is lebron a GREAT scorer?

1) Lebron scored the most points without producing the best teams of his era, which demonstrates that his scoring style is suboptimal and doesn't yield the best team ceilings like Curry, Kawhi or MJ - these expert jumpshooters were coachable to play the best brand of ball and achieve the highest team ceilings, while Lebron forces coaches into a heliocentric offense that revolves around 1 player and requires more help (lower team ceilings/Finals records).

2) Heliocentric scoring imposes spot-up roles that stall young players, so it lacks the teammate development, fits and brand of ball to win organically and must pursue talent-based winning instead (team-hopping.. all-star team strategy).

3) At carry-job scoring levels, heliocentric players lack sufficient brand of ball to beat top teams (too ball-dominant) - this inability to carry the scoring load requires all-time scoring help like Kareem, AD, or Wade and can't win with secondary producers like Wiggins or Pippen.. GM's must find expensive, star scoring help for heliocentric players, while expert jumpshooters like Curry or MJ that can carry the scoring load allow GM's to build a team of cheap defenders .

4) Great scorers require a jumper that routinely pops off, which forces opponents to consider double-teaming to get the ball out of their hands (commanding doubles).. aka great scorers must have their scoring be devastating enough to make opponents willing to compromise their defense by double-teaming (gambling).

5) Turnovers - great scoring requires low turnovers and Lebron is #1 all-time in turnovers - he's a 6'8" Westbrook turnover machine with similar non-elite jumpshooting efficiency.. He was on his way to becoming just another career-losing ball-dominator like CP3 or Luka until the "decision" to stack the deck.

LeBron is the Greatest scorer.

About to surpass Kareem as the all time leading scorer of all time, and that is Kareem's [B][I][U]career magnus opus[/U][/I][/B]. Kareem has won 6 championships and 6 MVPs and nobody talks about those achievements.

[IMG]https://images4.imagebam.com/c7/e8/8e/MEE4DNN_o.png[/IMG]

Does Elon Musk have A LOT of money?

[IMG]https://www.thesouthafrican.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/09/Rich-list-28-Sept.jpg[/IMG]

[QUOTE=TheGoatest;14664771][IMG]https://images4.imagebam.com/c7/e8/8e/MEE4DNN_o.png[/IMG]

Does Elon Musk have A LOT of money?

[IMG]https://www.thesouthafrican.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/09/Rich-list-28-Sept.jpg[/IMG][/QUOTE]

Oh shit.


Rat poison response.

Yes

[QUOTE=8Ball;14664768]LeBron is the Greatest scorer.

About to surpass Kareem as the all time leading scorer of all time, and that is Kareem's [B][I][U]career magnus opus[/U][/I][/B]. Kareem has won 6 championships and 6 MVPs and nobody talks about those achievements.[/QUOTE]


Scoring less for longer doesn't really mean anything or reflect scoring ability.

Reggie Miller scored 3000 more points than Bird but no one thinks Miller was a better scorer than Bird or anywhere near

and the WAY a player scores matter the same as how MUCH they score..

Specifically, ball-dominators can't carry the scoring load against top teams (too ball-dominant) and therefore need all-time scoring help.. They also can't win organically because they lack the fits/chemistry and teammate development (they impose spot-up roles that stall young players), nor can they achieve the highest team ceilngs (weak Finals records), command doubles or limit turnovers (westbrooking)

So no

Yes

[QUOTE=3ba11;14664774]Scoring less for longer doesn't really mean anything or reflect scoring ability.

Reggie Miller scored 3000 more points than Bird but no one thinks Miller was a better scorer than Bird or anywhere near

and the WAY a player scores matter the same as how MUCH they score..

Specifically, ball-dominators can't carry the scoring load against top teams (too ball-dominant) and therefore need all-time scoring help.. They also can't win organically because they lack the fits/chemistry and teammate development (they impose spot-up roles that stall young players), nor can they achieve the highest team ceilngs (weak Finals records), command doubles or limit turnovers (westbrooking)

So no[/QUOTE]

Kareem has 6 MVPs, nobody cares.
Kareem has 6 championships, nobody cares.

Kareem's all time scoring record = Most sought after record.

No the guy who has the 5th highest scoring average in the history of the NBA, along with 3 seasons of 30 or more PPG and a scoring title, is a terrible scorer. Obviously.

[QUOTE=8Ball;14664776]Kareem has 6 MVPs, nobody cares.
Kareem has 6 championships, nobody cares.

