Most popular athlete IN THE WORLD ever to wear no. 23: Jordan or Beckham?

[QUOTE=Knoe Itawl]Most of Beckhams' fame comes from the media hype of him, not because the average American gives a shyt about soccer or watches his games. Please.[/QUOTE]

it's still the fame, one way or the other.

in fact that's the biggest reason beckham is much more famous than many players who are higher on the GOAT list. he goes far beyond football. he's the half of the second most famous celebrity couple in the world. he is sex and fashion icon. he's famous for sake of being famous, just like paris hilton. and the important difference is - he appeals to women more than any athlete ever. and women consist more than half of the world.

that's the reason he is probably more famous than football GOATs like pele, maradona, ronaldo, zizou and so on. and i definitely think, more than jordan too. jordan transcended the basketball and took it to the different level - but he still can't compete with the world cup or champions league finals.

[QUOTE=yobore]Are these based on fact because I'm surprised to see Hitler and no Stalin. I have met a Vietnamese man who didn't know of Hitler I was kind of surprised but then if a country doesn't have do much world history and the kids don't go to school it doesn't surprise me. Because the regions they influenced I wouldn't surprised if Stalin is more famous than Hitler. SE Asia and the istans didn't have any contact with Hitler and poorer countries typically don't have as much attention to world history.

I also really doubt Mohammad Ali is that well known don't know what kind of study that was.[/QUOTE]

Mohammad Ali is not famous at all however Muhammad Ali is still one of the most recogonizable faces in the world and at his apex was far more well known around the globe than Michael Jordan ever was, it's not even close

One thing people are overlooking when they cite the Air Jordan brand as evidence that MJ is more globally known is that many people wearing the Jordan brand now have no idea who Michael Jordan even is. It is its own standalone sports fashion label. Kind of like Polo. Few people could pick Ralph Lauren out of a crowd on the sidewalk, but his name is everywhere w/ Polo Ralph Lauren. Lacoste/Izod lost favor in the US, but it's still big in the rest of the world. 1 in 100 people who wear Lacoste clothing are aware that a French tennis player named Rene Lacoste is the man behind the brand. Jordan is entering that kind of territory. You don't see Michael Jordan popping up in non-North American news articles anymore because he is not as relevant to today's news. The media is searching for the lowest common denominator, so a Chinese or Japanese, or Indian, or French media outlet does not care where he ate dinner. He's no longer an entertainer, but only a business man.

Many of you will not believe this because this is a North American web site and Beckham's awareness and popularity is lower in N America than anywhere else in the world, while Jordan's is higher here than anywhere else in the world. The fact that this argument is still close in a basketball message board from the US should tell you something: it's Beckham and it's not even close.

[QUOTE=Sharas]it's still the fame, one way or the other.

in fact that's the biggest reason beckham is much more famous than many players who are higher on the GOAT list. he goes far beyond football. he's the half of the second most famous celebrity couple in the world. he is sex and fashion icon. he's famous for sake of being famous, just like paris hilton. and the important difference is - he appeals to women more than any athlete ever. and women consist more than half of the world.

that's the reason he is probably more famous than football GOATs like pele, maradona, ronaldo, zizou and so on. and i definitely think, more than jordan too. jordan transcended the basketball and took it to the different level - but he still can't compete with the world cup or champions league finals.[/QUOTE]


id actually say its easier to become famous today then it was when jordan was at his peak. no disrespect to beckham, but it is a lot easier for him. i mean think of all the people that are popular that have accomplished absolutely NOTHING... the people on the hills, paris hilton, the karasidian wh0res, brooke hogan, anyone on american idol etc, etc etc. now i am not comparing beckham to those people. ill admit, i now jack crap about soccer. i know he has accomplished a lot. but his accomplishments came in a time where people with NO accomplishments can become famous. im sure he would be famous regardless, very famous even, but its hard to compare when jordans peak ended in 1998 when the world of internet blogging, message boards, etc, etc didnt exist. even then jordan was widely popular.

[QUOTE=Kblaze8855]When I really think about it...is Jordan more famous in his time than Joe Louis in his? In America that is. technology gives more worldwide access to modern guys but hearing about Joe makes me think he may have been bigger here. As popular as Jordan was you wont have damn near all of america sit down to watch/listen(as the case may be at the time) to his games. I dont think anyone modern can approach the level of interest over the Joe Louis/Max Schmeling fight. Hearing about the level of interest....entire towns meeting in one place with dozens of radios so everyone could hear? Nationwide parties after Joe won? Joe Louis, Muhammad Ali, Babe Ruth, and guys like that were probably as big as Jordan for the people who had access to them.[/QUOTE]

When Joe Louis fought, the United States came to a stand still, families all around the country, black, white-whatever were glued around the radio, if they didn't have one they went to the neighbors who did. There were crowds of people listening to the radio on the streets-in front of stores, in bars-wherever listening to the fight, there is no comparison. It was not a boxing or sporting event, it was a national "holiday" for those few hours.

[QUOTE=Chicago76]One thing people are overlooking when they cite the Air Jordan brand as evidence that MJ is more globally known is that many people wearing the Jordan brand now have no idea who Michael Jordan even is. It is its own standalone sports fashion label. Kind of like Polo. Few people could pick Ralph Lauren out of a crowd on the sidewalk, but his name is everywhere w/ Polo Ralph Lauren. Lacoste/Izod lost favor in the US, but it's still big in the rest of the world. 1 in 100 people who wear Lacoste clothing are aware that a French tennis player named Rene Lacoste is the man behind the brand. Jordan is entering that kind of territory. You don't see Michael Jordan popping up in non-North American news articles anymore because he is not as relevant to today's news. The media is searching for the lowest common denominator, so a Chinese or Japanese, or Indian, or French media outlet does not care where he ate dinner. He's no longer an entertainer, but only a business man.

Many of you will not believe this because this is a North American web site and Beckham's awareness and popularity is lower in N America than anywhere else in the world, while Jordan's is higher here than anywhere else in the world. The fact that this argument is still close in a basketball message board from the US should tell you something: [B] it's Beckham and it's not even close[/B].[/QUOTE]

:rockon: :rockon: :rockon:

I can't imagine David Beckham being more popular than Michael Jordan. No one here know for sure, of course, but I would think Pele, Maradona or even Ronaldo is currently more famous than Beckham. This is due to England never winning the world cup in Beckham's era. He would be far more popular if they did.

Anyways, the other MJ and is more popular than both Jordan and Beckham. Also, Mike Tyson is currently more famous than Muhammad Ali :D

[QUOTE=gotbacon23][B]id actually say its easier to become famous today then it was when jordan was at his peak[/B]. no disrespect to beckham, but it is a lot easier for him. i mean think of all the people that are popular that have accomplished absolutely NOTHING... the people on the hills, paris hilton, the karasidian wh0res, brooke hogan, anyone on american idol etc, etc etc. now i am not comparing beckham to those people. ill admit, i now jack crap about soccer. i know he has accomplished a lot. but his accomplishments came in a time where people with NO accomplishments can become famous. im sure he would be famous regardless, very famous even, but its hard to compare when jordans peak ended in 1998 when the world of internet blogging, message boards, etc, etc didnt exist. even then jordan was widely popular.[/QUOTE]

OK, i'd say that's definitely true, i think some people even already mentioned that on the pages before. the hype machine is getting stronger by the day, and beckham benefited from it like very few others. that's basically what allowed him to venture so successfully into non-sport areas of life and become basically more famous that GOATs of the football. (while he was top 3-5 in the world for a few years, some people even proclaimed him #1 for a time, although i myself don't think so, he definitely isn't in GOATs discussions)

[QUOTE]Yes it actually does because there's no way you can argue any of those points. [/QUOTE]

Then why am I doing so?

[QUOTE]Technically, Jordan is 5 years past retirement. He's big, no doubt. Not arguing that. But 2 million and 400 internet results more speak more than anything I can say. And of course, soccer being so much popular in parts of the world that aren't technologically up to date makes that even more lopsided. And oh yeah, Beckham isn't at the height of his fame either. [/QUOTE]

First of all, he's 10 years past retirement at the height of his fame. BECKHAM IS STILL PLAYING, AND IS AT THE HEIGHT OF HIS FAME. Yet he doesn't trail Jordan all that considerably, all things considered.

But anyway, I already explained why you can't use Google hits as an indicator since it doesn't take into account those that don't have the Internet, nor those that know Jordan but don't do google hits on him.

Even so, the difference in hits considering the stages in their careers actually helps my argument more than it does yours.


[QUOTE]So what, we"ll take your opinion based on speaking to 10 people about only one of them, that being Jordan over the general statistics of how popular soccer and basketball are in those parts of the world and who naturally people are more likely to know, that of course being Beckham? Not to mention, the people you spoke to probably spoke English and I suppose in way represented the majority? Yeah...[/QUOTE]

The point, my intellectually challenged friend, is that I have been in the Arab world, know Arabs and your suggestion that his fame is diminished there is patently false. But since you have travelled there extensively and know about the culture, why don't you tell me all about it?

