ESPN article blasts "has-been" Jordan for Kobe comments

[QUOTE=the_wise_one]How is Jordan being disrespectful to Kobe? If anything, he's being too kind.[/QUOTE]
That's what I'm saying.

He didn't insult him in any way. But these Kobe groupies are all butt hurt because Jordan didn't say he was better than him. That wouldn't be true anyway, so what's the problem?

All Kobe fans thinks he's a top 5 or top one player. So that would automatically make him a top 10 guard. Where's the problem with that?

These Kobe groupies need to get over themselves. Seriously.

[QUOTE=Glide2keva]That's what I'm saying.

He didn't insult him in any way. But these Kobe groupies are all butt hurt because Jordan didn't say he was better than him. That wouldn't be true anyway, so what's the problem?

All Kobe fans thinks he's a top 5 or top one player. So that would automatically make him a top 10 guard. Where's the problem with that?

These Kobe groupies need to get over themselves. Seriously.[/QUOTE]

i'm not a kobe groupie (not even really a fan), but you're plea copping...we both know what jordan meant when he said kobe is a top 10 guard of all time.

it's like saying hendrix is in the top 100 guitarists of all time. not untrue, but disrespectful nevertheless

[QUOTE=Extempo][url]http://espn.go.com/espn/page2/index?id=5695896[/url]

:cheers: Love it.[/QUOTE]

Comparing Kobe to MJ is like comparing Aerosmith to the Stones. They're a good knockoff, but at the end of the day their still just a knockoff.

[QUOTE=tpols]What do you mean? Jordan never had a deadly 3 ball to the extent kobe has one. Kobe can go lights out with double digit 3 pointers in a game and that greatly helps in amassing a huge point total. Think about it. It's 50% more points with way less effort than driving or working out of the post. It's pretty much the reason kobe has had bigger scoring explosions than jordan.[/QUOTE]

In the regular season. Kobe's "style" works perfectly in the regular season. Not so much in the playoffs. The most explosive regular season scorer couldn't manage more than 50 points even once in 198 playoff games. And only scored 50 once. A dude that scored 81 points in a game...and 65 through 3 quarters in another isn't capable of topping 50 in the playoffs. Why is that?

MJ, a much less explosive scorer as has been proven on ISH, did this 6 times.

SInce MJ said he wouldn't have done what Lebron did, ESPN has occasional blog posts, articles, etc. taking little shots at him. It's gay. I'm sorry he doesn't worship Lebron but it's MJ. MJ STILL thinks he is the best, i mean right now. That type of delusion is common for all time greats.

why do ppl keep saying kobe is a better scorer than jordan? last time i checked jordan has the highes ppg average in the regular season and the playoffs. He has more scoring titles, higher single season ppg.

[QUOTE=Da_Realist]In the regular season. Kobe's "style" works perfectly in the regular season. Not so much in the playoffs. The most explosive regular season scorer couldn't manage more than 50 points even once in 198 playoff games. And only scored 50 once. A dude that scored 81 points in a game...and 65 through 3 quarters in another isn't capable of topping 50 in the playoffs. Why is that?

MJ, a much less explosive scorer as has been proven on ISH, did this 6 times.[/QUOTE]
Yea and all those games came in the first round or when his team wasn't winning shit. Kobe routinely rapes the first couple rounds (as was the case this year) but all I ever hear is how he can't perform in the finals.

There's a whole lot of thought going into what he said, don't think it should nor did i think it would get this much attention but anyway. As another poster said it's MJ, who cares what he says because he earned the right to say it... At the same time that doesn't necessarily make it non disrespectful.

Anyway with that said i'm thinking it was said more to stir things up and keep himself in the news then it was a stab at kobe, but that's just my opinion:cheers:

Poorly written article.

[QUOTE=tpols]Yea and all those games came in the first round or when his team wasn't winning shit. Kobe routinely rapes the first couple rounds (as was the case this year) but all I ever hear is how he can't perform in the finals.[/QUOTE]

55 points in the 93' Finals.

54 points in the 93' ECF.

Both of these do not match your posts qualifiers.

