How much respect have you lost for Ray Allen?

[quote]He 100% said he wouldn't come off the bench. Maybe not the 4th option part, but he was super pissed about coming off the bench.[/quote]

Like RMWG, I've never heard him say that, but I don't disagree with you that he wasn't happy with the bench situation. On interviews with him as the Miami Heat, he mentioned (not in exact words) that he wanted to still feel important and he didn't see that in Boston. They limited his role further in his last year with Boston. I understood why Doc did it last year with his bone spurs, but it appeared Allen did not view this perspective. He questioned the direction of the Celtics and with a cloudy future based on trade rumors, that swayed him on the side of joining to the Heat.


[QUOTE=dh144498]the dude is just a spot up shooter. He's too mentally weak to take charge. He's a follower, not a leader.[/QUOTE]

Go back in time and watch Ray with the Sonics and Bucks. K thanks.

He is still respected only ones that dont are bitter celtic fans and heat haters.

[QUOTE=Big Cheese]He is still respected only ones that dont are bitter celtic fans and heat haters.[/QUOTE]
Do you think he is respected by the players?

[QUOTE=shady6121]How b*tchmade is he for joining the Heat because the Celtics couldn't beat them? If he had no rings it would've been understandable, but he had already won one with the Celtics in 2008.

"If you can't beat them, join them". :lol[/QUOTE]
Maybe he just wanted to play somewhere where he felt wanted and they don't try to trade him every February.

The Heat players and organization made it clear that they wanted him in the fold. Contrast that to the Celtics trying to trade him, apparently bickering constantly with an on-the-rise Rajon Rondo, and it looks like an easy decision.

He made a business decision. That's what the NBA is, a business. People need quit getting their feelings hurt over this stuff.

[QUOTE=pegasus]Do you think he is respected by the players?[/QUOTE]
Fans care about this kind of stuff way, way , way more than players do.

[QUOTE=pegasus]Do you think he is respected by the players?[/QUOTE]

Yes

I never had much respect for Ray Allen but I grew some after seen him battle it out with Kobe in the 2010 Finals and his heart in GM 2. Needless to say I was quickly reminded why he deserves no respect when he joined the Heat.

It's what it's. Heat fans will defend him to death these days - but we all know why.

Even before he left and Rondo's ACL tore, Boston's window was closing due to age.

I think the rumored chemistry issues with Rondo was what may have provoked him choosing to go to rival Miami to spite the Celtics along with the prospects of winning another or multiple rings in the twilight of his career. I still respect him though. He can play, has made clutch shots, and has shown a winning attitude this year with his new team.

clear lock for the HoF but it's more interesting to me to speculate on what city's arena will have his jersey hanging.

[QUOTE=pegasus]Do you think he is respected by the players?[/QUOTE]
He's got the record for most career threes. How could they not respect him?

[QUOTE=Real Men Wear Green]He's got the record for most career threes. How could they not respect him?[/QUOTE]
They can respect his record, but that doesn't mean they respect him as a person after what he's done. That's what I was asking; he can still play of course, I'm not arguing that.

He obviously didnt want to play for Boston any more since he turned down more money from them. And he wanted to play for a contender. Other than Miami, what other contender was showing him interest? I know the Clippers were until they signed Jamal Crawford.

[QUOTE=BasedTom]lock for the HoF but it's more interesting to speculate on what city's arena will have his jersey hanging.[/QUOTE]
Potentially no one. He has no ties to Oklahoma and the Celtics can't be happy with him right now. His only chance is Milwaukee.

[QUOTE=Real Men Wear Green]He's got the record for most career threes. How could they not respect him?[/QUOTE]

There are different types of respect. Surely people respect his game - he's one of the best 3-point shooters ever. There is more to Ray Allen than his game.

Ive lost a lot for him.. Cavs-Heat and Boston-Heat, basically bron vs older Cs, was one of the best rivalries in the playoffs year in and year out.

And Raty hopped onto the other side just as HIS side was declining. Thats almost Lebron level bandwagoning right there.

