Building a Franchise: Kyrie Irving or Russell Westbrook

[QUOTE=brandonislegend]Irving over Francis/Marbury with lower IQ, I mean Westbrick. Poor Durant has to carry this guy night in and night out and still Westbrick shoots more shots than the BEST SCORER IN THE NBA. What the **** is wrong with this guy shoots dumbass shots never passes to wide open Durant in transition instead pulls up with 2 guys guarding him and BRICKS.

You keep saying Westbrook is a winner, o[B]kay he has the best player in the league[/B] and some of the best defensive players in the league. If you swapped him and Irving Westbrook would shoot like 35% FG, he shoots 41% with the ****ing best player in the universe right now getting attention. Kyrie as a 19/20 year old already shoots a higher percentage from EVERYWHERE FT 3PT FG, on top of that he has no one on his team to take any pressure off him, Westbrook will never shoot percentages like that for his whole career.

GIVE ME MR. 4TH QUARTER ALL DAY.[/QUOTE]

:oldlol:

Really like both players...neither is a bad guy to start your franchise with. But I'll go with Uncle Drew just because i think Westbrook relies more on his athleticism and that will fade over time. If I had to win a ball-game today...right now... I might go Westbrook, but Irving has already shown that he's very good in late game situations.

Difficult to call since Kyrie's shooting %s are so outstanding. I think Westbrook would be able to carry a team by himself to the playoffs (though they would never win with him as lead dog). However, I think Kyrie actually has potential to win as lead dog. It would have to be a team set up like the 2000s Pistons though.

edit: I think Kyrie is the choice though since he seems like more of a leader who brings his teammates up whenever he speaks. Also, he has that killer drive to get better and the guts to go against the best (see USA vids of him and Kobe).

the logic of everyone :

give me the 20 year old who is guaranteed to have at least 20 wins a season :rockon:

whatever, enjoy your 20 win seasons kyrie.

westbrook on the cavs would equal more wins in a weak east, i dont care if he has dion waiters or gee. when westbrook played without durant (granted its not a big sample), he led them to 3-1 and this was before ibaka could hit a jumper. westbrook was let loose, had like a 40 pt, 15 reb, 9 assist game in a win. but thats ok, you have a 20 year old that can be clutch in the 20 wins he wins a year. oh yeah, and he likes taking games off with injury. what's not to like about that?????? :bowdown:

Kyrie.

Wasn't a dfficult decision for me.

Kyrie Irving

[QUOTE=imdaman99]the logic of everyone :

give me the 20 year old who is guaranteed to have at least 20 wins a season :rockon:

whatever, enjoy your 20 win seasons kyrie.

westbrook on the cavs would equal more wins in a weak east, i dont care if he has dion waiters or gee. when westbrook played without durant (granted its not a big sample), he led them to 3-1 and this was before ibaka could hit a jumper. westbrook was let loose, had like a 40 pt, 15 reb, 9 assist game in a win. but thats ok, you have a 20 year old that can be clutch in the 20 wins he wins a year. oh yeah, and he likes taking games off with injury. what's not to like about that?????? :bowdown:[/QUOTE]

Your logic:

Give me the guy who plays with a top 2 player, a top 10 PF and has played with a top 10-15 shooting guard for the past 2 seasons because he wins more games.

And pass on the guy who you just admitted was clutch, who's best player currently playing beside him is Alonzo gee, who shoots lights out, averages more points than westbrooke on better percantage a whole being the ONE MAN THAT THE DEFENSE IS GAMPEPLANNING TO STOP.

When teams play OKC their goal is keep the ball out of Durants hands and keep the ball in westbrooke hands because OKC is more likely to lose with westbrooke being the focal point of the offense

LOL @ Budadiiii having a massive coronary because everyone essentially agrees that to start a franchise you pick Kyrie >>> Westbrook (and it's not even close)

[QUOTE=imdaman99]the logic of everyone :

give me the 20 year old who is guaranteed to have at least 20 wins a season :rockon:

whatever, enjoy your 20 win seasons kyrie.

westbrook on the cavs would equal more wins in a weak east, i dont care if he has dion waiters or gee. when westbrook played without durant (granted its not a big sample), he led them to 3-1 and this was before ibaka could hit a jumper. westbrook was let loose, had like a 40 pt, 15 reb, 9 assist game in a win. but thats ok, you have a 20 year old that can be clutch in the 20 wins he wins a year. oh yeah, and he likes taking games off with injury. what's not to like about that?????? :bowdown:[/QUOTE]

Please explain how Westbrook plays the the best scorer in the league, Kevin martin a knock down 20 pt scorer on his own team, top 10 pf and shoots 41% and then put him on the cavs with no real weapons what would he shoot with defenses double and tripling 34%? 35%?

