Kyrie Irving Signs 5 year extension (Max)

[QUOTE=RedBlackAttack]I hope Windhorst chokes on a bratwurst.


For those of you who don't know what we're referring to, I direct you to the following which he put out there the day of our most important game since 2010 while scrapping for a playoff spot late in the season...


[IMG]http://hallpassnetwork.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/Brian-Windhorst-SiriusXM-Radio.png[/IMG]




[url]http://www.cavstheblog.com/?p=25410#more-25410[/url]

Kyrie responded with a flurry of tweets, basically calling him a liar.

Suck it, fatso.

[IMG]http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m61ifnrL1t1qfjsbk.gif[/IMG][/QUOTE]
I stand corrected on the earlier statement, this takes all of windys credibility away if he ever had any to begin with.

[QUOTE=RoundMoundOfReb]It's interesting because statistically Isaiah Thomas was just as good as Irving and by advanced stats even better but he's probably gonna get like 7-8 mil while Irving gets 18...[/QUOTE]

do these advanced statistics take into consideration advanced concepts like teammates, schemes, natural talent and potential, skills, difficulty settings (rookie, all-star, hall-of-fame??? obviously I mean rank of opposing defenses) ???

I'm not saying Irving deserves 10 million more a year than Isaiah Thomas but he is the better player and deserves more money.

not sure how windy is really misguided there though...who's going to prove or disprove that irving wasn't frustrated at one point, especially years ago? him signing the contract doesn't disprove that dissertation.

also, what player on a rookie contract turns down a max contract? rookie contract to max contract? then factor in they just got wiggins and a competent coach that can run a princeton-like offense that has shown he can run a multiple guard set? in the east?

please reel off the long list of players that went from rookie contract and turned down a max contract. shaq maybe? that's only cuz lakers not only could make a qualifying order but beat it...and allow him to play in hollywood with automatic endorsements.

how many teams would even be in contention? lakers won't do a long-term deal unless your name is lebron or melo.

if you want to poke some of a 'reporter', good ol' broussard is open season:

[IMG]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BrcBuWjIEAA7AI3.png[/IMG]

MULTIPLE SAUCES!

[QUOTE=Meticode]So...you don't give him the max, he turns it down and goes somewhere else for the max. Is that what you're saying you'd do?[/QUOTE]
Id have traded him long ago.

kyrie didn't regress in his third year, he actually tried playing on the defensive end. He moved the ball around better too. His numbers dipped slightly, but he had his best basketball season in year 3, IMO.

[QUOTE=Meticode]So...you don't give him the max, he turns it down and goes somewhere else for the max. Is that what you're saying you'd do?[/QUOTE]
Yes, he's an injury prone point guard that can't guard, lead a team or pass.
He just became incredibly overrated with that contract.
Solid 6th man on an average team, nothing more.

[QUOTE=blacknapalm]not sure how windy is really misguided there though...who's going to prove or disprove that irving wasn't frustrated at one point, especially years ago? him signing the contract doesn't disprove that dissertation. [/quote]
Years ago? That was from April. And, he clearly did not think Irving was going to sign the max. I can't imagine reading that piece and everything else he was saying whenever he got the chance and coming to any other conclusion. Make no mistake, this was not a good look for Windy.

It also can't be said enough the timing of those comments. It was literally the day of the biggest game the Cavs have had since James left... The last couple weeks of the season and the day we were playing the Hawks, who owned the 8th spot we were chasing.

Furthermore, Irving lambasted him on Twitter, saying he was lying and attempting to sabotage the Cavs' season... And that no attempts were made to contact him before going public in such a harsh manner.

At this point, I'm taking Kyrie's word for it, not Windy's. Truth is, he was/is a Chris Grant guy. Windy lost access the moment Grant was fired and he's sounded like a guy with an axe to grind ever since.

Fatso needs to stay in James' hip pocket and stay out of Cavs' gossip. I'm sick of him being looked at as some untouchable in the media. He's not. I've seen him get plenty wrong, with this just being the latest example. I remember Windy back when he was covering high school track for the ABJ, before James happened to come along and give him a career.

F#ck that guy.

[QUOTE=RedBlackAttack]Years ago? That was from April. And, he clearly did not think Irving was going to sign the max. I can't imagine reading that piece and everything else he was saying whenever he got the chance and coming to any other conclusion. Make no mistake, this was not a good look for Windy.

It also can't be said enough the timing of those comments. It was literally the day of the biggest game the Cavs have had since James left... The last couple weeks of the season and the day we were playing the Hawks, who owned the 8th spot we were chasing.

Furthermore, Irving lambasted him on Twitter, saying he was lying and attempting to sabotage the Cavs' season... And that no attempts were made to contact him before going public in such a harsh manner.

