The GOAT List: 2014 Edition

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[SIZE="4"][B][FONT="Book Antiqua"]#132 Rasheed Abdul Wallace
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[B]Tier Classification:[/B] Championship Pieces: Non-Alpha
[B]Years Played (Quality Prime Seasons):[/B] 16 (13)
[B]Primary Role(s):[/B] #1/#2/#3 on Contenders
[B]Prime Averages: [/B] 15-7-2-1-1 on 47/34/72
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Is Rasheed a Hall of Famer?

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[SIZE="4"][FONT="Georgia"]This section, the next four players anyway, is dedicated to guys who perpetuate one of the most frustrating, but as always, true stereotypes in basketball. The nonathletic white big man. Here however we will pay homage to guys who had great careers despite not being cast from the typical mold.[/FONT][/SIZE]

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[SIZE="4"][B][FONT="Book Antiqua"]#131 Robert Clyde Jones
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[B]Tier Classification:[/B] Championship Pieces: Non-Alpha
[B]Years Played (Quality Prime Seasons):[/B] 12 (12)
[B]Primary Role(s):[/B] #2/#3/#4 on Playoff teams and Contenders
[B]Prime Averages: [/B] 12-6-3-2-2 on 54/80
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[SIZE="3"][FONT="Comic Sans MS"]-[SIZE="6"]S[/SIZE]ome players need to be the man. Others don

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[SIZE="4"][B][FONT="Book Antiqua"]#129 Jack Wayne Sikma
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[B]Tier Classification:[/B] Championship Pieces: Non-Alpha
[B]Years Played (Quality Prime Seasons):[/B] 14 (11)
[B]Primary Role(s):[/B] #2/#3 on Contenders
[B]Prime Averages: [/B] 17-11-4-1 on 47/85
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[SIZE="3"][FONT="Comic Sans MS"]-[SIZE="6"]A[/SIZE] gangly, gawking 6’11” Dutch raised toehead is not the traditional image associated with NBA greatness in the pivot, but Jack Sikma had no problem defying those odds nor the unprecipitated criticism of his draft selection from numerous sources including his future coach Don Nelson who said he would have selected Sikma 23rd overall only if his team had already used all 22 first round choices. In eight seasons in Seattle Sikma became the face of Sonics basketball and helped them earn the “Super” that preceded their nickname winning the 1979 NBA Championship. After a 5-17 start during his rookie year, Sikma and the Sonics took off, reaching the Finals in 1978 before becoming Champions in 1979 as mentioned, but following the next postseasons defeat at the hands of the Lakers (who Seattle has cast off in ‘78 and ‘79) internal conflict and poor front office management grounded the once high lying Northwesterners. Sikma, a key figure during the title run, having averaged 15 and 12 from the center position, had evolved during the first half of the 1980’s into one of the games best centers averaging 18-11-4 while making seven consecutive all-star games. As one by one the former pieces of Sonics greatness began to depart; Dennis Johnson, John Johnson, Fred Brown, Gus Williams, soon it was just Sikma and head coach/GM Lenny Wilkens who remained. Though Wilkens had been key to the team's turnaround in 1977-78, now. in 1985 Sikma and other teammates wanted him replaced as coach saying he was, if anything “Too nice a guy” to coach in the league. The next off-season Sikma demanded a trade, though he loved Seattle, he wanted to play for a contender again and he knew Seattle could not trade a local hero like him without his precipitating it. As team President Bob Whitsitt said then; “Jack is huge in our community, he’s bigger than the Space Needle” add to that former GM Zolie Volchok once claimed, “I wouldn’t trade Jack Sikma for the resurrection of Marilyn Monroe in my bedroom.” and you can imagine how shocking his 1986 trade to the Bucks was.

Milwaukee had a history of trading for aging center having acquired Bob Lanier and Dave Cowens earlier in the decade. They were perpetually bridesmaids in the Eastern Conference Finals to Boston or Philadelphia. They hoped Sikma could put them over the top and despite more regular season success, Milwaukee never took the next step in the playoffs. Sikma averaged 14 points and 8 rebounds in five seasons with the Bucks before retiring. His seven all-star selections, two MVP top-ten finishes and his 15/10 average in almost 100 playoff games a starter speak to his high level of play, Nelson eventually changed his tune and said of Sikma; “While I don’t think he’s the type of player who can carry a team, his value lies in his ability to do really well, everything a center has to do. There isn’t a part of the game he isn’t good at.” To basketball coaches he is perhaps most famous for the move he created; a reverse 180 pivot post move, the basic stepback jumper today, simply known as the SIkma move then, utilizing his high release and exceptional footwork and range of his jump shot. In addition he consistently rebounded and defended his position at an above-average to exceptional level. In the ‘79 Finals, at just 23 years of age and during the pivotal third game he had 21 points on 10-14 shooting and 17 rebounds while holding superstar Elvin Hayes to 5-20 from the field; he would average 16 points 15 rebounds and over 3 blocks for the series. In 1987, nearly 32 now with the Bucks he came up with 18 points and 21 rebounds in do or die game five win in the first round versus the 76ers with Doctor J and Sir Charles. Keeping with the theme of Ironmen, Sikma played in 1,209 of 1,248 games during his career. What’s with these guys. [/FONT][/SIZE]
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[SIZE="4"][B][FONT="Book Antiqua"]#128 William J. Laimbeer Jr.
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[B]Tier Classification:[/B] Championship Pieces: Non-Alpha
[B]Years Played (Quality Prime Seasons):[/B] 14 (9)
[B]Primary Role(s):[/B] #2/#3/#4 on Champions and Contenders
[B]Prime Averages: [/B] 15-11-2-1 on 50/32/84
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[SIZE="3"][FONT="Comic Sans MS"]-[SIZE="6"]H[/SIZE]e used to joke that he was the only player in the NBA who made less money than his Dad, and for much of his career that was true. Even though NBA contracts began to take off right as Bill Laimbeer turned pro, a six figure income was the norm for Laimbeer, raised in a privileged suburb of Chicago, going to the NBA may have meant a pay cut for Bill. But Laimbeer didn

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[SIZE="4"][FONT="Georgia"]This section, the next four players anyway, is dedicated to guys who perpetuate one of the most frustrating, but as always, true stereotypes in basketball. The nonathletic white big man. Here however we will pay homage to guys who had great careers despite not being cast from the typical mold.[/FONT][/SIZE][/QUOTE]
I was almost correct. Only I had Paul Westphal instead of Dan Issel.

[QUOTE=L.Kizzle]I was almost correct. Only I had Paul Westphal instead of Dan Issel.[/QUOTE]
Interesting. I saw that description and immediately thought Issel. Wasn't sure who else though. Interesting group of players.

[QUOTE=MP.Trey]Interesting. I saw that description and immediately thought Issel. Wasn't sure who else though. Interesting group of players.[/QUOTE]
Issel was pretty athletic for a big. He was supposed to be in the ABA dunk Contest.

[QUOTE=G.O.A.T]...Unquestionably he is beloved by fans in Detroit and bemoaned by those almost everywhere else. But let

[QUOTE=L.A. Jazz]You have for sure seen him play a lot and done a lot of research. But i dont respect players that try to hurt other players. The games i saw it looked like that and Larry Bird even said it in the interview with Bill Simmons.[/QUOTE]

I know what you mean. I heard the Simmons/Bird BS Report and I was a little surprised that Larry had not lighten up a little with time, but considering how violent their rivalry was, I'm not shocked.

I am certain many players still dislike and never really respected Laimbeer. But I wanted to point out (and feel I did with the quotes I used) that a number of players with cause to "hate" Laimbeer actually respected him.

As a Pistons fan, I admit my bias, but I am not ignorant of how others (mostly rightfully) may view Laimbeer. I just think most guys who hate him for what he did on the court would be singing a different tune if he wore the same jersey as them.

Goat why is chambers so high?
Over guys lik Lou Hudson etc

G.O.A.T, this is a tremendous thread. I used to enjoy reading your GOAT rankings back in the day (before I bothered registering), so it's great to see the biographies still going strong.

Sorry to nitpick, but I found it strange that you started a section about "nonathletic white big men" by talking about Bobby Jones. He was a great leaper! Also quite quick for his size.

Your rankings are excellent. I find myself agreeing with most of them and, where I do spot a discrepancy, I can see the logic (even if I don't necessarily agree with it). In other words, nobody appears massively overrated or underrated, but, instead, within the right tiers.

Keep up the great work.

While I don't agree with all the rankings, and I'm interested where you have Manu Ginobili and Tony Parker (last time you did this I think Parker was overrated and Manu wasn't even top-100), I can appreciate all the time and effort put into this list :cheers:

[QUOTE=WillC]G.O.A.T, this is a tremendous thread. I used to enjoy reading your GOAT rankings back in the day (before I bothered registering), so it's great to see the biographies still going strong.

Sorry to nitpick, but I found it strange that you started a section about "nonathletic white big men" by talking about Bobby Jones. He was a great leaper! Also quite quick for his size.

Your rankings are excellent. I find myself agreeing with most of them and, where I do spot a discrepancy, I can see the logic (even if I don't necessarily agree with it). In other words, nobody appears massively overrated or underrated, but, instead, within the right tiers.

Keep up the great work.[/QUOTE]

I screwed up a little. Jones was a good athlete. If you go back to my original GOAT list I mention this. But I had just got done doing these four and SPOILER ALERT: Vern Mikkelsen (who is next in my rankings) and I had quotes from all five guys talking about how they couldn't jump worth a darn.

Laimbeer said that since Bill Paultz left the league he believed he now was the worst leaper in the NBA.

Sikma said of his plyometric workouts, "Great now I can jump over two phone books instead of one."

Issel said that something about "When I was young I could outjump most of my peers, then I turned 12."

and Jones had a few...

"I couldn't do the things in the air those guys could do...I could jump when I was younger, but only with a running start, guys like Larry (Kenon) and George (McGinnis) wold ge to where I got and kept going until I cam down." - Jones in 1989

"I needed to use everything I had to keep up with the other guys at my position. They were stronger, faster and jumped better most of the time, playing less minutes meant I could go full speed whenever I was on the court."

I should have added Mikkelsen to the "White Men Can't Jump" group, not Jones, but I was sleepy and thought I had already posted the Jones article.

Bobby does not belong with those guys, but the only reason he was considered a good athlete was because he was "good for a whiteguy" which I hate.

[QUOTE=SCdac]While I don't agree with all the rankings, and I'm interested where you have Manu Ginobili and Tony Parker (last time you did this I think Parker was overrated and Manu wasn't even top-100), I can appreciate all the time and effort put into this list :cheers:[/QUOTE]

Please remember that Parker was not ranked by number, but with a group of players of like achievements. Though he was #66 on the list, I had said he may not even have been in my top 90 by pure rankings.

I have them both in this list still to come, where approximately would you rank each as a Spurs fan? And which players would you have them ranked around historically?