1990-1992 Michael Jordan Shot Chart

[QUOTE=andgar923]
Zone? he'd laugh at it and spit on it. It actually plays to his strengths, creating tons of mismatch opportunities because he was skilled AND smart enough to dissect it with precision. [/QUOTE]
He torched zones in the Olympics before he was even a pro. One of the most slept on aspects of MJ's game is his ability to pass, and read defenses. If he got doubled, or tripled, he'd quickly pass then cut to negate the double team. I never see: Kobe, LeBron, Wade, or Durant do that.

He didn't need to do everything ball in hand like a lot of today's stars. Which makes his numbers all the more impressive. He could catch and shoot while moving with great proficiency. He set better picks than these guys too. No defense as you said could stop him. To take it even further he's like this:

LeBron's efficiency, finishing ability
Wade's off the dribble quickness, help side defense
Kobe's offensive skill set, jumper, man defense
Durant's catch and shoot ability

An absolute headache for any defensive scheme.

51% from midrange. :bowdown:

[QUOTE=bdreason]51% from midrange. :bowdown:[/QUOTE]

What makes that stat meaningful to me is the type of defense he did it against.

Remember centers and big men were able to camp in the paint, there was more 'enforcers' back then, the league as a whole was more physical. But more importantly, he didn't have a big that could draw attention. There was NO offensive threat in the post or basically anywhere outside a wide open BJ or Pax. Teams didn't cover Pip, they usually sagged off him. So the defensive attention that he drew was more than every player he's been compared to (or player that's been compared to him).

MJ is arguably the most double/triple teamed player of all time.

He just wasn't dumb enough to allow himself to get trapped. As the chart point out, he was quick at making decisions and executing which made it difficult for teams to trap him effectively.

So whatever numbers are being shown, one must take that into consideration.

[quote=tpols]Hmm.. seems like Jordan's only real weakness is creation through PnR and [B]long range baseline shots.[/B][/quote]

It is almost the opposite in 1997-98

[URL="http://stats.nba.com/playerShotchart.html?PlayerID=893&Season=1997-98"]http://stats.nba.com/playerShotchart.html?PlayerID=893&Season=1997-98[/URL]


[quote]Phila is there any reason why there's only 126 games from the total sample of 300 from 90-92?[/quote]
Those are just the games I could find on the internet.

Surprised (but not really given the Lebron slurping over there) that there is so little discussion of this in the topic you created at that other forum.

His 74.3% at-rim FG% is ABSURD, and is higher than all but one of Lebron ("the best finisher of all-time" :rolleyes: ) James' seasons, on a comparable number of attempts per game (~6.7 FGA at the rim per game compared to 6.6-6.9 for Lebron most seasons). Then keep in mind that he was doing this in an era where the paint was FAR more packed, with MUCH worse spacing that what Lebron has enjoyed in both Cleveland and especially Miami, with LEGIT big men inside waiting to block shots or take hard fouls, and it's pretty clear that Jordan is either the best finisher of all time (an argument I and most other knowledgeable fans have long maintained) or on the VERY short list of them.

Don't even get started on his mid-range FG%, which is similarly crazy. His percentages take a dump on Lebron despite taking 5 more midrange shots per game, and they are also significantly better than prime Kobe's midrange numbers on 2+ more attempts per game. Disgusting.

Really glad you took the time to do this, since it's good to have data to support what is pretty easily observable.

[quote]it's pretty clear that Jordan is either the best finisher of all time (an argument I and most other knowledgeable fans have long maintained) or on the VERY short list of them.[/quote]

I would say Barkley, though he is a clear outlier. Even Shaq wasn't finishing at Barkley's efficiency.

[url]http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=8769975&postcount=41[/url]

[URL="http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=312709"]http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=312709[/URL]

In the 84 game sample he shot 81% at the rim, though he went up strong with [SIZE=3][B]two hands[/B][/SIZE] almost every single time, thus reducing the chance of him missing easy shots every now and then. I can't even recall him doing a one handed dunk. Everything around the basket was a powerful two handed finish.