At this point, I'm taking Kyrie's word for it, not Windy's. Truth is, he was/is a Chris Grant guy. Windy lost access the moment Grant was fired and he's sounded like a guy with an axe to grind ever since.

Fatso needs to stay in James' hip pocket and stay out of Cavs' gossip. I'm sick of him being looked at as some untouchable in the media. He's not. I've seen him get plenty wrong, with this just being the latest example. I remember Windy back when he was covering high school track for the ABJ, before James happened to come along and give him a career.

F#ck that guy.[/QUOTE]

fair enough. i didn't realize it was that recent and ya, he certainly owes lebron his career basically

[QUOTE=blacknapalm]fair enough. i didn't realize it was that recent and ya, he certainly owes lebron his career basically[/QUOTE]


yes and no.

Windy is a talented writer and he did try and stay with the Cleveland PD to cover cavs after the decision.

Problem was that a struggling print newspaper wasn't going to come close to what ESPN had to offer.


But the timing of that nasty piece was horrible. Jason LLyod wrote a scathing Kyrie article as well a month or so beforehand. There was writing on the wall with Kyrie not being happy in town, but supposedly he loves the direction the team is going in.

Actions speak louder than words, and i'm pretty pumped that he signed this big deal.



Despite all that, Windhorst is more plugged into NBA and the cavs by proxy the the majority of the writers that cover the cavs. It's too soon to tell under the new administration which writers you can or cannot trust.

[QUOTE=buddha]do these advanced statistics take into consideration advanced concepts like teammates, schemes, natural talent and potential, skills, difficulty settings (rookie, all-star, hall-of-fame??? obviously I mean rank of opposing defenses) ???

I'm not saying Irving deserves 10 million more a year than Isaiah Thomas but he is the better player and deserves more money.[/QUOTE]

Irving has more potential obviously and is 3 years younger but in 2014 Isaiah was probably the better player off the eye test (a lot of that can be put on Mike Brown though).

As far as difficulty goes - Isaiah played in a tougher conference and tougher schedule.

Except the Kings had ****ing Demarcus Cousins and Rudy Gay for half the year. Makes things a lot easier when you're the third focus of the defense.

[QUOTE=KyrieTheFuture]Except the Kings had ****ing Demarcus Cousins and [B]Rudy Gay[/B] for half the year. Makes things a lot easier when you're the third focus of the defense.[/QUOTE]
:biggums:

[QUOTE=RoundMoundOfReb]:biggums:[/QUOTE]
He'd be the second best player on the cavs

[QUOTE=KyrieTheFuture]He'd be the second best player on the cavs[/QUOTE]
He's about as good as Deng was. I'd take all of Deng, Varejao, TT and Waiters over him. He was a huge net negative with the Raptors.

[QUOTE=RoundMoundOfReb]He's about as good as Deng was. I'd take all of Deng, Varejao, TT and Waiters over him. He was a huge net negative with the Raptors.[/QUOTE]
He was better with the kings doe if I remember right and Deng was absolutely atrocious just unbelievably awful it was mind blowing.

[QUOTE=KyrieTheFuture]He was better with the kings doe if I remember right and Deng was absolutely atrocious just unbelievably awful it was mind blowing.[/QUOTE]
He was better with the Bulls. That pretty much describes Rudy Gay with TO.

[QUOTE=Meticode]So...you don't give him the max, he turns it down and goes somewhere else for the max. Is that what you're saying you'd do?[/QUOTE]
I don't think there's such thing as a team other than Cleveland who is desperate enough to give an unproven player like Kyrie Irving 18m/year.

[QUOTE=wagexslave]I don't think there's such thing as a team other than Cleveland who is desperate enough to give an unproven player like Kyrie Irving 18m/year.[/QUOTE]
Why is he unproven?

[QUOTE=wagexslave]I don't think there's such thing as a team other than Cleveland who is desperate enough to give an unproven player like Kyrie Irving 18m/year.[/QUOTE]
Wait did Cleveland figure out a way to circumvent the cap and sign Irving to the 10 years experience max contract? That would be awesome...

Oh you mean average, well by the time he is making that much it will be three years into the deal. He could legitimately be the best PG in the league in 3 years. Already is in the East..

[QUOTE=wagexslave]I don't think there's such thing as a team other than Cleveland who is desperate enough to give an unproven player like Kyrie Irving 18m/year.[/QUOTE]
Do you not know how much Kyrie is making this year lol.

[QUOTE=wagexslave]I don't think there's such thing as a team other than Cleveland who is desperate enough to give an unproven player like Kyrie Irving 18m/year.[/QUOTE]
[IMG]http://i3.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/000/783/443/d1b.gif[/IMG]

[QUOTE=RoundMoundOfReb]He's about as good as Deng was.[/QUOTE]
Deng fckin sucks. Let another team pay him $10mil for shit.