[QUOTE=pegasus]They can respect his record, but that doesn't mean they respect him as a person after what he's done. That's what I was asking; he can still play of course, I'm not arguing that.[/QUOTE]
What has he done? Joined a winner? Lots of players do that. Do players disrespect Gary Payton?

[QUOTE=dh144498][B]the dude is just a spot up shooter.[/B] He's too mentally weak to take charge. He's a follower, not a leader.[/QUOTE]
No wonder that that guy ripthekik is your hero.

He couldn't see himself starting behind Avery Bradley but he wouldn't mind being behind D-Wade.

Also how bad was that beef with Rondo? I remember they did the post game together(like Lebron and D-Wade) after I think Game 2 of the ECF...

[QUOTE=Real Men Wear Green]What has he done? Joined a winner? Lots of players do that. Do players disrespect Gary Payton?[/QUOTE]
Gary Payton didnt join his closest rivals.. He went to what LA? Miami? Seattle wasnt in a big rivalry with them at those times at all.

Heat Celtics and in general Bron-Celtics was one of the biggest rivalries in basketball. And ray jumped just as his ship was sinking to the other side. You have to use context.

[QUOTE=Real Men Wear Green]What has he done? Joined a winner? Lots of players do that. Do players disrespect Gary Payton?[/QUOTE]
I wonder when Noah's contract is up. I'm sure he wouldn't mind joining the Heat for less money and become their starting C.

[QUOTE=PickernRoller]There are different types of respect. Surely people respect his game - he's one of the best 3-point shooters ever. There is more to Ray Allen than his game.[/QUOTE]

Who cares if they respect him as a person? All that matters is that they respect the mark he left on the game.

I don't know about you but when I go to work, the thing I care about most is that people know I can do my job and do it well. There's someone else at my job that has the best personality but is relatively incompetent at her job. Bottom line is do you take care of business or not. All of that other crap is for the birds.

Ray Allen's mark on this game is indelible. Doesn't matter who "respects" him or not.

[QUOTE=tpols]Gary Payton didnt join his closest rivals.. He went to what LA? Miami? Seattle wasnt in a big rivalry with them at those times at all. [/quote]Rivalry only matters to people within the rivalry. We've seen no signs of players in general disrespecting Allen.
[quote]Heat Celtics and in general Bron-Celtics was one of the biggest rivalries in basketball. And ray jumped just as his ship was sinking to the other side. You have to use context.[/QUOTE]
So? If they told Allen he would still be a starter and make 10 mil a year he'd probably still be here. He was a free agent, meaning he could sign wherever he wanted to. He chose to go to a team that his previous employer was a rival of. His business. The Celts didn't like it, us fans didn't like it, but he played hard when he was here, never cheated the game in any way, and remains a total pro. Unless he's one of the Celtics that played alongside him, why would another player be angered by his action? Makes no sense.

[QUOTE=Goldrush25]

[B]Ray Allen's mark on this game is indelible. Doesn't matter who "respects" him or not.[/B][/QUOTE]

If that's so then why are you on the thread? Who gives a shit if someone respect him or not? Right?

Lol at that example - doesn't in any way, shape or form rebutted what I had to say. A lot of players in this league deliver - that's why they made it to the NBA. :facepalm

Your competitive spirit, drive, morals, and ethics are also taken into account. If we were all judged on our ability to deliver then there is little uniqueness factor among all humans - certainly not the case.

This thread can be broken down into two camps:

1. Those who believe Ray Allen's decisions and conduct do not in any way affect their respect/opinion of the person.

2. Those who believe Ray Allen's decision and conduct play a role in their respect for the person.

No need to convince one side or the other for either of the two. It's clear both are grounded in strong opinions. Everyone is entitled to theirs.

[QUOTE=pegasus]I wonder when Noah's contract is up. I'm sure he wouldn't mind joining the Heat for less money and become their starting C.[/QUOTE]
Different scenario. Ray Allen will probably be retired within the next 2-3 years whereas Noah might even con the max out of someone and be one of the East's 3 best centers for the next 5+ years. Ray Allen has had his max deals, probably has a ton of $, he can value a ring over the MLE or whatever the Cs were offering. Plus Noah isn't mad at Chi the way Allen was mad at the Cs.

