cliffs:[/B]


[I]Despite having the [url=http://stats.nba.com/tracking/#!/player/possessions/?sort=TOP&dir=1&Season=2014-15&SeasonType=Playoffs]highest time of possession[/url] per game, ball-dominators like Lebron, Harden, and CP3 actually travel the [url=http://stats.nba.com/tracking/#!/player/speed/?sort=DIST_48&dir=1]least distance[/url] each game, presumably because they stand around half the time pounding the rock and not actually going anywhere..

Of course, we already know that in Lebron's case, he's a SF, so his ball-dominance turns a normally high-assisted position into a low-assisted one, which has served to drastically reduce his team's [url=http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=385446]assist frequency[/url] relative to his peers. [/I]

[QUOTE=3ball].
[B]Thread Cliffs:[/B]

I'm OBSESSED with LeBron and my life is absolutely pointless without him.[/QUOTE]

:applause:

[QUOTE=3ball].
[B]Thread Cliffs:[/B]


[I]Despite having the [url=http://stats.nba.com/tracking/#!/player/possessions/?sort=TOP&dir=1&Season=2014-15&SeasonType=Playoffs]highest time of possession[/url] per game, ball-dominators like Lebron, Harden, and CP3 actually travel the [url=http://stats.nba.com/tracking/#!/player/speed/?sort=DIST_48&dir=1]least distance[/url] each game, presumably because they stand around half the time pounding the rock and not actually going anywhere..

Of course, we already know that in Lebron's case, he's a SF, so his ball-dominance turns a normally high-assisted position into a low-assisted one, which has served to drastically reduce his team's [url=http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=385446]assist frequency[/url] relative to his peers. [/I][/QUOTE]

Wow, 3ball just took a big dump on Branstans and all they can do is sit there, hold the L, and take it. I honestly expected a better rebuttal, but the mad scientist just found another way to use facts to prove a solid point.

[QUOTE=3ball].
[B]Thread Cliffs:[/B]


[I]Despite having the [url=http://stats.nba.com/tracking/#!/player/possessions/?sort=TOP&dir=1&Season=2014-15&SeasonType=Playoffs]highest time of possession[/url] per game, ball-dominators like Lebron, Harden, and CP3 actually travel the [url=http://stats.nba.com/tracking/#!/player/speed/?sort=DIST_48&dir=1]least distance[/url] each game, presumably because they stand around half the time pounding the rock and not actually going anywhere..

Of course, we already know that in Lebron's case, he's a SF, so his ball-dominance turns a normally high-assisted position into a low-assisted one, which has served to drastically reduce his team's [url=http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=385446]assist frequency[/url] relative to his peers. [/I][/QUOTE]

I'm a HUGE le[B]BRONZE[/B] fan and I agree, we take the L on this one like usual :cry: :cry: :cry: I wish le[B]BRONZE[/B] was as good as kobe :banghead: :banghead:

exposes the fraudulent tired excuse for his 39% shooting against single coverage

I like how OP just ignores the fact that this is really a positive thing.His navigational efficiency is probably the highest in league history.Per step lebron averages more(pps,rps,bps,sps, and aps) points rebounds blocks steals and assist per step than anyone in nba history.


You disappoint me OP :facepalm

[QUOTE=warriorfan]That is his specialty. 3ball is a scientist. Why would you ask a biochemist to write about astrophysics?[/QUOTE]


:oldlol:

[QUOTE=3ball](Lebron is on 13th page of 14): [url]http://stats.nba.com/tracking/#!/player/speed/?sort=DIST_48&dir=1&Season=2014-15&SeasonType=Regular%20Season[/url]

Harden is also at a league-bottom 3.0 miles.. Chris Paul's is at 3.1 miles.. Westbrook's is 3.3.. All the heavy ball-dominators are < 3.5 miles.. And they're stats are identical in the playoffs.

Otoh, all the high-assisted, off-ball players are > 3.5 miles.. Korver, Danny Green, Kawhi Leonard, Klay Thompson, Steph Curry - all the off-ball players have over 3.5 miles traveled per 48 minutes, which means [I]off-ball players travel almost 20% further than Lebron every 48 minutes[/I].

So don't be fooled into thinking ball-dominators are expending more energy with their playground style because they're not - they're actually traveling a shorter distance than everyone else, which is remarkable since ball-dominators have the highest time of possession.. The low distance traveled coupled with high time of possessions means that Chris Paul, Lebron, and other ball-dominators spend a lot of time just standing around with the ball.
.[/QUOTE]

sup brother..... just out of curiosity, what do you do for a living ?

Interesting.

[QUOTE=Im so nba'd out]I like how OP just ignores the fact that this is really a positive thing.His navigational efficiency is probably the highest in league history.Per step lebron averages more(pps,rps,bps,sps, and aps) points rebounds blocks steals and assist per step than anyone in nba history.


You disappoint me OP :facepalm[/QUOTE]

He moves around the court less than a non dominate ball player so essentially he is holding onto the ball way more than he should. Same with CP3. It's wasted time of possession at the expense of the team. He is causing his team to work harder and take more steps per game than they should in order to get the win.

[QUOTE=Straight_Ballin]He moves around the court less than a non dominate ball player so essentially he is holding onto the ball way more than he should. Same with CP3. It's wasted time of possession at the expense of the team. He is causing his team to work harder and take more steps per game than they should in order to get the win.[/QUOTE]


Also he just stands around on defense, or camps near the rim to statpad his rebounds, that probably accounts for his low distance

[QUOTE=Straight_Ballin]He moves around the court less than a non dominate ball player so essentially he is holding onto the ball way more than he should. Same with CP3. It's wasted time of possession at the expense of the team. He is causing his team to work harder and take more steps per game than they should in order to get the win.[/QUOTE]
That would be true if Kawhi, Green, and TP are among the league leaders in distance travelled per game. Who's holding onto the ball on the Spurs and making them run?

Also, Cleveland was the 3rd best offense last seasons and the Clips were #1. They must be doing something right...:confusedshrug:

I'd argue that LeBron is one of the best off-ball players in the league, not as good as Reggie Miller, but certainly quite a bit better than Jordan.

[QUOTE=dubeta]I'd argue that LeBron is one of the best off-ball players in the league, not as good as Reggie Miller, but certainly quite a bit better than Jordan.[/QUOTE]
Please kill yourself.

[QUOTE=aj1987]Please kill yourself.[/QUOTE]

:roll: