Let's Be Honest, the Heat are Lucky to Play in the East

[QUOTE=tmacattack33]Playoff records the past two years:

Miami: 30-13

San Antonio: 12-8

Memphis: 10-10

Clippers: 4-7 (and these 11 games are all from 2012...they failed to make the playoffs in 2011)

...:oldlol:[/QUOTE]

Wow the point of the OP went right over your head didn't it? In the west the top 8 teams beat the living shit out of each other every year. Nothing comes easy it's a straight up tedious bloodbath. Put the Heat in the west the last two years and no guarantees they even get to the WCF.

Now put the Clippers, Grizzlies, Spurs, Lakers etc in the west and they are a lock for the finals most likely as well or at worst ECF.

[QUOTE=Clippersfan86]Wow the point of the OP went right over your head didn't it? In the west the top 8 teams beat the living shit out of each other every year. Nothing comes easy it's a straight up tedious bloodbath. Put the Heat in the west the last two years and no guarantees they even get to the WCF.

Now put the Clippers, Grizzlies, Spurs, Lakers etc in the west and they are a lock for the finals most likely as well or at worst ECF.[/QUOTE]


...or so you say, based off of no evidence at all.

In the 2011 playoffs, the Heat trampled through completely healthy Bulls and Celtics teams that were definitely on par with this years Grizzlies and Spurs.

Also, you can't just move Miami to the West. To make things fair, you'd have to swap them with the top Western team (right now that is Memphis).

So swap them with Memphis.

Okay, so in round 1 they'd get 8th seeded Houston.

Round 2 they'd play the Spurs.

Round 3 they'd play the Thunder.


So their path would be: [B]Houston - San Antonio - OKC[/B]

That's not any harder than what they did in 2011 in the Eastern playoffs: [B]Philly - Boston - Chicago[/B].

[QUOTE=tmacattack33]...or so you say, based off of no evidence at all.

In the 2011 playoffs, the Heat trampled through completely healthy Bulls and Celtics teams that were definitely on par with this years Grizzlies and Spurs.[/QUOTE]

This year we have played what 15-20 games? It's WAY too soon to act like these teams are all finished products because most of the contenders still aren't conditioned or 100 percent.

Bottom line is you need to pay respect and acknowledge that some teams give Miami matchup problems. Every team in the NBA has matchup strengths and weaknesses. Miami doesn't do well vs these big, athletic and skilled frontcourts and we've seen it time and time again the last 3 years. Memphis and the Clippers have torched them winning 4 of 5 a piece vs Miami in the Lebron era.

Spurs have given Miami problems in recent years too. No shame in admitting that you have a weakness. For example my Clips have problems with the Lakers and Spurs. Doesn't mean they can't win, just means it's a huge challenge and would be a dogfight.

I'm not saying Miami wouldn't beat these teams but rather to act like they wouldn't be more challenged by these teams is stupid and ignorant.

The 2012 Miami Heat B1tchslapped the Spurs in the regular season. Back to back 30 points @$$whooping.

[QUOTE=tmacattack33]Also, you can't just move Miami to the West. To make things fair, you'd have to swap them with the top Western team (right now that is Memphis).

So swap them with Memphis.

Okay, so in round 1 they'd get 8th seeded Houston.

Round 2 they'd play the Spurs.

Round 3 they'd play the Thunder.


So their path would be: [B]Houston - San Antonio - OKC[/B]

That's not any harder than what they did in 2011 in the Eastern playoffs: [B]Philly - Boston - Chicago[/B].[/QUOTE]

Dude... Houston isn't getting the 8 seed most likely. Dirkless Mavs will bounce back, Nuggets should pick it up. Also who's to say they would even be the 1 seed if they played in the west? I can easily see them at 3 in the regular season behind the Thunder and Spurs which would mean they can face a huge number of quality teams in the lower brackets. Jazz, Mavs, Rockets, Nuggets, Warriors etc.

[QUOTE=Clippersfan86]This year we have played what 15-20 games? It's WAY too soon to act like these teams are all finished products because most of the contenders still aren't conditioned or 100 percent.

