[IMG]http://www.irreligion.org/wp-content/uploads/2007/04/god-v-satan.png[/IMG]
I'd prefer it if the devil was real since god is such a dick.
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[IMG]http://www.irreligion.org/wp-content/uploads/2007/04/god-v-satan.png[/IMG]
I'd prefer it if the devil was real since god is such a dick.
[QUOTE=Nowitness]An agnostic is someone who neither believes nor disbelieves in the existence of a deity or deities, whereas a theist and an atheist believe and disbelieve, respectively.
You smokin' san? Just because we may never know doesn't mean we don't assert.[/QUOTE]
Not even close
[QUOTE][B]Gnostic[/B]
Relating to knowledge, especially esoteric mystical knowledge.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE][B]Origin[/B]
late 16th century (as a noun): via ecclesiastical Latin from Greek gnōstikos, from gnōstos 'known' (related to gignōskein 'know').[/QUOTE]
Gnostic = to have knowledge
Agnostic = to lack having knowledge
"Agnostic" literally means "not knowing". "Not knowing" applies to everybody. None of us know what is or isn't outside of the known universe.
[QUOTE][B]the
[QUOTE=NumberSix]Not even close
Gnostic = to have knowledge
Agnostic = to lack having knowledge
"Agnostic" literally means "not knowing". "Not knowing" applies to everybody. None of us know what is or isn't outside of the known universe.
Theism = belief in god(s)
Atheism = the lack of belief in god(s)
Lacking a belief =/= believing the opposite.
Agnostic = not knowing if there is a god.
Atheist = not believing there is a god. That doesn't mean believing there ISN'T a god.[/QUOTE]
Which is exactly why I label myself as an antitheist. Checkmate.
God no by the time I'm old and crusty I will probably be so sick of the human experience that I hope there isn't anything that resembles it after I die.
[QUOTE=Patrick Chewing]You were rebutting my statement about God being ever-present I'm assuming. You need to keep up with your replies. I was actually trying to be civil with you and warning that you that we cannot get into a debate about who came first and who created what since we honestly do not know. The best we can do is use Einstein's Theory of Relativity to possibly answer the question about a "Creator" always being there and the universe/stars/planets/life coming afterwards.
[B]I'm no bible-thumper. I'm trying to use science to prove Creationism and not the alternative. But if you guys have other science proving otherwise, I'd love to see it.[/B][/QUOTE]
Royal Society = 97% non-theists
American National Academy of Sciences = 93% non-theists
But hey, what do they know? I'm sure you can set them straight. :oldlol: :hammerhead:
[QUOTE=Nowitness]Which is exactly why I label myself as an antitheist. [B]Checkmate[/B].[/QUOTE]
Assuming you even know what it means. By your recent history........
You really can't get anywhere with a religious person. Indoctrination is powerful.
I read somewhere that the brain rewards you for holding onto your beliefs. So trying to talk to a religious person with logic will only make them hold onto their beliefs even stronger.
As for the question, I wouldn't want the god of any religion mankind has created. I feel like the book God Delusion captures all my feelings on the subject of religion. It's useless thing today that causes nothing but trouble. Yes it gives people comfort, but so does Santa for children. There comes a time when you have to grow up. It's amazing how children figure out that Santa isn't real, but adults can't let go of the idea of a man in the sky watching over them.
Let's see what Einstein himself has to say about god:
[QUOTE]The word god is for me nothing more than the expression and product of human weaknesses, [B]the Bible a collection of honourable, but still primitive legends which are nevertheless pretty childish.[/B] No interpretation no matter how subtle can (for me) change this.
-- Albert Einstein[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE]I cannot imagine a God who rewards and punishes the objects of his creation, whose purposes are modeled after our own -- a God, in short, who is but a reflection of human frailty. [B]Neither can I believe that the individual survives the death of his body, although feeble souls harbor such thoughts through fear or ridiculous egotisms.[/B]
-- Albert Einstein[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE][B]For me the Jewish religion like all others is an incarnation of the most childish superstitions.[/B] And the Jewish people to whom I gladly belong and with whose mentality I have a deep affinity have no different quality for me than all other people. As far as my experience goes, they are no better than other human groups, although they are protected from the worst cancers by a lack of power. Otherwise I cannot see anything "chosen" about them.
