The Top 100 Greatest NBA Players Of All Time According To ISH

[QUOTE=Dasher]After looking over the list again:
Zeke and Elvin Hayes should be ranked over Karl Malone. David Robinson also has an argument to be ranked over Karl.

I would put Shaq above both Magic AND Bird.

Kobe hasn't done anything to be ranked above Clyde Drexler, and Rick Barry should be ranked over both.

Patrick Ewing should be ranked above Scottie Pippen, who should be in the range of the 40s.

Sidney Moncrief should have cracked the top 40 and also has an argument to be ranked over Pippen.

Robert Parish being in above Nate Thurmond should be fixed.

Tmac being ranked as high as he is silly, and he has not had a better career than his cousin Vince Carter.

Mitch Richmond should be ranked ahead of Reggie Miller.

Walt Bellamy in the 70s....SMH

If Big Ben is on the list, then Mark Eaton should be as well.

Fat Lever not being on the list is jokes.

Drazen should be on the list, and so should Detlef Shremph.

Walt Frazier should be above AI, and I would slot him above Willis. Jason Kidd also has an argument over the answer.

8-15 could be scrambled and I would not complain, all the players in that range are interchangeable.

Pistol Pete is WAY too high.[/QUOTE]


You were doing fine with elvin and Zeke over Karl but Shaq over Bird and magic Im just shaking my head.
Why is big ben even talked about in a All Time Great List.

[QUOTE=ACCBaller1403]You have got to be kidding me...is this in order? And this is seriously your top 10 players of all time?[/QUOTE]

no chance

think iverson should be lower
karl malone should be lower
rodman should be lower
bill walton should be lower
kevin johnson should be lower
t mac should be a lil lower

barkley should be higher
clyde should be higher
nique should be higher
c webb should be considerably higher
kg should be a lil higher
nash sould be a lil higher
ZO SHOULD BE HIGHER


in a few years when players like lebron wade bosh amare and others jump on this list chaos will ensue

[QUOTE=KB42PAH]Any list without kobe in top 5 is a joke.

lmao at the overrating of legend players like Dr. J who are overrated. If Dr.J is up there, why isn't Lebron up there?
lmao at larry bird being so high. keith van horn+passing.
lmao at some of the pathetic garbage names you have on that list before kobe, lebron or KG for that matter.[/QUOTE]

buddy wer talking about all time and not past 10 years. You know nothing since you have kobe,lebron,garnett,duncan, and shaq all in top 10.

Right now Shaq is the only one that top50 all time.

[QUOTE=ACCBaller1403]You can't just throw out accomplishments like they're nothing. And how, if you're ranking it based on skill, is Bird not on your list? Arguably the most skilled, intelligent player of all time isn't in your top 10.[/QUOTE]

-Poor, unfundamental jumpshot mechanics (KB = perfect jumpshot)
-A defensive liability (only plays 1 side of the floor, unlike KB who is 9 time defensive member)
-Slow foot speed, quickness (no where near KB)
-His finish ability around the rim is no where near kobe

[QUOTE]
If you're ranking based solely on skills as well, I'd have Barkley up there, [/QUOTE]

Lacked a 3 point shot and the finish ability of KB. Lacked the killer instinct, clutchness, off-hand abilites of Kobe as well.

[quote] Kobe would definately not be higher than Jordan. West was as skilled as you can be in basketball and he's not up there.[/QUOTE]

West? Please tell me thats a joke. He had no off-hand, not a great finisher around rim ( compared to KB), nowhere as good defensively.

Jordan is the only one thats in same boat as kobe skill wise.

Kobe vs. Jordan (Skil wise)

Kobe: Better shooter ( Midrange, Longrange), Better Ball-handler, Better scorer, better off-hand, better killer-instinct, better passer, better playmaker

Jordan: Smarter player, better inside player, better post player, more consistent defensively.

As an offensive force at the least Shaq is their equal. On defense it is not close. Neither of them are in Shaq's class on that end of the court. If you take away the whole "saving of the NBA" out of the equation, people would be able to objectively look at these players, and correctly conclude that Shaq is better than both Magic and Bird.

