OT: The size of earth..........

[QUOTE=Shepseskaf]That's not necessarily so. How do you know that every species outside of Earth is so dissimilar to man that reproduction would be impossible?

Playing the devil's advocate here, its conceivable that another world with similar environmental conditions could give rise to a life form very similar to mankind. Maybe life in the universe isn't as vastly different as we might tend to believe.

Without direct hands-on experience with beings from other planets, that will remain an open question.

Going even deeper, there is more than a hint in a number of ancient documents that the species of man itself is a transplant from other planet - a transplant that was genetically engineered to be more like their "creators." Z. Sitchin promotes that theory in his books.

Still... who were the "sons of God?"[/QUOTE]

for a human to reproduce the gametes have to fuse if they are different species the womens reproductive cells would reject the alien sperm cells. As would her white blood cells and if the alien cells somehoe did fuse the body would expell the fetus(miscarriage). Therefore, the two groups Gods and Man had to be the same species.

[QUOTE=SecondFiddle]for a human to reproduce the gametes have to fuse if they are different species the womens reproductive cells would reject the alien sperm cells. As would her white blood cells and if the alien cells somehoe did fuse the body would expell the fetus(miscarriage). Therefore, the two groups Gods and Man had to be the same species.[/QUOTE]
Again, not necessarily the case. Different species can reproduce. Horses and donkeys make mules. There are other examples of this as well.

That's a pretty simple case, but if one contemplates that the "sons of God" might be extraterrestrials with advanced technology, DNA manipulation have bridged the gap and prevented biological roadblocks to producing children.

This is all highly hypothetical, of course, but I've learned that very few things are "impossible" when viewed outside of their normal paradigms.

[QUOTE=SupermanOnSteroids]which planets and stars does jesus rule?[/QUOTE]
I think his contract with the Earth expires next season, so the Earth becomes free agent

[QUOTE=ShannonElements]I said something similar in a previous post. What do you think the odds are that there's extra-terrestrial life out there somewhere nearly identical to us? one-in-a-googolplex? Well, in terms of the universe, those are actually some pretty decent odds.[/QUOTE]
If mankind along with all life on the Earth were placed here by a Creator, who's to say that entity didn't do the exact same thing in another corner of the universe? Mankind might not be unique. One day, contact might be made by men who bascially look just like us....

Who knows if that will ever happen, but its interesting to think about.

[QUOTE=Shepseskaf]If mankind along with all life on the Earth were placed here by a Creator, who's to say that entity didn't do the exact same thing in another corner of the universe? Mankind might not be unique. One day, contact might be made by men who bascially look just like us....

Who knows if that will ever happen, but its interesting to think about.[/QUOTE]
If there were any other human beings out there, I think they would not look like us at all, look at the apes, they have about 99% of the DNA information in common with us and they are pretty different from us. It would also mean they have had the same weather conditions and their evolution have followed the same way, Anyway, it is a thought that makes me think long about...wouldn' it be nice?:confusedshrug:

[QUOTE=Jerm]The thing is that people have presented miracles to show that this is God at work. Miracles that beat logical explainations. From both the biblical days and present days, miraculous events attributed to the power of God has been reported. This is one reason why billions of people believe that there is a God. You don't need to see him to believe it, all you have to do is experience him in your life. It's funny how countless atheists after coming close to death or contracting a terminal illness suddenly believe that there is a God and go out to experience him instead of asking people to show them God himself.



You do know that due to the distance of certain galaxies from the earth, we see them how they were millions of years ago. Now if man can somehow move at the speed of light or even faster and travel to another galaxy. Chances are that we will expect him to see the earth how it was a million years before his arrival there which is completely ridiculous when you begin to list the implications of a universe with that sort of possibility. A universe where you can experience 2 lives per se.

