The United States needs High-Speed Rail

[QUOTE=bladefd;14041020]Private sector will not fund anything that does not instantly boost up their bottom line. They also cannot possibly be able to raise sums in the tens of billions like nations and states can. If you look around the world, you will not find privately owned high speed rails. Not even AMTRAK can raise the funds for a high-speed rail without major assistance from government/tax money.[/QUOTE]

Are there examples of the private sector funding things that do not instantly boost bottom line?

Are you sure it would cost tens of billions to build a train from SF to LA?

[B]Has anyone stopped and asked if it's a good idea to build a 100 billion dollar choo-choo train from SF to LA with an estimated completion date of 2033?[/B]

Lol the public transport in the states is worse than third world countries, you guys are so far behind. LA traffic is a disgrace.
The Amtrak on the east coast is ok, but you should have rail links and especially high speed between cities all over the country like Japan. There's no reason LA can't set up rail and metro like Tokyo..

Maybe if you didn't have 400 levels of government bending over to corporations all day there.. actually never mind.. freedom etc etc

[QUOTE=coin24;14041026]Lol the public transport in the states is worse than third world countries, you guys are so far behind. LA traffic is a disgrace.
The Amtrak on the east coast is ok, but you should have rail links and especially high speed between cities all over the country like Japan. There's no reason LA can't set up rail and metro like Tokyo..

Maybe if you didn't have 400 levels of government bending over to corporations all day there.. actually never mind.. freedom etc etc[/QUOTE]

Agreed with some of this, but cities all over the country like Japan? We have 2.6x the population, but 26x the size of Japan in area. LA, yeah, but like you said - we have 400 levels of government / unions / environmentalists / etc that make it difficult and expensive. And our gov't seems to only get bigger.

3rd world country.

Im frequently using high speed trains in germany and france. The route Nuremberg (bavaria) to Cologne (west germany) via Würzburg and Frankfurt in just 3 1/2 h with the ICE train. From Cologne to Brussels via Aachen and Lüttich in 1 1/2 h. Or Cologne to Paris in 3 h 45 min via Brussels. both with the Thalys train.

Saying that, Germany has one of the densest transportation networks. Even small cities are connected to the railway system. We have the ICE as a high speed train who connects just big cities ( 100.000 and above) And then many regional train networks who are connecting small and medium and big cities.

The ICE train between Berlin and Hamburg takes 2hrs. With a car on the Autobahn, it takes 3hrs.

When you arrive after sitting on the train, listening to podcasts or reading, you are in much better shape than after hours of sitting in the car and hammering away on the Autobahn.

Anyway, as long as the automobile industry lobby is so strong, and also the oil lobby.......You aren't getting High-Speed rail in the States. Nope. Too bad. It would be perfect for such a big country with wide open spaces.

[QUOTE=Rolando;14041037]The ICE train between Berlin and Hamburg takes 2hrs. With a car on the Autobahn, it takes 3hrs.

When you arrive after sitting on the train, listening to podcasts or reading, you are in much better shape than after hours of sitting in the car and hammering away on the Autobahn.

Anyway, as long as the automobile industry lobby is so strong, and also the oil lobby.......You aren't getting High-Speed rail in the States. Nope. Too bad. It would be perfect for such a big country with wide open spaces.[/QUOTE]
United States has some of the most difficult geography for high speed rail, especially in comparison to Europe and China


$150m per mile


[video=youtube;Qaf6baEu0_w]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qaf6baEu0_w[/video]

[QUOTE=scuzzy;14041040]United States has some of the most difficult geography for high speed rail, especially in comparison to Europe and China


$150m per mile


[video=youtube;Qaf6baEu0_w]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qaf6baEu0_w[/video][/QUOTE]

Excellent video. Pretty much spells it all out. Thanks.

And.....just a minor correction. The film says, (at 9:22) for high speed rail it is anywhere from 20-80m per mile. Still way too expensive.

The eurail system is a great way to get around, fantastic system.
I went on the high speed from Barcelona to Madrid, travels about 300km an hour, superb

[QUOTE=scuzzy;14041040]United States has some of the most difficult geography for high speed rail, especially in comparison to Europe and China


$150m per mile


[video=youtube;Qaf6baEu0_w]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qaf6baEu0_w[/video][/QUOTE]
Courtesy for building so much roads.