[QUOTE=KB42PAH]-Poor, unfundamental jumpshot mechanics (KB = perfect jumpshot)
-A defensive liability (only plays 1 side of the floor, unlike KB who is 9 time defensive member)
-Slow foot speed, quickness (no where near KB)
-His finish ability around the rim is no where near kobe



Lacked a 3 point shot and the finish ability of KB. Lacked the killer instinct, clutchness, off-hand abilites of Kobe as well.



West? Please tell me thats a joke. He had no off-hand, not a great finisher around rim ( compared to KB), nowhere as good defensively.

Jordan is the only one thats in same boat as kobe skill wise.

Kobe vs. Jordan (Skil wise)

Kobe: Better shooter ( Midrange, Longrange), Better Ball-handler, [B][U]Better scorer, [B][U]better off-hand[/U][/B], better killer-instinct[/U][/B], better passer, better playmaker

Jordan: Smarter player, better inside player, better post player, more consistent defensively.[/QUOTE]

bold is your stupidest of many stupid statments. jordan is probably the most determined and insanly strong willed of all time , his 'killer instinct' ****s on kobe

and yes hes a better scorer than kobe as well goes without saying

A whole grip of Lakers in the top ten...I LOVE IT!!!

[QUOTE=KB42PAH]

Jordan is the only one thats in same boat as kobe skill wise.

Kobe vs. Jordan (Skil wise)

Kobe: Better shooter ( Midrange, Longrange), Better Ball-handler, Better scorer, better off-hand, better killer-instinct, better passer, better playmaker

[/QUOTE]

Please dude. If Kobe was a better shooter he would have shot a consistent 50% from the field. He hasn't. Jordan shoots better from the field, has a higher efg% and a higher ts%.
Jordan is the much better scorer quite easily. Only player to average 30+ ppg in the playoffs in nba history and did it in the season and finals as well.
30.1 ppg in the season, 33.4 ppg in the playoffs, 33.6 ppg in the finals

Kobe in the season is at 25.0 ppg, he is at 24.3 ppg in the playoffs and at 23.0 ppg in the finals.

Jordan has 10 scoring titles to Kobe's 2 scoring titles and Kobe in the playoffs has never even averaged in any given year what MJ's career playoffs average was.

Kobe is also nowhere near the playmaker Jordan was and definitely doesn't have MJ's killer instinct.

I don't know where you got that Kobe was even close to Jordan, but the fact that a guy doesn't show up in the finals and plays bad in every one should tell you about his killer instinct. A guy who has been in 5 finals and yet has 0 finals mvp's vs a guy who has been in 6 finals and has 6 finals mvp's.

case closed^^^

[QUOTE=TmacsRockets]Please dude. If Kobe was a better shooter he would have shot a consistent 50% from the field. He hasn't. Jordan shoots better from the field, has a higher efg% and a higher ts%.[/QUOTE]

1) FG% has nothing to do with Shooting ability
2) 2001-present is the Zone era of basketball. Jordan shot 42% in zone era.

[QUOTE]Jordan is the much better scorer quite easily. Only player to average 30+ ppg in the playoffs in nba history and did it in the season and finals as well.
30.1 ppg in the season, 33.4 ppg in the playoffs, 33.6 ppg in the finals
Kobe in the season is at 25.0 ppg, he is at 24.3 ppg in the playoffs and at 23.0 ppg in the finals.
Jordan has 10 scoring titles to Kobe's 2 scoring titles and Kobe in the playoffs has never even averaged in any given year what MJ's career playoffs average was.[/QUOTE]

1) Kobe didnt' get playing time early in his career
2) He played alongside Shaq, yet still put up huge numbers
3) Season averages mean nothing really. Kobe could have gotten the scoring title from 2002-now every single year, but he has played in best interest of the team.

Kobe Bryant's Scoring accomplishments that blow Jordan out the water:

-81 points in a game
-62 points in 33 minutes, outscoring dallas 62-61
-40 points in first 18 minutes of the game (42 at half)
-4 straight 45+ point games
-4 straight 50+ point games
-9 straigh 40+ point games
-13 straight 35+ point games
-551 points in 13 games
-43.4 ppg january 2006
-40.1 ppg april 2006
-42.4 ppg February 2003
-only player to score 2800 points and 180 threes in a season
-92 Career 40+ point games
-24 career 50+ point games
-4 career 60+ point games

Jordan has never outscored a team himself.
Jordan has never had 81
Jordan never had 50+ in 4 straight
Jordan never average 40 ppg for a month (Kobe has done it 3 times)

[Quote]Kobe is also nowhere near the playmaker Jordan was and definitely doesn't have MJ's killer instinct.[/quote]

Kobe is 100% fearless on the court to take and make anyshot. Jordan didnt' have that. He lacked confidence beyond the arc, what if your team was down 3 or 4 points? I would much rather have kobe's unstoppable 3 point shot to will my team back. This is why Wade and Lebron are useless in tight games or when their team is down by 3 or more points in close games final seconds.

[Quote]I don't know where you got that Kobe was even close to Jordan, but the fact that a guy doesn't show up in the finals and plays bad in every one should tell you about his killer instinct. A guy who has been in 5 finals and yet has 0 finals mvp's vs a guy who has been in 6 finals and has 6 finals mvp's.[/QUOTE]

2004 Pistons and 2008 Celtics >>> Anything Jordan faced in Finals.
Jordan' team>>>>Kobe's team
Jordan's teammates>>>Kobes teammates
This era 2000-present>>90s'

Finals MVP = irrelevant.

Kobe is still only 30, I know that makes you piss your pants. He will win 2-4 more rings still. Bynum will be the best center soon. Pau is top 3 PF. Tmac meanwhile is out 3 weeks and will accomplish nothing .

[QUOTE=KB42PAH]1) FG% has nothing to do with Shooting ability
2) 2001-present is the Zone era of basketball. Jordan shot 42% in zone era.



1) Kobe didnt' get playing time early in his career
2) He played alongside Shaq, yet still put up huge numbers
3) Season averages mean nothing really. Kobe could have gotten the scoring title from 2002-now every single year, but he has played in best interest of the team.

Kobe Bryant's Scoring accomplishments that blow Jordan out the water:

-81 points in a game
-62 points in 33 minutes, outscoring dallas 62-61
-40 points in first 18 minutes of the game (42 at half)
-4 straight 45+ point games
-4 straight 50+ point games
-9 straigh 40+ point games
-13 straight 35+ point games
-551 points in 13 games
-43.4 ppg january 2006
-40.1 ppg april 2006
-42.4 ppg February 2003
-only player to score 2800 points and 180 threes in a season
-92 Career 40+ point games
-24 career 50+ point games
-4 career 60+ point games

Jordan has never outscored a team himself.
Jordan has never had 81
Jordan never had 50+ in 4 straight
Jordan never average 40 ppg for a month (Kobe has done it 3 times)



Kobe is 100% fearless on the court to take and make anyshot. Jordan didnt' have that. He lacked confidence beyond the arc, what if your team was down 3 or 4 points? I would much rather have kobe's unstoppable 3 point shot to will my team back. This is why Wade and Lebron are useless in tight games or when their team is down by 3 or more points in close games final seconds.



2004 Pistons and 2008 Celtics >>> Anything Jordan faced in Finals.
Jordan' team>>>>Kobe's team
Jordan's teammates>>>Kobes teammates
This era 2000-present>>90s'

Finals MVP = irrelevant.

Kobe is still only 30, I know that makes you piss your pants. He will win 2-4 more rings still. Bynum will be the best center soon. Pau is top 3 PF. Tmac meanwhile is out 3 weeks and will accomplish nothing .[/QUOTE]


[url]http://www.usatoday.com/sports/scores97/97132/97132380.htm[/url]

This is what Kobe did in the handcheck era.

He averaged 7 ppg and got locked down by Jeff Hornecek.

