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MVP is the player with the best stats on the team with the best record award.
that's been the criteria
What's weird about that season is how many people advocate for Lebron being MVP but Wade is never mentioned. 26/5/7 50% shooting, was every bit as good as Lebron that season.
Dwight, Lebron and Kobe were more deserving of it than Rose.
[QUOTE=Kblaze8855]It really wasnt close. He got 113 first place votes to the rest of the leagues....8. I think Lebron got 4, Dwight 3, and Kobe 1.
They have won on a 64 win pace with him since 09/10. Without him its I wanna say 45.
But still...its everything but him. Even if they go 33-7 with him in 2012 and turn to the Hawks without him.
That winning cant be traced back to the guy who...the moment he isnt playing...the team with the leagues best record is merely...ok.[/QUOTE]
Dwight Howard only had three votes? That is the biggest robbery since The Town.
[QUOTE=Suguru101]No, it didn't. It came down to LeBron being a better overall player than Chris Paul, which ever year it was.
[B]You can make all the wins and record arguments that you want, the thing is that the MVP should go to the best player in the league if he isn't in a losing team.[/B]
That's the reason nobody respects Charles Barkley's 1993 MVP. His team had 5 more wins than the Bulls, but everybody knows that Jordan was the best player in the league and that he shoupd have won it.
LeBron, Dwight, Kobe, Wade and Nowitzki were all better players than Rose in 2011, yet he won because of his record.
That's why he shouldn't have won.[/QUOTE]
Your opinion. You are not arguing facts.
My opinion is that Chris Paul had a remarkeable season that was better than Lebron's that year. The fact is, Lebron was voted MVP and deserved it based on the criteria of an MVP.
The FACT is since 1982-83, every player who has been voted MVP except for the lockout shortened seasons has had a team win percentage above .610.
You can pump all the names out you want, but the fact is Rose did deserve MVP based on criteria and that' why he won it.
[QUOTE=poido123]It doesn't mean Rose doesn't deserve it or meet the criteria for an MVP, Rose had a team percentage over .610 which is what every MVP has had since 83'.
[B]It is arguable that Rose was the best player[/B], what you believe to be different is not FACT.[/QUOTE]
It isn't arguable that Rose was the best player in the league. He had the best team, his narrative was the most atractive, and he was fun to root for in light of the Miami situation.
Rose wasn't even arguably better than LeBron, Dwight or Kobe in 2011. Wade you could argue, but Wade was a much better defender. Dirk was just a better player.
Narrative is leading a team to 62 wins while its frontcourt starters miss 70 games......
Rose won the MVp the reason most people win it.
Win a shitload of games, be the teams obvious key player, and have other people falter at the wrong time or be worse with similar or more help.
Lebron with Wade and Bosh wins less than Rose with Deng and half a season from his frontcourt....Lebron isnt winning MVP. All anyone had was "Well the defense is the reason" and then Rose leads them to a 68 win pace in 2012 while he plays and that year and 2013 combined...they are pretty much a 5-6 seed.
64 win pace with Rose even killed by other injuries.
They are a notch up from the Bucks without him.
Thats roughly MVP impact and always has been.
Lebron had a letdown regular season and won less than he did with half the help in Cleveland and everyone with a good enough record but Kobe had stars taking credit. And Kobe had a down year. Dirk wasnt winning doing 23/7 as a power forward. He put up 22/6/ and 20/5 back to back months. He had a hot start then I believe got hurt and didnt look Dirklike for a while.
Just all fell into place.
Because he wasn't the best player in the league, not close to it, and he wasn't the most valuable player on the team.
Take away Dwight and the Magic wouldn't have been as good, probably miss playoffs.
As evident by the Bulls last season, the Bulls are still a playoff team, even a 2nd round team without Rose.
Thibs was the MVP of the team.
[QUOTE=poido123]Your opinion. You are not arguing facts.
My opinion is that Chris Paul had a remarkeable season that was better than Lebron's that year. The fact is, Lebron was voted MVP and deserved it based on the criteria of an MVP.
The FACT is, every player who has been voted MVP except for the lockout shortened seasons has had a team win percentage above .610.
