Re: 100 Greatest Hip-Hop Artist of All-Time (According to ISH)
[QUOTE=ace23]Revising my top 50 and just checked Kizzle's shitty criteria:bowdown: . 3/5 things have nothing to do with the music. :wtf:
Impact, fame, and sales? :roll: Jay-Z/Pac/Biggie/Lil Wayne are pretty much guaranteed the top spots. :facepalm
****, hard to not include Ice Cube when the list ain't even mostly about skills.[/QUOTE]
Impact has nothing to do with music????:wtf:
Just post your shit already.
Re: 100 Greatest Hip-Hop Artist of All-Time (According to ISH)
[QUOTE=-p.tiddy-]I do think it would be fun to do a real one, like the ISH top 100 bball players...that was fun
I'm down...I think I have extremely good knowledge for everything pre 2000...yes I do, I listened to ALL OF IT
and average knowledge for everything after
and yeah my #1 is
[IMG]http://jakedavis.typepad.com/jakedavis/images/2008/05/26/biggie.jpg[/IMG]
we need at least 20 posters to make it worth it though...less and the list wouldn't be that realistic[/QUOTE]
I vote this as #1
are we going to get this thing going or not?
1 VOTE BIGGIE
Re: 100 Greatest Hip-Hop Artist of All-Time (According to ISH)
[QUOTE=RaininTwos]Impact has nothing to do with music????:wtf:
Just post your shit already.[/QUOTE]
No, it doees not. You can make the deepest music and make zero impact if no one ever hears it. Those 3 fluff categories really hurt the underground artists.
And calm down, bro. Why are you rushing me?
Re: 100 Greatest Hip-Hop Artist of All-Time (According to ISH)
[QUOTE]You can write the deepest poetry and make zero impact if no one ever reads it.[/QUOTE]
fixed for all intents and purposes
if you're going to talk about something completely different than everybody else, at least be honest about it. you put excessive value into lyrical coherence and depth and as a result fail to acknowledge a great rapper who might not be as bright as lupe or mos. hence overrating guys like immortal technique who are interesting and worth listening to but not particularly talented.
Re: 100 Greatest Hip-Hop Artist of All-Time (According to ISH)
[QUOTE=ace23]No, it doees not. You can make the deepest music and make zero impact if no one ever hears it. Those 3 fluff categories really hurt the underground artists.
And calm down, bro. Why are you rushing me?[/QUOTE]
I am calm, you keep talking about this mythical list, where is it?
Re: 100 Greatest Hip-Hop Artist of All-Time (According to ISH)
[QUOTE=RaininTwos]I am calm, you keep talking about this mythical list, where is it?[/QUOTE]
Where is your list? You seem to believe that Ice Cube is a top-100 rapper. Stop referencing your mythical list! :no:
Re: 100 Greatest Hip-Hop Artist of All-Time (According to ISH)
[QUOTE=RidonKs]fixed for all intents and purposes
if you're going to talk about something completely different than everybody else, at least be honest about it. you put excessive value into lyrical coherence and depth and as a result fail to acknowledge a great rapper who might not be as bright as lupe or mos. hence overrating guys like immortal technique who are interesting and worth listening to but not particularly talented.[/QUOTE]
Excessive value? Are you trying to argue that the lyrics are not the best barometer in measuring a rapper's skill? There's flow, delivery obviously, but those are not as difficult to master as lyrical dexterity.
Or are you trying to say that lyricism takes no talent, and that anyone can do it? :oldlol:
Re: 100 Greatest Hip-Hop Artist of All-Time (According to ISH)
:facepalm :facepalm :facepalm
Re: 100 Greatest Hip-Hop Artist of All-Time (According to ISH)
Stop arguing with yourself Phoenix, it's weird.