Bottom line is you need to pay respect and acknowledge that some teams give Miami matchup problems. Every team in the NBA has matchup strengths and weaknesses. Miami doesn't do well vs these [B]big, athletic and skilled frontcourts and we've seen it time and time again the last 3 years[/B]. Memphis and the Clippers have torched them winning 4 of 5 a piece vs Miami in the Lebron era.

Spurs have given Miami problems in recent years too. No shame in admitting that you have a weakness. For example my Clips have problems with the Lakers and Spurs. Doesn't mean they can't win, just means it's a huge challenge and would be a dogfight.

I'm not saying Miami wouldn't beat these teams but rather to act like they wouldn't be more challenged by these teams is stupid and ignorant.[/QUOTE]

Actually, in the playoffs, we have never seen that (and no, Dirk is not a big and physical big man, and Dallas didn't win by bullying Miami's front court around)

This argument of teams with big and strong front courts bullying Miami was the same one we heard in 2011 about Boston and Chicago. And Miami dominated them.

Even Hibbert and West are pretty good front court and were supposed to bully Miami around...never happened. Even without Bosh.

[QUOTE=Lebron23]The 2012 Miami Heat B1tchslapped the Spurs in the regular season. Back to back 30 points @$$whooping.[/QUOTE]
:kobe:
Please, Spurs bench with Timmy, Parker, Ginobilli watching tv from home were one possession away from beating the Heat with Lebron, Wade, Bosh, Ray all playing heavy minutes

:yaohappy:

[QUOTE=tmacattack33]Actually, in the playoffs, we have never seen that (and no, Dirk is not a big and physical big man, and Dallas didn't win by bullying Miami's front court around)

This argument of teams with big and strong front courts bullying Miami was the same one we heard in 2011 about Boston and Chicago. And Miami dominated them.

Even Hibbert and West are pretty good front court and were supposed to bully Miami around...never happened. Even without Bosh.[/QUOTE]


:no: Tyson did kinda do some bullying down there.

[QUOTE=ripthekik]:kobe:
Please, Spurs bench with Timmy, Parker, Ginobilli watching tv from home were one possession away from beating the Heat with Lebron, Wade, Bosh, Ray all playing heavy minutes

:yaohappy:[/QUOTE]
But Miami won tho... If they blew the spurs out people would say it was because the big 3 didn't play. I was happy to see a good close game. Don't hate just appreciate my brotha

[QUOTE=tmacattack33]Actually, in the playoffs, we have never seen that (and no, Dirk is not a big and physical big man, and Dallas didn't win by bullying Miami's front court around)

This argument of teams with big and strong front courts bullying Miami was the same one we heard in 2011 about Boston and Chicago. And Miami dominated them.

Even Hibbert and West are pretty good front court and were supposed to bully Miami around...never happened. Even without Bosh.[/QUOTE]

Dirk would fall under big and skilled despite not being athletic. You guys also struggled with Chandler. So yes the Mavs are a perfect example of it. Last year you face a far smaller Thunder bigman group and look at the difference?

Hibbert has solid post skills but isn't exactly the most physical guy who's going to "bully". West again is capable on the block but is mostly a finesse player who prefers the jumper so bad example.

Okay the heat are lucky to play in the east whatever helps u guys sleep at night

Let's be honest, you're not being honest.

All you western homos can cry all you like.
You can only beat who is put in front of you.
Miami got through two great teams from last season in Indiana and Boston, while missing one of their most important players, and with Wade hobbled with a knee injury.
They then smacked OKC on the ass, the very best out of the West.
The Heat played unbelievable ball, led by one of the greatest players ever.
Crybabies.

The ball dont lie and deal with it.