Isaiah Thomas pretty much is the player right now that he'll be in 3-4 years. It is what it is with him, but Kyrie has superstar potential. Cavs would've fcked up if they didn't give Kyrie this deal. You can't live off the free agent market in Cleveland. If you hit gold in the draft, you lock them up. Good deal on both sides. Hope the Cavs can pick up a legit veteran to "wisen" up the team.

So many people underrating Deng it's insane.

So 19/7/4 on 45% shooting while playing with a bad Achilles sucks?

[QUOTE=Meticode]So many people underrating Deng it's insane.

So 19/7/4 on 45% shooting while playing with a bad Achilles sucks?[/QUOTE]

Bring those stats to the Hawks.

[QUOTE=Meticode]So many people underrating Deng it's insane.

So 19/7/4 on 45% shooting while playing with a bad Achilles sucks?[/QUOTE]
That was like a 20 game sample on the Bulls. Erratic shooter. Slowing down immensely. Relies on wingspan to defend now. He was probably worth his contract back then but now, anyone giving him $10+ million is :facepalm

[QUOTE=Mass Debator]That was like a 20 game sample on the Bulls. Erratic shooter. Slowing down immensely. Relies on wingspan to defend now. He was probably worth his contract back then but now, anyone giving him $10+ million is :facepalm[/QUOTE]
25 games, and his role was completely different to begin with this year. He was asked to initiate the offense more once Rose went back down. He had to handle the scoring load more because who the hell else is going to score? Thib's played his ass into the ground over the years and he put up 19/7/4 on a bum ass achilles to where he couldn't even play back-to-backs when he was with the Cavs. Of course he'd slow down immensely with that and then given the fact you're playing on a whole new team after 9 seasons with a coach that doesn't have a clue what to do on the offensive side or just doesn't care enough.

[QUOTE=Meticode]So many people underrating Deng it's insane.

So 19/7/4 on 45% shooting while playing with a bad Achilles sucks?[/QUOTE]
Theyre underrating him because of his contract. If he was only getting 2mil a year he'd be solid gold.

[QUOTE=1~Gibson~1]Theyre underrating him because of his contract. If he was only getting 2mil a year he'd be solid gold.[/QUOTE]
He certainly doesn't deserve the $14.5 million he made this year. But he's worth $10 million to me when he's healthy. Like I said, Woj reporeted he'll probably get a contract worth $10-$12, I wouldn't be surprised if it's around $13 to be honest.

[COLOR="Magenta"]where do all these ppl get these "sources" from that guys r unhappy n want to leave? Like wtf r hangn out with these players?

the fact kyrie signed so quickly shows he never wanted to leave

Gud move by Cle , dude is gnna b a beast [/COLOR]

Can I just say that these constant comparisons between Kyrie and Isaiah Thomas are both ludicrous and head-scratching. First of all, the same people making the comparisons, which are completely based on box scores are probably also the ones who were likely diminishing Kyrie in his first two years as being all numbers, no substance. People use statistics when it suits them.

Second, Thomas had a really good year. He probably stacked up well statistically against most point guards in the league. The guy averaged 20+ points and 6+ assists on 45+% shooting.

He had a nice season. Props to him. Let's see if he can do it consistently before everyone starts comparing him to a guy who [I][B]earned [/B][/I]a max contract, which Kyrie has.

Third, and the most obvious... anyone who actually sat down and watched the Cavs this past season (there weren't a ton of us) knows that every night, defending Kyrie was the opposing defense's first job. He was seeing doubles and traps all over the floor. Every basket and every assist was made through the teeth of focused defenses. It even got to the point where Waiters, Jack and Delly began alternating at the point, because playing off the ball made Irving harder to double (and he had success playing off the ball).

It would be easy to say, "Well, he's the point guard. Just pass it when the doubles come," but he was far and away the Cavs' best scorer and, in general, they didn't stand a chance if he wasn't putting the ball in the basket. And, defenses knew it.

Thomas has never been the focus of any defenses. They worry about Cousins first, Gay second... he might be third on the pecking order. Maybe.

Last, Thomas will be 25 next season. Irving will be 22.

It's a weak comparison.

[QUOTE=Meticode]He certainly doesn't deserve the $14.5 million he made this year. But he's worth $10 million to me when he's healthy. Like I said, Woj reporeted he'll probably get a contract worth $10-$12, I wouldn't be surprised if it's around $13 to be honest.[/QUOTE]
I have to wonder what version of Deng you were watching. Chicago ran him into the ground and it showed. You can blame it on injuries, but he looked like a guy whose career was running on fumes.

Who knows, maybe he'll turn things back around this season. But, would you feel comfortable giving him four years, $48 million based on what you saw? I don't think many Cavs fans would. And, I don't think many Bulls fans would either.

That says a lot.

Deng's a good player when he's dialed in and healthy.

