The 2011-2014 Heat don't seem stacked anymore

[QUOTE=SouBeachTalents;14921020]Bosh wasn't a franchise player, which is no knock on him, there are maybe 10 franchise players in the league at one time, and there's just no way you could look at Bosh's body of work in Toronto and reach the conclusion he was a legitimate franchise player.

Even if you gave him a better supporting cast than he had in Toronto, what would be your realistic expectation of a team with Bosh as it's best player? That's a 2nd round exit at best, maybe they sneak into a conference finals once if all hell breaks loose with injuries.

If you're a franchise player you should be able to lead any team to the playoffs on a regular basis, you should be All-NBA annually, you should top 10 in MVP voting annually, and there should be a realistic scenario where you could lead a contending team to a championship; Chris Bosh checks none of these boxes.[/QUOTE]

I think your standards for franchise player are REALLY high. By your definition, Wemby, AD, Ja, etc. aren't franchise players. And 20 teams don't have franchise players but 6 of them make the playoffs despite not having one. But to each his own.

[QUOTE=rmt;14921037]I think your standards for franchise player are REALLY high. By your definition, Wemby, AD, Ja, etc. aren't franchise players. And 20 teams don't have franchise players but 6 of them make the playoffs despite not having one. But to each his own.[/QUOTE]
I think standards for a franchise player SHOULD be very high, it should be reserved for the truly elite of the league. If we're applying it to a guy like Bosh who could barely muster a playoff appearance or even a winning record in a weak Eastern conference, the term loses all significance. What the hell is the point of calling someone a "franchise" player when the franchise is consistently in the lottery with them at the helm.

friendly reminder: time to pay your rent on me saying Lebron could easily be a decent 3 point shooter in the NBA

[QUOTE=rmt;14921037]I think your standards for franchise player are REALLY high. By your definition, Wemby, AD, Ja, etc. aren't franchise players. And 20 teams don't have franchise players but 6 of them make the playoffs despite not having one. But to each his own.[/QUOTE]

They are playing semantics to try to downplay Bosh. It’s pretty lame and transparent.

Once again I invite anyone who wants to hate on Bosh for not having team success in Toronto….take a look at his rosters if you didn’t follow NBA back then….it’s some of the worst of the worst. What did you want him to do exactly?

Trying to write off Bosh’s ability for the fact he had zero help in Toronto is flat out disingenuous.

[QUOTE=warriorfan;14921084]They are playing semantics to try to downplay Bosh. It’s pretty lame and transparent.

Once again I invite anyone who wants to hate on Bosh for not having team success in Toronto….take a look at his rosters if you didn’t follow NBA back then….it’s some of the worst of the worst. What did you want him to do exactly?

Trying to write off Bosh’s ability for the fact he had zero help in Toronto is flat out disingenuous.[/QUOTE]

the ideaology behind the Heat management became "if you don't outsweat your opponents to win, then you're just like the Harlem Globetrotters"

but again, the fundamental flaw behind it all is the lack of spacing and sharing the floor, which is where Birdman came in.

[QUOTE=warriorfan;14921084]They are playing semantics to try to downplay Bosh. It’s pretty lame and transparent.

Once again I invite anyone who wants to hate on Bosh for not having team success in Toronto….take a look at his rosters if you didn’t follow NBA back then….it’s some of the worst of the worst. What did you want him to do exactly?

Trying to write off Bosh’s ability for the fact he had zero help in Toronto is flat out disingenuous.[/QUOTE]

its not a question of STACKED!

Its really a question of SUPER!

Magic's LAL were STACKED. Bird's BOS were STACKED.

Chris Bosh was Raptors leader and Franchise and legit 24 ppg 11 rpg All Star before joining LBJ at age 26.

LBJ's Ball Dominance style reduced Bosh to 16 PPG 6 RPG do not mean Bosh is any less.

Its LBJs fault that he cannot make players better under him. because he is a playmaker, ball dominator.

Especially when Bosh was 26 YO, LBJ was 25 YO and Wade was 29 YO. all in their best year.

That 3rd Franchise All-Star leader in Bosh and Love make HEAT and CAVs both SUPER teams not STACKED teams.

[QUOTE=gengiskhan;14921122]its not a question of STACKED!

Its really a question of SUPER!

Magic's LAL were STACKED. Bird's BOS were STACKED.

Chris Bosh was Raptors leader and Franchise and legit 24 ppg 11 rpg All Star before joining LBJ at age 26.

[B]LBJ's Ball Dominance style reduced Bosh to 16 PPG 6 RPG[/B] do not mean Bosh is any less.

Its LBJs fault that he cannot make players better under him. because he is a playmaker, ball dominator.

Especially when Bosh was 26 YO, LBJ was 25 YO and Wade was 29 YO. all in their best year.