[QUOTE=G-train]All you western homos can cry all you like.
You can only beat who is put in front of you.
[B]Miami got through two great teams from last season in Indiana and Boston,[/B] while missing one of their most important players, and with Wade hobbled with a knee injury.
They then smacked OKC on the ass, the very best out of the West.
The Heat played unbelievable ball, led by one of the greatest players ever.
Crybabies.[/QUOTE]

:roll:

[QUOTE=Clippersfan86]Dirk would fall under big and skilled despite not being athletic. You guys also struggled with Chandler. So yes the Mavs are a perfect example of it. Last year you face a far smaller Thunder bigman group and look at the difference?

Hibbert has solid post skills but isn't exactly the most physical guy who's going to "bully". West again is capable on the block but is mostly a finesse player who prefers the jumper so bad example.[/QUOTE]

Dirk played well against us, but not in the way that you are trying to say that Marc Gasol, Zach Randolph, Blake, D. Jordan, and Tim Duncan would.

Also, so you are saying Tyson Chandler is a good/great big man? Great...we smacked his azz up in the first round last year. And this year we will likely be playing them again in the playoffs...so there goes your "you guys are lucky you didn't play great big men" excuse.

Of course they are lucky.

They are spoon-fed lottery teams until the finals, where they arrive with fresh legs to face a banged up western team that carries the scars and exhaustion of the competitive elite western confernce.

And even after that, if they still face trouble in the Finals, referees have no shame in putting on their cHeat jerseys.

[QUOTE=Mr. Jabbar]Of course they are lucky.

They are spoon-fed lottery teams until the finals, where they arrive with fresh legs to face a banged up western team that carries the scars and exhaustion of the competitive elite western confernce.

And even after that, if they still face trouble in the Finals, referees have no shame in putting on their cHeat jerseys.[/QUOTE]
Lol sure:hammerhead:

[QUOTE=Mr. Jabbar]Of course they are lucky.

They are spoon-fed lottery teams until the finals, where they arrive with fresh legs to face a banged up western team that carries the scars and exhaustion of the competitive elite western confernce.

And even after that, if they still face trouble in the Finals, referees have no shame in putting on their cHeat jerseys.[/QUOTE]

heat vs thuder went to 5 games, heat vs celtics went to 7 games, hopefully next time the west can send out some "elite" competition that at least challenges the heat more than a team consisting of retirement home players.

Has any team actually fared better than Miami against elite competition(55+ wins) the last 2 postseasons? They defeated 2 terrific teams in Boston and Chicago in the 2011 playoffs, took Dallas further than anyone in the West did(despite LeBron not competing), and last season, they took care of OKC in 5 after OKC kicked everybody's ass in the West.

Yet the Heat beat the Thunder in 5 games, who was the best team in the West. Who beat the Mavs, Lakers, and Spurs.

The Pacers and Celtics gave the Heat more trouble than the Thunder, but that was because Bosh wasn't there in most of those games.

2010-2011 Bulls and Celtics would smash these weak west teams, and Heat are ten times better now.

[QUOTE=asdf1990]heat vs thuder went to 5 games, heat vs celtics went to 7 games, hopefully next time the west can send out some "elite" competition that at least challenges the heat more than a team consisting of retirement home players.[/QUOTE]

Again people miss the point. Heat get to coast through first 3 rounds then play a legit contender. In the west every single round you can be facing a contender getting beat the fu** up. By the time Miami gets to the finals they are more rested and less banged up.

Also you have to account for matchups here. OKC isn't a team that could capitalize on Miami's biggest weaknesses. They got almost zero interior scoring from Ibaka+Perkins so Miami's size disadvantage didn't hurt them like it would vs the other contenders in the west. OKC was an ideal matchup for them almost. Memphis, Spurs, Lakers, Clippers and even teams like the Nuggets and Jazz are far bigger matchup problems.

And the only reason miami lost against Dallas because they choked. If not, it'd have been another 5 game series or sweep.

[QUOTE=HEAT111]And the only reason miami lost against Dallas because they choked. If not, it'd have been another 5 game series or sweep.[/QUOTE]

Yes... it had nothing to do with Dallas running a defensive clinic with Kidd, Marion and Chandler obliterating them. Or Dirk having a top 10 playoff run in NBA history. Of course the average Heat fan is going to give zero credit though when it's convenient.