[QUOTE=brandonislegend]Please explain how Westbrook plays the the best scorer in the league, Kevin martin a knock down 20 pt scorer on his own team, top 10 pf and shoots 41% and then put him on the cavs with no real weapons what would he shoot with defenses double and tripling 34%? 35%?[/QUOTE]

hey aren't you the poster that said Durant was the best player in the league?

:oldlol:

[QUOTE=SilkkTheShocker]hey aren't you the poster that said Durant was the best player in the league?

:oldlol:[/QUOTE]

He is at the moment he's averaging 38ppg on 56% shooting last 8 games and he's leading MVP race at the moment. :confusedshrug:

[QUOTE=brandonislegend]He is at the moment he's averaging 38ppg on 56% shooting last 8 games and he's leading MVP race at the moment. :confusedshrug:[/QUOTE]


So what you are saying is that you have an agenda against Lebron, got it. Go troll somewhere else, Corky.

Replace Durant and Westbrook w/ Lebron and Kyrie.

Is OKC a better team?

BTW I like Kyrie better as a PG. Not sure how well build around RW as an undersized SG will turn. A slightly better peak Monta Ellis, if even that?

[QUOTE=Cali Syndicate]Replace Durant and Westbrook w/ Lebron and Kyrie.

Is OKC a better team?[/QUOTE]


Easily. You get the best player in the NBA and the best shooting PG in the NBA not named Curry/Nash. Not to mention Kyrie is an absolute beast in the 4th quarter.

Kyrie and it's not even close.

[QUOTE=SilkkTheShocker]He has also proven to be mentally r.etarded. :oldlol:[/QUOTE]

True, but I think as his career progresses he'll tone down on the sporadic bone-headed plays.

[QUOTE=SilkkTheShocker]So what you are saying is that you have an agenda against Lebron, got it. Go troll somewhere else, Corky.[/QUOTE]

What? Why are you being so butthurt? everything I said was a fact look at the stats and look at NBA.com MVP race. I am not a OKC fan or Heat fan I don't really care. You seem so butthurt :roll:

[QUOTE=brandonislegend]What? Why are you being so butthurt? everything I said was a fact look at the stats and look at NBA.com MVP race. I am not a OKC fan or Heat fan I don't really care. You seem so butthurt :roll:[/QUOTE]

Didn't you know? You cant say anything wrong about his father lebron or he will have a fit. He will defend lebron to the death as if he actually knows him :lol

[QUOTE=brandonislegend]What? Why are you being so butthurt? everything I said was a fact look at the stats and look at NBA.com MVP race. I am not a OKC fan or Heat fan I don't really care. You seem so butthurt :roll:[/QUOTE]
But a known Westbrook hater. Your agenda is clear Mr clueless

[QUOTE=imdaman99]But a known Westbrook hater. Your agenda is clear Mr clueless[/QUOTE]

I played basketball at a D1 school, and I coached basketball last year, when I see a point guard make dumb decisions all game and take stupid shots, and on top of that take more shots than the best scorer in the league almost EVERY single game, I am sorry that's not the way a point guard is suppose to play. I don't know how much more logic you need.

[QUOTE=brandonislegend]What? Why are you being so butthurt? everything I said was a fact look at the stats and look at NBA.com MVP race. I am not a OKC fan or Heat fan I don't really care. You seem so butthurt :roll:[/QUOTE]


Anyone that believes Durant is the best player in the NBA is missing a chromosome. But than again, you are the same poster that said Irving is leaving after his rookie contract. So obviously you have no idea what the f.uck you're talking about

[QUOTE=SilkkTheShocker]Anyone that believes Durant is the best player in the NBA is missing a chromosome. But than again, you are the same poster that said Irving is leaving after his rookie contract. So obviously you have no idea what the f.uck you're talking about[/QUOTE]

He is leading the MVP race at the moment so I guess you know more than everyone, and I said if the Cavs don't make any big moves by the time his contract is over he will leave.

How is Kyrie a loser? He is one of the most clutch players in the league.

[QUOTE=fsvr54]How is Kyrie a loser? He is one of the most clutch players in the league.[/QUOTE]

[url]http://www.82games.com/1112/CSORT11.HTM[/url]

[url]http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1156648-nba-stat-central-10-most-productive-superstars-in-the-clutch/page/11[/url]

yup.