[QUOTE=Real Men Wear Green]Rivalry only matters to people within the rivalry. We've seen no signs of players in general disrespecting Allen.

So? If they told Allen he would still be a starter and make 10 mil a year he'd probably still be here. He was a free agent, meaning he could sign wherever he wanted to. He chose to go to a team that his previous employer was a rival of. His business. The Celts didn't like it, us fans didn't like it, but he played hard when he was here, never cheated the game in any way, and remains a total pro. Unless he's one of the Celtics that played alongside him, why would another player be angered by his action? Makes no sense.[/QUOTE]
Who said other players would be angered by his actions? No one's angry and the thread is asking if we have lost respect for him. No anger involved.. Just opinions on the matter. If anything it be more of a smh type reaction like really dude? The heat?

And there were 28 other teams he could've gone to.. He went to the heat. Their chief rivals and the guys they hated. Obviously KG doesn't respect him anymore.. Wouldn't even shake his hand at times. And deservedly so. As a fan of the game I agree with KGs sentiments.

:oldlol: Outside of Boston fans, the only people who have lost respect for Ray Allen are those who resented the Heat prior to, for which I can say who gives a f*ck if they lost respect for him or not?

It's called free agency. Deal with it.

I lost respect but not primarily because he went to the heat. Just the way he handled it from what all the boston staff and players have said. Tried to paint it as a Rondo issue when he was making stuff up and acting like a princess in the media.

[QUOTE=tpols]Who said other players would be angered by his actions.[/QUOTE]
[URL="http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=8455237&postcount=43"]Read up.[/URL] [quote]No one's angry and the thread is asking if we have lost respect for him. No anger involved.. Just opinions on the matter. If anything it be more of a smh type reaction like really dude? The heat?

And there were 28 other teams he could've gone to.. He went to the heat. Their chief rivals and the guys they hated. Obviously KG doesn't respect him anymore.. Wouldn't even shake his hand at times. And deservedly so. As a fan of the game I agree with KGs sentiments.[/QUOTE]
KG would be one of the players within the rivalry.

No one had a bad word to say about Ray until he left for Miami.
What does that say about the situation?

Perhaps he had very good reasoning that the average ISH poster does not know about.

Zero

Nope. But he's bitchmade.

[QUOTE=jimmy77x]STFU you scum of the earth bandwagoning loser. Not everyone wants to live in miami.
[IMG]http://i45.tinypic.com/16ko120.png[/IMG][/QUOTE]
Every rich man wants to live in a good place like Miami, LA or NY.

And I guess I'm sorry if I have no attachments to any teams on the NBA. I'm not even from America. What is the point of supporting a team from a city I've never even been to?

[QUOTE=pegasus]I wonder when Noah's contract is up. I'm sure he wouldn't mind joining the Heat for less money and become their starting C.[/QUOTE]
If there wasn't a salary cap Noah would have been in Miami if they wanted him. It's like soccer, Barca and Real Madrid get every player they want or baseball with the Yankees. Noah isn't in Chicago because he's loyal or some dumb shit like that. Let's be real, he's there because they are a good team, in a good city and they are the team that can offer him the most money.

[QUOTE=PickernRoller]If that's so then why are you on the thread? Who gives a shit if someone respect him or not? Right?

Lol at that example - doesn't in any way, shape or form rebutted what I had to say. A lot of players in this league deliver - that's why they made it to the NBA. :facepalm

Your competitive spirit, drive, morals, and ethics are also taken into account. If we were all judged on our ability to deliver then there is little uniqueness factor among all humans - certainly not the case.

This thread can be broken down into two camps:

1. Those who believe Ray Allen's decisions and conduct do not in any way affect their respect/opinion of the person.

2. Those who believe Ray Allen's decision and conduct play a role in their respect for the person.

No need to convince one side or the other for either of the two. It's clear both are grounded in strong opinions. Everyone is entitled to theirs.[/QUOTE]

I'm just attempting to appeal to perhaps a few intelligent, open-minded invididuals that might be able to recognize merit in someone else's viewpoint. Trying to divert from the usual drivel that can run rampant on these boards.

Why do people keep saying 28 other teams? Do people actually prefer a Celtic player to go to a Laker team and vice versa where there rivalry spans basically from the beginning of the NBA? The fck is this?

Plus, it isn't about the money for Ray. He wants to continue to be great and he views greatness as getting to the playoffs and winning a championship while still creating a major impact. Out of all the destinations, Grizzlies, Clippers, Heat (and maybe one other team) SHOWED interest in Allen. I don't remember 28 teams asking for Ray's services.

If he wanted to feel important, why the fck would he join a team that does not want to covet Allen? Sure he can get more playing time in other locations, but he's done that with the Bucks, Sonics, and Celtics. The role? Yeah he can have a bigger role in a shitty team, but he's done that already as well. There's really nothing left for Allen to strive for other than to still make an impact and getting more rings. If you guys said maybe 5 other teams, it wouldn't sound farfetch'd.

[QUOTE=G-train]No one had a bad word to say about Ray until he left for Miami.
What does that say about the situation?

Perhaps he had very good reasoning that the average ISH poster does not know about.[/QUOTE]

There are MULTIPLE reasons why he left Celtics, not just one. He even said that in the interview. Lots of people seem to think it's just one reason he went to Miami.

This is a business. Ray Allen is free to do whatever he wants. He owes the Celtics nothing. They had already won a ring together, and made another Finals.

They were thinking of trading him to Memphis, aka "we don't want you here". He played out his contract and left for a better team. The Celts weren't winning the chip anyway.

[QUOTE=Killbot]
There are MULTIPLE reasons why he left Celtics, not just one. He even said that in the interview. Lots of people seem to think it's just one reason he went to Miami.[/QUOTE]
Rondo. Trade rumors. Being benched for Bradley. The 3 main things I remember people talking about. Not sure how much of it were true or not.

[QUOTE=DMV2]Rondo. Trade rumors. Being benched for Bradley. The 3 main things I remember people talking about. Not sure how much of it were true or not.[/QUOTE]

Only Allen knows, but we can speculate and those three are part of it.

Other possibilities:
-Declining usage with less plays run through Allen. He wanted some plays added (like in the post against a mismatch), but Doc stuck with the same system with Rondo having the ball and Ray being the decoy
-Unknown future direction of the Celtics. This kind of coincides with trade rumors. Are the Celtics going to blow up or are they going to fight it out?
-Heat showed more interest in getting Allen's services than Celtics. Pat Riley persuaded him on how they are going to use Allen and how Allen can make an impact
-Golf course
-Warm
-He felt hospitals in Miami took just as much care for his son as in Boston
-Contract situation. Every Celtics player from free agency seem to have 3 years. He gets 2 with less money.
-It's best for his family. I think his mom has a house in Orlando.

[QUOTE=IncarceratedBob]Ray took less money to play for a worse team. Pathetic.[/QUOTE]

1st seed says otherwise.

Zero respect for joining this crew.

There's only one thing that makes this whole Heat conspiracy "okay". In twenty years, when people are talking about great teams, the Heat will not be mentioned casually. People will always talk Lakers, Celtics, Spurs, Bulls, but the Heat - because absolute hatred has existed - will not be mentioned.

Can't wait for Ray Allen, like every other Heat player, to retire.

In before everyone else,

Butt Hurt in Cleveland (think of something new)

[QUOTE=Nash]If there wasn't a salary cap Noah would have been in Miami if they wanted him. It's like soccer, Barca and Real Madrid get every player they want or baseball with the Yankees. Noah isn't in Chicago because he's loyal or some dumb shit like that. Let's be real, he's there because they are a good team, in a good city and they are the team that can offer him the most money.[/QUOTE]
You don't know your own team's players, heck you don't even know what your team is, so I will excuse you for not being aware of Noah's hatred for the Heat and Lebron in particular. He would shave his head before pissing in Miami's locker room, let alone join them.