Japan’s terrain is mostly mountainous and they’ve built it, not an excuse.

[QUOTE=Cleverness;14041025]Are there examples of the private sector funding things that do not instantly boost bottom line?

Are you sure it would cost tens of billions to build a train from SF to LA?

[B]Has anyone stopped and asked if it's a good idea to build a 100 billion dollar choo-choo train from SF to LA with an estimated completion date of 2033?[/B][/QUOTE]

Of course, private sector has funded plenty of things without instant boost to bottom line but not while spending multiple billions up front. You need deep pockets up front and even deeper to maintain high speed rail annually. Private sector does not typically fund those sorts of high-risk investments that could take decades to break even.

High speed rail would cost multiple billions at the very least from SF to LA. It's not just a regular old train. High-speed trains like bullet trains don't work on regular train tracks. You need to build special rails and special trains. Those alone are very costly. And unfortunately government bureaucracy, corruption and politician term-limits make it difficult to build these decade-long projects.

100 billion is too much. China/Japan/France/etc doesn't spend anywhere close to those sums for their bullet trains so why should we?

[QUOTE=Rolando;14041037]The ICE train between Berlin and Hamburg takes 2hrs. With a car on the Autobahn, it takes 3hrs.

When you arrive after sitting on the train, listening to podcasts or reading, you are in much better shape than after hours of sitting in the car and hammering away on the Autobahn.

Anyway, as long as the automobile industry lobby is so strong, and also the oil lobby.......You aren't getting High-Speed rail in the States. Nope. Too bad. It would be perfect for such a big country with wide open spaces.[/QUOTE]

Yup, car industry and oil lobbyists have America by the balls. That is another reason.

[QUOTE=scuzzy;14041040]United States has some of the most difficult geography for high speed rail, especially in comparison to Europe and China


$150m per mile


[video=youtube;Qaf6baEu0_w]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qaf6baEu0_w[/video][/QUOTE]

That's not true. You can still connect similar terrains. Like terrains to the west of the Rocky mountains is pretty similar. Terrains to the east of the Appalachian mountains is pretty similar. You don't necessarily need to link California to New York across the entire country. Just link east coast to east coast and west coast to west coast. If you are traveling cross country then a plane is the quickest way to go. You can also inter-connect big states like Texas.

Out of curiosity I looked up how long it would take for me in NYC to get to my brother and niece in Sacramento by train in a sleeper car. It said more than 3 days. I was like screw it that's not an option. As much as I would enjoy the scenery, rail is not an option that far lol

[QUOTE=coin24;14041026]Lol the public transport in the states is worse than third world countries, you guys are so far behind. LA traffic is a disgrace.
The Amtrak on the east coast is ok, but you should have rail links and especially high speed between cities all over the country like Japan. There's no reason LA can't set up rail and metro like Tokyo..

Maybe if you didn't have 400 levels of government bending over to corporations all day there.. actually never mind.. freedom etc etc[/QUOTE]

That project in Sydney that is out of control is something I don’t want in the US.

[QUOTE=Hawker;14041279]That project in Sydney that is out of control is something I don’t want in the US.[/QUOTE]

Classic red stater who’s state takes in more federal funds than it pays in taxes, California’s economy dominates any trash red state, btw don’t forget to clarify you work in the fossil fuel industry.

[QUOTE=eliteballer;14041294]Classic red stater who’s state takes in more federal funds than it pays in taxes, California’s economy dominates any trash red state, btw don’t forget to clarify you work in the fossil fuel industry.[/QUOTE]

Then take care of your own state and build the damn thing yourself. Stop funding illegals.

[QUOTE=Hawker;14041299]Then take care of your own state and build the damn thing yourself.[/QUOTE]

Sure, just as soon as you mooching red states return our tax revenue..

[QUOTE=Hawker;14041299]Then take care of your own state and build the damn thing yourself. Stop funding illegals.[/QUOTE]
:roll:

[QUOTE=Hawker;14041279]That project in Sydney that is out of control is something I don’t want in the US.[/QUOTE]

The light rail? In the end I think they spent around $2b, but it links a lot of suburbs that had no rail before and links up to all the major destinations across the city. Could have been cheaper but what do you expect from government. At least this one has added much needed highways and rail projects. Disagree with the idiotic amount of high rise apartments they've green lit creating future slums though.