[QUOTE=brandonislegend]I played basketball at a D1 school, and I coached basketball last year, when I see a point guard make dumb decisions all game and take stupid shots, and on top of that take more shots than the best scorer in the league almost EVERY single game, I am sorry that's not the way a point guard is suppose to play. I don't know how much more logic you need.[/QUOTE]
This ain't the 80s coach Nick. There is no proof that pass first superstar point guards win championships. No magic Johnson around. You act like Durant isn't leading the league in scoring every year. Didn't know you and Joyner were the same person. Oh let me guess, you want Durant to average 40. Because he will still have the energy to close teams out down the stretch than. Keep up the Westbrook hate :applause:

[QUOTE=imdaman99]This ain't the 80s coach Nick. There is no proof that pass first superstar point guards win championships. No magic Johnson around. You act like Durant isn't leading the league in scoring every year. Didn't know you and Joyner were the same person. Oh let me guess, you want Durant to average 40. Because he will still have the energy to close teams out down the stretch than. Keep up the Westbrook hate.tTroll on :applause:[/QUOTE]

There is no reason why a point guard that shoots 41% from the field should shoot more shots than the best scorer in the NBA. I don't know how hard that is to get. I hate OKC though so I hope Westbrook continues to play this way :)

[QUOTE=brandonislegend]There is no reason why a point guard that shoots 41% from the field should shoot more shots than the best scorer in the NBA. I don't know how hard that is to get. I hate OKC though so I hope Westbrook continues to play this way :)[/QUOTE]
Yeah because OKC went to the finals despite what Westbrook did. Stay smart :roll:

Btw nice clutch stat line. Noticed who's #4? No you didn't. Once again, stay smart

I thought it was a thread bump by Brandon because he made a similar thread, but the answer is still Westbrook for me.

[QUOTE=imdaman99]Yeah because OKC went to the finals despite what Westbrook did. Stay smart :roll:

Btw nice clutch stat line. Noticed who's #4? No you didn't. Once again, stay smart[/QUOTE]

Kyrie is averaging 16 more points per 48 and is shooting 54.4% compared to 49.3% and he has no Kevin Durant commanding attention from him :confusedshrug: teams usually deny Durant the ball cause they want Westbrook to shoot or make a decision. If you look he leads the whole list in turnovers as well.

[QUOTE=TheMarkMadsen]Kyrie and i don't think twice about it.

Has that rare ability to be a go to scorer while also having control of the team/making smart plays

he's like a pass first shoot first point guard.

[B]Kyrie has the potential to a 28 5 8 guy during his prime[/B][/QUOTE]

You mean like what Westbrook is just about averaging now? Westbrook is averaging 24/5/8/2 ATM as a second option. I love Kyrie, but I think Westbrook has a better all-around game. Much better on the boards and a much better defender than Kyrie. Kyrie is more efficient though.

So since there's a lot of people supporting Irivng in this thread, I ask this same question again in the other thread:

Build a franchise: Derrick Rose (pre-injury) or Kyrie Irving ?

[QUOTE=maybeshewill13]You mean like what Westbrook is just about averaging now? I love Kyrie, but I think Westbrook has a better all-around game. [B]Much better on the boards and a much better defender than Kyrie[/B]. Kyrie is more efficient though.[/QUOTE]

That's fair, but you have to take in account he has Ibaka behind him and Perkins (even though he sucks) is still more intimidating than Thompson and Zeller :roll:

[QUOTE=Legends66NBA7]So since there's a lot of people supporting Irivng in this thread, I ask this same question again in the other thread:

Build a franchise: Derrick Rose (pre-injury) or Kyrie Irving ?[/QUOTE]

What does this matter? Do you have a time machine?

[QUOTE=Legends66NBA7]I thought it was a thread bump by Brandon because he made a similar thread, but the answer is still Westbrook for me.[/QUOTE]
I honestly don't see how you could choose other wise.

[QUOTE=brandonislegend]What does this matter? Do you have a time machine?[/QUOTE]

Matters a lot.

Obviously I do, just don't want to use it.

[QUOTE=Just2McFly]I honestly don't see how you could choose other wise.[/QUOTE]

Nah, didn't you read the thread ?

The answer is "Kyrie and it's not close". F[COLOR="Black"]u[/COLOR]ck actually thinking for yourself and watching games, who needs that ?

[QUOTE=Legends66NBA7]Nah, didn't you read the thread ?

The answer is "Kyrie and it's not close". F[COLOR="Black"]u[/COLOR]ck actually thinking for yourself and watching games, who needs that ?[/QUOTE]
LOL yeah, lets base all our answers on a statline that means more clutch. Apparently this is why everyone would rather have Robert Horry than Karl Malone... look at that clutch statline guys! And he never took away shots from his superstars!!!!!!! YEAHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Kyrie

And I do like Irving a lot too. Clearly has Top 3 PG potential.

I just grow tired of reading the "it's not close" line, when it's obviously the opposite of that when it's being discussed.

I like Westbrook but Kyrie is just an amazing talent.

Like others have said his IQ, jumper and game management are far superior to Westbrook. Not to mention he has had numerous games where he has taken over the fourth quarter scoring and other teams couldn't stop him, despite the fact they knew he was looking for his shot.

Kryie has potential to be a top 5 player in the next couple years.