[QUOTE=RRR3;15030701]Looks like only the least knowledgeable posters of ISH when it comes to basketball think Kobe is better.[/QUOTE]
John8204 voted for Kobe so that isn't true.
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[QUOTE=RRR3;15030701]Looks like only the least knowledgeable posters of ISH when it comes to basketball think Kobe is better.[/QUOTE]
John8204 voted for Kobe so that isn't true.
[QUOTE=SouBeachTalents;15030704]John8204 voted for Kobe so that isn't true.[/QUOTE]
True where would we be without his genius takes like Stockton>Shaq?
Snivelball voted for Kobe. In case you needed any more proof Jokic is better.
Snivelly, how come Jokic has far better PER WS BPM and VORP? Your favorite stats apparently. And how come Jokic didn’t need allstars to win unlike Kobe. Be consistent snivelly :no:
[QUOTE=Overdrive;15030646]What exactly except ballhandling is Kobe better at? Yeah Jokič is slower, but he's more effective while scoring at the same clip on average. Better rebounder, better passer. So all Kobe has on Jokič is fanciness. Kobe's defense outside the 3 peat years is massively overrated.[/QUOTE]
"More effective at scoring..." :oldlol:
He's so effective yet he couldn't figure out how to beat Alex Caruso. He's so effective yet he relies on Jamal Murray half the time.
Your grandpa could score at higher efficiency in this era. Look at Bron and Durant, old and injured as fukk but more "efficient" than they were during their primes.
Here is what Ty Lue had to say about MJ just a few days ago when asked how many he would average today:
[B]"Today? 45," Lue said confidently when asked how many points Jordan would average today. "You can't touch nobody. It's a foul. ... There wouldn't be a year he wouldn't average 45. You can't touch nobody now. The physicality's pretty much gone. Anything, you're going to the free throw line, and just how smart he was. Especially nowadays, you can take advantage of these guys just as far as IQ alone."[/B]
Considering Kobe is the closest thing we've seen to MJ, both in terms of talent and killer mindset, it's safe to say those same things apply.
Jay-Z has a famous lyric "do you fools listen to music or do you just skim through it..."
Here it's more like "do you fools actually watch basketball or do you just look at numbers after the fact..."
Because only a number obsessed dork could watch Kobe dominate in real time, rack up all these championships... and then look at his numbers AFTER THE FACT and determine he was no good.
And to add insult to injury, they're not even real numbers. They're made up advanced statistics. Frankenstein numbers that carry no significance.
[QUOTE=RRR3;15030651]xRAPM has Kobe ranked 21st percentile as a defender for his career :lol[/QUOTE]
Where does it rank Klay Thompson?
[QUOTE=Baller234;15030801]"More effective at scoring..." :oldlol:
He's so effective yet he couldn't figure out how to beat Alex Caruso. He's so effective yet he relies on Jamal Murray half the time.
Your grandpa could score at higher efficiency in this era. Look at Bron and Durant, old and injured as fukk but more "efficient" than they were during their primes.
Here is what Ty Lue had to say about MJ just a few days ago when asked how many he would average today:
[B]"Today? 45," Lue said confidently when asked how many points Jordan would average today. "You can't touch nobody. It's a foul. ... There wouldn't be a year he wouldn't average 45. You can't touch nobody now. The physicality's pretty much gone. Anything, you're going to the free throw line, and just how smart he was. Especially nowadays, you can take advantage of these guys just as far as IQ alone."[/B]
Considering Kobe is the closest thing we've seen to MJ, both in terms of talent and killer mindset, it's safe to say those same things apply.
Jay-Z has a famous lyric "do you fools listen to music or do you just skim through it..."
Here it's more like "do you fools actually watch basketball or do you just look at numbers after the fact..."
Because only a number obsessed dork could watch Kobe dominate in real time, rack up all these championships... and then look at his numbers AFTER THE FACT and determine he was no good.
And to add insult to injury, they're not even real numbers. They're made up advanced statistics. Frankenstein numbers that carry no significance.[/QUOTE]
You keep citing Caruso while it's not like Kobe qasn't locked down multiple times during whole series.
Also Kobe was good. Just not as good as Jokič is and I watched Kobe "grow up".
[QUOTE=Baller234;15030801]"More effective at scoring..." :oldlol:
He's so effective yet he couldn't figure out how to beat Alex Caruso. He's so effective yet he relies on Jamal Murray half the time.
