Kobe 360 dunk at 2011 Kobe Academy

[QUOTE=tpols]When did I say defenders 'gladly give' him a jumper? I said they stay about 2 feet off of him when he has the ball in the triple threat.. It is by no means an open jumper, but it is more space than what Kobe gets. Kobe this past season didn't have the athleticism to get much separation off of his man.. the large majority of midrange shots he took came out of the post and they were fadeaways because he had a man right up against him. Lebron NEVER has to take fade aways because his man is always a foot or two off of him. Jesus Christ man, are you serious with this shit?[/QUOTE]

It's crazy. Honestly, I'm just trying to figure out why he (and other crazy ass people on this forum) believe the shit they do.

TMac past his prime, big deal it means nothing.

[url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UX8CCMKVulQ&feature=fvst[/url]

[url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fhT5tZucGsQ[/url]

Kobe is more determined though, obviously.
Nice dunk either way, still skeptical how a full season will take its toll.

[QUOTE=catch24]Bullsh*t. There's much more air space for LeBron because of his ability to take it to the basket[/quote]

This is just not true anymore. LeBron's no more capable of breaking a defense down in the half-court today than Kobe is. He's a much more effective finisher ONCE he gets in there because of superior leaping ability and size, but as a threat to penetrate? They're essentially the same. Thus nobody backing off of LeBron anymore, that and the fact that he's simply a much better shooter today than he used to be.

[quote]Then you factor in FT shooting and 3PT shooting. Since the disparity in FT %'s larger, Kobe wins by at least 7% (could be 6% -- I already forgot the percentages).[/quote]

You're factoring in FT% way too much, considering 07-11 Kobe and 10-11 LeBron's numbers are mostly a wash from 10-23 feet. There are plenty of scorers out there who shot a TON better than 10-11 Kobe from the FT line - Nowitzki, Billups, Durant, Ray Allen, Nash, CP3 - do you consider them [i]on a different level than Kobe[/i] as shooters too?

And again, LeBron enjoys a humongous 8%+ edge from the area Kobe RELIES most on in order to score. That makes up for the FT edge Kobe has.

[quote]If we are talking about this season, you're right, I shouldn't have overstated.[/QUOTE]

Not just this season, but any season of Kobe's career compared to 10-11 LeBron. Safe to assume the numbers charted on hoopdata are the best of Kobe's career, and considering 10-11 LeBron compares very well against them, your original comment couldn't have been more off.

[QUOTE=Indian guy] LeBron's no more capable of breaking a defense down in the half-court today than Kobe is. [/QUOTE]
:roll:
Aigt I'm out.. I've seen it all now.

[URL="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y3LDFhZYNQw"]Another angle[/URL]

[QUOTE=Indian guy]This is just not true anymore. LeBron's no more capable of breaking a defense down in the half-court today than Kobe is. He's a much more effective finisher ONCE he gets in there because of superior leaping ability and size, but as a threat to penetrate? They're essentially the same. Thus nobody backing off of LeBron anymore, that and the fact that he's simply a much better shooter today than he used to be.[/quote]

You do realize Kobe is 32 and LeBron is 26, right? You do understand that Kobe has way more mileage than LeBron does, right?

I may joke on here and other places..but this crap is inexcusable. You are flat out nuts to really think LeBron is no more capable of breaking down a defense in the half court.


[quote]You're factoring in FT% way too much, considering 07-11 Kobe and 10-11 LeBron's numbers are mostly a wash from 10-23 feet. There are plenty of scorers out there who shot a TON better than 10-11 Kobe from the FT line - Nowitzki, Billups, Durant, Ray Allen, Nash, CP3 - do you consider them [i]on a different level than Kobe[/i] as shooters too?[/quote]

No I'm not. They cancel each other out from 10-15/16-23FT, that leaves us with 3PT and Freethrow shooting. LeBron shoots 1% better from 3; Kobe shoots 7% better from the line. As I said, about a 6% difference.

I consider Durant, Dirk, Allen, Nash and CP3 all better shooters. Better from midrange and long range is a different story. I've maintained that Kobe is a better all-around shooter than LeBron this entire time.

I'm not gonna continue to debate something that's obvious. Kobe is clearly a better shooter than LeBron. End of story.

damn, kobester looking young in that clip :applause:

lot of pages in this thread, assuming MJ fans are mad their boy couldn't do 360s (there is like one from the '85 dunk contest and it's barely a 180).

[QUOTE=Fatal9]damn, kobester looking young in that clip :applause:

lot of pages in this thread, assuming MJ fans are mad their boy couldn't do 360s (there is like one from the '85 dunk contest and it's barely a 180).[/QUOTE]

Check out Indian Guy's posts and let me know what you think, lol.

Come on! A wide open 360, are standards becoming that low for Kobe now?
It was nice to see him dunk it, but the one over Okafor still impressed me more.