[QUOTE]
The Lakers had a chance to win it in regulation, but Kobe Bryant, who finished
with 11 points, shot an air ball at the buzzer.

The 18-year-old Bryant would miss three more shots, including
two air balls, in the overtime.

[/QUOTE]


Kobe's accomplishments don't even compare to Jordan's.

90's > 00's.

90's had dominant big men which is what wins championships. 00's don't have it that is why some of the worst teams ever have gotten to the finals. 2001 Sixers, 2002 and 2003 Nets, 2006 Heat, 2007 Cavs, and the 2004 Pistons.

In fact it has only been in this era where top 5 players all time haven't won finals mvp's. 2004 - Billups, 2007 Parker, 2008 Pierce.


Playoffs

Most Points Per Game (min. 25 games)
33.4 by Michael Jordan (179 games)

Most Points in a Game
63 by Michael Jordan

Most 50 Point Games
8 by Michael Jordan

Most 40 Point Games
38 by Michael Jordan

Most 30 Point Games
109 by Michael Jordan

Most 20 Point Games
174 by Michael Jordan (he played 179 playoff games and scored under 20 only 5 times)

-Highest PER Efficiency Playoffs: 28.59



MJ:
NBA Regular-season records Michael Jordan holds:
-Most seasons leading league in scoring: 10
-Highest scoring average, career: 30.12ppg
-Most consecutive points, one game: 23
-Most seasons leading league in field goals made: 10
-Most consecutive gms in double figures in scoring:
866
-Most consecutive seasons leading PER: 7
-Highest career PER: 27.91
-Oldest player to score 40+ points: age 40 (43 pts)
-Oldest player to score 50+ points: age 38 (51 pts)

NBA Regular-season records Michael Jordan shares:
-Most consecutive seasons leading league in scoring:
7 (tied with Wilt Chamberlain)
-Most consecutive seasons, 2,000 plus points: 11 (Tied
with Malone)


NBA Playoff records Michael Jordan holds:
-Highest scoring average, career: 33.4ppg
-Record Total points: 5987
-Record Most FTS made: 1463
-Most points playoffs, one-game: 63
-Most points playoffs, three-game series: 135 (vs.
Miami, 1992)
-Most Points playoffs, five-game series: 226 (vs.
Cleveland, 1988)
-Most field goals made playoffs, three-game series:
53 (vs. Miami, 1992)
-Most field goals made playoffs, five-game series: 86
(vs. Philadelphia, 1990)
-Most field goals made playoffs, six-game series: 101
(vs. Phoenix, 1993)
-Most consecutive 50pt games: 2
-Most consecutive 45pt games: 3
-Most consecutive games, 20 plus points: 60
-Most free throws made, one quarter: 13
-Most free throws attempted, one quarter: 14
-Most 50 point games: 8
-Most 40 point games: 39
-Most consecutive points: 23

NBA Playoff records Michael Jordan shares:
-Most field goals, in a game: 24 (vs. Cleveland, May
1, 1988; tied with two others)
-Most three-point field goals made, one half: 6
(first half vs. Portland, June 3, 1992; tied with four
others)

NBA Finals records Michael Jordan holds:
- Highest Scoring average: 33.6
-Most points, six-game series: 246 (vs. Phoenix,
1993)
-Most field goals made, five-game series: 63 (vs.
L.A. Lakers, 1991)
-Most field goals made, six-game series: 101 (vs.
Phoenix, 1993)
-Most steals, five-game series: 14 (vs. L.A. Lakers,
1991)
-Highest scoring average, one series: 41.0 (vs.
Phoenix, 1993)
-Most consecutive games, 40-plus points: 4 (June 11,
1993 to June 18, 1993)
-Most consecutive 30 point games: 9
-Most consecutive games, 20-plus points: 29 (June 22,

1991 to June 1997)
-Most points, one-half: 35 (vs. Portland, June 3,
1992)
-Most consecutive field goals: 13 (Vs. LA)
-Most consecutive points: 23 (Vs. Seattle)
-Most Finals MVPs: 6