Kareem's all time scoring record = Most sought after record.[/QUOTE]


Kareem...... 6 rings.... #1 scoring..... #3 rebounds
Lebron....... 4 rings.... #1 scoring..... #6 assists


^^^ so we know that Lebron isn't goat because Kareem's superior achievement wasn't goat

logic gonna logic

[QUOTE=RRR3;14664779]No the guy who has the 5th highest scoring average in the history of the NBA, along with 3 seasons of 30 or more PPG and a scoring title, is a terrible scorer. Obviously.[/QUOTE]


the WAY a player scores matter the same as how MUCH they score..

Specifically, ball-dominators can't carry the scoring load against top teams (too ball-dominant) and therefore need all-time scoring help - they literally need more help like kareem, AD or Wade and can't win with secondary producers like Wiggins or Pippen that require the 1st option to carry the scoring load.

GM's must find expensive, star scoring help for ball-dominators, while expert jumpshooters like Curry or MJ (that can carry the scoring load) allow GM's to build a team of cheap defenders .

furthermore, ball-dominators can't win organically because they lack the fits and teammate development (they impose spot-up roles that stall young players), nor can they achieve the highest team ceilngs (weak Finals records due to weak brand).. nor can they command doubles or limit turnovers (westbrooking)

He ight.

No. LeBron is the only player in the top 20 (yeah I atleast put him in the top 20) to possess an unwillingness to take contested jumpers. Imo to be a great scorer you have to take contested jumpers and hit them at a reasonable rate.

Depends on what you value in a basketball player. Lebron is all about quantity, not quality.

[QUOTE=8Ball;14664776]Kareem has 6 MVPs, nobody cares.
Kareem has 6 championships, nobody cares.

Kareem's all time scoring record = Most sought after record.[/QUOTE]

Except that Kareem is ahead of Lebron all time and still will be even after Bronie passes up his longevity record. :lol

Kareem = top 5
Bronie = fringe top 10

Calling Lebron the greatest scorer of all time is just silliness. Nobody takes that kind of hyperbole seriously.

However, he has averaged something like 27ppg for his career, so he's clearly a great scorer.

Yes

The point of the game is to put the ball into the basket more often than your opponent. How Lebron does it doesn't matter he puts it into the basket at a higher rate than almost anyone in the league ever.

I don't like his style of play, but that doesn't matter. He's undeniably one of the greatest scorers ever.

[QUOTE=Overdrive;14664829]The point of the game is to put the ball into the basket more often than your opponent. How Lebron does it doesn't matter he puts it into the basket at a higher rate than almost anyone in the league ever.

I don't like his style of play, but that doesn't matter. He's undeniably one of the greatest scorers ever.[/QUOTE]

89 Pippen

[QUOTE=RRR3;14664833]89 Pippen[/QUOTE]

What about '89 Pippen?

[QUOTE=Overdrive;14664839]What about '89 Pippen?[/QUOTE]
3ball always talks about him lol

Makes sense...in his 19 seasons or whatever, has he actually ever had a young side kick that developed next to him?

No...partly because he either trades them away at the start...or he diminishes their growth.

What kind of retarded thread is this? You are seriously asking if a player who is 5th all-time in PPG on great efficiency is a great scorer?

This is who Bron haters label as the smartest guy on ISH? LOL. If that's the guy you look up to, it just shows most Bron haters here are really low IQ.

[QUOTE=1987_Lakers;14664856]What kind of retarded thread is this? You are seriously asking if a player who is 5th all-time in PPG on great efficiency is a great scorer?

This is who Bron haters label as the smartest guy on ISH? LOL. If that's the guy you look up to, it just shows most Bron haters here are really low IQ.[/QUOTE]
And he has once again backed himself into a corner where LeBron, who’s not a great scorer according to him, averages more ppg than literally everybody in his top 10 besides Jordan :lol Which means for the guy who’s entire arguments boil down to ppg and scoring, 9 of the players in his top 10 are not great scorers according to him.

Bronie logic...

Karl Malone has more career points than MJ so obviously he's the better scorer.