[QUOTE=tpols]Yea and all those games came in the first round or when his team wasn't winning shit. Kobe routinely rapes the first couple rounds (as was the case this year) but all I ever hear is how he can't perform in the finals.[/QUOTE]

1986 First Round -- 63 vs Celtics (lost game, lost series)

1988 First Round -- 55 vs Cavaliers (won game, won series)

1992 First Round -- 56 vs Heat (won game, won series)

1993 Conference Semis -- 54 vs Knicks (won game, won series)

1993 NBA Finals -- 55 vs Suns (won game, won series)

1997 First Round -- 55 vs Bullets (won game, won series)

Not only did they win 5 of six of those games, they won 5 of 6 of those series. And the last 4 occurred during championship runs. :facepalm

Kobe's played in 198 playoff games and never once scored more than 50, regardless of the playoff round or whether he was on a championship squad or not. Why hasn't the most explosive regular season scorer topped 50 in the playoffs?

LMAO at this article....maybe the author should try learning to read...he said although he is not finished with his career, he has to be a top 10 guard right now....wow what a bash on Kobe....Jordan also does not call himself the GOAT...he always states because he never got to play against Baylor, West, Russell....kobestans are comical

[QUOTE=tpols]Yea and all those games came in the first round or when his team wasn't winning shit. Kobe routinely rapes the first couple rounds (as was the case this year) but all I ever hear is how he can't perform in the finals.[/QUOTE]

MORON!!!!:roll:

[QUOTE=Da_Realist]1986 First Round -- 63 vs Celtics (lost game, lost series)

1988 First Round -- 55 vs Cavaliers (won game, won series)

1992 First Round -- 56 vs Heat (won game, won series)

1993 Conference Semis -- 54 vs Knicks (won game, won series)

1993 NBA Finals -- 55 vs Suns (won game, won series)

1997 First Round -- 55 vs Bullets (won game, won series)

Not only did they win 5 of six of those games, they won 5 of 6 of those series. And the last 4 occurred during championship runs. :facepalm

Kobe's played in 198 playoff games and never once scored more than 50, regardless of the playoff round or whether he was on a championship squad or not. Why hasn't the most explosive regular season scorer topped 50 in the playoffs?[/QUOTE]
Kobe played with shaq for most of his playoff games so it's not really surprising he wasn't able to get as many shot attempts off with the most dominant offensive center ever on his team. When he was in his peak/prime he only played like ten playoff games and put up insane stats in them regardless of if he missed your benchmark by a couple points. If kobe never had had shaq he would've won less rings but he would've had ten times the opportunities to have scored 50, 60, and/or 70+ in the playoffs.

[QUOTE=tpols]Kobe played with shaq for most of his playoff games so it's not really surprising he wasn't able to get as many shot attempts off with the most dominant offensive center ever on his team. When he was in his peak/prime he only played like ten playoff games and put up insane stats in them regardless of if he missed your benchmark by a couple points. If kobe never had had shaq he would've won less rings but he would've had ten times the opportunities to have scored 50, 60, and/or 70+ in the playoffs.[/QUOTE]

And if Jordan chose to score as many points as possible against the worst teams in the league during the regular season he would have had many opportunities to score 81 or more. :confusedshrug:

[QUOTE=tpols]What do you mean? Jordan never had a deadly 3 ball to the extent kobe has one. Kobe can go lights out with double digit 3 pointers in a game and that greatly helps in amassing a huge point total. Think about it. It's 50% more points with way less effort than driving or working out of the post. It's pretty much the reason kobe has had bigger scoring explosions than jordan.[/QUOTE]

Yeah Kobe can just go on tears that Jordan never could.....Jordan 8(9 if you want to round off) 30 point seasons, Kobe 2.....yeah I see what your getting at with this great 3 pointer (Jordan .327/Kobe .340) yup real huge...playoffs (Jordan .332/ Kobe .337)

[QUOTE=tpols]Kobe played with shaq for most of his playoff games so it's not really surprising he wasn't able to get as many shot attempts off with the most dominant offensive center ever on his team. When he was in his peak/prime he only played like ten playoff games and put up insane stats in them regardless of if he missed your benchmark by a couple points. If kobe never had had shaq he would've won less rings but he would've had ten times the opportunities to have scored 50, 60, and/or 70+ in the playoffs.[/QUOTE]
Now we have the shaq excuse.

[QUOTE=Calabis]Yeah Kobe can just go on tears that Jordan never could.....Jordan 8(9 if you want to round off) 30 point seasons, Kobe 2.....yeah I see what your getting at with this great 3 pointer (Jordan .327/Kobe .340) yup real huge...playoffs (Jordan .332/ Kobe .337)[/QUOTE]
Owned again. This is getting laughable.

Kobe is the best of all time.