3 year guaranteed deals are out of the question if you ask me. He may be worth 10 mill for 3 years with a team option on the third to the right team. Maybe.

[QUOTE=RoundMoundOfReb]It's interesting because statistically Isaiah Thomas was just as good as Irving and by advanced stats even better but he's probably gonna get like 7-8 mil while Irving gets 18...[/QUOTE]

isiaih also three years older

and even aside from his age, just looking at their games, kyrie has a lot more potential.

[QUOTE=chips93]isiaih also three years older

and even aside from his age, just looking at their games, kyrie has a lot more potential.[/QUOTE]
I'll address RBA's post later when I have more time but:

Isaiah was slightly better this year (at least imo) but yeah I DO think Irving deserves to be paid more than him based on potential....but not 10 million more on a longer term deal. He's not worth more than 2x Isaiah.

[QUOTE=RedBlackAttack]Can I just say that these constant comparisons between Kyrie and Isaiah Thomas are both ludicrous and head-scratching. First of all, the same people making the comparisons, which are completely based on box scores are probably also the ones who were likely diminishing Kyrie in his first two years as being all numbers, no substance. People use statistics when it suits them.

Second, Thomas had a really good year. He probably stacked up well statistically against most point guards in the league. The guy averaged 20+ points and 6+ assists on 45+% shooting.

He had a nice season. Props to him. Let's see if he can do it consistently before everyone starts comparing him to a guy who [I][B]earned [/B][/I]a max contract, which Kyrie has.

Third, and the most obvious... anyone who actually sat down and watched the Cavs this past season (there weren't a ton of us) knows that every night, defending Kyrie was the opposing defense's first job. He was seeing doubles and traps all over the floor. Every basket and every assist was made through the teeth of focused defenses. It even got to the point where Waiters, Jack and Delly began alternating at the point, because playing off the ball made Irving harder to double (and he had success playing off the ball).

It would be easy to say, "Well, he's the point guard. Just pass it when the doubles come," but he was far and away the Cavs' best scorer and, in general, they didn't stand a chance if he wasn't putting the ball in the basket. And, defenses knew it.

Thomas has never been the focus of any defenses. They worry about Cousins first, Gay second... he might be third on the pecking order. Maybe.

Last, Thomas will be 25 next season. Irving will be 22.

It's a weak comparison.[/QUOTE]

Kyrie did not earn his max contract. If he did, then we have incredibly low standards for max players, Deng is a better player and he's not getting a max, Parsons is a better player and he's not getting a max, same as Lowry.
Of course it's a weak comparison, Isiah Thomas is better, has a better character, better passer, better defender, much more heart in him.
Shit, I'd take Avery Bradley, Lance Stephenson over him in a heart beat.
Kyrie is incredibly overrated, he's a no defense, injury prone gunner who has little to no passing ability as a point guard

:wtf: [QUOTE=SexSymbol]Kyrie did not earn his max contract. If he did, then we have incredibly low standards for max players, Deng is a better player and he's not getting a max, Parsons is a better player and he's not getting a max, same as Lowry.
Of course it's a weak comparison, Isiah Thomas is better, has a better character, better passer, better defender, much more heart in him.
Shit, I'd take Avery Bradley, Lance Stephenson over him in a heart beat.
Kyrie is incredibly overrated, he's a no defense, injury prone gunner who has little to no passing ability as a point guard[/QUOTE]

I take it Kyrie isn't your favorite player?

[QUOTE=SexSymbol]Kyrie did not earn his max contract. If he did, then we have incredibly low standards for max players, [B]Deng is a better player [/B]and he's not getting a max, [B]Parsons is a better player [/B]and he's not getting a max, [B]same as Lowry[/B].
Of course it's a weak comparison, [B]Isiah Thomas is better[/B], has a better character, better passer, better defender, much more heart in him.
Shit, I'd take [B]Avery Bradley[/B], [B]Lance Stephenson [/B]over him in a heart beat.
Kyrie is incredibly overrated, he's a no defense, injury prone gunner who has little to no passing ability as a point guard[/QUOTE]
LOL @ all of the bolded.

That guy is a ****ing troll.

No brainer. He was getting the max no matter what. 1st overall pick, put up numbers, Only turning 23 before the playoffs start next year. Just how the NBA works, Cleveland would be dumb to hurt the relationship by playing stupid and trying to lowball him.

That being said since were comparing him to PG's around the league deals like this make me happy with Lawson at 11ish mill next season. Don't think Irving was that much better this year, if at all. Obviously younger tho.

I'd take him without thinking over I.Thomas. IT is a blackhole. Not even a good one like Arenas, or Stevie Franchise/Marbury. He's destined to put up numbers on shitty teams or come off the bench for a good one IMO. Talented but you just don't go anywhere with overdribbling, shoot first 5'9 PG's. Maybe that's unfair but Thomas has never passed the eyetest for me.

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