What does LeBron need to do to be accepted as the GOAT?

[QUOTE=K Xerxes]Ship sailed a few years ago, but there's still a good chance for top 3-5 all time status. No shame in that whatsoever. No need to compare him to MJ all the time when all that does is unfortunately blur his greatness. Let's just appreciate it.[/QUOTE]

This... this is it. If there is one message that I try to get across to people on ISH, it is exactly this. I'm a huge LeBron fan, but he is neither now nor is he ever going to challenge the supremacy of Michael Jordan. It would be so much more fun to enjoy his career as a fan if everyone would just let it go.

[QUOTE=Partizan]Hey!
Didn't post here in a while, but last couple of days I've been thinking about something...

Is there any chance that LeBron will be accepted by basketball fans as the GOAT when it all set and done? By accepted I mean basically being what is Jordan right now. ( Considered the GOAT by most of objective bball fans).

For me, I don't really see it happening, but if he would for example, win something like 5 championships with the Cavaliers in a dominant fashion, without 2011 finals like moments, with all the MVPs he is gonna get, I guess he could be considered for a GOAT?

Do you agree? What do you personally think it would take for him to get to that level, and do you find it possible? :)[/QUOTE]
I think he'd have to build a time machine and start his career over on a different organization. He's got a few years before he declines. Little to no chance he cracks top 7

[QUOTE=SamuraiSWISH]He played a superior defense than the 2012 Celtics with Riley's '93 Knicks. A superior team period that won 60+ games.

And he still played a great floor game in the ECF considering the circumstances, he didn't shoot well. Bad wrist, great defense. Still put up the necessary volume to carry the Bulls offense. The next series he went completely APE shit.

LeBron shot like shit for the vast majority of the 2012 playoffs. Especially compared to his averages in the regular season. Didn't shoot well in the Finals, either.

There was no significant regression in 1993. You mean to tell me 1993 Jordan on the 2011 - 2014 Heat couldn't win 3 rings? You're a joke.


YES[/QUOTE]

No, no... 2012 LeBron is twice the scorer 1996-1998 MJ is, get real.

Nope, I said 1993 MJ MIGHT win in 2012.. Probably not, though.

He isn't replicating LeBron's Game 6

[QUOTE=ArbitraryWater]No, no... 2012 LeBron is twice the scorer 1996-1998 MJ is, get real.[/quote]
LOL WHAT ?!

MJ's teams were busy curb stomping the competition for much of the 2nd three peat. He still in his mid 30s was hovering around 30 ppg playing off the ball, in a non ball dominant capacity. He did all his damage basically exclusively off jump shots, mid range, and post game.

LeBron got so many baskets in the 2011 - 2013 era off padding his FG% off transition buckets, easy run outs and dunks. MJ was murdering people in his mid 30's against a set half court defense. Bron struggles with that now in his absolute peak / prime at times.

See 2013 Finals, just letting him shoot open shots for proof. Yes, even late 90s Jordan is a better SCORER than LeBron.

[quote=ArbitraryWater]Nope, I said 1993 MJ MIGHT win in 2012.. Probably not, though.[/quote]
You have GOT to be kidding me. LeBron had that game 6 scoring binge in Boston by attacking the basket, and having one of his best games EVER from mid range with Rajon Rondo seemingly guarding him for many possessions.

You're telling me 1993 MJ, who was the strongest he ever was in the first three peat, had the skill / jumper / mid range of fadeaway Jordan, yet the versatility in his offensive game to still attack the bucket AT WILL isn't going to destroy:

Rondo in the post, or from mid range?
Pietrus off the dribble?
Old Pierce off the dribble?

MJ made it look easy because he was playing chess, when Bron's simple ass scoring wise plays checkers. Consistently trying to force round pegs into square holes.

Which is why old Jason Kidd locked him up. '93 MJ can replicate LeBron's 2012 run easily. Hell, Jordan's '93 numbers that post season blow Bron's out the water.

30 ppg 10 rpg 6 apg
35 ppg 7 rpg (@ SG) 6 apg (not facilitator)

[quote=ArbitraryWater]He isn't replicating LeBron's Game 6[/QUOTE]
The rebounds? Arbitrary. Unless the majority of them were offensive. Which even old Jordan could do when his team needed it to grind out. See game 7 v.s. Pacers.

Or 45 points? Because he did that in his final game as a Bull @ age 35. Sit down Gloria, go watch some Jordan footage and learn before you spout off at the mouth sounding like a retard.

[QUOTE=SamuraiSWISH]LOL WHAT ?!

MJ's teams were busy curb stomping the competition for much of the 2nd three peat. He still in his mid 30s was hovering around 30 ppg playing off the ball, in a non ball dominant capacity. He did all his damage basically exclusively off jump shots, mid range, and post game.

[B]LeBron got so many baskets in the 2011 - 2013 era off padding his FG% off transition buckets, easy run outs and dunks. MJ was murdering people in his mid 30's against a set half court defense. Bron struggles with that now in his absolute peak / prime at times.[/B]

See 2013 Finals, just letting him shoot open shots for proof. Yes, even late 90s Jordan is a better SCORER than LeBron.