-- Albert Einstein[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE][B]I cannot conceive of a personal God who would directly influence the actions of individuals, or would directly sit in judgment on creatures of his own creation.[/B] I cannot do this in spite of the fact that mechanistic causality has, to a certain extent, been placed in doubt by modern science. [He was speaking of Quantum Mechanics and the breaking down of determinism.] My religiosity consists in a humble admiration of the infinitely superior spirit that reveals itself in the little that we, with our weak and transitory understanding, can comprehend of reality. Morality is of the highest importance -- but for us, not for God.
-- Albert Einstein[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE]It was, of course, a lie what you read about my religious convictions, a lie which is being systematically repeated. [B]I do not believe in a personal God and I have never denied this but have expressed it clearly. [/B]If something is in me which can be called religious then it is the unbounded admiration for the structure of the world so far as our science can reveal it.
-- Albert Einstein[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=RoseCity07]You really can't get anywhere with a religious person. Indoctrination is powerful.
I read somewhere that the brain rewards you for holding onto your beliefs. So trying to talk to a religious person with logic will only make them hold onto their beliefs even stronger.
As for the question, I wouldn't want the god of any religion mankind has created. I feel like the book God Delusion captures all my feelings on the subject of religion. It's useless thing today that causes nothing but trouble. Yes it gives people comfort, but so does Santa for children. There comes a time when you have to grow up. It's amazing how children figure out that Santa isn't real, but adults can't let go of the idea of a man in the sky watching over them.[/QUOTE]
Love that Dawkins quote.
[QUOTE=RoseCity07]You really can't get anywhere with a religious person. Indoctrination is powerful.
[B]I read somewhere that the brain rewards you for holding onto your beliefs. So trying to talk to a religious person with logic will only make them hold onto their beliefs even stronger.
[/B]
As for the question, I wouldn't want the god of any religion mankind has created. I feel like the book God Delusion captures all my feelings on the subject of religion. It's useless thing today that causes nothing but trouble. Yes it gives people comfort, but so does Santa for children. There comes a time when you have to grow up. It's amazing how children figure out that Santa isn't real, but adults can't let go of the idea of a man in the sky watching over them.[/QUOTE]
Yup, it's called confirmation bias.
[QUOTE=Brokenbeat]Royal Society = 97% non-theists
American National Academy of Sciences = 93% non-theists
But hey, what do they know? I'm sure you can set them straight. :oldlol: :hammerhead:[/QUOTE]
LOL Science is always changing. Nothing is ever concrete in the scientific world.
Scientists still can't explain how DNA was created, yet simpletons all across the globe believe in Evolution as irrefutable certainty.
[QUOTE=Patrick Chewing]LOL Science is always changing. Nothing is ever concrete in the scientific world.
Scientists still can't explain how DNA was created, yet simpletons all across the globe believe in Evolution as irrefutable certainty.[/QUOTE]
Okay, and this is evidence that the Bible is correct? If science has these built in methods to get it right and revise, then how wrong is the Bible which has no method for correcting its errors?
Science is tentative. You say that as if it's a bad thing. It's a great thing. No scientist would be ashamed of the scientific method.
no one is really against the idea of religion/God in my opinion.
they might just be against the idea of living a healthy life.
to accept the unknown.
instead of risking the unknown.
[QUOTE=Patrick Chewing]Scientists still can't explain how DNA was created, yet simpletons all across the globe believe in Evolution as irrefutable certainty.[/QUOTE]
like those simpletons at monsanto who use evolutionary principles to design products that earn them billions of dollars, right?
[QUOTE=Patrick Chewing]LOL Science is always changing. Nothing is ever concrete in the scientific world.
[B]Scientists still can't explain how DNA was created[/B], yet simpletons all across the globe believe in Evolution as irrefutable certainty.[/QUOTE]
Exactly. Who makes us breath? Who make our brain function? To all of the non believers out there, you can't see wind but you believe its there right?
The real problem with religion is that it teaches people to stop asking questions. They can live their lives and just know that some being out there figured it all out and they don't have to think for themselves. Just be a follower.
This thinking leads to war and destruction. You see it in the news every single night. People killing each other over which god is the right god.
