Hakeem
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Hakeem
[QUOTE=hateraid]Don't feel bad for saying it. Yeah, it feels like you're disrespecting your elders, but you have eyes, a brain, so come up with your own conclusion.:cheers:[/QUOTE]
No,I
Of course it's always the current players (especially if they happen to play for your team) who are better than those elders ><
yawn
This is about as close as they get comparison wise.
Tough choice that im not going to make.
I can count on one hand how many twenty footers Duncan has taken in the playoffs.
[QUOTE=johndeeregreen]I can count on one hand how many twenty footers Duncan has taken in the playoffs.[/QUOTE]
wow, I didn't know you could count
Uhhh... all right?
Do you have a point?
Undoubtedly Duncan can shoot the midrange jumper, but shoots it extremely rarely. It's really not a big part of his game at all, and definitely not something that separates him in any way from Hakeem.
[QUOTE=johndeeregreen]Uhhh... all right?
Do you have a point?
Undoubtedly Duncan can shoot the midrange jumper, but shoots it extremely rarely. It's really not a big part of his game at all, and definitely not something that separates him in any way from Hakeem.[/QUOTE]
uh, I beg to differ, his eighteen footer from the wing is a staple of his (bank shot) and maybe he hasn't used it a lot this particualr playoff season (probably because the plan versus the Jazz and Suns was to jam it down their throats) but it is practically a trademark of his.
and back when he used to battle the Lakers he would kill Shaq from the top of the key, even hit that impossible jumper before Derek Fisher one upped him at the 0.4 second mark.
You guys are clearly not taking into account Hakeem Olajuwon's clutch factor v Tim Duncan's. How quickly some forget how Tim would and still does now at times clank those key free throws circa 2000-2004 versus LA Lakers although they won it all in 2003. Hakeem would Dream Shake Timmy while Timmy would Funda"mentally" do Olajuwon.
[QUOTE=hateraid]Give poeticism credit for laying down the stats. Yes, stats don't tell the story, but it's funny how people use that argument when they argue for "their" player. Also give him credit for actually summing up an argument rather than," Hakeem is better, take my word for it," argument. Tell you the truth I've been around for both their careers and I'd take Duncan for a smidgen myself.
You can't use the competition arugument. Although yes, Dream had Ewing Shaq,and Admiral, but let's not take away from as prime Webber, prime Sheed, prime Nowitzki, they both had Shaq, but Laker Shaq was far better and on a more dominant Laker team than early Orlando. Also please don't take away level of competition in both eras. Yeah, Hakeem's era had the legendary status, the same status that blinds our judgment when it comes to comparing. we always seem to rate the legends miles ahead of todays competition. It's not that far off.
Accolades do tell part of the story. It show your ability to lead a team and create you own legendary status. Statistics aslo show your performance against elite competition. So taking into account of the accolades, Duncan has been doing what he's doing longer and with more consistancy. With those accolades piled up, and no doubt in my mind he will ad to his acheivments for at least 4 or five more years. His body is a warrior, barely ever gets injured, does his thing, even though he's less physically gift compared to Hakeem in the athleticism and speed department.
Supporting cast. Hakeem had the better teams. Yeah, you can say, Ducan had Admiral, but at the same points of their career (supporting cast) hakeem also had a hungry Barkley, and Pip, and a Drexler. Even with their combonation of what seemed the best compliment of legends, Hakeem didn't lead the team to glory. It's arguable Duncan may have, but he has lead a weaker team against what seemed to be an invincable Lakers team.
So you can see any argument can be debunked whether it be accolades, competition, or supporting cast. It's how you put your personal spin on it. You can't just come in and say ," hakeem is way better, I've seen them play." Where the evidence and the back-up statement? My dad saw Dr.J in his prime and many older people, who are die hard fans, are convinced that Julius Erving was a way better individual player than Jordan. So, we can't debunk that argument because we judge players from the past on stories or reputation, and in to most the degree, accolades.
So who would I take? Duncan. He's just the more consistant player, and has been doing it a top level longer. I like dependability. It's a good foundation to lay your team upon. Keep in mind the fact that Duncan played all four years in college, shortening the time span in which he could have racked up more accolades early in his career. And he most certainly will achieve more.