Now forget about travelling backwards. Let's say you travel forwards in time and see the world a million years later. How can 1 human being age and another won't?...These things do not make sense. It applies to electrons and protons doesn't mean it will apply to a human being ( who is made up of these electrons/protons/neutrons by the way). This is why I insist that time in itself, the period from one moment to another is ****ing independent of matter but the way we measure it isn't. Sometimes science that goes beyong possibilities even when proven right mathematically just can't be true. The earth obeys Newtonian laws for a reason. We don't operate at high speeds because humans aren't subject to time dilation. This is what I think about this subject, it just can't apply to human being because time for us has to be absolute even though how me measure it doesn't have to be. A man can't be ageing while the other one isn't.[/QUOTE]

On one hand you're arguing the existence of god based on no evidence and then you're trying to disprove something of which we do have evidence? Anyway I won't go into the whole god thing but found that bit amusing. (Not your belief in God, just your argument for it. I believe in God so no issues there).

To respond to your other points.
you're saying that if you move at the speed of light or faster we'll be able to see the earth from the past.
Newsflash!
You can't travel faster than light. Which is what you'd need to do if you want to see earth from the past. The light from the past has already left us. Its like a race. Light's leadind the race and you're running behind trying to catch up but you can't catch up, ever. You can't even match speeds, hence you'll likely never be able to see earth's past unless you ended up in a blackhole where that light is trapped, but in that case time dilation would be the least of your problems. Further even if by some miracle you could see earth's past, whats the big deal. You can't affect the events. Its like watching a movie, which is light trapped on film in a sense.

Regarding your second point, atleast you're admitting that time does indeed slow down as speed increases at the quantum level. It does happen at the macroscopic level, as I've said before, it has been proven via experimentation.
The only thing is that for the effect to be noticable we need to be traveling at a much faster speed then we are capable off.

There are also other issues. As speed increase, so does an object's mass requiring more and more energy to make it go faster. There's no telling what would happen to a person once their mass approaches infinity, and since more mass=more energy needed to push it faster, you can't really ever reach that speed anyway.

[QUOTE=ShannonElements]Very interesting indeed. I love thinking about this stuff. Think about this: the universe stretches infinitely in all directions. Once you get past the perimiter of the ever-outwardly-expanding matter which was created in our Big-Bang, maybe 10 trillion googolplex of light years away, there was a similar 'bang', and somewhere within one of its many galaxies is a solar system eerily similar to ours, with a planet that's identical to ours in every way, only the Germans had won World War Two 60+ years ago. Impossible? Not at all. Actually, if the universe is infinite in size, far-fetched ideas like this are actually a mathematical probability. Think of alternate dimmension ideas, but instead of different dimmesions, VAST distances.[/QUOTE]
Interesting indeed. I happen to think that even if two far-flung planets were as identical as could be, and essentially the same life-forms sprang up on both - their histories would be totally different. In other words, there would probably not be a group on the "other" planet that were known as "Germans," etc.

But, all of this is pure speculation. If you haven't already read it, you would really enjoy a SF book titled, "Spin" by Robert Charles Wilson. It should be at your local library. To my mind, its the most fascinating, paradigm-shifting look at extraterrestrial interaction with Earth since "Stranger in a Strange Land."

here's for some interesting reading.

[url]http://www.sitchin.com/[/url]

The problem I have with that theory is that I don't think infinite space necessarily means infinity possiblities. It could just means infinite space..

[QUOTE=shadow]On one hand you're arguing the existence of god based on no evidence and then you're trying to disprove something of which we do have evidence? Anyway I won't go into the whole god thing but found that bit amusing. (Not your belief in God, just your argument for it. I believe in God so no issues there).

To respond to your other points.
you're saying that if you move at the speed of light or faster we'll be able to see the earth from the past.
Newsflash!
You can't travel faster than light. Which is what you'd need to do if you want to see earth from the past. The light from the past has already left us. Its like a race. Light's leadind the race and you're running behind trying to catch up but you can't catch up, ever. You can't even match speeds, hence you'll likely never be able to see earth's past unless you ended up in a blackhole where that light is trapped, but in that case time dilation would be the least of your problems. Further even if by some miracle you could see earth's past, whats the big deal. You can't affect the events. Its like watching a movie, which is light trapped on film in a sense.