[QUOTE=Da_Realist]And if Jordan chose to score as many points as possible against the worst teams in the league during the regular season he would have had many opportunities to score 81 or more. :confusedshrug:[/QUOTE]

How quick these young morons forget, how many times he sat out on special nights "the shrug" sat out the last 6 1/2 minutes of the first half, took only four shots in second half....if that was Kobe he would have asked to stay in and keep chucking...:eek:

Let me know when Kobe avg's 40 in the finals

[QUOTE=Willkill24]Kobe is the best of his generation and possibly top 6 player at end of his career.[/QUOTE]

FIXED

[QUOTE=Glide2keva]Now we have the shaq excuse.[/QUOTE]

Hmm one of his 30 point seasons was with Shaq and that season was his second career highest in FGA's at 23 per game...that damn Shaq hurt Kobe's legacy:roll:

Kobe's legacy without 3 chips???? Hmmm makes me wonder..can we say Dominique Wikins

[QUOTE=Calabis]How quick these young morons forget, how many times he sat out on special nights "the shrug" sat out the last 6 1/2 minutes of the first half, took only four shots in second half....if that was Kobe he would have asked to stay in and keep chucking...:eek:

Let me know when Kobe avg's 40 in the finals[/QUOTE]

Exactly. Kobe and Jordan had different mentalities. I just find it odd that a guy that can throw up 81 hasn't been able to score 51 in the playoffs. No, I don't. I know why. It's because teams have pride in the playoffs, even in the first round. And typically, to win playoff games the best player has to do more than stand behind the 3pt line waiting on teammates to feed him the ball. So this negates a lot of what Kobe's able to do in the regular season.

[QUOTE=Calabis]Yeah Kobe can just go on tears that Jordan never could.....Jordan 8(9 if you want to round off) 30 point seasons, Kobe 2.....yeah I see what your getting at with this great 3 pointer (Jordan .327/Kobe .340) yup real huge...playoffs (Jordan .332/ Kobe .337)[/QUOTE]
How is a 30ppg season an explosion?:oldlol: We're talking about big games here buddy and kobe's elite scoring games are better. It's just a fact. And lol at your 3pt argument acting like kobe doesn't have twice as many 3 balls made than jordan. Reachin hard my man but the facts remain. Kobe had more range than jordan and was a better shooter (and had better elite scoring games~best the league has ever seen since wilt).

[QUOTE=Calabis]Hmm one of his 30 point seasons was with Shaq and that season was his second career highest in FGA's at 23 per game...that damn Shaq hurt Kobe's legacy:roll:

Kobe's legacy without 3 chips???? Hmmm makes me wonder..can we say Dominique Wikins[/QUOTE]
Uh... he has two other chips and will likely have more but going with your hypothetical, jordan would be 'nique 2.0 with no rings.

[QUOTE=Calabis]FIXED[/QUOTE]

5 time champion and really he should of won in 03/04/08 so you could call him an 8 time champion and the GOAT IMO.

[QUOTE=asdf1990]why do ppl keep saying kobe is a better scorer than jordan? last time i checked jordan has the highes ppg average in the regular season and the playoffs. He has more scoring titles, higher single season ppg.[/QUOTE]

No surprise. Jordan was the biggest ballhog in NBA history, dude led the league in jacking up shots a recorded 9 times and averaged 24 fg attempts per game for his career! But that's not all!

He shots the ball 49 times in one game, in 15 years he shot the ball..24,567 times a record for a 15 year career!

He had seasons' of 25 FG attempt's, 28 FG attempts and 24 FG attempts per game.

Doug Collins wanted MJ to pass more and MJ had Doug fired!!!! (this was before Pippen emerged as the facilitator)

[QUOTE=Da_Realist]Exactly. Kobe and Jordan had different mentalities. I just find it odd that a guy that can throw up 81 hasn't been able to score 51 in the playoffs. No, I don't. I know why. It's because teams have pride in the playoffs, even in the first round. And typically, to win playoff games the best player has to do more than stand behind the 3pt line waiting on teammates to feed him the ball. So this negates a lot of what Kobe's able to do in the regular season.[/QUOTE]
What is this retard spewing? Kobe has been the consensus most clutch player in the league the whole decade in the reg season and in the playoffs. Can't believe you just insulted kobe on some clutch shit. You need some reading up seriously.

[QUOTE=Ne 1]Doug Collins wanted MJ to pass more and MJ had Doug fired!!!! (this was before Pippen emerged as the facilitator)[/QUOTE]

So why didn't he get Phil Jackson fired? Doug installed a "Give the ball to Michael and get the hell out of the way" offense. Phil wanted to have more people make decisions with the ball. Yet MJ wanted Collins fired, but he LOVED Phil Jackson. Even threatened the Bulls with retirement if they fired Phil Jackson in the late 90's. Doesn't make sense.

[QUOTE=tpols]What is this retard spewing? Kobe has been the consensus most clutch player in the league the whole decade in the reg season and in the playoffs. Can't believe you just insulted kobe on some clutch shit. You need some reading up seriously.[/QUOTE]
Yep U Mad

[QUOTE=Glide2keva]Yep U Mad[/QUOTE]
This is what jordan fans resort to.:oldlol: :applause:

[QUOTE=Da_Realist]So why didn't he get Phil Jackson fired? Doug installed a "Give the ball to Michael and get the hell out of the way" offense. Phil wanted to have more people make decisions with the ball. Yet MJ wanted Collins fired, but he LOVED Phil Jackson. Even threatened the Bulls with retirement if they fired Phil Jackson in the late 90's. Doesn't make sense.[/QUOTE]
Nothing they ever say makes any sense. They take small things or rumors and try to pass it off as fact.

Saying Jordan didn't want to pass the ball is beyond stupid. In 89, with Doug Collins as the coach he played Jordan at point guard for 11 games. Jordan only went on to record 7 straight triple doubles or so and 10 in 11 games, while averaging over 40 points per game during that stretch. But yeah, he wanted to ball hog and got him fired.

[QUOTE]Kobe's legacy without 3 chips???? Hmmm makes me wonder..can we say Dominique Wikins[/QUOTE]

Jordan's legacy without 6 chips? Bald-headed Dominique Wilkins. Jordan was actually well on his way to a career like Wilkins with flashy dunks but no rings before Pippen. He was 1-9 in the playoffs and never got past the 1st round! :oldlol:

[QUOTE=tpols]This is what jordan fans resort to.:oldlol: :applause:[/QUOTE]
Just felt like doing it. You guys are getting owned left and right and it's funny. You are pissed that Jordan trumps Kobe on every level.

1996 NBA Finals
Bulls 4, Sonics 2
GM1: 9-18 FG (50%), 9-10 FT, 28 PTS, 7 REB, 2 AST, 2 TO
GM2: 9-22 FG (40.9%), 10-16 FT, 29 PTS, 6 REB, 8 AST, 2 TO
GM3: 11-23 FG (47.8%), 11-11 FT, 36 PTS, 3 REB, 5 AST, 3 TO
GM4: 6-19 FG (31.6%), 11-13 FT, 23 PTS, 3 REB, 2 AST, 4 TO
GM5: 11-22 FG (50%), 4-5 FT, 26 PTS, 4 REB, 1 AST, 2 TO
GM6: 5-19 FG (26.3%), 11-12 FT, 22 PTS, 9 REB, 7 AST, 5 TO
AVERAGES: 51-123 FG (41.5%), 56-67 FT (83.6%), 27.3 PPG, 5.3 RPG, 4.2 APG, 3.00 TO, 20.5 FGA per game

1997 NBA Finals
Bulls 4, Jazz 2
GM1: 13-27 FG (48.1%), 5-7 FT, 31 PTS, 4 REB, 8 AST, 0 TO
GM2: 11-20 FG (55%), 15-21 FT, 38 PTS, 13 REB, 9 AST, 5 TO
GM3: 9-22 FG (40.9%), 4-5 FT, 26 PTS, 3 REB, 6 AST, 1 TO
GM4: 11-27 FG (40.7%), 0-0 FT, 22 PTS, 4 REB, 4 AST, 3 TO
GM5: 13-27 FG (48.2%), 10-12 FT, 38 PTS, 7 REB, 5 AST, 3 TO
GM6: 15-35 FG (42.9%), 8-10 FT, 39 PTS, 11 REB, 4 AST, 1 TO
AVERAGES: 72-158 FG (45.6%), 42-55 FT (76.4%), 32.3 PPG, 7.0 RPG, 6.0 APG, 2.17 TO, 26.3 FGA per game