With that all said, Go Cavs![/QUOTE]
:applause:
[QUOTE=JtotheIzzo]Duncan is better than Hakeem
there I said it, feels good too...now let me explain why, because so often, us here at ISH love to big up thepast in our revisionist history.
-Sure Hakeem had a nice post up game, but guess what, so does Duncan, it may not be as pretty but it yields the same results.
-Both are great defenders, potentialy all NBA defense every season, so this area is a push.
-Both have rings, but TD has more, and at a time where his conference was the stronger conference.
-The difference in my opinion is Duncan's range out to twenty two feet. Hakeem never had the ability to kill a team from the wing or the top of the key with jumpers like TD can, this is the difference, everything else is close or a push.
Timmy is better
get over yourselves.[/QUOTE]
:applause:
[QUOTE=allball]if you factor in defense there is no way you say Shaq surpassed Hakeem. Shaq was the most dominant offensive threat but defensively no way. Hakeem never had a Kobe or Wade either or a Magic or Jerry West. Clyde was past his prime.all time lists are based on opinions bro not science.[/QUOTE]
With all due respect... Shaq being above Hakeem on any all time greatest list is FACT. Like Jordan over Jerry West on that same list, or Magic above Barkley.
I'm not saying Shaq was a superior skilled player. But his dominance in his prime, plus all his rings and playoffs runs puts him above Hakeem, career wise. There is no disputing Shaq is above Hakeem on any all time greatest list.
[QUOTE=EricForman]With all due respect... Shaq being above Hakeem on any all time greatest list is FACT. Like Jordan over Jerry West on that same list, or Magic above Barkley.
I'm not saying Shaq was a superior skilled player. But his dominance in his prime, plus all his rings and playoffs runs puts him above Hakeem, career wise. There is no disputing Shaq is above Hakeem on any all time greatest list.[/QUOTE]
Agreed, no disputing at all; or that Tim Duncan has passed Shaq on the all-time list, but that is an argument for another thread.
:pimp:
:)
[QUOTE=Loki]:pimp:
:)[/QUOTE]
:oldlol:
which leads to
:cheers:
[QUOTE=poeticism707]Sorry guys, but as great a player as Hakeem is, its not close. Lets review the scorecard:
Titles: Hakeem 2, Duncan 3
Finals MVPs: Hakeem 2, Duncan 3
MVPs: Hakeem 1, Duncan 2
DPOY: Hakeem 2, Duncan 0
First team all NBA: Hakeem 6, Duncan 9
first team all defense: Hakeem 5, Duncan 7
Hakeem Career: 21.8 ppg, 11.1rpg, 2.5apg, 3.1bpg
Duncan: 21.8ppg, 11.9rpg, 3.2apg, 2.4bpg
The only only awards Hakeem has the Duncan doesn't is DPOY, but Duncan already has 2 more first team defense selections, and of the fact that Duncan should easily have multiple DPOY awards by now. Duncan may win his 4th title and 4th MVP in only his 10th year. Again, Hakeem is a great player, but its not close. Tim Duncan is already greater.
One of the excuses I DO NOT want to hear for Hakeem: "Hakeem didn't win more titles because of Jordan." Same as Barkley (except once) Hakeem was in the West, Mike in the East, and they never met in the Finals. Meaning it wasn't Jordan eliminating Hakeem year after year. He is a great player, but there are no "Jordan" excuses for why he didn't win more.[/QUOTE]
you cant really compare those numbers because Tim Duncan's numbers will go down with age..so Hakeem will have the better career numbers....those numbers are skewed because Hakeem played like 3 years too long so his numbers took a nose dive
It is a tough choice but i am going to go with Hakeem on this one. When comparing statlines you have to remember that Hakeem played 18 seasons and his last 5 or so years were when his athleticism and skills were waning which would bring his averages down. On defense i think Hakeem is a step above Duncan. For one if you look at the stats Hakeem averaged 3 blocks and almost 2 steals per game for his career which is amazing. Duncan might have the NBA-defensive teams edge but you have to remember that Hakeem played in an era with some great defensive centers. He played against Eaton, Ewing, Robinson, and Mutombo late in his career. Im not taking away from Duncan's accomplishments either but he plays the PF making him available for either F spot on the defensive teams while Hakeem had to battle all those great C for one spot. And yes Duncan has one more championship but Hakeem did when his two championship in the two years that Jordan was retired meaning other teams actually had a shot at the title. He also lost a title against one of those great 80's Celtics teams in his second year. When people use shooting range as an advantage for Duncan it doesnt hold much wieght becuase while yes he can hit a jumper out to about 20 feet but it is not something he uses frequently. If he used the 18-20 ft. jumper like KG does it would be a huge advantage but Duncan's main operating zone and where he is most effective is 10 ft. and in.
Tim Duncan could win the next 90 titles and still be worse thank Hakeem, he simply has less of an impact on the game. He's a worse scorer and defender. Accolades and titles he collects in a different era with a different coach and different teammates doesn't alter how good he is at basketball.
And let's please stop this talk about how Hakeem/Shaq only dominated for a few years. That's plain BS.
[QUOTE=SCY]Tim Duncan could win the next 90 titles and still be worse thank Hakeem, he simply has less of an impact on the game. He's a worse scorer and defender. Accolades and titles he collects in a different era with a different coach and different teammates doesn't alter how good he is at basketball.
And let's please stop this talk about how Hakeem/Shaq only dominated for a few years. That's plain BS.[/QUOTE]
man u are probly arguin with 15 yrs old kids...or less...they dnt know nothing about Hakeem/Shaq dominance...its like a TD bandwagon of kids...dnt waste ur time
[QUOTE=EricForman]With all due respect... Shaq being above Hakeem on any all time greatest list is FACT. Like Jordan over Jerry West on that same list, or Magic above Barkley.
I'm not saying Shaq was a superior skilled player. But his dominance in his prime, plus all his rings and playoffs runs puts him above Hakeem, career wise. There is no disputing Shaq is above Hakeem on any all time greatest list.[/QUOTE]
well lists are always subjective so...
[QUOTE=Dynasty]You guys are clearly not taking into account Hakeem Olajuwon's clutch factor v Tim Duncan's. How quickly some forget how Tim would and still does now at times clank those key free throws circa 2000-2004 versus LA Lakers although they won it all in 2003. Hakeem would Dream Shake Timmy while Timmy would Funda"mentally" do Olajuwon.[/QUOTE]
Point taken and I think you mistakenly gave the upper hand to Tim Duncan in your end statement because that's who I would take in a heartbeat. Tim Duncan
Whoever thinks these 2 guys are not close is just plain retarded. The fact is Hakeem and Duncan are very similar statisticly and accomplishment wise. You can't go wrong with either, and they should be ranked anywhere from 8-12 of all time.
[QUOTE=poeticism707]Sorry guys, but as great a player as Hakeem is, its not close. Lets review the scorecard:
Titles: Hakeem 2, Duncan 3
Finals MVPs: Hakeem 2, Duncan 3
MVPs: Hakeem 1, Duncan 2
DPOY: Hakeem 2, Duncan 0
First team all NBA: Hakeem 6, Duncan 9
first team all defense: Hakeem 5, Duncan 7
Hakeem Career: 21.8 ppg, 11.1rpg, 2.5apg, 3.1bpg
Duncan: 21.8ppg, 11.9rpg, 3.2apg, 2.4bpg
The only only awards Hakeem has the Duncan doesn't is DPOY, but Duncan already has 2 more first team defense selections, and of the fact that Duncan should easily have multiple DPOY awards by now. Duncan may win his 4th title and 4th MVP in only his 10th year. Again, Hakeem is a great player, but its not close. Tim Duncan is already greater.
One of the excuses I DO NOT want to hear for Hakeem: "Hakeem didn't win more titles because of Jordan." Same as Barkley (except once) Hakeem was in the West, Mike in the East, and they never met in the Finals. Meaning it wasn't Jordan eliminating Hakeem year after year. He is a great player, but there are no "Jordan" excuses for why he didn't win more.[/QUOTE]
Duncan has played 10 years. Lets takes Hakeem's stats for his first 11 years. (You could do the first 13 if you want to)
Hakeem 24 Points 12.4 Rebounds 3.6 Blocks 2.5 Assists 1.9 Steals
Duncan 21.8 Points 11.9 Rebounds 2.4 Blocks 3.2 Assists .8
Your right it is not even close by your own criteria.