In this video below he powers through the attempted trap like it is a practice drill.

[URL="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CmjUpA3UVlA&t=3m3s"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CmjUpA3UVlA&t=3m3s[/URL]

[QUOTE=OldSchoolBBall]Surprised (but not really given the Lebron slurping over there) that there is so little discussion of this in the topic you created at that other forum.

[B]His 74.3% at-rim FG% is ABSURD[/B], and is higher than all but one of Lebron ("the best finisher of all-time" :rolleyes: ) James' seasons, on a comparable number of attempts per game (~6.7 FGA at the rim per game compared to 6.6-6.9 for Lebron most seasons). Then keep in mind that he was doing this in an era where the paint was FAR more packed, with MUCH worse spacing that what Lebron has enjoyed in both Cleveland and especially Miami, with LEGIT big men inside waiting to block shots or take hard fouls, and it's pretty clear that Jordan is either the best finisher of all time (an argument I and most other knowledgeable fans have long maintained) or on the VERY short list of them.

Don't even get started on his mid-range FG%, which is similarly crazy. His percentages take a dump on Lebron despite taking 5 more midrange shots per game, and they are also significantly better than prime Kobe's midrange numbers on 2+ more attempts per game. Disgusting.

Really glad you took the time to do this, since it's good to have data to support what is pretty easily observable.[/QUOTE]

Lebron only had two seasons above Jordan's 74.3% at the rim.

[QUOTE=PHILA][B]On Court ORtg:[/B] 123.9

[B]Off Court ORtg:[/B] 88.3

[B]Net ORtg:[/B] +35.6[/QUOTE]:eek:


51% midrange jumper (on 1500+ attempts)? Unbelievable.

Thank you for taking the time to do this, we really appreciate it.

GOAT gonna GOAT.

[QUOTE=scm5]Lebron only had two seasons above Jordan's 74.3% at the rim.[/QUOTE]

No, he only had one season (2013). The current season of 14 games or whatever is not a full season.

[QUOTE=PHILA]I would say Barkley, though he is a clear outlier. Even Shaq wasn't finishing at Barkley's efficiency. [/QUOTE]

Yeah, Barkley (and of course Shaq) was monstrous inside. Barkley is a favorite of mine. I meant among wing players.

Like a boss :applause: :bowdown:

Great work, OP!

?? am i missing something these arent stats for 1 full seasons, rather just a selection of his best streaks

[QUOTE=inclinerator]?? am i missing something these arent stats for 1 full seasons, rather just a selection of his best streaks[/QUOTE]

Err, no, it's a (more than) representative sample over 3 full seasons. It's essentially a season and a half's worth of data. It's not "his best streaks" nor is it cherry picked.

[QUOTE=PHILA]I would say Barkley, though he is a clear outlier. Even Shaq wasn't finishing at Barkley's efficiency.

[url]http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=8769975&postcount=41[/url]

[URL="http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=312709"]http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=312709[/URL]

In the 84 game sample he shot 81% at the rim, though he went up strong with [SIZE=3][B]two hands[/B][/SIZE] almost every single time, thus reducing the chance of him missing easy shots every now and then. I can't even recall him doing a one handed dunk. Everything around the basket was a powerful two handed finish.



In this video below he powers through the attempted trap like it is a practice drill.

[URL="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CmjUpA3UVlA&t=3m3s"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CmjUpA3UVlA&t=3m3s[/URL][/QUOTE]


:bowdown: :applause: :rockon: :pimp:

[QUOTE=andgar923]Basically what some of us have been saying for eons.

if you combined the best of Kobe at his best
The best of Bron at his best
And the best of Wade at his best

You get MJ[/QUOTE]


Essentially.

[QUOTE=OldSchoolBBall]No, he only had one season (2013). The current season of 14 games or whatever is not a full season.
[/QUOTE]

[url]http://www.hoopdata.com/player.aspx?name=LeBron%20James[/url]

75.4 in 2012
78.3 last season.

I don't know what his percentages are this season.