Regarding your second point, atleast you're admitting that time does indeed slow down as speed increases at the quantum level. It does happen at the macroscopic level, as I've said before, it has been proven via experimentation.
The only thing is that for the effect to be noticable we need to be traveling at a much faster speed then we are capable off.

There are also other issues. As speed increase, so does an object's mass requiring more and more energy to make it go faster. There's no telling what would happen to a person once their mass approaches infinity, and since more mass=more energy needed to push it faster, you can't really ever reach that speed anyway.[/QUOTE]

Shadow, if you travel at the speed of light to some random planet and catch an image of earth, that image of earth is most definitely in the past relative to the time you're at your new destination/planet. I didn't mean past as to the time you were on earth. When you think about the implication that nothing follows a timeline, then this theory becomes straight up ridiculous. There has to be an absolute timeframe somehow somewhere for things to function.

[QUOTE=Jerm]Shadow, if you travel at the speed of light to some random planet and catch an image of earth, that image of earth is most definitely in the past relative to the time you're at your new destination/planet. I didn't mean past as to the time you were on earth. When you think about the implication that nothing follows a timeline, then this theory becomes straight up ridiculous. There has to be an absolute timeframe somehow somewhere for things to function.[/QUOTE]
OK I get what you're saying, but it is following the time line. Time travels only in one direction, foward. Since you're only going foward in time you're not breaking the timeline. You're only jumping ahead but still abiding by the laws of nature.

Let's go back to the race analogy I used earlier. The race track is the fabric of space-time, and the leader, light is running around at it's speed with myself and a few others are running waaay behind.(Life) If I'm faster than the other people, I get to the finish line before everyone else. So I got from point A to Point B in time before everyone else. For the slower guys, maybe on the way someone tripped and didn't finish, another guy got shot by a terrorist pissed off over people watching too much TV or something...well point being they died because they were too slow in time. Granted its an abstract analogy, but that's the concept.

Finally, as far as the absolute reference of time goes, well look at it this way. When I'm going at light speed or whatever experiencing time dilation, time has slowed down for me relative to the entire universe. So Its not just people on earth who've aged a X number of years. The entire universe has X years.

Anyway, in general though nature has laws in place that we can't overcome, atleast not with our current capability, to reach a point where the effects of time dilation could turn our lives upside down. And in all likelihood we're probably going to blow ourselves to nuclear hell before we even get to that level so its pointless to even worry imo.

And finally I'm not an expert, just read too much on this stuff. I guess there is always the possibility that we're all dead wrong and you're the only guy screaming the truth and no one will listen. If I didn't allow that then it would be kinda pointless to keep learning more because if you think you know something for sure why bother researching it. But for the moment, everything we know points towards this stuff being true, through math, through experient, through reason. And honestly if something like the SToR freaks you out, man I don't know what you'd do if you read up on stuff like uncertainty principle, probability waves and such. That's some seriously f'ed up ****. Now please excuse me for I'm afraid I've blown my cover and everyone knows I'm a big geek by now ;)

Whew too much typing :D

I wish more threads like this are created, this was very interesting and enligthening. Good read...

Do you like the science aspect or the religious aspect or both?

If you are interested in science discussion check this site out.. underneath each article there is a lot of discussion. It can be difficult to follow at times though because the discussions are so technical.

[url]http://slashdot.org/[/url]

One problem I have with the "infinit possibilities" idea, is that if that's so, then some alien race would have created technology that would have allowed it to get this far to our planet and let themselves be known. In fact, [I]infinte [/I] other alien civilizations should have been able to do this (by that theory), so where are they?

I most certainly believe in life elsewhere in the universe, and even that there are immense possibilites out there, but with [I]infinite [/I] possibilites should come infinite opportunities for aliens to have contacted us.

well actually jaydacris may have a point, even though he probably is not aware of it.


in most likelihood, any other form of life that develops may have vastly different biochemical pathways/structures/etc... because all life on Earth came from the same ancestral precedessor which developed out of early Earth enviroments. if life developed elsewhere, if is possible that other lifeforms are vastly different from us and have different methods of metabolism. therefore, they could view Earth as we view Venus... a toxic wasteland.