You have GOT to be kidding me. LeBron had that game 6 scoring binge in Boston by attacking the basket, and having one of his best games EVER from mid range with Rajon Rondo seemingly guarding him for many possessions.

You're telling me 1993 MJ, who was the strongest he ever was in the first three peat, had the skill / jumper / mid range of fadeaway Jordan, yet the versatility in his offensive game to still attack the bucket AT WILL isn't going to destroy:

Rondo in the post, or from mid range?
Pietrus off the dribble?
Old Pierce off the dribble?

MJ made it look easy because he was playing chess, when Bron's simple ass scoring wise plays checkers. Consistently trying to force round pegs into square holes.

Which is why old Jason Kidd locked him up. '93 MJ can replicate LeBron's 2012 run easily. Hell, Jordan's '93 numbers that post season blow Bron's out the water.

30 ppg 10 rpg 6 apg
35 ppg 7 rpg (@ SG) 6 apg (not facilitator)

[B]
The rebounds? Or 45 points? Because he did that in his final game as a Bull @ age 35.[/B][/QUOTE]

Bolded the funniest parts...

LeBron can "struggle" and he's still more efficient than 1996-1998 MJ.. Stop the hyperbole. 1996-1998 MJ shot over 50% ONCE in all his 3 combined finals appearances... This wasn't the godly 1991-1993 version. Get real.

[QUOTE=ArbitraryWater]He isn't replicating LeBron's Game 6[/QUOTE]
So Jordan, who averaged 41/9/6/2/1 on 51% shooting over 6 games in the finals against a better team than the '12 Celtics isn't getting past the '12 Celtics? He had 4 straight 40+ point games that series with a 55-point game in there :oldlol:

[QUOTE=Milbuck]So Jordan, who averaged 41/9/6/2/1 on 51% shooting over 6 games in the finals against a better team than the '12 Celtics isn't getting past the '12 Celtics?[/QUOTE]

AGAIN :facepalm

I said if he brings the same ECF performance from 1993 in 2012, he will LOSE.

[QUOTE=ArbitraryWater]AGAIN :facepalm

I said if he brings the same ECF performance from 1993 in 2012, he will LOSE.[/QUOTE]
And why are we to assume that? Are the 2012 Celtics even close to the 1993 Knicks?...who finished 60-22 and had the #1 defense, with Ewing, who was significantly better than anyone on the Celtics.

This thread again

[IMG]http://gifrific.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/04/leaving-now-grandpa-simpsons.gif[/IMG]

[QUOTE=ArbitraryWater]AGAIN :facepalm

I said if he brings the same ECF performance from 1993 in 2012, he will LOSE.[/QUOTE]
He was facing a BETTER TEAM and BETTER DEFENSE than the 2012 Celtics.

You're speaking like someone who didn't watch the guy actually play. We're talking about MJ's abilities in 1993 on the 2012 Heat v.s. the 2012 Celtics.

He is going to absolutely SLAUGHTER that old AF Celtics team, and it isn't going to take 7 games to do it.

He'd have given them 45 in game 1 and had the Celtic crew shook in fear. '93 MJ is destroying Rondo, Pietrus, and old ass Pierce.

How do you want it?

Off the dribble?
In the post?
Mid range jumper?
Sag, and give him the 3?

LMAO @ '93 MJ not being able to put up a performance the caliber of Bron's game 6. He did it in that very series down 1 - 2 v.s. the Knicks putting up 54. All on LONG jumpers.

SMH the people writing off lebron are probably the same people who wrote off MJ in 1994 for quitting on the bulls and playing baseball

"MJ is a quitter, doesnt have the heart to play"
:facepalm

Heck when MJ won 6 there was probably 1 fgt saying "Russell still has nearly twice the amount of rings"

Wear a goat costume for the rest of his life.

1993 Knicks 2nd best player was John Starks... You guys hype this as some UBER team.

"He'd have given them 45 in game 1 and had the Celtic crew shook in fear. '93 MJ is destroying Rondo, Pietrus, and old ass Pierce."

You guys are underrating everything else LeBron did...


It's not a coincedence that's its ranked 2nd on both GOAT Playoff Run Lists by ESPN.... 1991 MJ, then 2012 LeBron...

LMFAO at comparing his 54 to LeBron's 45/15/5 on 70% after like 3 Q's

To you Swish, you're probably the worst Stan on this board.

You call LeBron the 2nd Greatest Ever, yet trash him all the time, like I've seen you do with Kareem. :facepalm

You like MJ and no one else. Truly Kobetard-esque.

Oh and btw, Kareem > LeBron, Kareem is 1A/1B with MJ as GOAT.

[QUOTE=Beastmode88]Still won't erase 2011 and 2014.[/QUOTE]

lol well if he wins out it won't matter. If he just starts winning and wins like 8 titles straight who will care about those years? I think he has to at least 3 peat in order to be considered... and that'll give him a b2b and a 3 peat. Good but not great. 4 peat and we're really close. 5 peat and he's GOAT imo.

Of course, it's hard to cross compare, but his resume if he 5 peated would be GOATie.

-Smak

Realistically he's not ending up GOAT...probably go down top 5 though