[QUOTE=catch24]You do realize Kobe is 32 and LeBron is 26, right?[/quote]

You also realize LeBron weighs 270+ pounds to Kobe's 210, right?

[quote]I consider Durant, Dirk, Allen, Nash and CP3 all better shooters.[/quote]

But do you consider them on an entirely different level? A case where it's not even close? Taking into account 10-15 FT/16-23 FT/3PT%/FT%, Durant is +5% on Kobe, CP3 +9%, Nash +20%, Ray Allen +22%, Dirk +25%. Would you say there's a FAR bigger difference between these players than there is between Kobe and LeBron?

[quote]Kobe is clearly a better shooter than LeBron.[/QUOTE]

Definitely not as clear as Durant, Dirk, Ray, Nash and CP3 being FAAAAAR better shooters than Kobe. And even if Kobe is better than LeBron, numbers clearly suggest it's very CLOSE and you were completely talking out of your ass to suggest Kobe was [i]on a different level[/i].

[QUOTE=catch24]You do realize Kobe is 32 and LeBron is 26, right? You do understand that Kobe has way more mileage than LeBron does, right?

I may joke on here and other places..but this crap is inexcusable. You are flat out nuts to really think LeBron is no more capable of breaking down a defense in the half court.




No I'm not. They cancel each other out from 10-15/16-23FT, that leaves us with 3PT and Freethrow shooting. LeBron shoots 1% better from 3; Kobe shoots 7% better from the line. As I said, about a 6% difference.

I consider Durant, Dirk, Allen, Nash and CP3 all better shooters. Better from midrange and long range is a different story. I've maintained that Kobe is a better all-around shooter than LeBron this entire time.

I'm not gonna continue to debate something that's obvious. Kobe is clearly a better shooter than LeBron. End of story.[/QUOTE]

Although I am on u'r side...does Kobe really have more mileage than Lebron at the same age....Lebron came in is rookie year and immediately had a huge burden of double teams and was the opposing teams main focus...Kobe had at least 7 seasons without this burdern. Other than that I agree with u 100%

[QUOTE=Indian guy]You also realize LeBron weighs 270+ pounds to Kobe's 210, right?[/quote]

I also recognize Kobe has played in far more finals than LeBron, with at least 7+ more years on him. Apparently you forgot about Kobe going through 2-3 knee surgeries (including arthroscopic--which can be career ending).


[quote]But do you consider them on an entirely different level? A case where it's not even close? Taking into account 10-15 FT/16-23 FT/3PT%/FT%, Durant is +5% on Kobe, CP3 +9%, Nash +20%, Ray Allen +22%, Dirk +25%. Would you say there's a FAR bigger difference between these players than there is between Kobe and LeBron?[/quote]

I consider Dirk, Nash and Ray Allen to be on completely different levels, as shooters, than Kobe and LeBron. CP3 and Durant would be clearly better.

[quote]Definitely not as clear as Durant, Dirk, Ray, Nash and CP3 being FAAAAAR better shooters than Kobe. And even if Kobe is better than LeBron, numbers clearly suggest it's very CLOSE and you were completely talking out of your ass to suggest Kobe was [i]on a different level[/i].[/QUOTE]

lol, you didn't read where admittedly I exaggerated? 6% when you factor defense attention and all the main aspects of shooting is clearly better though. I also consider those guys far better shooters than both Kobe and Lebron. Especially Wade. Your point?

[QUOTE=Calabis]Although I am on u'r side...does Kobe really have more mileage than Lebron at the same age....Lebron came in is rookie year and immediately had a huge burden of double teams and was the opposing teams main focus...Kobe had at least 7 seasons without this burdern. Other than that I agree with u 100%[/QUOTE]

Kobe has been through so many leg/knee surgeries, that I can't say LeBron has similar mileage to Kobe at 32. No way. Plus Kobe has played till June 7 times in his career...

[QUOTE=catch24]Kobe has been through so many leg/knee surgeries, that I can't say LeBron has similar mileage to Kobe at 32. No way. Plus Kobe has played till June 7 times in his career...[/QUOTE]

My bad I misread, I was comparing Kobe and Lebron at same age, didn't know we were talking about 32 year old Kobe, vs prime Lebron.....not fair for Kobe imo.

[QUOTE=catch24]Kobe has been through so many leg/knee surgeries, that I can't say LeBron has similar mileage to Kobe at 32. No way. Plus Kobe has played till June 7 times in his career...[/QUOTE]
Good point.

But Kobe has been having knee troubles ever since the end of 2003.

:(

LeBron's never had any kind of major injury, let alone to like a load barring ligament like the one in Kobe's right knee

And his athleticism is already almost shot.

I mean hell, I saw Kobe even on that bad knee and hurt ankle go around Trevor Ariza quite a few times off the dribble in the playoffs.