Here is Kobe's

KOBE:
NBA Regular-season records Kobe holds:
-All-rookie game (now defunct): 31 points

NBA Regular-season records Kobe Shares:
-Most 3 pointers in one game: 12 (shared with 1
player)
-Most 3 pointers in one half: 8 (5 players)
-Most consecutive 3 pointers: 9 (2 players)
-Most free throws made in one quarter: 14 (5 players)
-Most free throws attempted one quarter: 16 (6
players)

NBA Playoff Records Kobe holds:
-NONE

NBA Playoff Records Kobe Shares:
-NONE

NBA Finals records Kobe holds:
-NONE

NBA Finals records Kobe Shares:
-NONE


Conclusion: MJ still owns the most
scoring records as well as ALMOST ALL THE PLAYOFF
Records. Take a look at the all time scoring feats at
the bottom. MJ has 21 of them and the most important
ones, Wilt has 16, Kobe has 1. Take away Wilt and MJ
climbs to 26 and Kobe has 8. Below that are MJ's
records and KB's records. Not even close.

Here's a list of ALL-TIME SCORING RECORDS.

- Highest career scoring average: MJ 30.12
- Highest career playoff scoring average: MJ 33.4
- Highest career Finals scoring average: MJ 33.6
- Highest single season scoring average: Wilt 50.4
- Highest single series playoff average: West 46.3
- Highest single Finals series average: MJ 41.0
- Most seasons leading league in scoring: MJ 10
- Most consecutive seasons leading in scoring: MJ,
Wilt tied at 7
- Most 50 point games: Wilt 118
- Most 50 point games playoffs: MJ 8
- Most 40 point games: Wilt 271
- Most 40 point games playoffs: MJ 42
- Most consecutive 60 point games: Wilt 4
- Most consecutive 50 point games: Wilt 7
- Most consecutive 50 point games in playoffs: MJ 2
- Most consecutive 45 point games: Wilt 7
- Most consecutive 45 point games playoffs: MJ 3
- Most consecutive 40 point games: Wilt 14
- Most consecutive 40 point games rookie: AI 5
- Most consecutive 40 point games playoffs: West 6
- Most consecutive 40 point games finals: MJ 4
- Most consecutive 35 point games: Wilt 33
- Most consecutive 30 point games: Wilt 65
- Most consecutive 30 point games playoffs: Elgin 11
- Most consecutive 30 point games finals: MJ 9
- Most consecutive 20 point games: Wilt 126
- Most consecutive 20 point games playoffs: MJ 60
- Most consecutive 20 point games finals: MJ 35
- Most consecutive double figures scoring: MJ 866
- Most consecutive points in one game: MJ 23
- Most consecutive points in one game playoffs: MJ 23
- Highest scoring game: Wilt 100
- Highest scoring game playoffs: MJ 63
- Highest scoring game finals: Elgin 61
- Highest scoring game rookie: Wilt 58
- Highest scoring all-star game: Wilt 42
- Highest scoring all-rookie game: Kobe 31
- Most points in 3 quarters: Wilt 69
- Most points in one half: Wilt 59
- Most points one half playoffs: Sleepy Floyd 39
- Most points in one half finals: MJ 35
- Most points one half all-star game: Rice 24
- Most points in one quarter: Gervin 33
- Most points in one quarter playoffs: Sleepy Floyd 29
- Most points in one quarter finals: Isiah 25
- Most points in one quarter all-star game: Rice 20
- Most points in OT: Arenas 16
- Most points in OT playoffs: Drexler 13
- Most points in OT in finals: Havlicek, Laimbeer,
Ainge tied at 9
- Oldest to score 50: MJ 51 at age 38
- Oldest to score 40: MJ 43 at age 40


Oh when did Kobe get a finals MVP?


Oh and how many times has Kobe scored 37 points in the finals?

Answer: 0


How many times has Jordan scored 37 in the finals?