That 3rd Franchise All-Star leader in Bosh and Love make HEAT and CAVs both SUPER teams not STACKED teams.[/QUOTE]

We're still on this?

I thought that one died years ago.

[QUOTE=ShawkFactory;14921124]We're still on this?

I thought that one died years ago.[/QUOTE]

Since the Goal Post kept moving for LBJ, this will pop up over and over again.

ESPN and Klutch Media's desperation in showing LBJ never had super team. MJ's Bulls were super team or at least stacked team. neither of it is true.

Here is what really happened.

Both Heat and Bulls showed up at the top of their decade. 1991 and 2011 respectively.

Unlike Bulls, Heat were literally handed down keys to weak, anemic East Conf. and young SUPER team. Hence, "not 3, not 4, not 5, not 6, not 7..."

SAS tried challenging Heat but were too old. OKC fizzeled away and were suppose to be true contenders to Heat.

It was GSW that really busted open Heat's championship decade long party. 4-peat turned into RE-peat for Heat.

GSW still turned into DYNASTY despite 1 painful loss. LBJ Colluded again in weak East Conf another SUPER Team hoping for DYNASTRY that never happened. then he jumps ship again to LA warm waters.

All LBJ has is this 4-6 losing record. with that laughable bubble ring!. thats a huge asteriks.

Now comes the pi$$ed off Media. ESPN and Klutch Media changing Goal Post after Goal Post. Either its MJs 1-9 start with cocaine circus OR MJs Final opponents were weak OR laughable longevity argument now.

this will continue. Because LBJ has not even single 3peat to show for. Despite 2 SUPER teams and 1 STACKED team.

[QUOTE=StrongLurk;14837208]At least compared to so many of the teams that have existed since 2017.

2011 Heat:
Mike Bibby (end of career)
Wade
Lebron
Bosh
Joel Anthony (lol) or Big Z (end of career)

Then the 2011 Heat was shit with Haslem, Mike Miller (actually decent but was always hurt) James Jones, Mario Chalmers, Juwan Howard (end of career), Eddie House.

Shit just look at the starting lineups of the Bucks/Celtics this year. They look just as good or even better than those Heat teams. Biggest difference is just Lebron being so much better than everyone else outside of the 2011 finals.

Celtics:
Jrue Holiday
Jason Tatum
Jaylen Brown
Al Horford
Kristaps[/QUOTE]

Bumping my thread. It's actually even funnier comparing the 2011-2014 heat to the Celtics now since they are defending champs. AND I didn't even include White/Pritchard in my original Celtics starting 5 comparison, yet these two guys just dropped 40 points in the same game.

It's love to see the 2013 Heat with modern coaching/analytics.

LeBron ball made that Heat team seem less stacked.

LeBron’s game devalues players.

[QUOTE=Norcaliblunt;14984771]D-uh-uh-uh-uh-uh[/QUOTE]
:roll:

The current Celtics don't have the top end talent Miami had. We're talking about peak prime Lebron and Wade. That would be like Jokic and Giannis or SGA on the same team. Brown and Tatum don't compare to a combo like that. Boston is deeper, but the Heat actually filled out quite well. On top of prime Lebron, Wade, and Bosh they added Shane Battier, Ray Allen, Birdman, Mike Miller, etc. The team was stacked. Battier went nuts in the 2012 Finals, Ray saved the 2013 Finals, and Birdman had unreal playoff production in 2013 as well. Everybody was balling and I wouldn't be surprised if they could take this Celtic team.

[QUOTE=tpols;14984778]The current Celtics don't have the top end talent Miami had. [B]We're talking about peak prime Lebron and Wade.[/B] That would be like Jokic and Giannis or SGA on the same team. Brown and Tatum don't compare to a combo like that. Boston is deeper, but the Heat actually filled out quite well. On top of prime Lebron, Wade, and Bosh they added Shane Battier, Ray Allen, Birdman, Mike Miller, etc. The team was stacked. Battier went nuts in the 2012 Finals, Ray saved the 2013 Finals, and Birdman had unreal playoff production in 2013 as well. Everybody was balling and I wouldn't be surprised if they could take this Celtic team.[/QUOTE]
I don't even care if you claim Miami had more talent than Boston, but will you really continue to pretend forever that Wade was still this dude after 2011. He just wasn't :lol Comparing even 2012 Wade to SGA is a joke, let alone the shell of himself he was by the 2013 playoffs.

[QUOTE=RRR3;14984774]:roll:[/QUOTE]

Nice bite on the bait you fascist corporate stooge lover.

[QUOTE=Norcaliblunt;14984784]:mad:[/QUOTE]
:yaohappy:

He's raging at his keyboard again, folks.