This can't happen in science. If there is disagreement, you talk about it, use evidence to support your claim. People either reach consensus or they don't. Disagreement about the the creator being of the Earth or the universe drives people to murder and hate.
[QUOTE=Patrick Chewing]LOL Science is always changing. Nothing is ever concrete in the scientific world.
Scientists still can't explain how DNA was created, yet simpletons all across the globe believe in Evolution as irrefutable certainty.[/QUOTE]
Irrefutable certainty for creationists:
[IMG]http://stream1.gifsoup.com/view/937240/ray-s-banana-o.gif[/IMG]
[QUOTE=GimmeThat]no one is really against the idea of religion/God in my opinion.
they might just be against the idea of living a healthy life.
to accept the unknown.
instead of risking the unknown.[/QUOTE]
Yes, they are. There are many reasons for it. Ranging from God being petty, not wanting to live in a George Orwell novel, not surrendering your mind to a book, refusing to be told who you can have sex with and how.
[QUOTE=RoseCity07]Okay, and this is evidence that the Bible is correct? If science has these built in methods to get it right and revise, then how wrong is the Bible which has no method for correcting its errors?
Science is tentative. You say that as if it's a bad thing. It's a great thing. No scientist would be ashamed of the scientific method.[/QUOTE]
I said earlier in this thread that the Bible is merely a history book on past events. I don't even own a Bible. Again, people are so quick to shoot down Christians since it's the dominant religion across the globe.
Forget Christianity and forget the Bible. I'm more interested in how science can invariably prove the existence of a deity by using that same science to show that there are things on this Earth, in the universe, and within ourselves that cannot be scientifically explained. While DNA research is still fairly new, I'm fascinated by the fact that we can find nothing else like it here on Earth or begin to explain its origins.
This is a good read on Creationism for those non-believers who at least have an open mind about the whole thing.
[url]http://www.icr.org/article/105/[/url]
[QUOTE=Patrick Chewing]While DNA research is still fairly new, I'm fascinated by the fact that we can find nothing else like it here on Earth or begin to explain its origins.[/QUOTE]
we might not know the full story about DNA yet but we can definitely "begin to explain its origins"
[url]http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK6360/[/url]
[quote]The transition from the RNA to the DNA world was a major event in the history of life. The invention of DNA required the appearance of enzymatic activities for both synthesis of DNA precursors, retro-transcription of RNA templates and replication of singleand double-stranded DNA molecules. Recent data from comparative genomics, structural biology and traditional biochemistry have revealed that several of these enzymatic activities have been invented independently more than once, indicating that the transition from RNA to DNA genomes was more complex than previously thought. The distribution of the different protein families corresponding to these activities in the three domains of life (Archaea, Eukarya, and Bacteria) is puzzling. In many cases, Archaea and Eukarya contain the same version of these proteins, whereas Bacteria contain another version. However, in other cases, such as thymidylate synthases or type II DNA topoisomerases, the phylogenetic distributions of these proteins do not follow this simple pattern. Several hypotheses have been proposed to explain these observations, including independent invention of DNA and DNA replication proteins, ancient gene transfer and gene loss, and/or nonorthologous replacement. We review all of them here, with more emphasis on recent proposals suggesting that viruses have played a major role in the origin and evolution of the DNA replication proteins and possibly of DNA itself.[/quote]
[QUOTE=Patrick Chewing]I said earlier in this thread that the Bible is merely a history book on past events. I don't even own a Bible. Again, people are so quick to shoot down Christians since it's the dominant religion across the globe.
Forget Christianity and forget the Bible. [B]I'm more interested in how science can invariably prove the existence of a deity by using that same science to show that there are things on this Earth, in the universe, and within ourselves that cannot be scientifically explained. [/B] While DNA research is still fairly new, I'm fascinated by the fact that we can find nothing else like it here on Earth or begin to explain its origins.[/QUOTE]
We couldn't explain a lot of things. There are things that people believed we would never understand. Humans solve problems that have no apparent solution. If you just give up because you don't know the answer you get nowhere. Perhaps science will never solve that problem ("How did something come from nothing?"). It beats sitting around and saying, "I'm tired of thinking...god did it".
There is nothing wrong with saying, "I don't know". Pretending you know when you don't does nothing but feed the ego. Just because we feel there needs to be a purpose to the universe doesn't mean there is one.