Answer: 15


[url]http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/playoffs2008/columns/story?columnist=hollinger_john&page=FinalsPerformances-Worst[/url]

[QUOTE]
Kobe Bryant, L.A. Lakers, 2004
Lakers vs. Pistons -- [B]Bryant's PER 14.2[/B]
With his feud against Shaq escalating and the series getting away from the Lakers, Bryant began taking whatever shot struck him. Mostly, they struck the rim -- he shot 38.1 percent and had nearly as many turnovers (18) as assists (22) as Detroit romped in five games.
[/QUOTE]


Oh and MJ has 5 of the top 15 greatest finals performances.

MVP's - Jordan = 5; Kobe = 1

Titles - Jordan = 6 (as the #1 Option); Kobe = 3 (in the shadow of another)

Finals MVP's - Jordan = 6; Kobe = 0

DPOY - Jordan = 1; Kobe = 0

Scoring Titles - Jordan = 10; Kobe = 2

Career PPG - Jordan = 30.1 (Highest Ever); Kobe = 25.0

Playoffs PPG - Jordan = 33.4 (Highest Ever); Kobe = 24.3

Playoff Points - Jordan = 5987 - Most Ever Points (179 games); Kobe = 3686 (152 games)

FG% - Jordan - 50% Career; Kobe = 45% Career Thus Far

Playoff FG% - Jordan = 49% Career; Kobe = 44% Career Thus Far

PER (Offensive and Defensive Rating) - Jordan Career = 27.91 (highest ever); Kobe = 23.57

Steals - Jordan = 2.4 SPG Career (with 3 Steals Titles); Kobe = 1.5 SPG

Blocks - Jordan = 0.8 BPG Career (most blocks ever for a guard); Kobe = 0.6


Kobe has never scored 50 in the finals
Kobe never has scored 40 in the finals.
Kobe never has scored 37 in the finals.
Kobe never has hit 6 3's in the finals.
Kobe has never averaged 27.3 ppg or more in any finals.
Kobe never has even led a team in the finals.


Kobe has never averaged 40 ppg in any playoff series whereas MJ has done so 6 times.


No contest,


Oh and if you want to battle show me his finals mvp's.


I know that pisses you off to see how Billups and Pierce are better than Kobe by the fact they outplayed him in the finals and Pierce did so with a busted knee cap.


Compare Kobe to someone like Vince Carter, he is more on his level. Because Vince Carter actually scored 50 in regulation in the playoffs something Kobe never did.

Lmao desperation sets in

posting numbers from 17 and 18 year old kobe:roll: :lol pathetic.

Then comparing jordan's stats in isolation era to Kobe's zone era. lmao

desperation stinks.

How does it feel that rockets will go nowhere with artest/yao/tmac/battier/scola/alston

LMAO!

Did this fool try to say that Kobe is better than Jordan????????

[QUOTE=KB42PAH]Lmao desperation sets in

posting numbers from 17 and 18 year old kobe:roll: :lol pathetic.

Then comparing jordan's stats in isolation era to Kobe's zone era. lmao

desperation stinks.

How does it feel that rockets will go nowhere with artest/yao/tmac/battier/scola/alston

LMAO![/QUOTE]

That was a peak Kobe at his best. He just got shut down by Hornecek.

The zone era started in 2004. From that point forward guys numbers have been increasing because it is easier to score.


How does it feel that Kobe will lose once again in the playoffs with the most stacked team ever?


Show me how Kobe is even better than Vince.

Vince scored 50 in regulation in the playoffs and Kobe never did that, thus Vince is better.

Billups and Parker got a finals mvp and Kobe never has thus they are better.

[QUOTE=KB42PAH]Lmao desperation sets in

[B]posting numbers from 17 and 18 year old kobe:roll: :lol pathetic.[/B]

Then comparing jordan's stats in isolation era to Kobe's zone era. lmao

desperation stinks.

How does it feel that rockets will go nowhere with artest/yao/tmac/battier/scola/alston

LMAO![/QUOTE]

Are you insinuating that Kobe Bryant's stats from his first two years are excused? Akin to a teacher throwing out your worst test grade when they calculate your final average.