[QUOTE]Duh, that's the point. No one gives a **** about soccer. Doesn't affect Beckham's popularity. Still is enormous. Why? Because he's David freaking Beckham and everybody care about him. If there's so much media hype as you say and there is, even more in fact, isn't there a high demand as well? Beckham isn't popular for being a great soccer player. He's mainstream popular for everything. He's a celebrity. An entertainment juggernaut. All of it. Even in the USA[/QUOTE]

First of all, Jordan's popularity and fame far trancended basketball. How else do you think he became one of the most famous people in history, and at one time the most famous person in the world by playing a sport that is NOT the biggest in the world? THINK. That says something right there.

Your problem is that you're talking based on what you THINK, rather than what actually IS.

LOL, I'm going to post this on a soccer board, just flat out do a V Unit and copy paste the whole OP. Let's see what they say.

[QUOTE=Knoe Itawl]Then why am I doing so?



First of all, he's 10 years past retirement at the height of his fame. BECKHAM IS STILL PLAYING, AND IS AT THE HEIGHT OF HIS FAME. Yet he doesn't trail Jordan all that considerably, all things considered.

But anyway, I already explained why you can't use Google hits as an indicator since it doesn't take into account those that don't have the Internet, nor those that know Jordan but don't do google hits on him.

Even so, the difference in hits considering the stages in their careers actually helps my argument more than it does yours.




The point, my intellectually challenged friend, is that I have been in the Arab world, know Arabs and your suggestion that his fame is diminished there is patently false. But since you have travelled there extensively and know about the culture, why don't you tell me all about it?



First of all, Jordan's popularity and fame far trancended basketball. How else do you think he became one of the most famous people in history, and at one time the most famous person in the world by playing a sport that is NOT the biggest in the world? THINK. That says something right there.
[B]
Your problem is that you're talking based on what you THINK, rather than what actually IS.[/B][/QUOTE]

Amazing. :roll:
So why don't you actually explain the part where you say that google doesn't take into account people that don't use internet, which is true but why don't you explain the part that those folks are so much more likely to know Beckham that it's not even funny? And lol, doesn't take into account those who have internet but don't search for Jordan? LOL, there are only those who know Jordan but don't search for him? So I guess it's no other way around, everyone who knows Beckham search for him, right? Hilarious.

And why the hell would I talk about what I know about Arab world, that would in fact be me, doing what you said I do, say what I know and not what it is. So yeah, since that is blatantly incorrect I won't do that...my intellectually challenged friend. What I do know however that soccer, just like most the world is the most popular sport there while basketball really isn't big. That I know. That is.

So keep ignoring everything, keep ignoring google that shows the overwhelming difference of 2.5 million more results for Beckham, keep ignoring the size of soccer audience, keep ignoring the internetless part of the world favoring Beckham in this debate, keep ignoring the appeal to women, keep ignoring the mainstream recognition, the ratings of world cup, champions league compared to that of the NBA and so on. It isn't close. Deal with it. Beckham > Jordan. Regardless of what you want to think is true and defy any common sense and every other proof put in front of you to make it look as it's true.

I can't believe this is still being discussed. MJ was the most popular athlete in the world to a level that has never been matched, certainly not by Beckham, who isn't really more popular than many players of his own era like Ronaldinho, Zidane, and the Ronaldos. I think the thing is when people say "the world" means UK and Western Europe (though in most of Europe Zidane and Ronaldo was/are as or more popular). In fact the world includes other places like Asia and Africa, where generally, even in countries where soccer dominates, MJ is much more well known and popular than Beckham.

I will settle this once and for all with one question.

what was a better movie: space jam or bend it like beckham?

these debates can be resolved so simply.

And one more thing since I"ll know you"ll bring up "Jordan was at the top of his fame in 98". Beckham practically retired from soccer as well. I mean, playing in America, not playing for his national team, it's as if he's retired. I mean, it's like Scottie Pippen playing in Sweden. What's his status? Retired. It's like it doesn't matter that he's playing.
But thats just the thing. Beckham doesn't need to play, be in his prime or whatever. He's famous and known for reasons beyond that. So being practically retired, he's still one of the hottest celebrities. How's that? You rarely see or hear about Jordan, other than America, even more so. Beckham? All around the world aya ya ya... Even if he still isn't relevant to the soccer world. That's one of many differences in favor of David Beckham over Michael Jordan.

[QUOTE=gotbacon23]I will settle this once and for all with one question.

what was a better movie: space jam or bend it like beckham?

these debates can be resolved so simply.[/QUOTE]

Beckham still didn't really have a movie. If some day he does, most say he's eying Hollywood, of course it"ll be bigger and more publicized than anything Jordan's ever done in that venture because Beckham is so much bigger as far as entertainment goes. That of course being the USA, we're talking about, the place where MJ's bigger than everywhere else and soccer smaller than anywhere else. Well, Becks still trumps MJ, of course.