[QUOTE=Micku]Yet the Heat beat the Thunder in 5 games, who was the best team in the West. Who beat the Mavs, Lakers, and Spurs.

[/QUOTE]



Match ups match ups, and match ups are everything in this league.


You cant just sit there and say since the Heat took out the Thunder in 5, that by default they should be greater than the people the Thunder eliminated.


IMO, Heat do not go through particular teams in the west.


I'd venture to say San Antonio does not lose to Miami in a series.


Unfortunately that is speculation of what I know of both team's strengths, and weaknesses.




I KNEW before the Heat/Thunder series, that Miami would make short work of OKC. I was laughing when people figured that OKC, since beating on the west competition would exploit the Heat.


OKC is EXACTLY the type of team Miami can dismantle and it showed. When you break the Thunder down, they ARE a perimeter based team, plain and simple.

[QUOTE=Clippersfan86]Again people miss the point. Heat get to coast through first 3 rounds then play a legit contender. In the west every single round you can be facing a contender getting beat the fu** up. By the time Miami gets to the finals they are more rested and less banged up.

Also you have to account for matchups here. OKC isn't a team that could capitalize on Miami's biggest weaknesses. They got almost zero interior scoring from Ibaka+Perkins so Miami's size disadvantage didn't hurt them like it would vs the other contenders in the west. OKC was an ideal matchup for them almost. Memphis, Spurs, Lakers, Clippers and even teams like the Nuggets and Jazz are far bigger matchup problems.[/QUOTE]

Not last year. When Bosh went out, they had to kick it up. Since Wade was injured and wasn't the same Wade of 2011 and below, LeBron basically had to do everything since he wasn't banged up as Wade or Bosh. If they didn't get Bosh back in the Celtics series, they probably would've lost because Bosh was great in game 7 or LeBron would've had to do more again like he did in game 6 (Bosh was in the game too, but LBJ was insane that game).

And when they got to the Finals, what really beat the Thunder were the role players of the Heat and Harden sucking. That's the big reason why. I do agree that I think other teams with big guys that are capable of scoring inside and getting rebounds. While I don't think they will necessary beat the Heat, I think they could give them problems and exploit their weakness better.

[QUOTE=Clippersfan86]Again people miss the point. Heat get to coast through first 3 rounds then play a legit contender. In the west every single round you can be facing a contender getting beat the fu** up. By the time Miami gets to the finals they are more rested and less banged up.

Also you have to account for matchups here. OKC isn't a team that could capitalize on Miami's biggest weaknesses. They got almost zero interior scoring from Ibaka+Perkins so Miami's size disadvantage didn't hurt them like it would vs the other contenders in the west. OKC was an ideal matchup for them almost. Memphis, Spurs, Lakers, Clippers and even teams like the Nuggets and Jazz are far bigger matchup problems.[/QUOTE]

only on ISH can a team play 3 more games than the other team in the finals and have one of their major component out for majority of 2 rounds and still be fresher than the opponent who had no key injuries.

[QUOTE=Clippersfan86]Again people miss the point. Heat get to coast through first 3 rounds then play a legit contender. In the west every single round you can be facing a contender getting beat the fu** up. By the time Miami gets to the finals they are more rested and less banged up.

Also you have to account for matchups here. OKC isn't a team that could capitalize on Miami's biggest weaknesses. They got almost zero interior scoring from Ibaka+Perkins so Miami's size disadvantage didn't hurt them like it would vs the other contenders in the west. OKC was an ideal matchup for them almost. Memphis, Spurs, Lakers, Clippers and even teams like the Nuggets and Jazz are far bigger matchup problems.[/QUOTE]

Why you making so many excuses for OKC. Also, if its all about matchups, explain last year. Clippers match up well with SA, yet y'all still got swept. :confusedshrug:

Let's be honest, the NBA is lucky Wade has declined or it would be a wrap the way LeBron is playing.