LA could use a decent rail network, doesn't even have to be high speed. The only one they have joins hollywood to staples basically, it's pathetic.

Does Australia have a light rail connecting Sydney, Melbourne, Canberra? All the major cities are on the coast I believe.

[QUOTE=eliteballer;14041146]Japan’s terrain is mostly mountainous and they’ve built it, not an excuse.[/QUOTE]
Because japan always had great urban planning way back even before the 20th century and the ones that they build there are resilient because we all know their geography is prone to natural disasters.

[QUOTE=eliteballer;14041419]Does Australia have a light rail connecting Sydney, Melbourne, Canberra? All the major cities are on the coast I believe.[/QUOTE]

The main east coast places are Sydney, Melbourne and Brisbane. Theres normal rail between Brisbane, Sydney, Melbourne and Sydney to Canberra. There should be high speed connecting all of it but I guess for similar reasons of cost, distance and not a lot of interest they havnt bothered.

Each city has plenty of public trains, trams and light rail to get around.

[QUOTE=Axe;14041427]Because japan always had great urban planning way back even before the 20th century and the ones that they build there are resilient because we all know their geography is prone to natural disasters.[/QUOTE]

They also made the decision to get rid of most of the cars out of Tokyo, make registration extremely expensive and create a fantastic cheap to use train and metro system so you don't need to drive.. Tokyo is huge but you can reach any corner of it easily

[QUOTE=coin24;14041431]They also made the decision to get rid of most of the cars out of Tokyo, make registration extremely expensive and create a fantastic cheap to use train and metro system so you don't need to drive.. Tokyo is huge but you can reach any corner of it easily[/QUOTE]
Well, I've been there to Tokyo twice already but i wouldn't exactly say their trains are cheap to use, if you mean the fare. :lol

Also, with the extensive rail network that they have there, going from north to southern japan (say from tokyo to fukuoka) is made possible via land travel obviously due to the presence or abundance of high speed rails like the shinkansen.

And since there are a lot of narrow roads & streets there, kei cars are quite common as well, something that would attract practical locals because those things have some exemptions from tax, unlike bigger cars.

[QUOTE=Axe;14041439]Well, I've been there to Tokyo twice already but i wouldn't exactly say their trains are cheap to use, if you mean the fare. :lol

Also, with the extensive rail network that they have there, going from north to southern japan (say from tokyo to fukuoka) is made possible via land travel obviously due to the presence or abundance of high speed rails like the shinkansen.

And since there are a lot of narrow roads & streets there, kei cars are quite common as well, something that would attract practical locals because those things have some exemptions from tax, unlike bigger cars.[/QUOTE]

Travelling on the Shinkansen is definitely a great experience, much more enjoyable than jerking around with airports and travelling to and from.
We get a japan rail pass in Australia before we leave, so for a set price you can use the service as much as you like
. Same as the eurail pass

[QUOTE=coin24;14041442]Travelling on the Shinkansen is definitely a great experience, much more enjoyable than jerking around with airports and travelling to and from.
We get a japan rail pass in Australia before we leave, so for a set price you can use the service as much as you like
. Same as the eurail pass[/QUOTE]
Lol me and my fam also tried that back then from two years ago. We landed in the airport at fukuoka during the night and immediately, we took the bullet train to hiroshima.

The whole trip was almost around 190 miles but it only took us 45 minutes to reach our destination in the city and there were some stopovers along the way. The rail pass takes at least 9000 yen per person if I'm not mistaken but it was sweet.

On the other hand, it would take at least 3 hours if the said trip was travelled via bus instead.

[url]https://www.yahoo.com/news/biden-promised-railroad-revolution-could-134400412.html[/url]

[url]https://abcnews.go.com/Business/amtrak-joe-bidens-infrastructure-push-put-rail-back/story?id=77241007[/url]

[url]https://www.yahoo.com/gma/amtrak-joe-bidens-infrastructure-push-100414758.html[/url]

[url]https://finance.yahoo.com/news/biden-focus-infrastructure-event-celebrating-100652286.html[/url]

[url]https://www.reuters.com/world/us/biden-focus-infrastructure-with-event-celebrating-trains-2021-04-30/[/url]

What's the demand for a choo choo train that travels to/from Bakersfield to Wichita? To Dallas from LA? (Could there be a better way?)