1998 NBA Finals
Bulls 4, Jazz 2
GM1: 13-29 FG (44.8%), 6-8 FT, 33 PTS, 3 REB, 2 AST, 0 TO
GM2: 14-33 FG (42.4%), 9-10 FT, 37 PTS, 5 REB, 3 AST, 0 TO
GM3: 7-14 FG (50%), 10-11 FT, 24 PTS, 3 REB, 2 AST, 2 TO
GM4: 12-27 FG (44.4%), 10-15 FT, 34 PTS, 8 REB, 2 AST, 3 TO
GM5: 9-26 FG (34.6%), 10-11 FT, 28 PTS, 4 REB, 4 AST, 4 TO
GM6: 15-35 FG (42.9%), 12-15 FT, 45 PTS, 1 REB, 1 AST, 1 TO
AVERAGES: 70-164 FG (42.7%), 57-70 FT (81.4%), 33.5 PPG, 4 RPG, 2.3 APG, 1.67 TO, 27.3 FGA per game

---------------------------------

Just a few things:

1) The number of shots taken, compared to the amount of points scored, must not be that big of a deal when Michael Jordan shoots the ball. In 21 of the 34 games, Jordan had no more than seven points over his shot attempts that game.

2) Despite winning two season MVP's in two of the last three championships seasons (1996 and 1998), Jordan's field goal percentages were fairly low, especially for a guy taking 26-27 shots per game.

3) Jordan attempted over 25 shots per game four years, and actually launched over 33 shots per game in 1993. He never attempted less than 20 shots per game in six Finals appearances.

4) In six of Jordan's 34 Finals games, he missed five or more free throws. In other words, on average, there was one Finals game in each season where Jordan, being a career 83.5% free throw shooter, missed five or six free throws.

Also, Jordan matched or exceeded his career free throw shooting percentage just three times in six of his Finals appearances.

5) Jordan's assists, over a combined 34 Finals games, comes to 5.97 APG. He averaged 2.83 turnovers per game. For every two assists, he threw an average of approximately one turnover per game.

Just some things to chew on, and to have for future references when discussing NBA Finals performances, shooting percentages, turnovers, missed free throws, etc.

With all the articles blasting Bryant and his shot attempts and Finals performances, it might be good to look back on someone who was rarely criticized for anything he ever did.

[QUOTE=Da_Realist]Exactly. Kobe and Jordan had different mentalities. I just find it odd that a guy that can throw up 81 hasn't been able to score 51 in the playoffs. No, I don't. I know why. It's because teams have pride in the playoffs, even in the first round. And typically, to win playoff games the best player has to do more than stand behind the 3pt line waiting on teammates to feed him the ball. So this negates a lot of what Kobe's able to do in the regular season.[/QUOTE]

LMAO at this garbage. lol @ using 51 points as a barometer when he's had a 50 point game in the playoffs, and more 30+ point/40+ point games in the playoffs than anybody in the league. :roll:

[QUOTE=Glide2keva]Just felt like doing it. You guys are getting owned left and right and it's funny. You are pissed that Jordan trumps Kobe on every level.[/QUOTE]
Not pissed because I know jordan>kobe. But kobe has had better elite scoring games and that is something that eats jordan fans up. How could a guy that is [I]so inferior[/I] possibly have bigger scoring explosions? Not exactly sure, but I know that simple fact brings you guys coming back for more.:oldlol:

[QUOTE=Willkill24][B]5 time champion and really he should of won in 03/04/08 so you could call him an 8 time champion and the GOAT IMO[/B].[/QUOTE]

What kind of logic is that?

He could have won 8 rings? if were talking about what players could have done then Len Bias could have been better than Jordan. Grant hill could have dominated had he not gotten injured. Lebron could have 1 chip if the Cavs won against the spurs.

Kobe is a 5 time champion. Regardless of whether or not he could have won another 3 it doesn't change anything.

[QUOTE=Da_Realist]And if Jordan chose to score as many points as possible against the worst teams in the league during the regular season he would have had many opportunities to score 81 or more. :confusedshrug:[/QUOTE]
:roll:

Jordan, especially young Jordan, was a far bigger chucker than Kobe and he never came even close to 81. The only closest he got was 69 and he needed overtime to do that. You Jordan stans are ****ing ridiculous.

[QUOTE=step_back]What kind of logic is that?

He could have won 8 rings? if were talking about what players could have done then Len Bias could have been better than Jordan. Grant hill could have dominated had he not gotten injured. Lebron could have 1 chip if the Cavs won against the spurs.

Kobe is a 5 time champion. Regardless of whether or not he could have won another 3 it doesn't change anything.[/QUOTE]
Hey man don't step mid way into a debate and state your uninformed opinion. He was clearly responding to calabis who was saying kobe would be 'nique if he had no rings.