Even without a centre the heat can still beat all of the western conference teams you mentioned. If they grizzlies are truly as good as they have looked this season then they would give the heat hell but the spurs are outmatched.

I love watching the Eastern Conference constantly get degraded.

As much as I don't like the Heat, they smoked the bejesus out of the best team the West could offer last year.

[url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KgLMI784M4E[/url]

this shit right here would sink every team in the league, we all forget this because of lebron's once in a lifetime choke in the next round

[QUOTE=Derka]I love watching the Eastern Conference constantly get degraded.

As much as I don't like the Heat, they smoked the bejesus out of the best team the West could offer last year.[/QUOTE]

This. :applause:

I agree that the Heat have it easier come playoff time and they would get beat on a little more in the West, but they will still get through the west and be the champs regardless. Who's going to stop them in the west :roll:

[QUOTE=oh the horror]Match ups match ups, and match ups are everything in this league.


You cant just sit there and say since the Heat took out the Thunder in 5, that by default they should be greater than the people the Thunder eliminated.


IMO, Heat do not go through particular teams in the west.


I'd venture to say San Antonio does not lose to Miami in a series.


Unfortunately that is speculation of what I know of both team's strengths, and weaknesses.




I KNEW before the Heat/Thunder series, that Miami would make short work of OKC. I was laughing when people figured that OKC, since beating on the west competition would exploit the Heat.


OKC is EXACTLY the type of team Miami can dismantle and it showed. When you break the Thunder down, they ARE a perimeter based team, plain and simple.[/QUOTE]

The Heat and Thunder are very similar teams though. Especially with the athleticism, and they have no inside scorer either. While the Thunder have better defenders with the PF/C, the Heat was better with team defensive. The Heat probably attack more inside because Wade and LeBron are both slashers while the Thunder are more jump shooters. And despite the injuries that they faced, besides the Spurs and the Thunder, I don't really see anybody in the West really taking them out.

Some teams like Memphis and the Lakers could give them a bit problems with their size, but I don't really see them actually beating the Heat. The Heat's defense, I think, is too good. LeBron James was more consistent and harder to stop. An injured Wade was still the 2nd best SG with some solid d and capable of giving you 20 ppg. And Bosh was consistent in his contributions to the team.

The Thunder had a pretty good chance to take them out. What stopped them was Harden's play and some role players couldn't step it up and keep up with Miami's role players. Harden played pretty badly in the Finals, and was basically the major reason why they lost in 5 games. He had his lowest ppg in the whole playoffs in the Finals and couldn't really get that much done against them.

The Spurs probably had a good chance with them tho. But the Heat would've kept it competitive and who knows how would Wade and Bosh would do against them. Like I said, I don't think anybody could really stop them in the West besides those two teams last year. The Thunder is obviously out, and the only reason why they had trouble with the Pacers and the Celtics is because Bosh was not there.

[QUOTE=Derka]I love watching the Eastern Conference constantly get degraded.

As much as I don't like the Heat, they smoked the bejesus out of the best team the West could offer last year.[/QUOTE]
:applause:

It's a new era in the NBA. Both conferences have great teams.

[QUOTE=upside24]:applause:

It's a new era in the NBA. Both conferences have great teams.[/QUOTE]
The league has been like this for the most part of its history, with the obvious exception of the Russell era.

I mean look at the 80's which had the Lakers/Celtics dynasty's the 90's that had multiple great teams, the early 2000's were relatively weak, but got stronger as the decade grew older (I mean in the East), and now the 10's are shaping up to have multiple championship caliber teams in the East, and West (Lakers/OKC/Miami/Chicago/NYK/BKN/LAC) for at least a few years.

Of course things can change, injuries can come, as they did in the early 2000's leading to a weaker talent pool (Yao, TMac, Hill, Penny, etc all taken away by injuries), but it looks like if this current talent pool can stay relatively healthy then we will be in for some great seasons.

A lot of you need a life. I understand you hate the Heat that's fine; I hate the Celtics and the Lakers, but I don't make 100 retarded threads about them.