Re: 100 Greatest Hip-Hop Artist of All-Time (According to ISH)
[QUOTE]Excessive value? Are you trying to argue that the lyrics are not the best barometer in measuring a rapper's skill? There's flow, delivery obviously, but those are not as difficult to master as lyrical dexterity. [/QUOTE]
actually i think it's pretty clear that lyricism is easier to master than the other factors that contribute to a legit mc. well, most of the other factors. a lot of it is just a matter of voice, lots of guys alter how they sound on the mic but if you sound grainy or whiny when you're talking, you're not going to get much love except from backpackers and suburbanites.
i'm sure if i put the time in i could put together great verses, all technically sound and 'deep' or whatever, make you think on a few bars. i'm good with words and have listened to more than enough hip hop to know how its done. but if it's coming out of my mouth? it's inevitably gonna suck because i don't have the accent, the charisma, just the natural ability to hold the attention of a listener for a whole verse.
like the way you phrase this shit it seems you consider rap to be an entirely different form of art compared to every other musical genre. obviously it was natural ability that elevated aretha and sam cooke above the rest. lyrics play a more important role in hip hop just because there are simply more of them and usually no melody, but no, i wouldn't call them the deciding factor or even the most important factor. i've listened to waaaaaay too many really talented writers who can't spit worth shit.
Re: 100 Greatest Hip-Hop Artist of All-Time (According to ISH)
That natural ability to hold the attention of the listener is called delivery. Switching up your voice every now and then, sounding confident, etc. does not take the talent it takes to be a good lyricist.
And I feel you on the voice thing, kind of. But if a dude is really lyrical, I look past it. You can still enjoy the music if you focus on the substance and actual skill involved.
And hip-hop is very different from other genres. There is no real vocal melody or harmony. It's poetry over music.
Re: 100 Greatest Hip-Hop Artist of All-Time (According to ISH)
Ice Cube no doubt is a top 100 rapper just of popularity alone.....
Not top 100?!? Like really :facepalm :wtf: :biggums: :coleman:
Re: 100 Greatest Hip-Hop Artist of All-Time (According to ISH)
[QUOTE]You can still enjoy the music if you focus on the substance and actual skill involved.[/QUOTE]
but this is the point. you aren't enjoying the music, you're enjoying the poetry. maybe you additionally enjoy the music behind the poetry. but they aren't one and the same, they aren't blended into a SONG, you're simultaneously appreciating both music and poetry but they don't form a homogeneous entity like the best hip hop does. that's the problem with earl sweatshirt and immortal technique and even guys like elzhi, who i respect the hell out of for ridic lyricism, complex rhyme schemes, and technically mastering the art of rapping... and i still love his work with slum village and the preface is an amazing album. but in spite of all that technical ability, all those mind=blown verses, half the time it just feels like he's slinging everything he's got at you hoping enough will stick. even if the lyrical content spells out a coherent message, it's not done in a particularly fluid way.
ive been listening to a bunch of elzhi lately but i didn't feel any differently than you did until like the past few weeks... i remember [URL="http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=6810877&postcount=9"]this post[/URL] by al that spelled it out. maybe you won't hear the same thing, nasta didn't, but to me elzhi's interpretation sounds like a barrage whereas brown's is just... rapping. iunno it's a tricky distinction to describe
Re: 100 Greatest Hip-Hop Artist of All-Time (According to ISH)
[QUOTE=ace23]That natural ability to hold the attention of the listener is called delivery. Switching up your voice every now and then, sounding confident, etc. does not take the talent it takes to be a good lyricist.
[B]And I feel you on the voice thing, kind of. But if a dude is really lyrical, I look past it. You can still enjoy the music if you focus on the substance and actual skill involved.[/B]
And hip-hop is very different from other genres. There is no real vocal melody or harmony. It's poetry over music.[/QUOTE]
That's like a terrible singe who's a good songwriter.
Anyways, why are people acting brand new. Y'all know what I'm talking bout when I say "100 Greatest Artist of All-Time." If I wanted 100 lyricist, I would have titled it that. Is Elzhi a greater artist than say, Busta Rhymes or whoever,, no. Is he a better lyricist. that's up to you to decide. That's totally different. Elzhi hasn't impacted a damn thing in hip-hp, hasn't done anything. No one knows him unless you google his ass.
Get with the program ... and where is your list Ace, it's been like 3 days?
Re: 100 Greatest Hip-Hop Artist of All-Time (According to ISH)
[QUOTE=Al Thornton]wouldn't it be easier to break down into 25 groups 25 producers 50 individuals and rank them in their own categories?[/QUOTE]
I like that idea, but than some people double as producer/artist.
So Kanye or Rza can be in the list as a solo artist and producer.