Your grandpa could score at higher efficiency in this era. Look at Bron and Durant, old and injured as fukk but more "efficient" than they were during their primes.
Here is what Ty Lue had to say about MJ just a few days ago when asked how many he would average today:
[B]"Today? 45," Lue said confidently when asked how many points Jordan would average today. "You can't touch nobody. It's a foul. ... There wouldn't be a year he wouldn't average 45. You can't touch nobody now. The physicality's pretty much gone. Anything, you're going to the free throw line, and just how smart he was. Especially nowadays, you can take advantage of these guys just as far as IQ alone."[/B]
Considering Kobe is the closest thing we've seen to MJ, both in terms of talent and killer mindset, it's safe to say those same things apply.
Jay-Z has a famous lyric "do you fools listen to music or do you just skim through it..."
Here it's more like "do you fools actually watch basketball or do you just look at numbers after the fact..."
Because only a number obsessed dork could watch Kobe dominate in real time, rack up all these championships... and then look at his numbers AFTER THE FACT and determine he was no good.
And to add insult to injury, they're not even real numbers. They're made up advanced statistics. Frankenstein numbers that carry no significance.[/QUOTE]
Make the case for Kobe with facts not whiny emotional meltdowns please.
[QUOTE=RRR3;15030811]Make the case for Kobe with facts not whiny emotional meltdowns please.[/QUOTE]
What applies to MJ applies to Kobe
I didn't know Lue said all that - so it shows that everyone knows previous eras were better basketball players with superior hoops instinct, IQ and toughness
[QUOTE=3ba11;15030842]What applies to MJ applies to Kobe
I didn't know Lue said all that - so it shows that everyone knows previous eras were better basketball players with superior hoops instinct, IQ and toughness[/QUOTE]
Kobe had a terrible basketball IQ, he chucked up horrid shots like a madman. Next.
Meanwhile the stats you always use have Jokic FAR ahead.
Kobe career high BPM: 7.6 Jokic AVERAGE BPM: 10.3
Kobe career high PER: 28.0 Jokic AVERAGE PER: 28.5
Kobe career high WS/48: .224 Jokic AVERAGE WS/48: .260
:yaohappy:
poor poor POOOOR snivelly
Soooooo, what does DRAPM say about Klay? lol
[QUOTE=warriorfan;15030852]Soooooo, what does DRAPM say about Klay? lol[/QUOTE]
Stay on topic please this is about Jokic and Kobe
[QUOTE=3ba11;15030842]What applies to MJ applies to Kobe
I didn't know Lue said all that - so it shows that everyone knows previous eras were better basketball players with superior hoops instinct, IQ and toughness[/QUOTE]
No, it does simply not. Kobe was worse than Jordan at everything but shooting 3s.
[QUOTE=Overdrive;15030869]No, it does simply not. Kobe was worse than Jordan at everything but shooting 3s.[/QUOTE]
What's wild to me is you could never convince me Kobe was discernably better at his peak than guys like Kawhi & Wade, yet people try to lump him in with Jordan when he's clearly not on his level either all time or peak wise.
I honestly can't think of another athlete people try so hard to elevate to a level he doesn't belong at like Kobe, they frankly do a disservice to him by trying to do that.
[quote=soubeachtalents;15030871]what's wild to me is you could never convince me kobe was discernably better at his peak than guys like kawhi & wade, yet people try to lump him in with jordan when he's clearly not on his level either all time or peak wise.
I honestly can't think of another athlete people try so hard to elevate to a level he doesn't belong at like kobe, they frankly do a disservice to him trying to do that.[/quote]
5 rangz
[QUOTE=SouBeachTalents;15030871]What's wild to me is you could never convince me Kobe was discernably better at his peak than guys like Kawhi & Wade, yet people try to lump him in with Jordan when he's clearly not on his level either all time or peak wise.
I honestly can't think of another athlete people try so hard to elevate to a level he doesn't belong at like Kobe, they frankly do a disservice to him by trying to do that.[/QUOTE]
He wasn't leaps better, but he was definitely better.
Wade was quicker than Kobe and faster off the dribble no question, but he didn't have the same raw fundamentals. With Kawhi it's the opposite. He has the fundamentals but Kobe is more crafty and creative.
They're both great players. The gap between them and Kobe isn't big at all. We're splitting hairs.
But I'm still giving Kobe the edge over them if forced to choose. Neither of them were visibly "better" and neither of them have the resume or the results to prove it.