Printable View
Wasn't Draymond on his way to win FMVP if the warriors won in 2016?
I don't know why you always devalue defensive players.
NBA teams already tried your method of all scoring players with no defense (KD's Nets & Suns teams), and they failed miserably.
[QUOTE=1987_Lakers;15029171]Wasn't Draymond on his way to win FMVP if the warriors won in 2016?
I don't know why you always devalue defensive players.
NBA teams already tried your method of all scoring players with no defense (KD's Nets & Suns teams), and they failed miserably.[/QUOTE]
[URL="http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?489427-Breaking-The-Houston-Rockets-are-trading-James-Harden-to-the-Brooklyn-Nets&p=14226806&viewfull=1#post14226806"]http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?489427-Breaking-The-Houston-Rockets-are-trading-James-Harden-to-the-Brooklyn-Nets&p=14226806&viewfull=1#post14226806[/URL]
He also predicted the Suns would win the title in 2024 when they got swept in the first round :lol Just absolutely clueless about basketball.
[QUOTE=1987_Lakers;15029171]Wasn't Draymond on his way to win FMVP if the warriors won in 2016?
I don't know why you always devalue defensive players.
NBA teams already tried your method of all scoring players with no defense (KD's Nets & Sun's teams), and they failed miserably.[/QUOTE]
You're purposefully misunderstanding the points being made so you can hold onto false beliefs that you were told by someone on TV
First of all, my method isn't an all-scoring team... My method and every GM's dream is to get a player like Curry, Kobe or MJ that can carry the "star" category of scoring, thereby allowing GM's to fill out the roster with cheap defenders - this is a GM's dream, as opposed to having a guy that can't carry the scoring load and therefore needs a bunch of expensive star help..
In this case, it's common knowledge that excessive ball-domination can't beat top teams, so Lebron can't carry the scoring load against top teams.. This inability to carry the star category of scoring requires more stars, which prevents GM's from getting the right defenders/others, aka elite roster construction.. Without elite roster construction, Lebron can't win with normal rosters of 1 franchise player, aka organic.
Secondly, guys like Lebron would never be able to play with non-scorers like Rodman or Draymond - this is common knowledge.. Bron-ball needs a ton of scoring help, so it can't go 4 on 5.
Thirdly, bringing up low usage/low FGA players makes my point that the Warriors were a 1-man team.. Draymond was just a role player that was lucky to land in a goat system that Curry's skillet allowed
Low usage/low FGA players like Draymond only have positive plus/minus on winning teams... On a losing team, Draymond is a big negative - he simply got a good slot in the goat system... It's similar to Kukoc being 4th in the league in plus/minus but then -300 in 1999 without the system
[QUOTE=1987_Lakers;15029171]Wasn't Draymond on his way to win FMVP if the warriors won in 2016?
[/Quote]
No because a Draymond-led team is a weak team - Dray needs to be at 5th or 6th option for a team to be any good, let alone 73 wins..
And the fact that Dray was the scoring leader instead of Klay further boosts my point about Klay (< 09' Mo).
In addition to Klay's ineptness, the reason the Warriors were so depleted by Game 7 is because of Curry's surgically-repaired MCL, which needed a rest after his hero-job against OKC... Meanwhile, Dray's suspension shut off the most well-oiled machine of all-time, and there simply wasn't enough time to get the engine back up to speed .. They had just enough gas in the tank for 73 wins + title, but the Dray suspension left then with an empty tank and job unfinished.. That's also partly why Dray was more motivated than anyone in Game 7 - it probably ruined their normal chemistry - again, they needed a little more time to get the engine back revving to full speed
[QUOTE=3ba11;15029185]No because a Draymond-led team is a weak team - Dray needs to be at 5th or 6th option for a team to be any good, let alone 73 wins..
And the fact that Dray was the scoring leader instead of Klay further boosts my point about Klay (< 09' Mo).
In addition to Klay's ineptness, the reason the Warriors were so depleted by Game 7 is because of Curry's surgically-repaired MCL, which needed a rest after his hero-job against OKC... Meanwhile, Dray's suspension shut off the most well-oiled machine of all-time, and there simply wasn't enough time to get the engine back up to speed .. They had just enough gas in the tank for 73 wins + title, but the Dray suspension left then with an empty tank and job unfinished.. That's also partly why Dray was more motivated than anyone in Game 7 - it probably ruined their normal chemistry - again, they needed a little more time to get the engine back revving to full speed[/QUOTE]
They just ran into the GOAT
[IMG]https://i.pinimg.com/736x/b3/75/c7/b375c7a409b2c1eaafcf56ef23a110b3--lebron-james-stats-nba-finals-.jpg[/IMG]
[img]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ClArCksWQAQ_EqP.jpg[/img]
[SIZE=4]Imagine if Mathurin dominated SGA, or Pippen dominated FMVP Barkley - it's impossible to lose when your sidekick dominates the current MVP - destroying the MVP is the most help possible, and Lebron is the only guy that ever had this kind of help..[/SIZE]
The only reason the Cavs were down 1-3 is because Lebron wet the bed through 4 games (24 and 6 TO's per game).. That's the only reason a big 3 preseason favorite was losing to a 1-man team.. Lebron had a team with 3 franchise players versus a 1-man team that was carried to 70 wins, despite a sidekick that under-produced 09' Mo or Hornacek..
[QUOTE=SouBeachTalents;15029186]They just ran into the GOAT
[IMG]https://i.pinimg.com/736x/b3/75/c7/b375c7a409b2c1eaafcf56ef23a110b3--lebron-james-stats-nba-finals-.jpg[/IMG][/QUOTE]
^^^ baby-brained
It's called a statistical anomaly and a meaningless footnote in history.
Lebron had teammates match him in every category, so he [i]never CARRIED any category[/i].. It isn't even optimal to lead role player categories like rebounding, since teams want their role players doing the role player stuff.. Otoh, the ultimate carry-job is carrying the "star" category of scoring, thereby needing less stars and winning with cheap defenders/others, while facing max defensive attention (carrying scoring load)..
Accordingly, all of Jordan Finals destroy Lebron's, especially Jordan's 41.0 ppg in the 93' Finals while facing "all eyes on me" defensive attention (carrying scoring load) in a slower-paced series - this is far superior to Lebron's 29.7 ppg, while having an equal-scoring partner to attract equal defensive attention and CLOSE.. It's night and day.
Defeating max defensive attention (carrying scoring load) > defeating HALF defensive attention (equal-scoring partner & CLOSER)
Who were the Warriors Cheap defenders?
Klay, Draymond, Iggy and Bogut all cost more against the cap than Curry did in 2016.
Here's a thought - they were far more than "defensive" players.
[QUOTE=Carbine;15029221]Who were the Warriors Cheap defenders?
Klay, Draymond, Iggy and Bogut all cost more against the cap than Curry did in 2016.
Here's a thought - they were far more than "defensive" players.[/QUOTE]
Generally, the category with the biggest correlation to higher salaries is scoring - it's the "star" category... And..
* Bogut = Big Z or Ben Wallace
31 year old Iggy (1x all-star) = 31-year old Szczerbiak (1x all-star) -
* Klay < 09' Mo and easily Jamison
* DraySystem Green = all defensive heady Varejao or Ben Wallace, or even old Shaq
So again, "the phrase" 73-win team" implies a stacked team, which robs Curry of having the carry-job and 1-man teams that 07' Dirk or 09' Lebron got credit for (despite higher-producing teammates)... Curry was the only unanimous MVP ever FOR A REASON (1-man team)
[QUOTE=3ba11;15029224]Generally, the category with the biggest correlation to higher salaries is scoring - it's the "star" category... And..
* Bogut = Big Z or Ben Wallace
31 year old Iggy (1x all-star) = 31-year old Szczerbiak (1x all-star) -
* Klay < 09' Mo and easily Jamison
* DraySystem Green = all defensive heady Varejao or Ben Wallace, or even old Shaq
So again, "the phrase" 73-win team" implies a stacked team, which robs Curry of having the carry-job and 1-man teams that 07' Dirk or 09' Lebron got credit for (despite higher-producing teammates)... Curry was the only unanimous MVP ever FOR A REASON (1-man team)[/QUOTE]
I think this is genuinely the worst post of the year.
[QUOTE=SouBeachTalents;15029289]I think this is genuinely the worst post of the year.[/QUOTE]
The only difference between the teams is that Curry's off-ball game and ball movement chemistry allowed a goat system that elevated Iggy, Bogut, and Dray, while Lebron's ball-domination reduced Zydrunas, Varejao, Szczerbiak, Delonte, Jamison and others.. Otherwise, Zydrunas was comparable to Bogut, or Jamison easily better than Klay, or Varejao and Mo compare to Iggy and Dray... System-ball and winning simply makes Curry's teammates seem better than Lebron imposing spot-up roles and losing upon everyone
.
Thread Cliffs
Saying that Jamison/Shaq were added to a 66-win league favorite robs Lebron of the carry-job in 09', while saying that KD was added to a 73-win team robs Curry of his carry-job despite lesser-producing teammates than 09' Lebron or 07' Dirk (stats in OP).. Accordingly, the proper way to say it is that "KD was added to a 1-man team that won 73 games".
This response was necessary because a "normal" roster of 1 franchise player can't compete with a super-team of 3 franchise players, and a +2800 preseason roster can't compete with someone that assembled a record 6 straight preseason favorites (the previous record was 3 straight)..
The point was that the term "66-win team" implies that the 09' Cavs were a stacked team - that's the point... Same thing with "73-win team" even though Curry's high usage teammates (Klay )were lower producers than Lebron's (Mo)