You can pump all the names out you want, but the fact is Rose did deserve MVP based on criteria and that' why he won it.[/QUOTE]
Alright, that's your opinion, i'll respect it. It's just that in my opinion, the best player in the league should win it, as long as he was on a winning team.
That's why i think Nash shouldn't have won MVPs, Barkley shouldn't have won MVPs, Malone in 1997 shouldn't have won over Jordan, and Rose shouldn't have won over LeBron and Dwight in 2011.
Let's agree to disagree. :cheers:
[QUOTE]That's the reason nobody respects Charles Barkley's 1993 MVP. His team had 5 more wins than the Bulls, but everybody knows that Jordan was the best player in the league and that he shoupd have won it.[/QUOTE]
Funny. I remember 1993.
Barkley deserving MVP really wasnt even that argued.
Jordan didnt even come in second.
People were never that upset over that.
97 was the bad year. Second most wins ever...the best player...still doesnt get it.
93?
Jordan was the best player. He wasnt that strong an MVP choice. And people were hardly up in arms over it.
[QUOTE=poido123]I expected something a bit more mature than that.
There was a season in which Lebron had won MVP with the Cavs and I was convinced Chris Paul deserved it, but it came down to the wins column of the team. Same goes for Rose, the last 30 years, it has nearly always gone to the player with a superior team record.[/QUOTE]
I don't understand your first comment, but ok. The biggest reason why Rose won it is because he had the best record in the NBA.
Rose wasn't the best player in the NBA in 2011. The MVP doesn't always go to the best player in the league or LeBron would have won in 2011. I don't have a problem with Rose getting the MVP. He was a young new star, and the media credited him for leading his team to the best record in the NBA. He was not better than LeBron or Howard. The award goes to the most [B]valuable[/B] player, and Rose clearly made big plays and helped win them many games with big shots and plays.
Now whether Howard was more valuable to the Magic than Rose was to the Bulls is a legitimate argument, but Rose deserved it.
After Nash won back to back MVP's I stopped caring about the award completely.
[QUOTE=Kblaze8855]Funny. I remember 1993.
Barkley deserving MVP really wasnt even that argued.
Jordan didnt even come in second.
People were never that upset over that.
97 was the bad year. Second most wins ever...the best player...still doesnt get it.
93?
Jordan was the best player. He wasnt that strong an MVP choice. And people were hardly up in arms over it.[/QUOTE]
Of course nobody complained as it was happening, because the narrative was unfolding. But when you look at it now, objectively and with perspective, most would agree that Jordan should have won.
Not that Barkley was undeserving, but that Jordan should have taken the trophy. Same in 2006, the narrative was:
"Nash makes everyone better, amazing teammate, unselfish, blah blah blah..."
But when anybody with good basketball knowledge looks at Nash's MVPs now, we know that Shaq should have won in 2005, and Kobe in 2006.
[QUOTE=Suguru101]Alright, that's your opinion, i'll respect it. It's just that in my opinion, the best player in the league should win it, as long as he was on a winning team.
That's why i think Nash shouldn't have won MVPs, Barkley shouldn't have won MVPs, Malone in 1997 shouldn't have won over Jordan, and Rose shouldn't have won over LeBron and Dwight in 2011.
Let's agree to disagree. :cheers:[/QUOTE]
:cheers: Not worth getting a headache over.
I'm just pumped to see a new season of basketball, this offseason is killing me.
[QUOTE=bdreason]After Nash won back to back MVP's I stopped caring about the award completely.[/QUOTE]
I don't really care that much about the award either, but I just think it's funny how people on here think it was blasphemous that Rose won it.
[QUOTE=Electric Slide]Because he wasn't the best player in the league, not close to it, and he wasn't the most valuable player on the team.
Take away Dwight and the Magic wouldn't have been as good, probably miss playoffs.
As evident by the Bulls last season, the Bulls are still a playoff team, even a 2nd round team without Rose.
Thibs was the MVP of the team.[/QUOTE]
The 76ers won 57 without Wilt, Bulls 55 without Jordan, Celtics made the playoffs without Bird, and the Bucks won the exact same number of games without Kareem when he left for LA.
Problem with any of their MVPs?
The Bulls minus rose fell off by more than most teams would minus the MVP. The Heat sure as hell arent a 45 win team without Lebron.
Doesnt seem anyone cares.