[QUOTE=Patrick Chewing]This is a good read on Creationism for those non-believers who at least have an open mind about the whole thing.
[url]http://www.icr.org/article/105/[/url][/QUOTE]
Unexplained =/= proof that god did it.
[QUOTE=Nowitness]Yes, they are. There are many reasons for it. Ranging from God being petty, not wanting to live in a George Orwell novel, not surrendering your mind to a book, refusing to be told who you can have sex with and how.[/QUOTE]
so you're fighting the idea of what others are telling you what/who God is and should be like.
you have insulted the bear in which I am dancing with.
Patrick Chewing, i thought you hated religion? Hell i thought you were even a racist.... doesnt make sense....
[QUOTE=NumberSix]Unexplained =/= proof that god did it.[/QUOTE]
[IMG]http://i.qkme.me/3ts9ud.jpg[/IMG]
[QUOTE=pauk]Patrick Chewing, i thought you hated religion? Hell i thought you were even a racist.... shit doesnt make sense.... :biggums:[/QUOTE]
Nein, nein. I'm a Christian and technically a minority in the United States.
A racist? Hardly. I offend equally. I do not like Islam.
I will make it my goal in life to convert you, Pauk. None of this fasting, no TV-watching, no sex for a month bullshit. You and I will eat, shit, f*ck (not each other) all we want. Come to my church, bro.
[QUOTE=Patrick Chewing]Nein, nein. I'm a Christian and technically a minority in the United States.
A racist? Hardly. I offend equally. I do not like Islam.
I will make it my goal in life to convert you, Pauk. None of this fasting, no TV-watching, no sex for a month bullshit. You and I will eat, shit, f*ck (not each other) all we want. Come to my church, bro.[/QUOTE]
Because you're part of a different denomination?
[QUOTE=Patrick Chewing]Nein, nein. I'm a Christian and technically a minority in the United States.
A racist? Hardly. I offend equally. I do not like Islam.
I will make it my goal in life to convert you, Pauk. None of this fasting, no TV-watching, no sex for a month bullshit. You and I will eat, shit, f*ck (not each other) all we want. Come to my church, bro.[/QUOTE]
My mother is Christian, father a Muslim....... none of them were so religious, if they were i doubt they would be married... i myself am more agnostic, not a huge fan of any religion... but open to suggestion, proof.... until then i might aswell believe in Santa Clause...
What i believe in:
Peace & Benovelence (no matter what!), be kind, treat others like i want to be treated, take care of planet earth, Kumbaya and all that stuff.... and from there on, just live my life.... and when i die, if God does exist and decides to punish me for that.... then so be it, because i know i lived & behaved better than most of his "true followers"....
[QUOTE=pauk]My mother is Christian, father a Muslim....... none of them were so religious, if they were i doubt they would be married... i myself am more agnostic, not a huge fan of any religion... but open to suggestion, proof.... until then i might aswell believe in Santa Clause...
What i believe in:
Peace & Benovelence (no matter what!), be kind, treat others like i want to be treated, take care of planet earth, Kumbaya and all that stuff.... and from there on, just live my life.... and when i die, if God does exist and decides to punish me for that.... then so be it, because i know i lived & behaved better than most of his "true followers"....[/QUOTE]
:applause:
[QUOTE=pauk]My mother is Christian, father a Muslim....... none of them were so religious, if they were i doubt they would be married... i myself am more agnostic, not a huge fan of any religion... but open to suggestion, proof.... until then i might aswell believe in Santa Clause...
What i believe in:
[B]Peace & Benovelence (no matter what!), be kind, treat others like i want to be treated, take care of planet earth, Kumbaya and all that stuff.... and from there on, just live my life.... and when i die, if God does exist and decides to punish me for that.... then so be it, because i know i lived & behaved better than most of his "true followers"....[/B][/QUOTE]
:applause:
You know, you're alright pauk. I disagree with you at times (blaming Wade for 2011, and exagerrating the possessions in the 60s), but you seem like a good guy with a level head on your shoulders. Good shit. :cheers:
[QUOTE=Nowitness]Because you're part of a different denomination?[/QUOTE]
More Roman Catholic than anything, but I don't practice it. I know who I am with God and I'm a sinner just as much as the next guy.
