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[QUOTE=Maniuchi]I am watching the game againts freaking minnesota and this guy cant do anything , f..............ing paxson another dumb move not picking beasley[/QUOTE]
Wow. Can you say "Panick Mode"? It's like the fourth game of pre-season and he's not even doing badly. RELAX!
Rose is going to be special. I can see the upside, he just needs a season to get his feet wet in this league like Chris Paul.
[QUOTE=jbot]everybody has bad games, geez. u can't write this kid off so soon but there's bound to be haters towards a high draft pick that's not playing a perfect game every day. :rolleyes:[/QUOTE]
The bad part is he had a decent game!
26 mins
9 pts
4-7 shooting
7 assists
I said before that he could be what Steve Francis used to be. A 20/6/6 kind of guy. The Jason Kidd comparisons that Jay Bilas gave out are probably what have people calling him a bust.
like colin cowherd says if it smells like a duck quacks like a dunk shyts like a duck its a duck.
1 bad games ok 2 bad games ok 3 bad games now its a trend.
Rose has show us nothing in any of his summer league and preseason games, why because that is what he is. ex Darko each year he suxed dic we all saw that and that was what he was, but experts were like give him time.
While Beastley and Mayo and Oden have been doing there things
youll was bashing Mayo after his 5-17 performance then he comes back and goes 6-8 3pt land
Rose high was 14pts then the rest have been around 6-10pts a game and i aint heard shyt about it
[QUOTE=Posterize246]The bad part is he had a decent game!
26 mins
9 pts
4-7 shooting
7 assists
I said before that he could be what Steve Francis used to be. A 20/6/6 kind of guy. The Jason Kidd comparisons that Jay Bilas gave out are probably what have people calling him a bust.[/QUOTE]
yeah, the kidd comparison is way too early to be speaking about. given some time, i think this kid will produce. i think he will become the bulls' leader.
I think he's more Steve Francis like in his prime than Jason Kidd.
[QUOTE=Vendetta]Did I just read someone say that speed and explosiveness are SKILLS? Hahaha... just when I thought this place couldn't get any dumber. Oh well.[/QUOTE]
Physical skills... athletic abilities.... poe-tay-toe... poe-tah-toe... toe-may-toe... toe-mah-toe...
Did you not read the entire post or something? How did you not recognize that I broke skills down into three distinct categories?
[QUOTE=Samurai Swoosh]I think he's more Steve Francis like in his prime than Jason Kidd.[/QUOTE]
Steve Francis in his prime was a bad man yeah Drose aint no JKidd he like a Unaccomplished Steve Francis skill wise
you guys got kwame'd.
Derrick Rose's career path will in no way resemble Kwame Brown's. He definitely proved himself at the college level, which Kwame never did before the Wizards wasted a pick on him.
That is a ridiculous statement.
I don't see him turning out like Steve Francis either, I think he is smarter than that. He will be, like many have said, a top point guard in this league in 3-5 years.
The Bulls may have been better going with Beasley, but Rose is certainly not a bust. He hasn't even played a regular season game yet, he'll be a great point guard.
Not a bust yet -.- One game hasnt even been played yet.. but he wont be a bust, jsut wont be a succesful #1 pick in his first year.
Let's give this kid some time to prove himself. I'm sure he won't be a bust even though he'll never be as good as Beasley. I'd say he'll probably improve into the next Chauncey Billups.
[QUOTE=Kiddlovesnets]Let's give this kid some time to prove himself. I'm sure he won't be a bust even though he'll never be as good as Beasley. I'd say he'll probably improve into the next Chauncey Billups.[/QUOTE]
More athletic and faster, so how about an improved Chauncey Billups if that is the direction you want to take? That actually sounds okay to me, considering how strong he is, but you can't see he has, may never have, as nice a jumper as Billups.
[QUOTE=out|hoops|side]More athletic and faster, so how about an improved Chauncey Billups if that is the direction you want to take? That actually sounds okay to me, considering how strong he is, but you can't see he has, may never have, as nice a jumper as Billups.[/QUOTE]
Improved? So he'll lead Chicago to a championship in 4-5 years, be Finals MVP, get to a second finals, and a 3-4 time all star? That would actually just be mathing Billups. He'd have to win 2 championships, get to another, and be a 4-5 time all star to be an "improved billups."
[QUOTE=DeuceWallaces]Improved? So he'll lead Chicago to a championship in 4-5 years, be Finals MVP, get to a second finals, and a 3-4 time all star? That would actually just be mathing Billups. He'd have to win 2 championships, get to another, and be a 4-5 time all star to be an "improved billups."[/QUOTE]
In terms of his game, lol. So fast to attack that statement, hey? Like when a scout says, he'll be a poor man's [insert name], that doesn't mean he will achieve half as many or three quarters as many awards or accomplishments that the player gets.
I mean improved Billups because he is more athletic and faster, although with much less of a jumper. Or I could say, "a richer man's Chauncey Billups".
he can start with trying to become as good as stuckey for now, focus on the billups part a little later :)
I'm acting as a "scout" here, I say best case scenario "rich man's Billups".
Which doesn't mean take Chauncey's accomplishments and multiply them by 2 to the power of 3.
[QUOTE=out|hoops|side]I'm acting as a "scout" here, I say best case scenario "rich man's Billups".
Which doesn't mean take Chauncey's accomplishments and multiply them by 2 to the power of 3.[/QUOTE]
The accomplishment of said players should be taken into account. If he's an improved Billups he should be able to improve on Billups' accomplishments.
hmmm Francis is the best comparison to me. Not a bad thing, cos an injury free Francis with a great attitude would have been considered an all time great PG.
Yeah I dont see any comparison with Billups. Except for maybe the time it will take for him to develop.
Did I just hear people say that Rose is going to be a rich man's Billups? I'm sorry, I see zero similarities between their games. Billups is a great shooter and doesn't rely on athleticism at all while Rose is still all athleticism with very poor shooting ability for a guy of his size. The closest comparison would be Steve Francis, but Francis was more talented coming into the league than Derrick Rose.
old school stephon marbury? when he was sickkk
[QUOTE=DULLAH]Co-Sign.
Francis, despite his poor shot-selection, was a much better shooter than Rose. Folks are really over looking just how bad a shooter Rose is. When we factor in how many transition buckets Rose got at memphis, and then look at his shooting %, we have to wonder what it woulda been w/o all them layups.
DIfferences:
#1. Billups is taller, and plays much taller.
#2. Billups always had a post game.
#3. Billups was always a GREAT shooter, dating back to 5-star camp.
#4. Billups has always been a smart player.
#5. Billups has always had excellent floor vision and passing.
#6. Rose is much quicker.
#7. Rose can jump much higher.
If I forgot anything, please add.....[/QUOTE]
since when are quickness and jumping ability a bad thing?
Rose is a better playmaker
Maybe you didnt know Chauncy before he got to Detroit when he had FG PCTs of .374, .382, .422 etc. granted he has always had the long range shot Chauncey has taken his share of bad shots. If Chauncey was directing a less talented squad as the PG he would have a more difficult time as a playmaker. he is not very dynamic in the open court. I've always liked Chauncy but he aint Isiah Thomas.
All the things that are wrong with Rose can be fixed and he can get streaky with his shot. Rose definitely plays bigger than his height and he finishes STRONG. good court vision and capable of being a solid defender. we shall see...
oh as for Francis he had loads of talent but when it comes to basketball IQs, Rose has him totally outclassed.
How about completely overlooking two glaring similarities between Billups and Rose?
I said rich man's Billups minus the shot is the best case scenario for Rose, read the post properly please. That doesn't mean that is where he is at now.
But, similarities:
Both use superior strength to finish and against other point guards.
Both use their bodies well when playing, to score.
Right now Rose not as good a playmaker or point guard or shooter, but that's why I say best-case scenario rich-man's Billups because Rose could definitely get to that level in 3-5 years.
When I watch Rose, I just see a slightly quicker version of Devin Harris.
Both have a weak outside game and iffy jumper, but can get into the lane with their quickness and are decent passers. Like I've said before... if they can get Harris type numbers (14PPG, 6AST, 1.2STL, 38%FG, 23%3PT) out of him by the end of this season... thats good enough.
It will give the team options over the summer.
[QUOTE=beasted86]When I watch Rose, I just see a slightly quicker version of Devin Harris.
Both have a weak outside game and iffy jumper, but can get into the lane with their quickness and are decent passers. Like I've said before... if they can get Harris type numbers ([B]14PPG, 6AST, 1.2STL, 38%FG, 23%3PT[/B]) out of him by the end of this season... thats good enough.
It will give the team options over the summer.[/QUOTE]
I think rose will be somewhere around that area in his rookie season, to be frank we suck right now, we don't have a good team period and unless a few big trades go down we won't be good for another few years when bad contracts expire and our younger talent reaches it's so called potential ( I'm still not convinced TT will amount to anything). however with the re-signing of Deng which I am very pleased about and the potential of rose and his work ethic I think we have a good 1-2 punch in the making.
Paxson needs to go, his poor judgement and deccison making completely over shadow his successes. I'm not expecting big things from chicago this year other then Deng and Rose to show that they will lead the team.
I think of Rose as more of a Starbury with a winner's mentality.
If we had a better team identity, things would be better for Rose's quick development. He adapts to talent levels very quickly. And they have said he's been the best player for the Bulls in camp. Move some of those guards off the roster, and give him more one v one scenarios handling the rock at the top of the key and his numbers will sky rocket. It could be seen at the end of the game against the T-Wolves. He needs some freedom for his style of play. And with all the slew of weak ass forwards, chucking guards (only to get worse with BG) ... everyone stands on the permiter instead of being a man about things and taking the ball to the cup. Rose will provide this but he couldn't, cause when watching the game, the defense is forcing the team to shoot jumpers cause all the other weak ass Bulls players are so willing to do so. There was a help defender on virtually every move Rose made.
[QUOTE=out|hoops|side]How about completely overlooking two glaring similarities between Billups and Rose?
I said rich man's Billups minus the shot is the best case scenario for Rose, read the post properly please. That doesn't mean that is where he is at now.
But, similarities:
Both use superior strength to finish and against other point guards.
Both use their bodies well when playing, to score.
Right now Rose not as good a playmaker or point guard or shooter, but that's why I say best-case scenario rich-man's Billups because Rose could definitely get to that level in 3-5 years.[/QUOTE]
Why compare to Billups, whose game isn't similar to Rose at all, when you have much better comparisons in Steve Francis or Devin Harris? Rose's game is based on his athleticism and he's at his best when he pushes the ball, while Billups is a traditional half court point guard who doesn't have any flash in his game. I don't think I've seen worse comparison that yours in a very long time.
Derrick Rose will be a stronger less likely to chuck TJ Ford. Drawing a blank on a better player to accurately describe that but.... :confusedshrug:
[QUOTE=Samurai Swoosh]If we had a better team identity, things would be better for Rose's quick development. He adapts to talent levels very quickly. And[B] they have said he's been the best player for the Bulls in camp[/B]. Move some of those guards off the roster, and give him more one v one scenarios handling the rock at the top of the key and his numbers will sky rocket. It could be seen at the end of the game against the T-Wolves. He needs some freedom for his style of play. And with all the slew of weak ass forwards, chucking guards (only to get worse with BG) ... everyone stands on the permiter instead of being a man about things and taking the ball to the cup. Rose will provide this but he couldn't, cause when watching the game, the defense is forcing the team to shoot jumpers cause all the other weak ass Bulls players are so willing to do so. There was a help defender on virtually every move Rose made.[/QUOTE]
Not surprising, Luol Deng is the best player on the Bulls and he is a third option at best.
[QUOTE=Human Error]Why compare to Billups, whose game isn't similar to Rose at all, when you have much better comparisons in Steve Francis or Devin Harris? Rose's game is based on his athleticism and he's at his best when he pushes the ball, while Billups is a traditional half court point guard who doesn't have any flash in his game. I don't think I've seen worse comparison that yours in a very long time.[/QUOTE]
The comparison is because kiddlovesnets said this:
[QUOTE=kiddlovesnets]Let's give this kid some time to prove himself. I'm sure he won't be a bust even though he'll never be as good as Beasley. I'd say he'll probably improve into the next Chauncey Billups.[/QUOTE]
So I said:
[QUOTE=out|hoops|side]More athletic and faster, so how about an improved Chauncey Billups if that is the direction you want to take? That actually sounds okay to me, considering how strong he is, but you can't see he has, may never have, as nice a jumper as Billups.[/QUOTE]
Then DeuceWallaces bashed me:
[QUOTE=DeuceWallaces]Improved? So he'll lead Chicago to a championship in 4-5 years, be Finals MVP, get to a second finals, and a 3-4 time all star? That would actually just be mathing Billups. He'd have to win 2 championships, get to another, and be a 4-5 time all star to be an "improved billups."[/QUOTE]
I responded, and started calling him a rich man's Chauncey:
[QUOTE=out|hoops|side]In terms of his game, lol. So fast to attack that statement, hey? Like when a scout says, he'll be a poor man's [insert name], that doesn't mean he will achieve half as many or three quarters as many awards or accomplishments that the player gets.
I mean improved Billups because he is more athletic and faster, although with much less of a jumper. Or I could say, "a richer man's Chauncey Billups".[/QUOTE]
That is how I just started comparing them, yes I can see he is more like Devin Harris or Stevie Franchise. I was just making a point before and then just started calling him rich man's Billups.
But, their games are some what similar in terms of strength and how they use that strength plus their bodies to their advantage to make plays and to score.
He is the middle class man's Devin Harris :eek:.
i think rose is stronger since he can bench 375 and squat 600
[QUOTE=inclinerator]i think rose is stronger since he can bench 375 and squat 600[/QUOTE]
What? Where the hell did you get those numbers from?
Rose will be a bigger Tony Parker...shooting threes as a pg is SO overrated
[QUOTE=CelticForce1349]What? Where the hell did you get those numbers from?[/QUOTE]
I'd be interested as well. If true, that's pretty impressive.
[QUOTE=Da KO King]Derrick Rose will be a stronger less likely to chuck TJ Ford. Drawing a blank on a better player to accurately describe that but.... :confusedshrug:[/QUOTE]
Uh no ... just ... no. Your self proclaimed knowledge of the game is just, WOW, LOL ...