You are accounting career stats when Hakeem played 17 years. He injured himself in 97-98, then came the strike season, then for three years he played 20 minutes a game as an old man ending with Toronto. This is the only reason their stats are close.
Hakeem dominates individual stats for the same career length so far and if Duncan playes seven more years Hakeems full career stats will dominate again.
There is absolutely nothing Duncan does better then Hakeem except low post passing.
Hakeem better man to man defender
Hakeem better low post moves.
Hakeem better scorer.
Hakeem better handles.
Hakeem better range on jumper.
Hakeem better free throw shooter.
Hakeem better off the ball blocker.
Duncan is no more of a Power Forward then Hakeem is a Power Forward.
Garnett and Duncan are both Power Forwards. Yet they were both on All NBA First Team in 2003-2004. If you choose only one then Duncan is out and on the second team. If Hakeem was allowed to be placed as a center or on either forward spots his first 13 years like they do with players now. (Amare, two Power Forwards at the Forward Position etc...) he would have had 10 or 11 All NBA first teams in his first 13 years.
Duncan 4 Finals 3 Wins Still Pending 4
Hakeem 3 Finals 2 Wins
Even with Jordan retired the road to Hakeems two championships where harder then any road Duncan has ever taken. The Nets in the finals.:oldlol: Strike season with Ewing hurt.:oldlol: The Cavaliers.:oldlol:
In 94-95 Hakeem beat the four teams with the best records in the NBA.
Prime Hakeem is vastly superior to Duncan.
Career Hakeem is a notch above Duncan.
Championships define individual careers by grabbing at least two and being able to carry your team to one practically by yourself. When you start stacking them up it becomes about era, team and who you play. For this reason. Bill Russell will never be better then Jordan and Duncan will never be better then Hakeem even if he wins 6 titles.
[QUOTE=D-Town-Raised]Duncan has played 10 years. Lets takes Hakeem's stats for his first 11 years. (You could do the first 13 if you want to)
Hakeem 24 Points 12.4 Rebounds 3.6 Blocks 2.5 Assists 1.9 Steals
Duncan 21.8 Points 11.9 Rebounds 2.4 Blocks 3.2 Assists .8
Your right it is not even close by your own criteria.
You are accounting career stats when Hakeem played 17 years. He injured himself in 97-98, then came the strike season, then for three years he played 20 minutes a game as an old man ending with Toronto. This is the only reason their stats are close.
Hakeem dominates individual stats for the same career length so far and if Duncan playes seven more years Hakeems full career stats will dominate again.
There is absolutely nothing Duncan does better then Hakeem except low post passing.
Hakeem better man to man defender
Hakeem better low post moves.
Hakeem better scorer.
Hakeem better handles.
Hakeem better range on jumper.
Hakeem better free throw shooter.
Hakeem better off the ball blocker.
Duncan is no more of a Power Forward then Hakeem is a Power Forward.
Garnett and Duncan are both Power Forwards. Yet they were both on All NBA First Team in 2003-2004. If you choose only one then Duncan is out and on the second team. If Hakeem was allowed to be placed as a center or on either forward spots his first 13 years like they do with players now. (Amare, two Power Forwards at the Forward Position etc...) he would have had 10 or 11 All NBA first teams in his first 13 years.
Duncan 4 Finals 3 Wins Still Pending 4
Hakeem 3 Finals 2 Wins
Even with Jordan retired the road to Hakeems two championships where harder then any road Duncan has ever taken. The Nets in the finals.:oldlol: Strike season with Ewing hurt.:oldlol: The Cavaliers.:oldlol:
In 94-95 Hakeem beat the four teams with the best records in the NBA.
Prime Hakeem is vastly superior to Duncan.
Career Hakeem is a notch above Duncan.
Championships define individual careers by grabbing at least two and being able to carry your team to one practically by yourself. When you start stacking them up it becomes about era, team and who you play. For this reason. Bill Russell will never be better then Jordan and Duncan will never be better then Hakeem even if he wins 6 titles.[/QUOTE]
i absolutely agree. Duncan is a great player but he's not Shaq or Hakeem...
Good post, D-Town. Despite Duncan having more championships, Hakeem's versatility was too much to ignore. It's been said that Duncan and Hakeem's defense was "a push". Not really. Hakeem's reflexes and speed gave him the ability to guard the paint as well as close to the perimeter. Duncan can't do this. Mutombo couldn't do this, Zo couldn't either. That's the main reason I consider Hakeem a better defender than them all. Just count the 100 steal/100 block seasons of Hakeem and compare it to the others'.
And when it comes to the playoffs, just see Olajuwon's numbers from 1986 to 1989 and from 1993 to 1997. Are they supposed to be inferior to Duncan's best ones (2001-03, 2006-07)?
[url]http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/d/duncati01.html[/url]
[url]http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/o/olajuha01.html[/url]
The only area where I think Duncan is more effective than Hakeem, at least pre-championship Hakeem is the mentality. Olajuwon used to be pretty uncooperative at times, whined to the team for not getting help, even demaned that he be traded. Duncan hasn't faced as many difficulties with his teammates, but even if he had, I don't think he would become as explosive and frustrating to the rest of the team.
[QUOTE=D-Town-Raised]Duncan has played 10 years. Lets takes Hakeem's stats for his first 11 years. (You could do the first 13 if you want to)
Hakeem 24 Points 12.4 Rebounds 3.6 Blocks 2.5 Assists 1.9 Steals
Duncan 21.8 Points 11.9 Rebounds 2.4 Blocks 3.2 Assists .8
Your right it is not even close by your own criteria.
You are accounting career stats when Hakeem played 17 years. He injured himself in 97-98, then came the strike season, then for three years he played 20 minutes a game as an old man ending with Toronto. This is the only reason their stats are close.
Hakeem dominates individual stats for the same career length so far and if Duncan playes seven more years Hakeems full career stats will dominate
again.
There is absolutely nothing Duncan does better then Hakeem except low post passing.
Hakeem better man to man defender
Hakeem better low post moves.
Hakeem better scorer.
Hakeem better handles.
Hakeem better range on jumper.
Hakeem better free throw shooter.
Hakeem better off the ball blocker.
Duncan is no more of a Power Forward then Hakeem is a Power Forward.
Garnett and Duncan are both Power Forwards. Yet they were both on All NBA First Team in 2003-2004. If you choose only one then Duncan is out and on the second team. If Hakeem was allowed to be placed as a center or on either forward spots his first 13 years like they do with players now. (Amare, two Power Forwards at the Forward Position etc...) he would have had 10 or 11 All NBA first teams in his first 13 years.
Duncan 4 Finals 3 Wins Still Pending 4
Hakeem 3 Finals 2 Wins
Even with Jordan retired the road to Hakeems two championships where harder then any road Duncan has ever taken. The Nets in the finals.:oldlol: Strike season with Ewing hurt.:oldlol: The Cavaliers.:oldlol:
In 94-95 Hakeem beat the four teams with the best records in the NBA.
Prime Hakeem is vastly superior to Duncan.
Career Hakeem is a notch above Duncan.
Championships define individual careers by grabbing at least two and being able to carry your team to one practically by yourself. When you start stacking them up it becomes about era, team and who you play. For this reason. Bill Russell will never be better then Jordan and Duncan will never be better then Hakeem even if he wins 6 titles.[/QUOTE]
PWNED :applause:
/THREAD
I agree with that. Hakeem was a live wire early. Ducna is better at passing out of a conventional post play and keeping his cool other then that Hakeem was superior at everything else.
I consider Hakeem the best defensive player ever. He could guard Shaq all game and he could cover point guards on the pick and roll for a good portion of the game as well. Hakeem is a bigger, stronger and more athletic Kevin Garnett. Hakeem had the body size to bang, the ups to block off the ball, the lateral quickness to guard on the perimeter and the hand quickness to strip small forwards.
I don't have Duncan as the greatest Power Forward ever because if Duncan is a Power Forward then I consider Moses Malone and Bill Russell to be Power Forwards as well. I consider Moses Malone the most underrated ever and I would take him over Duncan.
awards and recognizations aside - Hakeem was a better player than Duncan.
And there's no doubts in my mind about it.
:cheers:
[QUOTE=D-Town-Raised]Duncan has played 10 years. Lets takes Hakeem's stats for his first 11 years. (You could do the first 13 if you want to)
Hakeem 24 Points 12.4 Rebounds 3.6 Blocks 2.5 Assists 1.9 Steals
Duncan 21.8 Points 11.9 Rebounds 2.4 Blocks 3.2 Assists .8
Your right it is not even close by your own criteria.
You are accounting career stats when Hakeem played 17 years. He injured himself in 97-98, then came the strike season, then for three years he played 20 minutes a game as an old man ending with Toronto. This is the only reason their stats are close.
Hakeem dominates individual stats for the same career length so far and if Duncan playes seven more years Hakeems full career stats will dominate again.
There is absolutely nothing Duncan does better then Hakeem except low post passing.
Hakeem better man to man defender
Hakeem better low post moves.
Hakeem better scorer.
Hakeem better handles.
Hakeem better range on jumper.
Hakeem better free throw shooter.
Hakeem better off the ball blocker.
Duncan is no more of a Power Forward then Hakeem is a Power Forward.
Garnett and Duncan are both Power Forwards. Yet they were both on All NBA First Team in 2003-2004. If you choose only one then Duncan is out and on the second team. If Hakeem was allowed to be placed as a center or on either forward spots his first 13 years like they do with players now. (Amare, two Power Forwards at the Forward Position etc...) he would have had 10 or 11 All NBA first teams in his first 13 years.
Duncan 4 Finals 3 Wins Still Pending 4
Hakeem 3 Finals 2 Wins
Even with Jordan retired the road to Hakeems two championships where harder then any road Duncan has ever taken. The Nets in the finals.:oldlol: Strike season with Ewing hurt.:oldlol: The Cavaliers.:oldlol:
In 94-95 Hakeem beat the four teams with the best records in the NBA.
Prime Hakeem is vastly superior to Duncan.
Career Hakeem is a notch above Duncan.
Championships define individual careers by grabbing at least two and being able to carry your team to one practically by yourself. When you start stacking them up it becomes about era, team and who you play. For this reason. Bill Russell will never be better then Jordan and Duncan will never be better then Hakeem even if he wins 6 titles.[/QUOTE]
reading this makes me want to take a dump
[QUOTE=beau_boy04]awards and recognizations aside - Hakeem was a better player than Duncan.
And there's no doubts in my mind about it.
:cheers:[/QUOTE]
True I agree...this was a no brainer:rockon:
Could these responses be more subjective? Are we talking about which is the greatest player, or who your favorite pop artist is? Based on adjectives like "Hakeem is faster" (have you timed them in the 40 yard dash
?) and "Hakeem would OWN Duncan" and other such nonsense. The reality is Tim Duncan has rose to be the cream of the crop within his own generation, against the likes of Shaq's Lakers, The Detroit Pistons, (talk about physical), etc., and he has done it more than Hakeem. Titles are objective; accomplishsments are objective; most posters on this thread are not.
[QUOTE=poeticism707]Could these responses be more subjective? Are we talking about which is the greatest player, or who your favorite pop artist is? Based on adjectives like "Hakeem is faster" (have you timed them in the 40 yard dash
?) and "Hakeem would OWN Duncan" and other such nonsense. The reality is Tim Duncan has rose to be the cream of the crop within his own generation, against the likes of Shaq's Lakers, The Detroit Pistons, (talk about physical), etc., and he has done it more than Hakeem. Titles are objective; accomplishsments are objective; most posters on this thread are not.[/QUOTE]
here here:applause:
there is one fool up there saying Hakeem had better range too:hammerhead:
this discussion has fallen to the bottom of the toilet bowl.
[QUOTE=poeticism707]Could these responses be more subjective? Are we talking about which is the greatest player, or who your favorite pop artist is? Based on adjectives like "Hakeem is faster" (have you timed them in the 40 yard dash
?) and "Hakeem would OWN Duncan" and other such nonsense. The reality is Tim Duncan has rose to be the cream of the crop within his own generation, against the likes of Shaq's Lakers, The Detroit Pistons, (talk about physical), etc., and he has done it more than Hakeem. Titles are objective; accomplishsments are objective; most posters on this thread are not.[/QUOTE]
The Dream was quicker and a better defender....hes in the top 5 all time in steals and thats wierd for a big man to be in that category...I like Tim Duncan and I think hes one of the best PF's of all-time but your comparing him to the "Dream" and he was better.
[QUOTE=poeticism707]Could these responses be more subjective? Are we talking about which is the greatest player, or who your favorite pop artist is? Based on adjectives like "Hakeem is faster" (have you timed them in the 40 yard dash
?) and "Hakeem would OWN Duncan" and other such nonsense. The reality is Tim Duncan has rose to be the cream of the crop within his own generation, against the likes of Shaq's Lakers, The Detroit Pistons, (talk about physical), etc., and he has done it more than Hakeem. Titles are objective; accomplishsments are objective; most posters on this thread are not.[/QUOTE]
The same Hakeem who beat the 85-86 L.A. Lakers 4 games to 1. Those same Lakers who would beat any team Duncan ever played on in 5 games? Then met the 85-86 Celtics a top ten team all time and played a close 6 game series.
The same Hakeem who has better stats for his first 13 years compared to Duncans first 10 in every category except assists?
The same Hakeem who beat the best three centers in the game to win his titles.
The same Hakeem who won back to back something Duncan hasn't done.
The same Hakeem who beat the 4 best Teams in the NBA record wise while outplaying Robinson and Shaq.
The same Duncan who was swept by the Lakers as the number 1 seed? And Blown out by 30 points two games in a row?
The same Duncan who was beaten 4-1 by the Lakers when he was the MVP?
The same Duncan who if he wouldn't have been injured and had Robinson by his side would have had Shaq put up 37 and 15 on both of them in 99-00?
The same Duncan who lost again in 2003-2004.
The same Duncan who benfited from a strike plagued season? Then met the Ewingless Knicks in the Finals?
The same Duncan who played an unworthy Mavs team in the conference finals with Dirk missing most of the series then met the Nets in the Finals?
The physical Pistons who where 5 times less physical then the 93-94 Knicks with Oakley, Mason and Hand Check Harper?
The Same Duncan who met the Jazz because of an upset?
[QUOTE=D-Town-Raised]Duncan has played 10 years. Lets takes Hakeem's stats for his first 11 years. (You could do the first 13 if you want to)
Hakeem 24 Points 12.4 Rebounds 3.6 Blocks 2.5 Assists 1.9 Steals
Duncan 21.8 Points 11.9 Rebounds 2.4 Blocks 3.2 Assists .8
Your right it is not even close by your own criteria....[/QUOTE]
You know your post is dead on the money when those that disagree with it completely ignore it. :roll:
:cheers:
After scanning thru this thread I realized something,
Spurs fans and 1-2% non Spurs fan think Duncan is > than Hakeem
while the rest of the population believe
Hakeem > Duncan
:cheers:
[url]http://www.nbcsports.com/nba/424876/detail.html[/url]
Another reason why Hak was a superior defender:
Hakeem Olajuwon:
12 seasons with at least 100 steals and 100 blocks
11 seasons with at least 100 steals and 200 blocks
4 seasons finishing top ten in both categories (steals and blocks)
1 season with at least 200 steals 100 blocks
Tim Duncan is nowhere to be found in those in the website listed above. Now we should all know by know the defensive monster Hak was and we all know he was far a superior scorer as well.
:cheers:
I would take Akeem all day! He was a phenom! Unlike any other big man. Is it safe to assume Duncan is succeeding with less than stellar comp? :confusedshrug:
hakeem was entertaining to watch
while TD is fundamentally boring to watch.....
[QUOTE=snipes12]hakeem was entertaining to watch
while TD is fundamentally boring to watch.....[/QUOTE]
I would not say TD is boring, but I agree that most non NBA fans would say that.
My opinion:
Dream better in his prime, but TD already has had a better career.