As far as the minority, I was referring to me being Hispanic. Based on my beliefs here, most people probably think I'm a racist redneck from Alabama or some shit with just a middle-school education.
I used to be an atheist/non-believer with the same, "well you can't prove it" attitude. I remember eating at a restaurant and some friends of mine took out a Bible and wanted to have a serious talk with me about God and my belief system. I told them to get that book the hell away from me. Without going into too much detail, it took the death of a close family member to re-ignite my faith in God and Jesus Christ.
LMFAO at the dude quoting Einstein.
What kind of wannabe smart guy quotes an accomplished physicist to support their opinions on the infantility of those of Faith. Bro if you want to bolster your atheist agenda get on dat dere David Hume and Voltaire time.
Pauk no wonder I like you. You're the same breed of my childhood friend.
IMO, there's merit to..
Catholics to dislike:
Gluttony - Wastefulness...
Sloth - Actually not laziness.. rather a lack of passion for life.. being a miserable person with a rain cloud on your head havin dat crab in a bucket mentality
Lust - Unwavering desire.... STD's drained fapping
Pride - Hubris..
Wrath - Destructive rage which results in spiraling violence
Greed - Excessive desire at the expense of your brother's well being etc..
Envy - just an ugly trait on any human.. compersion much better.
Christian Agape Love.. Protestant Work Ethic... "Love thy neighbor"... Do as to others... helping orphanages and homeless...
I'm pretty sure Muslims believe in
forbidding alcohol because it fuks up your conscoiusness
forbidding pork because it carries disease in the desert
Ni'ah being the mos timportant facet of starting something.... Intention
Sakinah... the steps to make a peaceful family environment
the healthy medium virtues like transcending fearfulness to have courage but not at the point of recklessness...
some codes involved in protecting the environmnet
slaughtering animals in a way that reduces pain
zakat charity work
shaytan as a symbol of selfishness falsehood and an enemy that creeps up on ya
The force of unwavering faith to conquer your inner demons and such an such.
There's some gems in there. Now which to hold on to and which to forego..
[QUOTE=JEFFERSON MONEY]LMFAO at the dude quoting Einstein.
What kind of wannabe smart guy quotes an accomplished physicist to support their opinions on the infantility of those of Faith. Bro if you want to bolster your atheist agenda get on dat dere David Hume and Voltaire time.
[/QUOTE]
He brought up Einstein, dipshit. I just posted what Einstein himself had to say about god. :cheers:
[QUOTE=Brokenbeat]Irrefutable certainty for creationists:
[IMG]http://stream1.gifsoup.com/view/937240/ray-s-banana-o.gif[/IMG][/QUOTE]
Friggin' idiot picked a genetically modified, asexual seedless fruit that wouldn't survive without humans to prove the existence of God :facepalm :roll:
The common banana has an intelligent designer--humans.
[QUOTE=ThePhantomCreep]Friggin' idiot picked a genetically modified, asexual seedless fruit that wouldn't survive without humans to prove the existence of God :facepalm :roll:
The common banana has an intelligent designer--humans.[/QUOTE]
so we design what we consume?
so God IS selfish and want others to worship
[QUOTE=Patrick Chewing]God is real. Heaven and Hell are real.
To look at the world and the universe[B] and convince yourself that it is all there "by chance"[/B] is ludicrous.[/QUOTE]
Pretty sure you're trolling but I hope you don't actually believe this is what atheists believe.
Well, even if God did create it then it still arose by 'chance' - the chance that God would choose to make the universe, and decide to make it fit to the general scientific principles to which it holds. Unless, of course, you are also declaring the actions of God to be predetermined, in which case he is lacking in free will, and not much of a God at all.
Nor does the acceptance of a God necessitate belief in Heaven or Hell in any way, shape, or form.
[QUOTE=Real14]Exactly. Who makes us breath? Who make our brain function? To all of the non believers out there, you can't see wind but you believe its there right?[/QUOTE]
:roll: read this post and can't stop laughing. Not gonna say anymore.
[QUOTE=Brokenbeat]He brought up Einstein, dipshit. I just posted what Einstein himself had to say about god. :cheers:[/QUOTE]
Here are some other quotes from Einstein; quotes that came much later on on his life.