:facepalm

[QUOTE=SouBeachTalents;14664859]And he has once again backed himself into a corner where LeBron, who’s not a great scorer according to him, averages more ppg than literally everybody in his top 10 besides Jordan :lol Which means for the guy who’s entire arguments boil down to ppg and scoring, 9 of the players in his top 10 are not great scorers according to him.[/QUOTE]


Ball-dominators like Lebron can't win while carrying the scoring load against top teams (too ball-dominant) and therefore need all-time scoring help

It's literally a shit brand of ball that needs a ton of scoring help (needs goat help) yet STILL has a lottery record on the championship level

Unlike expert jumpshooters (Curry, MJ), ball-dominators like Lebron lack the efficiency, brand of ball and elite jumpshooting skill to defeat maximum defensive attention (carry scoring load in Finals) - the inability of ball-dominators to successfully carry the scoring load against top teams requires goat scoring help like Kareem or Wade and cannot win with secondary producers like Wiggins or Pippen.

Ultimately, GM's love to build teams with cheap defenders but this requires a 1st option that can carry the scoring load like Curry or MJ, whereas Lebron forces GM's to find expensive scoring help to support his inferior brand of ball.

[QUOTE=Full Court;14664822]Calling Lebron the greatest scorer of all time is just silliness. Nobody takes that kind of hyperbole seriously.

However, he has averaged something like 27ppg for his career, so he's clearly a great scorer.[/QUOTE]

Yep

[QUOTE=Full Court;14664822]Calling Lebron the greatest scorer of all time is just silliness. Nobody takes that kind of hyperbole seriously.

However, he has averaged something like 27ppg for his career, so he's clearly a great scorer.[/QUOTE]


If a player needs to be the biggest ball-dominator EVER.... and the biggest turnover machine EVER.... and yield an inferior brand of ball that 1) has a lottery record on the championship level REGARDLESS OF CAST and 2) turns favored talent (preseason favorite) into underdog or loser for 6 straight years (11-16')

than who gives a shit about his scoring.. :confusedshrug:.

Lebron was just another 1-trick pony like Iverson or Dwight and just another losing ball-dominator like CP3 or Luka until the "decision" to manufacture a resume

He was just like those guys until he decided to consolidate power in the conference by teaming up with the top 2 first options in the conference

He literally hand-picked the preseason favorite for 6 straight years (11-16') but then complained about "comp" after his favored teams fell to Finals underdog or loser all 6 years (weak brand of ball).. However, the "comp" argument doesn't work for the preseason favorite, since that rewards underachieving the expectation.. Lebron had the preseason favorite in 2016, so he should've been flirting with 70 wins like expert jumpershooters Curry & Kawhi (better brands of ball = higher team ceiling).

OP is the Lebron James of ISH.

I look at Lebron like Perimeter Shaq. Both guys mastered scoring consistently 6-8 points a quarter and had their fair share of 15-24 point quarters.

Lebron is a great scorer. Averaged 20PPG in a slower paced league as a rookie and adjusted as the league sped up. A guy who has averaged 27 consistenty and has been averaged 30+ in his 20's and also 30's can't deny his ability to score the ball.

He's a not a greater scorer than Kobe, MJ, or KD.

Yes.

Yes. He is not a pretty scorer but he is effective.

Imagine being a good scorer while not being a ballhog at the same time, unlike op's true hero. That's king kong for you.

One of the best to ever do it.

Does the bear sh*t in the woods?

Is the Pope catholic?

Is Goateets the village idiot?

No, he's a really good scorer who happens to have the greatest longevity. There's literally been a better scorer 18 of the 19 years he's played.

[QUOTE=RogueBorg;14665338]No, he's a really good scorer who happens to have the greatest longevity. There's literally been a better scorer 18 of the 19 years he's played.[/QUOTE]

So you have to be the BEST scorer to be a GREAT scorer?

[QUOTE=RogueBorg;14665338]No, he's a really good scorer who happens to have the greatest longevity. There's literally been a better scorer 18 of the 19 years he's played.[/QUOTE]
How is someone who’s been the best scorer in the league statistically even if only once not a great scorer? That makes zero sense. Are you retarded?

[QUOTE=ShawkFactory;14665341]So you have to be the BEST scorer to be a GREAT scorer?[/QUOTE]

He has 2 moves, the three (which he's not very good at for how important it is to todays game) and the stiff-arm drive to the basket. He cannot dribble and pull up to hit the jumper like KD can. He doesn't have the post up game up MJ or Kobe, and has almost no mid-range game to speak of.

[QUOTE=RRR3;14665343]How is someone who’s been the best scorer in the league statistically even if only once not a great scorer? That makes zero sense. Are you retarded?[/QUOTE]

He's not good shooting threes and has one move and that's going to the basket. He is not a great scorer.

A great scorer should have more than 1 scoring title.