How's California's Boondoggle Train project doing?

High speed rail makes no financial sense in the U.S.

Most of our major metropolitan areas are too far away from each other so the cost of material to profit ratio is abysmal for a concept like high speed rail - this isn't Europe or Japan.

This is also why Elon Musks bullshit about a tunnel is laughable. He's a con artist taking peoples investments for that dead end lol

[QUOTE=hiphopanonymous;14306973]High speed rail makes no financial sense in the U.S.

Most of our major metropolitan areas are too far away from each other so the cost of material to profit ratio is abysmal for a concept like high speed rail - this isn't Europe or Japan.

This is also why Elon Musks bullshit about a tunnel is laughable. He's a con artist taking peoples investments for that dead end lol[/QUOTE]

You can connect regions IE California, the Northeast, Texas Triangle etc.

[QUOTE=eliteballer;14307330]You can connect regions IE California, the Northeast, Texas Triangle etc.[/QUOTE]

Yeah thats what planes do big guy.

OP is Chinese and thinks we need to emulate their infrastructure because he watched some Bill Nye episode

[QUOTE=welfarefan;14307414]OP is Chinese and thinks we need to emulate their infrastructure because he watched some Bill Nye episode[/QUOTE]
This is why sneaker prices are out of control as we speak :(

If the United States got a high speed rail that would mean more jobs for RR3, Axe and Doctorp

[QUOTE=hiphopanonymous;14306973]High speed rail makes no financial sense in the U.S.

Most of our major metropolitan areas are too far away from each other so the cost of material to profit ratio is abysmal for a concept like high speed rail - this isn't Europe or Japan.

This is also why Elon Musks bullshit about a tunnel is laughable. He's a con artist taking peoples investments for that dead end lol[/QUOTE]

Cross-country would cost too much and does not make sense. However, connecting similar terrains is feasible and worth it. Like one for northeast from DC to NYC, another from DC to Atlanta, another from Atlanta to Dallas then Dallas to San Diego and LA to San Francisco. 5 different high speed rails covering certain parts of the country.

My worry would be on the costs being overrun - everyone is out to scam and with corrupt politicians, it's easy for the scamming to happen. It needs strict regular inspections to make sure costs are not overrun. Do regular inspections and perhaps make the payments based on work done. As parts are completed and on time, make the payments. I don't like anyone getting paid before the work is done.

[QUOTE=bladefd;14307855]Cross-country would cost too much and does not make sense. However, connecting similar terrains is feasible and worth it. Like one for northeast from DC to NYC, another from DC to Atlanta, another from Atlanta to Dallas then Dallas to San Diego and LA to San Francisco. 5 different high speed rails covering certain parts of the country.

My worry would be on the costs being overrun - everyone is out to scam and with corrupt politicians, it's easy for the scamming to happen. It needs strict regular inspections to make sure costs are not overrun. Do regular inspections and perhaps make the payments based on work done. As parts are completed and on time, make the payments. I don't like anyone getting paid before the work is done.[/QUOTE]

Do you have any idea how far it is from Dallas to San Diego? Building a vast railroad across a desert when people can simply fly is utterly pointless.

And I'm pretty sure there already is a train between NYC and DC, no?

The bullet train from LA to San Fransisco was approved in 2008 and will be lucky to be HALFWAY done by 2030.

This is just another topic that gets framed as a "progressive ideal" so that a handful of people can get rich.

[QUOTE=FultzNationRISE;14307909][B]Do you have any idea how far it is from Dallas to San Diego? Building a vast railroad across a desert when people can simply fly is utterly pointless.[/B]

And I'm pretty sure there already is a train between NYC and DC, no?

[B]The bullet train from LA to San Fransisco was approved in 2008 and will be lucky to be HALFWAY done by 2030.
[/B]
This is just another topic that gets framed as a "progressive ideal" so that a handful of people can get rich.[/QUOTE]

:roll:

$100 billion boondoggle, way over budget, and maybe halfway done by 2030... :rockon: